Should The Muslim Veil Be Banned In USA?

[Vendot]

Its banned in France and according to a sky poll it seems like over 80% want it banned in the UK.... whats your view about in USA?

I just cant get my head around this. It feels a bit racist and over the top to ban something like a headdress which is a part of the muslim culture, and looks like an attack on civil liberties. Maybe im missing something, so lets hear some views on this.

[Bladewire]

Muslim isn't a race, it's a religion. There are muslims of all races that wear the veil.

[Vendot]

Originally Posted by Squirtit

Muslim isn't a race, it's a religion. There are muslims of all races that wear the veil.

Good point.

[CamsMaster]

to be honest yes, I respect them and their religion, and in the same way I respect them, as long as they are in my country at my home they should respect me and not wear that Veil as I am not wearing it.

[TheLegacy]

Until such time that there is equality with American's visiting their country then stands to reason that we offer the same courtesy that is given to us.

[Vendot]

Originally Posted by CamsMaster

to be honest yes, I respect them and their religion, and in the same way I respect them, as long as they are in my country at my home they should respect me and not wear that Veil as I am not wearing it.

Why does the fact that you are not wearing it, make it such that they should not wear it simply because they are different? I appreciate the point but I dont understand the logic as their wearing it does not actually affect you in a negative way.

[Vendzilla]

It's all good till 5 veiled gunmen rob the 1st national bank

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

Until such time that there is equality with American's visiting their country then stands to reason that we offer the same courtesy that is given to us.

X 2

[pornguy]

In the US many states have a law against covering the face in an effort to conceal identity. They dont use it often.

Wonder how it would hold up with this?

[Amputate Your Head]

Fuck 'em. Ban that shit.

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by Vendot

Its banned in France and according to a sky poll it seems like over 80% want it banned in the UK.... whats your view about in USA?

I just cant get my head around this. It feels a bit racist and over the top to ban something like a headdress which is a part of the muslim culture, and looks like an attack on civil liberties. Maybe im missing something, so lets hear some views on this.

they should ban the burka from the world

[Bladewire]

Being in adult we ALL know there are limits to our freedom of expression.

Honor killings are illegal in the U.S. but not in the Middle East.

Burkas are a means of suppressing women and should be illegal for that reason alone.

[Tom_PM]

Ok, yeah it has a weird "feel" to it.. But think of it this way, if a councilman or mayor of a city wanted to "ban" adult book stores "X" number of miles from schools, very few would disagree about the intent behind it. Many would jump right on that bandwagon publically too if it's what their base voters would want. However, existing zoning laws already cover that scenario! So there is no real need for some headline grabbing new law.

That was actually an issue in Illinois when a newbie state senator voted no and pointed out that existing law already bans it and went on to be president.

This is sort of the way it is with a full face veil. It's already law on the books that you cant be covering your entire face all day long in most cities. Perhaps there is no need for some new religion-based ban that has a discrimination feel to it. We want smaller governments anyway I'm told.

[Sly]

I do not support the taking away of yet another civil liberty in the name of "security." At this point, religious expression is a civil liberty and Islam is one of the largest religions in the world.

I can hide a bomb in my wheelchair that would level a building. Lets ban 'em!

[spazlabz]

Originally Posted by Sly

I do not support the taking away of yet another civil liberty in the name of "security." At this point, religious expression is a civil liberty and Islam is one of the largest religions in the world.

I can hide a bomb in my wheelchair that would level a building. Lets ban 'em!

[LiveDose]

Could care less unless it's a security check point or something similar. I am more concerned about the extremists.

[PR_Glen]

this sounds more like fashion police more than anything else... women have the right to dress as they wish in north america, let them...

[jigga]

The burqa was around long before Islam became a religion, and as such, its roots aren't religious based. Several verses in the Quran regarding modesty were interpreted by man as making the burqa mandatory, but those are open to debate. There's actually only a few middle eastern countries which have laws that make the burqa mandatory for women (which I personally don't agree with).

In most countries around the world Muslim women have the right to choose whether to wear it or not. And as much as some in the Western world can't phantom why a woman would choose to wear one, there's many Muslim women who actually enjoy the practice. Thus it's quite hypocritical for a government to restrict the usage of them (which in France is a low % of Muslim women) in the name of equality.

