the most important photography lesson there is: - GoFuckYourself.com

Grapesoda · 05-14-2011, 03:44 PM

http://laurencekim.com/2011/04/28/th...merican-dream/

AaronM · 05-14-2011, 04:48 PM

Interesting read.

Thanks for sharing.

aztecboi2003 · 05-14-2011, 04:54 PM

Good read, thanks

suesheboy · 05-14-2011, 04:56 PM

now that was a great find. For much of it substitute "photographer" for "webmaster"

billywatson · 05-14-2011, 05:01 PM

WOW -- what a great read!

L-Pink · 05-14-2011, 05:04 PM

Thank you, interesting read. And I do own commercial real estate, lol

Mr Cheeks · 05-14-2011, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bm bradley

http://laurencekim.com/2011/04/28/th...merican-dream/

nice. thanx for sharing

justinsain · 05-14-2011, 05:08 PM

I'm going to send that link to everyone that doesn't understand me

Everything is pretty much spot on. I especially liked the part about branding.
It drives me crazy when I go to a site like MM and see photographers with logos
that take up a third of the image. It's never about who has the biggest and fanciest logo. It should be about your work.

Thanks for posting

Deej · 05-14-2011, 05:14 PM

Thanks for the lead... ill read this fully later...

NemesisEnforcer · 05-14-2011, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bm bradley

http://laurencekim.com/2011/04/28/th...merican-dream/

Sounds like he attended the WPPI Convention in Vegas back in February.

NaughtyRob · 05-14-2011, 07:10 PM

Very interesting stuff.

ottopottomouse · 05-15-2011, 03:09 AM

Good read

AsianDivaGirlsWebDude · 05-15-2011, 03:24 AM

The 2nd Most Important Photography Lesson:

ADG

SimonScans · 05-15-2011, 03:29 AM

This is precisely why I quit mainstream photography to run my own site. Can't say it's turning out to be much different, but there ya go.

There's also another aspect to photography that's not mentioned - People want to be photographers for no other reason than they just want to. So at the lowest level you aren't even competing with other businesses, you're competing with trustafarians with inherited wealth, mid life crisis career changers and plain idiots who think they'll never pay any tax or need a pension or a health plan - all of them prepared to work at far below cost, because they ultimately don't care if the books balance.

I've heard this applied to both photography and motor racing:- How do you make a small fortune doing it? Start with a large one.

Porn worked for a while because ultimately it's a shitty job where you spend a lot of time with your arm right around the S bend, doing stuff most regular folk simply won't do.

Grapesoda · 05-15-2011, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimonScans

Porn worked for a while because ultimately it's a shitty job where you spend a lot of time with your arm right around the S bend, doing stuff most regular folk simply won't do.

bingo

Twoface31 · 05-15-2011, 04:23 AM

this is cool

Paul Markham · 05-15-2011, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimonScans

Porn worked for a while because ultimately it's a shitty job where you spend a lot of time with your arm right around the S bend, doing stuff most regular folk simply won't do.

Actually I disagree with this, who wouldn't want to do what I did? The answer's. "No one who should be in porn."

Difference is I did it well in a time when there was a lot to be earned, most online shooters do it at a time when there's little to be earned, relatively speaking.

The difference is they sell their work outright, we sold it over and over and over again. Who says theres no money in non exclusive content?

This made me chuckle and think of so many people here.

Quote:

Option 1: Curl up into the fetal position and rock back and forth. When finished, complain to everyone you know about all the newbies entering the market. Look under the seat cushions to scrape up your health insurance premium. Resume the fetal position and repeat.

Quote:

Shoot 10 weddings a year and you can easily bring in $20,000 of extra annual income.

What online custom shooter makes $2,000 a day?

A decent wedding shooter should be able to build up a better business that 10 jobs a year. Referrals alone would be that number. Weddings are packed full of people of marrying age, great potential market. Get in with a decent wedding planner and the work flows in.

And shooting a wedding is easier than shooting porn models. Brides want good pictures, porn models often don't give a shit.

