How can an affiliate program not afford to stay open? This shit doesn't make sense..

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  • potter
    Confirmed User
    • Dec 2004
    • 6559
    #51
    Originally posted by Brujah
    For the above to be true, the program already be very small and unable to sustain itself without affiliates anyway, let alone a large program making good sales.
    Exactly, and a program that small and unable to sustain itself anyway. Probably wouldn't be just closing the affiliate program and not the sites as well.

    A program large enough to sustain the paysite, but not the affiliate program. Most likely means the affiliate program has a large overhead to run.

      Comment

      • Brujah
        Beer Money Baron
        • Jan 2001
        • 22157
        #52
        Originally posted by potter
        A program large enough to sustain the paysite, but not the affiliate program. Most likely means the affiliate program has a large overhead to run.
        Honestly, don't you think that such a program is already managed poorly if it can't make any money on a 50% revshare?

          Comment

          • potter
            Confirmed User
            • Dec 2004
            • 6559
            #53
            Originally posted by Brujah
            Honestly, don't you think that such a program is already managed poorly if it can't make any money on a 50% revshare?
            If they're closing their affiliate program then obviously it was managed poorly.

            Where did you get the idea that I was stating it was top notch managing if they're closing their program down?

              Comment

              • Brujah
                Beer Money Baron
                • Jan 2001
                • 22157
                #54
                Originally posted by potter
                If they're closing their affiliate program then obviously it was managed poorly.

                Where did you get the idea that I was stating it was top notch managing if they're closing their program down?
                Oh you know, I just get confused easy.

                  Comment

                  • will76
                    Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                    • May 2003
                    • 18037
                    #55
                    Originally posted by Brujah
                    For the above to be true, the program already be very small and unable to sustain itself without affiliates anyway, let alone a large program making good sales.
                    no kidding he is talking about pennies on the dollar. If they can't afford those costs they have much bigger problems to worry about.

                    Originally posted by potter
                    Exactly, and a program that small and unable to sustain itself anyway. Probably wouldn't be just closing the affiliate program and not the sites as well.

                    A program large enough to sustain the paysite, but not the affiliate program. Most likely means the affiliate program has a large overhead to run.
                    Which part do you not fucking get. They are lieing to you. No affiliate program is closing down because of the overhead being too much for the affiliate program to stay in existence. So what all they have to do is fire the reps, stop updating promos. Big fucking deal. They keep the program open. There are affiliates out there like me, I don't need a rep and I don't use your promos, I make my own. All I need the company to do is send me my fucking money. Which is the one thing they DONT WANT TO DO and is why they closed down their program = EXIT STRATEGY.

                    Jesus christ you are thick in the head you keep going on and on trying to justify a line of shit that these programs are feeding you and you can't accept the obvious truth, they closed down the affiliate program because they didn't want to send out "xxxxxx" in affilaite payments for the couple periods still owed, they put that money in their pocket, they make 100% on all future rebills, they let their staff go, they cut back expenses as much as possible and they put the sites on cruise control. They can live off of the fucking rebills for probably a year or so and it prolongs them having to get a JOB.
                    Last edited by will76; 07-21-2010, 10:12 AM.
                    ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

                    PROGRAM SHIT LIST - DO NOT PROMOTE (click link for gfy thread)
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                      Comment

                      • The Porn Nerd
                        Living The Dream
                        • Jun 2009
                        • 19787
                        #56
                        Originally posted by will76
                        no kidding he is talking about pennies on the dollar. If they can't afford those costs they have much bigger problems to worry about.



                        Which part do you not fucking get. They are lieing to you. No affiliate program is closing down because of the overhead being too much for the affiliate program to stay in existence. So what all they have to do is fire the reps, stop updating promos. Big fucking deal. They keep the program open. There are affiliates out there like me, I don't need a rep and I don't use your promos, I make my own. All I need the company to do is send me my fucking money. Which is the one thing they DONT WANT TO DO and is why they closed down their program = EXIT STRATEGY.

                        Jesus christ you are thick in the head you keep going on and on trying to justify a line of shit that these programs are feeding you and you can't accept the obvious truth, they closed down the affiliate program because they didn't want to send out "xxxxxx" in affilaite payments for the couple periods still owed, they put that money in their pocket, they make 100% on all future rebills, they let their staff go, they cut back expenses as much as possible and they put the sites on cruise control. They can live off of the fucking rebills for probably a year or so and it prolongs them having to get a JOB.
                        Maybe he's in denial. Maybe he's friends with the offending party and THIS is all a scam. Whatever Will. Some people get it, others waste everyone's time.