[_Richard_]

like, for SURE man

next we should be putting these guys in camps for sassing us

[nation-x]

Why not outlaw sacred undergarments, Kippah, Mitre or those black shirts with the white square ties that priests wear while your at it... the constitution protects freedom of religion last time I checked.

[cykoe6]

I would love to see it banned in the UK and France...... but it seems pretty obviously unconstitutional to ban it in the US (for better of for worse).

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

Until such time that there is equality with American's visiting their country then stands to reason that we offer the same courtesy that is given to us.

True fucking dat.

[_Richard_]

and for you 12 that voted in favour of this ridiculous bs while peole are fucking starving and dying, here is a poem

First They came... - Pastor Martin Niemoller
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally Posted by _Richard_

and for you 12 that voted in favour of this ridiculous bs while peole are fucking starving and dying, here is a poem

First They came... - Pastor Martin Niemoller
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.

Fear monger.

[DWB]

Yes, ban them.

Wear it in your house, but if you go out take off.

As someone else said, if you walked around with a Halloween mask on everywhere you went, you would sooner or later be surrounded by police and probably arrested.

Walk into a bank, government building or police station with a mask on and see what happens.

[Sid70]

Please, do wear this to enter my country:

[jigga]

Originally Posted by DWB

Yes, ban them.

Wear it in your house, but if you go out take off.

As someone else said, if you walked around with a Halloween mask on everywhere you went, you would sooner or later be surrounded by police and probably arrested.

Walk into a bank, government building or police station with a mask on and see what happens.

Let's ban wearing hats and sunglasses in public too! Hooray for civil liberties!

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by Amputate Your Head

Fear monger.

fair enough, but this happened to be written by a german who probably was called a 'fear monger' up till he was arrested and thrown in prison for 8 years for daring to question state-controlled churches

my question is, how many times do we need to point to this historical piece of 'i told you so' before we start making some fundamental conclusions about the direction every nation here is deviating from it's roots

[Scott McD]

Try walking through a shopping mall or airport with your face covered, and you won't get very far before someone is on to you.

Why the rules don't apply to them is beyond me.

Ban the fuckers! And if they don't like it, send them back to a country where they can wear it...

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by jigga

Let's ban wearing hats and sunglasses in public too! Hooray for civil liberties!

Stupid to even compare it with those...

[mchacal]

I vote for a ban

[jigga]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

Stupid to even compare it with those...

how do you figure?

[Vendot]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

Try walking through a shopping mall or airport with your face covered, and you won't get very far before someone is on to you.

Why the rules don't apply to them is beyond me.

Ban the fuckers! And if they don't like it, send them back to a country where they can wear it...

Dood, I dont know what to make of this as Ive always had you down as a bit of a thicko not to mention a racist.

Having said that, I agree with your point about shopping mall or airport. I dont see why in specific zones it cannot be banned if its required for a security purpose but in that case, you need to ban all kinds of face coverings and face masks. Why target a specific section of the population and specific dress.

I guess if it was an outright ban, then at least it should stop those anarchists from hiding their faces during student riots... thats not to say i agree with it though.

[heatwaves]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

Until such time that there is equality with American's visiting their country then stands to reason that we offer the same courtesy that is given to us.

[Rochard]

I fail to see the need to ban the veil until it becomes a security issue. At the airport when they need to ID you, you'll need to take off the veil. If you refuse, then it's an issue.

In the mean time, feel free to walk around with a dress on your head and look like an idiot. I was in Balboa Park in San Diego this weekend, and there was one woman there with the full gown and veil on. She stood out like a sore thumb. If you don't want people to point at you and make fun of you, then don't dress like an idiot. I'm pretty confident that my male Irish ancestors didn't wear skirts when they first landed in the US, and I've never seen anyone in the US wearing lederhosen.

[BFT3K]

You can only wear costumes on Halloween.

[INever]

I think we should ban divisive polls.

[brassmonkey]

ill make up a robber religion. we can wear any color bandanna. we just look like robbers.