Grapesoda · 05-15-2011, 07:44 AM

Charley.... you're still a moron, what next with you? gonna buy some land with a lake and start selling ice in the winter?

dyna mo · 05-15-2011, 08:04 AM

i read the article, just for the sake of discussion-----

i don't see how photography is any different than a myriad of careers. everything he was saying that sucks about being a photog is pretty much the same sucky things most every self-employed person has to deal with- low barriers to entry, scalability, the lack of benefits, equity building, spending money on equipment are all topics most every self-employed person or entrepreneur needs to sort out.

it also doesn't seem to apply to adult photography where a photog can sell the same pictures mutliple times.

Davy · 05-15-2011, 08:08 AM

The MBA he mentions is worth shit and only shows that he spent several years of his life doing pointless things instead of earning money. I speak from experience, as well.

As a photographer, you need to build a client base and yourself a reputation. He makes several points of how much better off he would be pursuing his career in business. So I don't get the point of the article. As long as you have not built the two things mentioned above, you are up for a struggle.

Davy · 05-15-2011, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

low barriers to entry

I don't see this as a problem yet. You still have to lay down a couple of grand for a good camera and lenses. And that does not factor in the equipment needed for shoots and the helping hand that you will need to hire. And you don't just set things up randomly and start shooting. Producing good photos is difficult and a complex process. You can only learn this with experience and practice.

BFT3K · 05-15-2011, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suesheboy

now that was a great find. For much of it substitute "photographer" for "webmaster"

I do not equate the two.

A photographer either has an eye for the art, or he does not. The general skills required to take a picture today is not much different than it was 50 years ago.

A webmaster on the other hand, needs to learn new shit every month. If they are good, I believe they can certainly exceed the value of a photographer... and that's coming from a photographer.... unfortunately...

Nikki_Licks · 05-15-2011, 09:14 AM

Bookmarked, thanks for the link

marlboroack · 05-15-2011, 09:18 AM

Did i get in early enough for a good Signature spot?

Socks · 05-15-2011, 09:47 AM

I think he misses the mark a bit in that photography as a business isn't just for taking pictures for people who buy them from you. There's thousands of ways to incorporate photography into a business, packaged with some other skills. Porn is clearly a great example of that.

For example I would have never made anywhere near as much money as I've made by writing my porn reviews if I'd tried to be a freelance writer or some kind of journalist. Also I would have had higher competition, longer hours, less life flexibility, a boss, etc etc etc. I know of at least one instance where I've made over $50,000 on a single one page article, and only because I packaged writing with a good idea and a website.

Just recently I've started a couple new mainstream businesses that I'm already marketing locally where I'm a photographer of sorts. I learned how to make a website on my own rather than bring in partners, and it was relatively cheap to start, so I just paid for it myself too. I don't know a damned thing about photography, I just set my camera to "auto" and press the button a bunch of times. It's working great so far, and soon enough I'll be making more than many traditional photographers who spent thousands on school, thousands on equipment, and hundreds of hours of learning.

Now that's not to say there isn't other value in their learning on a personal and business level, just saying that it's not necessary in my photography business of sorts to be a pro photographer. Like everything else in life, I try to learn things as they become necessary, or if I'm personally curious enough. Also very important for someone like me to "build on the shoulders of giants" ie: just ask someone who knows the answer, rather than trying to truly understand all the building blocks to arrive at such a conclusion myself. There's a place for that, but only if it's crucial to whatever task you need accomplished.

dyna mo · 05-15-2011, 10:08 AM

i wonder where in the timeline he got his mba because the article (and the replies) seem more geared towards amateur photogs who were told "hey man, nice shot" once and consequently figured they can hang a shingle as a pro photog and the money comes rolling in. very few things every go that way.

Grapesoda · 05-15-2011, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

i wonder where in the timeline he got his mba because the article (and the replies) seem more geared towards amateur photogs who were told "hey man, nice shot" once and consequently figured they can hang a shingle as a pro photog and the money comes rolling in. very few things every go that way.

went that easy for me onto porn... problem was it took 100 hours a week though...

dyna mo · 05-15-2011, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bm bradley

went that easy for me onto porn... problem was it took 100 hours a week though...

