Stoled vids on Xhamster

[SpicyM]

Just found this guy, that has uploaded 38 pages of stolen full lenght scenes from different paysites. Watermarks removed. There is some HQ production from the TOP paysites.

http://xhamster.com/user/video/doctor84/new-1.html

I wonder, why does someone spend the time to cut the watermarks and then upload this amount of videos for free? I understand, that someone likes to share a clip or two, but 38 pages of full scenes, edited for this purpose and without any profit, that is just crazy.

1125 videos total!!

[Fat Panda]

legal tube porn

[ReggieDurango]

DD
fucking Dicks

[signupdamnit]

Yeah I think most of us know what is really going on there. But the problem is the people at the top of our industry don't care. In fact they probably think you are an asshole for complaining about it here. It's really sad but what can you do when the stakeholders don't give a shit?

[harvey]

Originally Posted by SpicyM

Just found this guy, that has uploaded 38 pages of stolen full lenght scenes from different paysites. Watermarks removed. There is some HQ production from the TOP paysites.

http://xhamster.com/user/video/doctor84/new-1.html

I wonder, why does someone spend the time to cut the watermarks and then upload this amount of videos for free? I understand, that someone likes to share a clip or two, but 38 pages of full scenes, edited for this purpose and without any profit, that is just crazy.

1125 videos total!!

I hope you never really believed the "user uploaded" chant. If so, I have a bridge for you, quite new, lots of opportunities

[helterskelter808]

Still, at least he didn't upload them to a file locker nobody has ever heard of.

[harvey]

Originally Posted by helterskelter808

Still, at least he didn't upload them to a file locker nobody has ever heard of.

no, he's sharing it with millions instead of a file locker nobody heard of

[AdultKing]

Here's the MO of several pirates migrating from file lockers.

They set up scraping tubes that fetch only their uploads filled with CPA ads, popups and banners, then they upload the videos to sites that allow video embeds. These are promoted from their piracy forums.

This is most likely what you are seeing here. It's not about having the videos on XHamster , its about having the videos on their own video sites filled with embeds of their uploads from big tubes.

Xhamster.com has bursts of infringement reported to Google but it's certainly not anywhere near as consistently bad as sites like Netload.in , Rapidgator or Extabit.

http://www.google.com/transparencyre.../xhamster.com/

[Redrob]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Yeah I think most of us know what is really going on there. But the problem is the people at the top of our industry don't care. In fact they probably think you are an asshole for complaining about it here. It's really sad but what can you do when the stakeholders don't give a shit?

I think you are wrong. Most of the studios do want to protect their content; but, the efforts have been stifled by the entire DMCA process which is terminally flawed due to the lack of accountability given hosts who say "I have no control of the content on my tube site" while they profit from the sites with ad sales and exit traffic sales while hiding behind the DMCA shield and counting their stacks of cash. At the same time, the this piracy has killed DVD sales destroying the studio's alternative source of funding.

As long as the public believes that porn should be free on the internet and are willing to lobby their congressmen to kill legislation like SOPA and PIPA, nothing will change.

I think the long term prognosis is poor and maybe down right bleak for content production unless you are producing for your own tube sites. Many content production studios are already gone. You know who to blame...... I laugh and cry when I go to trade shows and see content producers and webmasters sucking tubes site and streaming sites owner's dicks and asking to be fucked in the ass for the chump change being offered for their content.

Nothing but thieves, fools and Judases in my opinion. But, we created this Frankenstein.......now, we sleep with it.

[duk75]

Originally Posted by Redrob

I think you are wrong. Most of the studios do want to protect their content; but, the efforts have been stifled by the entire DMCA process which is terminally flawed due to the lack of accountability given hosts who say "I have no control of the content on my tube site" while they profit from the sites with ad sales and exit traffic sales while hiding behind the DMCA shield and counting their stacks of cash. At the same time, the this piracy has killed DVD sales destroying the studio's alternative source of funding.

As long as the public believes that porn should be free on the internet and are willing to lobby their congressmen to kill legislation like SOPA and PIPA, nothing will change.

I think the long term prognosis is poor and maybe down right bleak for content production unless you are producing for your own tube sites. Many content production studios are already gone. You know who to blame...... I laugh and cry when I go to trade shows and see content producers and webmasters sucking tubes site and streaming sites owner's dicks and asking to be fucked in the ass for the chump change being offered for their content.

Nothing but thieves, fools and Judases in my opinion. But, we created this Frankenstein.......now, we sleep with it.