                        Hey, promote my shit and I'll give you a pass to create your own promos. Heh - I'm not above a little whoring (I said 'little').
                        My Affiliate Programs:
                        Porn Nerd Cash | Porn Showcase | Aggressive Gold

                        Over 90 paysites to promote!
                        Now on Teams: peabodymedia

                          Comment

                          • datatank
                            Confirmed User
                            • Aug 2004
                            • 5471
                            #57
                            Originally posted by TheDoc
                            The average paysite join is still worth $70-$90 each, with rebills of course and time, so let's say $80. Let's assume the processor takes 12%.

                            Taking processing out,
                            At $80 it's: $70.40
                            At $70 it's: $61.60
                            At $60 it's: $52.80

                            Revshare Profit: No reason to include content, hosting, etc.. it equals out assuming the program is alive to some degree.

                            At $80 it's: $70.40 at 50% split $35.20 profit
                            At $70 it's: $61.60 at 50% split $30.80 profit
                            At $60 it's: $52.80 at 50% split $26.40 profit

                            On the PPS side
                            At $80 it's: $70.40 with $30pps = $40.40 profit
                            At $70 it's: $61.60 with $30pps = $31.60 profit
                            At $60 it's: $52.80 with $30pps = $22.80 profit

                            A hair over two months and the PPS program is passing the Revshare program in profits.

                            PPS Programs which convert as well as Revshare Programs, often pay on less join methods, exits, xsales, upsells, and emails. The profit margins are without question higher and more stable on a PPS Program.

                            That's why Revshare programs are closing down, they make less money than PPS programs when ran correctly. Any program type can fail, only one type though is locked into a profit margin that they can't escape from. That margin when you don't update, promote your sites directly, etc... get's very thin, very fast when you're always having to give out 50% - even if the affiliate isn't actively promoting you. Unlike PPS, when an affiliate stops promoting, it's all profit for them.

                            Define "average"

                              Comment

                              • will76
                                Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                                • May 2003
                                • 18037
                                #58
                                Originally posted by datatank
                                Define "average"
                                yeah I would like to know myself as well... what does that $70-$90 include all of the cross sales/ up sells they do off of the person as well?

                                No way any "average" membership is going to generate $70 - $90 just from membership fees even if the monthly charge is $35, that would still be an average retention rate of 2-3 months. I find that hard to believe that many pic and vid sites are doing that much less it being an average.
                                ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

                                PROGRAM SHIT LIST - DO NOT PROMOTE (click link for gfy thread)
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                                  Comment

                                  • Dollarmansteve
                                    Confirmed User
                                    • May 2005
                                    • 2849
                                    #59
                                    Originally posted by Brujah
                                    Are you a program owner or an affiliate rep? Why do you need to have "Dollarman_" as a prefix for your name? Is it because you're marketing a program to affiliates? Good job, buddy!
                                    Nope. Fail.

                                    I am the wind.
                                    I died.

                                      Comment

                                      • Dollarmansteve
                                        Confirmed User
                                        • May 2005
                                        • 2849
                                        #60
                                        Originally posted by will76
                                        comments like this show the intelligence of program owners and why a lot of them are going out of business.

                                        Most affiliates (at least the successful ones) are not 1 man operations. Personally I have a staff of 2 full time programmers, a designer, and 5-10 full/time part time people that assist me from everything from writing text for sites to doing my accounting to taking care of my servers.

                                        I am a business owner thank you very much.

                                        I've also owned my own membership sites, and done just about every other thing imaginable in this industry except be a content shooter.
                                        Congratulations. Was I talking to you?
                                        I died.

                                          Comment

                                          • ruff
                                            I have a plan B
                                            • Aug 2004
                                            • 5507
                                            #61
                                            I can't believe all of you putting a sweet justifiable spin on a company that, plain and simply, cheats its affiliates. You fucking idiots are just the fodder these shitheels love. "Gosh, they must have had a righteous reason for making such a prudent business decision." Do you realize how stupid that sounds? They are thieves, just plain thieves and they are stealing your money.
                                            CryptoFeeds

                                              Comment

                                              • DVTimes
                                                xxx
                                                • Jun 2003
                                                • 31658
                                                #62
                                                http://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=978729
                                                XXX

                                                  Comment

                                                  • Kiopa_Matt
                                                    Confirmed User
                                                    • Oct 2007
                                                    • 1448
                                                    #63
                                                    Originally posted by Jakez
                                                    I can see how closing it and keeping all the rebills and traffic makes sense, but it's going to eventually die out and it doesn't seem very wise in the long run.
                                                    If it takes me 20 - 30 hours a week to stay on top of shit, and ensure everything is running, then yeah, I'd rather have $0.
                                                    xMarkPro -- Ultimate Blog Network Management
                                                    Streamline your marketing operations. Centralize management of domains, pages, Wordpress blogs, sponsors, link codes, media items, sales and traffic statistics, plus more!