[CamsMaster]

Originally Posted by Vendot

Why does the fact that you are not wearing it, make it such that they should not wear it simply because they are different? I appreciate the point but I dont understand the logic as their wearing it does not actually affect you in a negative way.

to clear things up, I am a guy, I will definitely not wear such a thing on my face or a (turban), and yes once again I understand that they are wearing it this...coz is their tradition...and they were burn and grow up within this culture.... I perfectly understand but that doesn't give them the right to apply the same habits in a foreign country... they are at my home, they are a minority and they should act as a minority. Let's be honest if by chance meet an Arab women with a Muslim Vail on her face... to be honest you don't even know who you are talking to.. I am not a US, contrary I am an European, but I am fucking tired of accepting all the minorities shits, protecting them and so on... who's protecting me ? let's say I would go to an Arab country do you think they will allow me to scream on the street's I love Jesus ? Jesus is the best, Jesus is my god ? or to wear a kilt ? I don't think so... so I agree with the French people on this one, and I think you should do it as well.

[AmeliaG]

In the USA, we have a little thing called Separation of Church and State. That means the government does not get to legislate on this sort of thing. As a patriotic American, I'm embarrassed that anyone in my country would even be discussing this as a potentially good idea.

[halfpint]

I would like to see this banned in the UK as well. You go to thier countries and you have to abide by thier rules. They come here they should abide by our rules and if they dont like it they should go back to where they come from ...Infact they can all bugger off and give the jobs back to the real British people

And good on France for doing what the people of France wanted

[moeloubani]

The idea of laws is that when someone commits a crime, you arrest them, charge them and then let a judge/jury decide what to do with them.

The idea of arresting someone purely for hiding their face is like arresting someone for a precrime. Should people be ticketed for buying fast cars because they COULD break the speed limit?

I'd much rather go up against a guy wearing a mask than a guy with an assault rifle yet Americans feel it's perfectly okay to have an assault rifle and even carry it out in public. How can people be so scared of a piece of cloth and so okay with AK-47s in every home just beats me.

[potter]

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

In the USA, we have a little thing called Separation of Church and State. That means the government does not get to legislate on this sort of thing. As a patriotic American, I'm embarrassed that anyone in my country would even be discussing this as a potentially good idea.

Yup.. It's disgusting people voted yes.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by potter

Yup.. It's disgusting people voted yes.

Why is it disgusting ? Its pretty clear to me if you live or visit another country you abide by thier laws and if you dont like what the people of the country want you dont go there.

[potter]

Originally Posted by halfpint

Why is it disgusting ? Its pretty clear to me if you live or visit another country you abide by thier laws and if you dont like what the people of the country want you dont go there.

Yes, and the law of this country is you can wear whatever the hell you want. You've heard of the fucking constitution right?

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally Posted by potter

Yes, and the law of this country is you can wear whatever the hell you want. You've heard of the fucking constitution right?

What part of the Constitution outlines clothing rights?

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by potter

Yes, and the law of this country is you can wear whatever the hell you want. You've heard of the fucking constitution right?

nope lol im from the fucking UK

[potter]

Originally Posted by Amputate Your Head

What part of the Constitution outlines clothing rights?

In this case specially... The first.

[DWB]

Originally Posted by potter

Yup.. It's disgusting people voted yes.

It's OK when an Arab woman (or the think it's a woman) walks though immigration at the airport, coming from Afghanistan, and NO ONE is allowed to look at her face to see if the person under the birka is her or not? Even better, the photo in the ID is of them in a fucking birka?

This is OK?

Are you allowed to enter your own country in a mask? No. But they can.

Fuck 'em. If they don't like it, leave.

[Sly]

Originally Posted by halfpint

Why is it disgusting ? Its pretty clear to me if you live or visit another country you abide by thier laws and if you dont like what the people of the country want you dont go there.

How does that apply to citizens of that country?

A lot of the counter arguments in this thread are based on visiting countries and following customs. Guess what people? You have homegrown Muslims as well. They aren't even visiting! Real citizens that pay taxes!

What exactly is the security risk of a veil? Are they going to hide a bomb behind their veil that would not fit underneath their cloak (sorry I don't know the right word)?