You better change to promote cams or something weird. The old porn business is old, obsolete, and you will not kill the tubes. And people will hardly let you kill them. Do not hope on that. You better change to promote cams, or something different, that other market is death.

[helterskelter808]

Originally Posted by harvey

no, he's sharing it with millions instead of a file locker nobody heard of

Exactly my point. And, as if on cue, GFY's anti-piracy king falls over himself to defend piracy tubes.

[Robbie]

I'm sure nobody cuts out the watermarks.

The tube site just sets the encoder to stretch the movie dimensions out just a bit and then the watermarks don't show onscreen.

No need for anybody to waste any time or effort that way. Nice and easy and the watermarks are just...gone.

[WetandPuffy]

Yeah its very sad to see so much of this going on, they are not making it easy for the average joe to make money from his sites anymore.

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by Redrob

I think you are wrong. Most of the studios do want to protect their content; but, the efforts have been stifled by the entire DMCA process which is terminally flawed due to the lack of accountability given hosts who say "I have no control of the content on my tube site" while they profit from the sites with ad sales and exit traffic sales while hiding behind the DMCA shield and counting their stacks of cash. At the same time, the this piracy has killed DVD sales destroying the studio's alternative source of funding.

As long as the public believes that porn should be free on the internet and are willing to lobby their congressmen to kill legislation like SOPA and PIPA, nothing will change.

I think the long term prognosis is poor and maybe down right bleak for content production unless you are producing for your own tube sites. Many content production studios are already gone. You know who to blame...... I laugh and cry when I go to trade shows and see content producers and webmasters sucking tubes site and streaming sites owner's dicks and asking to be fucked in the ass for the chump change being offered for their content.

Nothing but thieves, fools and Judases in my opinion. But, we created this Frankenstein.......now, we sleep with it.

It's great to hear this from you. I don't know though. Probably 1/5th of my posts here since 2007 were about piracy. I increasingly feel that certain people think we're all assholes for speaking out about it. That we shouldn't rock the boat and should all just shut up and roll over like dogs.

I'm not going to write a book. I easily could but I honestly feel that many in this industry could have made a very big difference simply by speaking out more. You can say what you want but if a company or a certain person gets 1,000 replies to every message they post telling them to cut the crap it's going to have some sort of impact. The same if when they go to make a keynote speech they get two dozen people throwing eggs and pies at them. It feels to me as if most of the upper rungs in our industry have sold out. It goes far beyond not doing anything. We're talking about making pirates keynote speakers, removing incriminating evidence from public forums, banning people for speaking out and basically publicly condoning stealing.

That's fine. Nobody owes me anything. People may do as they want. But I only call it as I see it. It pisses me off to think of all the money I lost and all but in the end I'm not even a content producer. Others have far more skin in this game then I. If this is what people wanted then I guess they will get it.

[freecartoonporn]

i see someone hired a guy from 3rd world to fill the tube.

[SomeCreep]

Originally Posted by SpicyM

Just found this guy, that has uploaded 38 pages of stolen full lenght scenes from different paysites. Watermarks removed. There is some HQ production from the TOP paysites.

http://xhamster.com/user/video/doctor84/new-1.html

1125 videos total!!

Well, according to the law, it's the content owner's fault for not knowing about the videos and sending a DMCA notice to have them removed.

[seeandsee]

roque uploaders

[PornDude]

And then xHamster says "we are not interested in your site", when you want to upload legal content to their site. Funny.

[PornDiscounts-V]

Off with their watermarks! ~ said the Queen.

[Paul]

People need to get more creative in protecting their material, we've had the same lazy placement of watermarks in the bottom right corner of videos for over a decade now by most people.

Time to start being more agressive with watermarks and their placement i.e. Having watermarks in the middle of the screen for 20 seconds every couple of minutes with the watermarks changing positions each time etc.

I just find it amazing that the majority of people haven't adapted their strategy with watermarks when this shit has been going on for years with the tubes. I'll also add this point because someone will make the point "The customers don't like that"

Spend a bit of money, make some impressive animated graphical watermarks that look awesome, check out Youtube there are 1000s of people creating amazing videos with a high end professional look.

Honestly even as a surfer it frustrates me the removal of watermarks from tube sites, there has been a number of times I've seen a video and thought "What site is that from" because I wanna check the site but can't because the watermark has been removed.

Hopefully I've made my 2000th post a useful one!

Get creative folks

[Dankasaur]

Originally Posted by Redrob

As long as the public believes that porn should be free on the internet and are willing to lobby their congressmen to kill legislation like SOPA and PIPA, nothing will change.