                                                      Comment

                                                      • Brujah
                                                        Beer Money Baron
                                                        • Jan 2001
                                                        • 22157
                                                        #64
                                                        Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                        Nope. Fail.

                                                        I am the wind.
                                                        Uh oh. Should affiliates be worried about Python programs? Are they in danger now because of xsell problems or banking/processing?

                                                          Comment

                                                          • will76
                                                            Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                                                            • May 2003
                                                            • 18037
                                                            #65
                                                            Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                            Congratulations. Was I talking to you?
                                                            yes you were:

                                                            Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                            its threads like this that prove why affiliates are affiliates and business owners are business owners.

                                                            News flash: Being a 1-man show affiliate is NOT a business. The end.
                                                            I am an affiliate. I was posting in this thread and I agreed with the original poster.

                                                            You also made a blanked statement insinuating that affiliates aren't smart enough to be business owners, and that being an affiliate means you are a one man operation.

                                                            Congrats to you! for such logic.
                                                            ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

                                                            PROGRAM SHIT LIST - DO NOT PROMOTE (click link for gfy thread)
                                                            FNCash | Media Revenue

                                                              Comment

                                                              • icymelon
                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                • Dec 2007
                                                                • 3220
                                                                #66
                                                                probably something they will regret. they could sell the program. merge it with another program if they dont want to be bothered anymore. The thing that makes the most sense is switch from pps to revshare. And just don't update as often.
                                                                worst case they could set a script to take one update down per week and then add one update back per week and rotate it. eventually the update would look new to most members.

                                                                But the smart thing to do is just stop updating and turn to rev share. hosting isn't very expensive these days. you can get a pretty good quality server with a ton of traffic for a few hundred dollars. if your going through more traffic than that you probably have enough revenue to just pass off the day to day operations to a manager.
                                                                Network Of Adult Blogs With Hardlink Rentals Available

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Dollarmansteve
                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                    • May 2005
                                                                    • 2849
                                                                    #67
                                                                    Originally posted by ruff
                                                                    I can't believe all of you putting a sweet justifiable spin on a company that, plain and simply, cheats its affiliates. You fucking idiots are just the fodder these shitheels love. "Gosh, they must have had a righteous reason for making such a prudent business decision." Do you realize how stupid that sounds? They are thieves, just plain thieves and they are stealing your money.
                                                                    If they are thieves then you get a lawyer and get your money. That's what a real business does.

                                                                    Real businesses eat losses all the time from companies that go bankrupt or are delinquent. Affiliates live in a delusional world of business that does not reflect reality.

                                                                    If every company who got stiffed by another company chose never to do business with that company ever again, our entire economy would grind to a halt. In the real world, hurt feelings don't matter.. there is no 'code' like there is in the fantasy world of Adult internet.
                                                                    I died.

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • Dollarmansteve
                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                        • May 2005
                                                                        • 2849
                                                                        #68
                                                                        Originally posted by will76
                                                                        yes you were:



                                                                        I am an affiliate. I was posting in this thread and I agreed with the original poster.

                                                                        You also made a blanked statement insinuating that affiliates aren't smart enough to be business owners, and that being an affiliate means you are a one man operation.

                                                                        Congrats to you! for such logic.
                                                                        By your not being a 1-man show then I guess you are not included in the group of "1-man show affiliates" that I was referring to. Eat that logic boy.
                                                                        I died.

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • Dollarmansteve
                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                            • May 2005
                                                                            • 2849
                                                                            #69
                                                                            Originally posted by Brujah
                                                                            Uh oh. Should affiliates be worried about Python programs? Are they in danger now because of xsell problems or banking/processing?
                                                                            I don't work for Python and haven't for a long time. Timeline.
                                                                            I died.

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • Brujah
                                                                                Beer Money Baron
                                                                                • Jan 2001
                                                                                • 22157
                                                                                #70
                                                                                Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                                                I don't work for Python and haven't for a long time. Timeline.
                                                                                Couldn't cut it there?

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • Dollarmansteve
                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                    • May 2005
                                                                                    • 2849
                                                                                    #71
                                                                                    Originally posted by Brujah
                                                                                    Couldn't cut it there?
                                                                                    Yep. I work at BK now. Would you like fries with that?
                                                                                    I died.

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • ruff
                                                                                        I have a plan B
                                                                                        • Aug 2004
                                                                                        • 5507
                                                                                        #72
                                                                                        Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                                                        If they are thieves then you get a lawyer and get your money. That's what a real business does.

