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Originally Posted by TheDoc
And with it are lots of other changes coming too, tax code adjustments, tax havens, budget changes, wars ending. It's not one thing happening, several things are changing and healthcare is just one of them. Saying this bill wouldn't help the poor is simply crazy talk, of course it will help... like saying the VA or Medicare doesn't get used. Of course people need it.
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Okay, what in this bill helps anyone who is poor or middle class i.e. not the tax haven stuff for the wealthy, just what you think is new and helpful?
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That was in reference to cancer, not childbirth.
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Your math was that a $20k bill for childbirth equaled about 2.2 years of premiums. If so, then how can 33 years of premiums be less than $100k?
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Never heard of your insurance bills being more than the treatment would cost.
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How do you think insurance companies make money? You understand they are, in our current system, for-profit?
Do you understand that my whole objection to being forced to buy insurance is that I have done the math and understand that insurance will almost certainly cost me more over a lifetime than healthcare will?
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No.. I'm saying some people can't afford $30 and you helping pay will make it so they can. 
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Many grocery stores and drugstores already give flu shots out for free to the needy. Maybe some people in rural areas have trouble getting them, but we need more doctors in rural areas anyway. That is an entirely additional issue, which should have been addressed in this bill. Is there something about flu shots in this healthcare bill?
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AMP was talking about outlawing it. I want to regulate it. I loved the Canadian system and think we should be working to get ours working somewhat like they have.
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My point was that Canada didn't have to outlaw it or regulate it to get rid of the abuses; they just gave people a decent and obvious alternative.
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Not sure what you mean by limit immigration, it's not hard to move to Canada, become a citizen or even work in Canada & have health insurance too. They offer an extremely fast path compared to America.
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Canada does not permit elderly Americans to buy property there because they fear abuses of their healthcare system.
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I've pissed in like 500 cups and taken 100's of physicals, never once was I embarrassed. If the person is, they should seek mental treatments. I think if my tax dollars are going to pay for it, I don't want to be paying for people that "choose" to take the worst personal routes on my dime.
I think they should do it with food stamps and all welfare as well.
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So, if someone loses their job because they are a drug addict and it eventually impacts their performance, you think, as a society, we should let them starve in the street? If someone eats cheap fattening food, instead of more healthy expensive food, then, when they hit a certain weight, you think, as a society, we should let them starve in the street? I don't think that is where your heart is at, so you must just not have thought this through.
I'm not embarrassed to piss in a cup for a lab test my doctor and I agree I need. I'm not embarrassed to get a physical. I think there is an element of subjugation and domination, however, in a government requiring access to such personal information.
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Sure I get it... but your dream isn't going to happen. Nobody is going to take out a multi-billion/trillion dollar Industry, it will never happen. What they would do is regulate it though.
I also think if you removed insurance all together it would require the gov to step in and create a massive regulatory body that would greatly expand the size of gov and its costs. The insurance companies regulate lots of shit right now, someone would still need to make sure it's done and done fairly. They do fill a gap with more than just insurance.
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We don't need to outlaw health insurance. Trying to regulate something that complex is going to be pretty impossible, with so much money from that industry going into politicians' coffers, and laymen having such a minimal understanding of the structure.
Just offer a decent alternative, as they do in Canada, and let the market take its course.