100 hour/ week ain't easy. sure looking at tail most the time helps but even with just 1 day off, 100 hr work week is ~16 hour days.

also, i couldn't say what made your entry into porn go easy, but how would you apply your experience to what the author is saying?

Grapesoda · 05-15-2011, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

sure looking at tail most the time helps

mostly just arguing with pimps about money

Cherry7 · 05-15-2011, 03:16 PM

Just as photography has become easier to enter so the demands for more images has grown.

Everything sold on the web has to be photographed, 30 years ago photography was more popular than gardening, but the number of professional photographers was about 30..

If you have the right pictures you can make money.

And every website needs the work of some photographer, the better the pictures the better the site.

05-14-2011, 03:44 PM	#1
Grapesoda So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Montana Posts: 46,238	the most important photography lesson there is: http://laurencekim.com/2011/04/28/th...merican-dream/

05-14-2011, 04:54 PM	#3
aztecboi2003 Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Marysville,Wa Posts: 1,155	Good read, thanks __________________ Smoking Girl Fetish Petite Ashley

05-14-2011, 04:56 PM	#4
suesheboy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: FL - TN/NC Posts: 5,211	now that was a great find. For much of it substitute "photographer" for "webmaster" __________________ Adult Web Site Domain Names For Sale Adult Sex Toy Domain Names For Sale Tantric Delights, Sex Toys Blog, Tantric Sex Toys

05-14-2011, 05:01 PM	#5
billywatson Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: The Valley o' Smut. Posts: 3,281	WOW -- what a great read! __________________ We're Fabulous! PROTECT YOUR CONTENT on Twitter I Shoot Porn.

05-14-2011, 05:14 PM	#9
Deej I make pixels work Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: I live here... Posts: 24,386	Thanks for the lead... ill read this fully later... __________________ Deej's Designs n' What Not Hit me up for Design, CSS & Photo Retouching Icq#30096880

05-14-2011, 04:48 PM	#2
AaronM Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: ┌∩┐ ◣_◢ ┌∩┐ Posts: 46,909	Interesting read. Thanks for sharing.

05-14-2011, 05:04 PM	#6
L-Pink working on my tan Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Florida/Kentucky Posts: 39,152	Thank you, interesting read. And I do own commercial real estate, lol

05-14-2011, 05:08 PM	#8
justinsain Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,374	I'm going to send that link to everyone that doesn't understand me Everything is pretty much spot on. I especially liked the part about branding. It drives me crazy when I go to a site like MM and see photographers with logos that take up a third of the image. It's never about who has the biggest and fanciest logo. It should be about your work. Thanks for posting

05-14-2011, 07:10 PM	#11
NaughtyRob Two fresh affiliate progs Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Inside teen pussy Posts: 29,602	Very interesting stuff. __________________ [email protected] Skype: 17026955414 Vacares Web Hosting - Protect Your Ass with Included Daily Backups

05-15-2011, 03:09 AM	#12
ottopottomouse She is ugly, bad luck. Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 13,177	Good read __________________ ↑ see post ↑ 13101

05-15-2011, 03:24 AM	#13
AsianDivaGirlsWebDude Purveyor, Fine Asian Porn Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 38,323	The 2nd Most Important Photography Lesson: ADG __________________ Asian Diva Girls - Exclusive Photos and Videos Asian Diva Girls Affiliate Program (50% ccBill Revshare)

05-15-2011, 03:29 AM	#14
SimonScans Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 342	This is precisely why I quit mainstream photography to run my own site. Can't say it's turning out to be much different, but there ya go. There's also another aspect to photography that's not mentioned - People want to be photographers for no other reason than they just want to. So at the lowest level you aren't even competing with other businesses, you're competing with trustafarians with inherited wealth, mid life crisis career changers and plain idiots who think they'll never pay any tax or need a pension or a health plan - all of them prepared to work at far below cost, because they ultimately don't care if the books balance. I've heard this applied to both photography and motor racing:- How do you make a small fortune doing it? Start with a large one. Porn worked for a while because ultimately it's a shitty job where you spend a lot of time with your arm right around the S bend, doing stuff most regular folk simply won't do. Last edited by SimonScans; 05-15-2011 at 03:31 AM..