                                                                                        Real businesses eat losses all the time from companies that go bankrupt or are delinquent. Affiliates live in a delusional world of business that does not reflect reality.

                                                                                        If every company who got stiffed by another company chose never to do business with that company ever again, our entire economy would grind to a halt. In the real world, hurt feelings don't matter.. there is no 'code' like there is in the fantasy world of Adult internet.
                                                                                        That's realistic as fuckall. Servers in Croatia, incorporated in Panama, shell corp in US for money, operations located anywhere they can plug in a computer. One affiliate gets ripped for $400 - 500 bucks and you say get a lawyer for, what, 5 grand? Of course there is no difference, this is real business. Stealing is still stealing. Sure don't need any lessons about it from you.
                                                                                        CryptoFeeds

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • Shoplifter
                                                                                            Richest man in Babylon
                                                                                            • Jan 2002
                                                                                            • 5848
                                                                                            #73
                                                                                            Face it, most of these sites were simply front ends for card theft. And theft is what has largely been floating the adult online industry for the past few years.

                                                                                            Very few of these programs would be able to run as revshare on their own merits.
                                                                                            I Like Blondes

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              • Dollarmansteve
                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                • May 2005
                                                                                                • 2849
                                                                                                #74
                                                                                                Originally posted by ruff
                                                                                                That's realistic as fuckall. Servers in Croatia, incorporated in Panama, shell corp in US for money, operations located anywhere they can plug in a computer. One affiliate gets ripped for $400 - 500 bucks and you say get a lawyer for, what, 5 grand? Of course there is no difference, this is real business. Stealing is still stealing. Sure don't need any lessons about it from you.
                                                                                                The only thing that matters is what one chooses to do about it, not the fact that it happened.
                                                                                                I died.

                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                  • Brujah
                                                                                                    Beer Money Baron
                                                                                                    • Jan 2001
                                                                                                    • 22157
                                                                                                    #75
                                                                                                    Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                                                                    The only thing that matters is what one chooses to do about it, not the fact that it happened.
                                                                                                    Sure, they're just discussing it at the moment but guess what? So are you. How many posts have you made in this topic so far? What's the difference? There isn't one.

                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                      • Dollarmansteve
                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                        • May 2005
                                                                                                        • 2849
                                                                                                        #76
                                                                                                        Originally posted by Brujah
                                                                                                        Sure, they're just discussing it at the moment but guess what? So are you. How many posts have you made in this topic so far? What's the difference? There isn't one.
                                                                                                        What are you talking about? I liked it better when you were focused on personal attacks.
                                                                                                        I died.

                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                          • Brujah
                                                                                                            Beer Money Baron
                                                                                                            • Jan 2001
                                                                                                            • 22157
                                                                                                            #77
                                                                                                            Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                                                                            What are you talking about? I liked it better when you were focused on personal attacks.
                                                                                                            My daddy can beat up your daddy.

                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                              • epitome
                                                                                                                So Fucking Lame
                                                                                                                • Jun 2009
                                                                                                                • 12156
                                                                                                                #78
                                                                                                                First off, it is still very possible to do $30 PPS on $1 trials if you're doing things correctly.

                                                                                                                What I suspect is a lot of these companies refused to contain costs when the writing was on the wall and the owner(s) also refused to compromise their own lifestyles. That creates a disaster.

                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                  • TheDoc
                                                                                                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                    • Jul 2001
                                                                                                                    • 13827
                                                                                                                    #79
                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Brujah
                                                                                                                    What do you profit 50% more on? Residual links that they forgot about maybe, but if they're not sending you traffic anymore then you're not profiting on any of it. Someone else is.
                                                                                                                    They profit 50% on all of the rebills that they would normally pay out on.

                                                                                                                    Often on the smaller, or dropped in size, or dieing revshare program, the recurring members is the bulk of the payout to affiliates. Programs like this basically live on the rebills, the new sales just kind half ass hold it together.
                                                                                                                    ~TheDoc - ICQ7765825
                                                                                                                    It's all disambiguation

                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                      • datatank
                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                        • Aug 2004
                                                                                                                        • 5471
                                                                                                                        #80
                                                                                                                        Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                        yeah I would like to know myself as well... what does that $70-$90 include all of the cross sales/ up sells they do off of the person as well?

                                                                                                                        No way any "average" membership is going to generate $70 - $90 just from membership fees even if the monthly charge is $35, that would still be an average retention rate of 2-3 months. I find that hard to believe that many pic and vid sites are doing that much less it being an average.
                                                                                                                        Lets see if The Doc will give us a real answer

                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                          • Dollarmansteve
                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                            • May 2005
                                                                                                                            • 2849
                                                                                                                            #81
                                                                                                                            Margin doesn't mean Jack when you don't make enough gross profit. Would you rather sell 5 cups of $1.50 coffee at 1000% mark-up or 1 $10 sandwich at 300% mark-up? Who cares - rent is $100 a day, you lose.

                                                                                                                            In other words, a variable cost will never put you out of business unless you go full-retard.
                                                                                                                            Last edited by Dollarmansteve; 07-21-2010, 12:33 PM.
                                                                                                                            I died.

                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                              • Supz
                                                                                                                                Arthur Flegenheimer
                                                                                                                                • Jul 2006
                                                                                                                                • 11057
                                                                                                                                #82
                                                                                                                                This way they still have all the affiliate incoming links to the site and they dont have to pay anyone.

                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                  • TheDoc
                                                                                                                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                                    • Jul 2001
                                                                                                                                    • 13827
                                                                                                                                    #83
                                                                                                                                    Average: Some sites do better than others...

                                                                                                                                    The math is based off the long term retention ratio. It's the entire life span of the site, after it has had at least one full year to cycle over its rebills, basically double stacking them.

                                                                                                                                    So if you add the total sales and rebills income and divide by the total number of sales minus rebills, you get the join value of the site. The more time that is added in, the more the join value is, assuming the site doesn't blow ass.

                                                                                                                                    It can be skewed too, if a site only takes in a few sales but built a large rebill base, as time passes without sales the larger the skew will be. So you run the stats from the drop point, and back... If you re-fire a site back up, it could skew it's 'new real' numbers, so it's best to reset your starting date.
                                                                                                                                    Last edited by TheDoc; 07-21-2010, 12:50 PM.
                                                                                                                                    ~TheDoc - ICQ7765825
                                                                                                                                    It's all disambiguation

                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                      • will76
                                                                                                                                        Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                                                                                                                                        • May 2003
                                                                                                                                        • 18037
                                                                                                                                        #84
                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Dollarmansteve
                                                                                                                                        By your not being a 1-man show then I guess you are not included in the group of "1-man show affiliates" that I was referring to. Eat that logic boy.
                                                                                                                                        in the words of Sleazy dream, " your an idiot! "
                                                                                                                                        ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

                                                                                                                                        PROGRAM SHIT LIST - DO NOT PROMOTE (click link for gfy thread)
                                                                                                                                        FNCash | Media Revenue

                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                          • will76
                                                                                                                                            Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                                                                                                                                            • May 2003
                                                                                                                                            • 18037
                                                                                                                                            #85
                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by TheDoc
                                                                                                                                            They profit 50% on all of the rebills that they would normally pay out on.

                                                                                                                                            Often on the smaller, or dropped in size, or dieing revshare program, the recurring members is the bulk of the payout to affiliates. Programs like this basically live on the rebills, the new sales just kind half ass hold it together.
                                                                                                                                            You kind of sound like Fatfoo on that reply. It doesn't matter if it is new sales or rebills, they both pay out 50%... Only difference is that less new sales = shrinking rebill base of revenue, but that has nothing to do with what you were saying.
                                                                                                                                            ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

                                                                                                                                            PROGRAM SHIT LIST - DO NOT PROMOTE (click link for gfy thread)
                                                                                                                                            FNCash | Media Revenue

                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                              • KingpinMedia
                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                • Jan 2005
                                                                                                                                                • 834
                                                                                                                                                #86
                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by Jakez
                                                                                                                                                I really don't understand why these sponsors are closing their affiliate programs, sure you can't offer $30+ PPS anymore for obvious reasons, but what is the harm in running revshare?

                                                                                                                                                It doesn't make any damn sense that they have to turn away affiliates who are sending them traffic and sales.. we are on commission not salary.
                                                                                                                                                didn't you run a celeb program at one time?


                                                                                                                                                Jason Forrest is a scammer. Pay me my 15k bitch.
                                                                                                                                                http://www.jason-forrest.com/
                                                                                                                                                K-Man, Media and Moses are also scammers

                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                  • stocktrader23
                                                                                                                                                    Let's do some business.
                                                                                                                                                    • Jan 2003
                                                                                                                                                    • 18781
                                                                                                                                                    #87
                                                                                                                                                    Most of the apologists here fail to take into consideration the shitpile of 'clean' signups programs get thanks to affiliates doing all of the branding. It is an insane amount of people that click on an affiliate link but sign up without credit going to an affiliate.

                                                                                                                                                    The programs closing are either run by morons or are stealing your money.

                                                                                                                                                    That is all.


                                                                                                                                                    Hands Free Adult - Join Once, Earn For Life

                                                                                                                                                    "I try to make a habit of bouncing my eyes up to the face of a beautiful woman, and often repeat “not mine” in my head or even verbally. She’s not mine. God has her set aside. She’s not mine. She’s His little girl, and she needs me to fight for her by keeping my eyes where they should be."