05-15-2011, 04:23 AM	#16
Twoface31 Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 2,746	this is cool __________________ Email: [email protected] HentaiG4h * Lusty Life ICQ: 291-953

05-15-2011, 07:44 AM	#18
Grapesoda So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Montana Posts: 46,238	Charley.... you're still a moron, what next with you? gonna buy some land with a lake and start selling ice in the winter?

05-15-2011, 08:04 AM	#19
dyna mo The People's Post Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: invisible 7-11 Posts: 63,914	i read the article, just for the sake of discussion----- i don't see how photography is any different than a myriad of careers. everything he was saying that sucks about being a photog is pretty much the same sucky things most every self-employed person has to deal with- low barriers to entry, scalability, the lack of benefits, equity building, spending money on equipment are all topics most every self-employed person or entrepreneur needs to sort out. it also doesn't seem to apply to adult photography where a photog can sell the same pictures mutliple times.

05-15-2011, 08:08 AM	#20
Davy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Germany Posts: 4,323	The MBA he mentions is worth shit and only shows that he spent several years of his life doing pointless things instead of earning money. I speak from experience, as well. As a photographer, you need to build a client base and yourself a reputation. He makes several points of how much better off he would be pursuing his career in business. So I don't get the point of the article. As long as you have not built the two things mentioned above, you are up for a struggle. __________________ --- ICQ 14-76-98 <-- I don't use this at all

05-15-2011, 09:14 AM	#23
Nikki_Licks Confirmed User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Behind The Lens Posts: 6,323	Bookmarked, thanks for the link __________________ Amateur Content ICQ: 292 356 077

05-15-2011, 09:18 AM	#24
marlboroack So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: ☣ Posts: 9,327	Did i get in early enough for a good Signature spot?

05-15-2011, 09:47 AM	#25
Socks Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2002 Location: Toronto Posts: 8,478	I think he misses the mark a bit in that photography as a business isn't just for taking pictures for people who buy them from you. There's thousands of ways to incorporate photography into a business, packaged with some other skills. Porn is clearly a great example of that. For example I would have never made anywhere near as much money as I've made by writing my porn reviews if I'd tried to be a freelance writer or some kind of journalist. Also I would have had higher competition, longer hours, less life flexibility, a boss, etc etc etc. I know of at least one instance where I've made over $50,000 on a single one page article, and only because I packaged writing with a good idea and a website. Just recently I've started a couple new mainstream businesses that I'm already marketing locally where I'm a photographer of sorts. I learned how to make a website on my own rather than bring in partners, and it was relatively cheap to start, so I just paid for it myself too. I don't know a damned thing about photography, I just set my camera to "auto" and press the button a bunch of times. It's working great so far, and soon enough I'll be making more than many traditional photographers who spent thousands on school, thousands on equipment, and hundreds of hours of learning. Now that's not to say there isn't other value in their learning on a personal and business level, just saying that it's not necessary in my photography business of sorts to be a pro photographer. Like everything else in life, I try to learn things as they become necessary, or if I'm personally curious enough. Also very important for someone like me to "build on the shoulders of giants" ie: just ask someone who knows the answer, rather than trying to truly understand all the building blocks to arrive at such a conclusion myself. There's a place for that, but only if it's crucial to whatever task you need accomplished. Last edited by Socks; 05-15-2011 at 09:48 AM..

05-15-2011, 10:08 AM	#26
dyna mo The People's Post Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: invisible 7-11 Posts: 63,914	i wonder where in the timeline he got his mba because the article (and the replies) seem more geared towards amateur photogs who were told "hey man, nice shot" once and consequently figured they can hang a shingle as a pro photog and the money comes rolling in. very few things every go that way.

05-15-2011, 03:16 PM	#30
Cherry7 Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: UK Posts: 3,564	Just as photography has become easier to enter so the demands for more images has grown. Everything sold on the web has to be photographed, 30 years ago photography was more popular than gardening, but the number of professional photographers was about 30.. If you have the right pictures you can make money. And every website needs the work of some photographer, the better the pictures the better the site. __________________ My Neighbour Butterfly PORN-The Musical The Long Goodbye Cinema Erotique