                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                      • signupdamnit
                                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                        • Aug 2007
                                                                                                                                                        • 6697
                                                                                                                                                        #88
                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by seeandsee
                                                                                                                                                        they then open new program and enjoy in life...
                                                                                                                                                        Only if you let them get away with it.

                                                                                                                                                        You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                                          • will76
                                                                                                                                                            Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                                                                                                                                                            • May 2003
                                                                                                                                                            • 18037
                                                                                                                                                            #89
                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by stocktrader23
                                                                                                                                                            Most of the apologists here fail to take into consideration the shitpile of 'clean' signups programs get thanks to affiliates doing all of the branding. It is an insane amount of people that click on an affiliate link but sign up without credit going to an affiliate.

                                                                                                                                                            The programs closing are either run by morons or are stealing your money.

                                                                                                                                                            That is all.
                                                                                                                                                            Very good point that no one mentioned yet in this thread. The affiliates brand the hell out of different programs, and sometimes the customer comes back later through google search or type in. We all know sign ups are "lost" along the way depending on the program. Whether it is transaction that is declined, but retried 2 weeks later and goes through and the affiliate might not get paid depending on the program. Or the person enters in their email address but doesn't sign up, the program emails them promos and then the person signs up but the affiliate doesn't get credit.

                                                                                                                                                            Then there is intentional and unintentional erorrs.

                                                                                                                                                            There is straight up traffic leaks.

                                                                                                                                                            Affiliates generate a lot of free joins for programs.


                                                                                                                                                            I once joined a dating site after I signed up to be an affiliate because I wanted to see how it worked since they were only offering me revshare (50%). On a fucking revshare deal they still had 2 prechecked cross sales on the join page. Neither of which I got paid a penny from. Then when the person logged in for the first time, instead of seeing the members area there was another "up sell" that was tricky, to another membership site (didn't get paid on that one either). Then there was traffic leaks all over, paid ads, etc... none of which I got paid on. So I asked, you hit the person with about $200 a month of fees, plus the ad space you selling that my traffic is going to that I make nothing from, and you want to give me 50% of just the main site membership and nothing else. Crazy. The first statement the customer gets and sees 4 memberships he is going to cancel them all. so I make 50% of 1 membership fee, the site made 50% of 1 and 100% of 4 plus all t he other shit. bullshit.
                                                                                                                                                            Last edited by will76; 07-21-2010, 07:51 PM.
                                                                                                                                                            ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

                                                                                                                                                            PROGRAM SHIT LIST - DO NOT PROMOTE (click link for gfy thread)
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                                                                                                                                                              • potter
                                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                • Dec 2004
                                                                                                                                                                • 6559
                                                                                                                                                                #90
                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                                                                Which part do you not fucking get. They are lieing to you. No affiliate program is closing down because of the overhead being too much for the affiliate program to stay in existence. So what all they have to do is fire the reps, stop updating promos. Big fucking deal. They keep the program open. There are affiliates out there like me, I don't need a rep and I don't use your promos, I make my own. All I need the company to do is send me my fucking money. Which is the one thing they DONT WANT TO DO and is why they closed down their program = EXIT STRATEGY.

                                                                                                                                                                Jesus christ you are thick in the head you keep going on and on trying to justify a line of shit that these programs are feeding you and you can't accept the obvious truth, they closed down the affiliate program because they didn't want to send out "xxxxxx" in affilaite payments for the couple periods still owed, they put that money in their pocket, they make 100% on all future rebills, they let their staff go, they cut back expenses as much as possible and they put the sites on cruise control. They can live off of the fucking rebills for probably a year or so and it prolongs them having to get a JOB.
                                                                                                                                                                Your over the top GIANT CAPITAL LETTERS don't really make a point. I already stated, the majority of the time - it's obviously going to be a financial decision.

                                                                                                                                                                The obvious problem with your theory is the fact it's laden with emotion and the oversight of a business plan.

                                                                                                                                                                You're saying program A isn't doing that great, but still making money. Instead of moving forward with their business, they decide it would be more lucrative to end their business and turn into scammers. So the following day, they end the adult affiliate business they had running, and plan to make OMG SO MUCH MONEY (notice the caps) by closing their doors and keeping all the rebills at a whopping 40-50% more than they were.

                                                                                                                                                                So, the likely scenario is: Program Y makes Z sales each month. Their affiliate program costs R each month and R is less than the F the affiliate program makes them each month. --- So they close it!

                                                                                                                                                                Your theory is: Program D makes P each month. They are making a solid B each month off their affiliate program. Instead of continuing with that B each month, they are going to drop the program to scam the very minimal % increase of B sales each month.

                                                                                                                                                                Do you not understand how backwards that is?

                                                                                                                                                                Your basically saying (for those that didn't pass algebra), that instead of choosing a solid steady income through the future. The program is deciding to take a temporarily higher but rapidly declining income for the short future.



                                                                                                                                                                Oh, and I'm not an affiliate. So I'm not worried about "them lying to me".

                                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                                  • GrouchyAdmin
                                                                                                                                                                    Now choke yourself!
                                                                                                                                                                    • Apr 2006
                                                                                                                                                                    • 12085
                                                                                                                                                                    #91
                                                                                                                                                                    If a company could split their expenses 50% with an affiliate, what the hell, why not?

                                                                                                                                                                    You sent one sale that was worth $29. You have $14.50.

                                                                                                                                                                    NATS Tier 1 costs: $150/mo
                                                                                                                                                                    Elevated X costs: $150/mo
                                                                                                                                                                    Cheaper bandwidth: $5/mbit (average), let's say 30mbit sustained.
                                                                                                                                                                    Server rental: $450/mo (Let's say one members area, one NATS, relatively small program).
                                                                                                                                                                    Ok, so, processor fees are 12%, so your $14.50 is now $13.63 (that's 6%).

                                                                                                                                                                    Now, where can you be invoiced for the outstanding balance of $436.37?

                                                                                                                                                                    That is, of course, assuming that the content and employees work for free.

                                                                                                                                                                    This is just an entirely non-sustainable model if you can't keep the numbers up. Period. Now, send another 200 joins, and hey, both make money. But at these margins? Nuh-uh.

                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                      • The Ghost
                                                                                                                                                                        IslandDollars.com
                                                                                                                                                                        • Oct 2004
                                                                                                                                                                        • 12188
                                                                                                                                                                        #92
                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                                                                        That has nothing to do with an affiliate program. If they can't pay their overhead to stay in business with their own traffic then their business is the problem and getting rid of the affiliate program wont help save the business. It will however allow them to stuff their pockets as they walk out the door and put the company on cruise control. They will continue to make rebills and they can let staff go, not buy new content, and run things bare bones.
                                                                                                                                                                        Not all programs/sites have their own traffic. At least not enough inhouse generated sales to come close to sustaining production for a growing site. They can incur debt just like any other business. Also why there are so many dead sites comprised of 30 or less scenes (even exclusive ones).


                                                                                                                                                                        The thread's about how an affiliate program not afford to stay open which was outlined above well by others. Unless the OP meant how a developed revshare site/program becomes one that doesn't pay out anymore, which is theft under the guise of "going out of business."
                                                                                                                                                                        ISLAND DOLLARS
                                                                                                                                                                        1000's of Exclusive TS scenes / Constant Updates
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                                                                                                                                                                          • will76
                                                                                                                                                                            Making $$$$ w/ ClickCash
                                                                                                                                                                            • May 2003
                                                                                                                                                                            • 18037
                                                                                                                                                                            #93
                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by potter

                                                                                                                                                                            Oh, and I'm not an affiliate. So I'm not worried about "them lying to me".
                                                                                                                                                                            OK GOOD FOR YOU THEN
                                                                                                                                                                            ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

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                                                                                                                                                                              • TheDoc
                                                                                                                                                                                Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                                                                                • Jul 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                • 13827
                                                                                                                                                                                #94
                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                                                                                You kind of sound like Fatfoo on that reply. It doesn't matter if it is new sales or rebills, they both pay out 50%... Only difference is that less new sales = shrinking rebill base of revenue, but that has nothing to do with what you were saying.
                                                                                                                                                                                The rebills don't drop any faster than they naturally would already - the difference is they aren't replaced, so it's still a 50% profit in the rebills, either way.

                                                                                                                                                                                Aye, no reason to say less sales = shrinking rebills, that's a given.


                                                                                                                                                                                With your other reply above to stocktrader, most programs sit at 10% natural sales from affiliates, type-ins, etc. Unless the program has traffic of it's own, which almost none do. As soon as affiliates stop, that dries up.
                                                                                                                                                                                ~TheDoc - ICQ7765825
                                                                                                                                                                                It's all disambiguation

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                                                                                                                                                                                  • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                    Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                                                    • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                    • 75733
                                                                                                                                                                                    #95
                                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Jakez
                                                                                                                                                                                    Ok but I still don't understand how someone could be dumb enough to turn away money if they are closing it for financial reasons.. it doesn't cost anything to run revshare besides bandwidth. Like wegcash for example, I have typeins for one of their sites and went to grab some tools and they're closed, haven't they been around forever?

                                                                                                                                                                                    Has to be some kind of explanation.
                                                                                                                                                                                    That's not always true....

                                                                                                                                                                                    Depending on how big a company is. If solo girls / models are involved, a percentage of sales from a certain site goes to them. Even under the revshare model, if 60% goes to the affiliate, and 20% goes to the model, that leaves 20% to pay for all other expenses including hosting. I don't even own any paysites and I pay $700 a year for domain names.

                                                                                                                                                                                    Bigger companies like Wegcash, well, they have a big staff and an office. They have huge expenses. They can lay off their staff, but then they have no one to run stuff - something crashes, no programmers to fix it. Affiliate issues? No one to help, no one sends traffic.
                                                                                                                                                                                    Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                                                    Brooklyn, NY

                                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                      • potter
                                                                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                        • Dec 2004
                                                                                                                                                                                        • 6559
                                                                                                                                                                                        #96
                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                                                                                        OK GOOD FOR YOU THEN
                                                                                                                                                                                        You stated earlier:

                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                                                                                        I am an affiliate. I was posting in this thread and I agreed with the original poster.
                                                                                                                                                                                        Then you stated to me. (As some sort of validation to a point you were trying to make)

                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by will76
                                                                                                                                                                                        Jesus christ you are thick in the head you keep going on and on trying to justify a line of shit that these programs are feeding you and you can't accept the obvious truth, they closed down the affiliate program because they didn't want to send out "xxxxxx" in affilaite payments for the couple periods still owed, they put that money in their pocket, they make 100% on all future rebills, they let their staff go, they cut back expenses as much as possible and they put the sites on cruise control. They can live off of the fucking rebills for probably a year or so and it prolongs them having to get a JOB.
                                                                                                                                                                                        When I never made any statement relating to any previous program or any specific situation. I was making a clear observation on business decisions based on financials in the hypothetical question from the op.

                                                                                                                                                                                        And the reply I made which you quoted was a direct response to the quote above. You tried making a point that my statements had something to do with what programs were feeding me. When there is no program "feeding me" anything. Today is the longest I've spent on GFY in a year. I have no knowledge of any drama or bullshit posted on these forums. My points were made specifically off common sense and business logic.

                                                                                                                                                                                        As I said:

                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by potter
                                                                                                                                                                                        The obvious problem with your theory is the fact it's laden with emotion and the oversight of a business plan.
                                                                                                                                                                                        Let me know if you want to get back to the adult discussion and can leave the emotion and CAPITAL letters aside.

                                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                          • potter
                                                                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                            • Dec 2004
                                                                                                                                                                                            • 6559
                                                                                                                                                                                            #97
                                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                            That's not always true....

                                                                                                                                                                                            Depending on how big a company is. If solo girls / models are involved, a percentage of sales from a certain site goes to them. Even under the revshare model, if 60% goes to the affiliate, and 20% goes to the model, that leaves 20% to pay for all other expenses including hosting. I don't even own any paysites and I pay $700 a year for domain names.

                                                                                                                                                                                            Bigger companies like Wegcash, well, they have a big staff and an office. They have huge expenses. They can lay off their staff, but then they have no one to run stuff - something crashes, no programmers to fix it. Affiliate issues? No one to help, no one sends traffic.
                                                                                                                                                                                            Uh oh, someone making some sense. Better wait for the doom and gloom "they're all out to get us" crowd to try and refute what you're saying.


                                                                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                              • Brujah
                                                                                                                                                                                                Beer Money Baron
                                                                                                                                                                                                • Jan 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                • 22157
                                                                                                                                                                                                #98
                                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by potter
                                                                                                                                                                                                Uh oh, someone making some sense. Better wait for the doom and gloom "they're all out to get us" crowd to try and refute what you're saying.

                                                                                                                                                                                                but at the same time some of you (Rochard, you, etc...) are making it sound like running a revshare program is virtually impossible, and obviously it isn't. There are thousands of programs on ccbill alone that are proving you wrong. Of course you can throw a zillion variables at it to skew it one way or the other but at the end of the day the mere fact that so many are doing it just fine, is proof that it can be done. If you want to do it.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                  • aubreythree
                                                                                                                                                                                                    So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • Sep 2007
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • 435
                                                                                                                                                                                                    #99
                                                                                                                                                                                                    yup, that's right

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Chosen
                                                                                                                                                                                                        VIPPay.com | AdultWebSponsors.com
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • Aug 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • 63151
                                                                                                                                                                                                        #100
                                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by area51
                                                                                                                                                                                                        The majority of them keep their sites up even though they close their affiliate program. They never end up paying affiliates what they are owed, or past rebills anymore. Complete fraud.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

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