Are you fucking mental? Do you really think SOPA and PIPA are about making porn free? I think you need to go look into those bills and why people like Alexis Ohanian and Google were fighting against SOPA and PIPA... And it has NOTHING to do with porn.

Now you're just using conspiracy like theories to justify why LEGAL tubes are still up.

And ruining the business? Sorry to burst your bubble but it's far from ruining the business...

RIAA said that fucking tapes were ruining the music industry because anybody could just tape their favorite songs from the radio... Doesn't look like the industry is dead now does it? They've just moved onto MP3's as the problem... Yet people who have embraced the way music delivery is going have came out on top... But let me guess, you're gonna say NIN is just backing up pirates by giving their music away for free right?

Wrong, NIN has made more money by putting their music up for free on their own site than they ever did selling CD's, tapes, or anything else and that's saying something considering how HUGE NIN was in the 90's.

Stop fucking blaming other shit because you can't change and adapt to how the industry is moving.

There's tons of people who stopped fighting the tubes and work with them and are now making great money. Just because you're to fucking bullheaded to figure that out doesn't mean the whole fucking internet is trying to make porn free.

[nikki99]

Originally Posted by SAC

legal tube porn

[Redrob]

Originally Posted by Dankasaur

Stop fucking blaming other shit because you can't change and adapt to how the industry is moving.

There's tons of people who stopped fighting the tubes and work with them and are now making great money. Just because you're to fucking bullheaded to figure that out doesn't mean the whole fucking internet is trying to make porn free.

Friends,

According to Dankasaur, we should all stop fighting the tubes and give our content away for free like NIN. By making all our content free, we will make mad bucks.

Sign me up for the 'Bro' deal right away....

How could I have been so blind and stupid?????

[Dankasaur]

Originally Posted by Redrob

Friends,

According to Dankasaur, we should all stop fighting the tubes and give our content away for free like NIN. By making all our content free, we will make mad bucks.

Sign me up for the 'Bro' deal right away....

How could I have been so blind and stupid?????

Nice response. But I know many people who post their stuff on the tubes and say the sales are great... Now what's your excuse? Oh wait, you have been a content producer since 1775 so you're clearly more knowledgable of the subject and everything you say is spot on, right?

Your ignorance is what's killing your business.

[Redrob]

My business is fine and all my bill are paid.

I remember trying to sell Moses a copy of "A Man and a Goat"; but, I lost the sale to some commandments.

As an old guy, all my porn after the 1860's has been in color and business has been good.

I don't dislike tubesites per se; just, content thieves who steal other peoples' property.

If you support thieving, then, we will continue to disagree.

[Dankasaur]

I don't support thieving, but I do get annoyed with uneducated people spouting off about subjects they don't know because they read about it on one site.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by Dankasaur

I don't support thieving, but I do get annoyed with uneducated people spouting off about subjects they don't know because they read about it on one site.

Take a peek in the mirror.

You claim to be "educated" because you: "know many people who post their stuff on the tubes and say the sales are great"
Wow. That certainly makes you an expert.

I'm gonna guess you don't produce content or own any paysites. Your ignorance of this is showing.
In case you didn't notice (with all your knowledge of the porn biz and all), this thread title is about STOLEN content on Xhamster. Not submitted content.

You jumped the gun with your comments.

[Dankasaur]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Take a peek in the mirror.

You claim to be "educated" because you: "know many people who post their stuff on the tubes and say the sales are great"
Wow. That certainly makes you an expert.

I'm gonna guess you don't produce content or own any paysites. Your ignorance of this is showing.
In case you didn't notice (with all your knowledge of the porn biz and all), this thread title is about STOLEN content on Xhamster. Not submitted content.

You jumped the gun with your comments.

Pot meet kettle. My original post to Redrob was regarding SOPA/PIPA.

[Redrob]

SOPA and PIPA were killed because of the intellectual property provisions being incompatible with YouTube, Facebook and other large social media repositories of unlicensed content.

Everything else as far as reasoning was just lip service in my opinion.

[Dankasaur]

Originally Posted by Redrob

SOPA and PIPA were killed because of the intellectual property provisions being incompatible with YouTube, Facebook and other large social media repositories of unlicensed content.

Wrong.

8chars.

[adultmobile]

Originally Posted by AdultKing

They set up scraping tubes that fetch only their uploads filled with CPA ads, popups and banners, then they upload the videos to sites that allow video embeds. These are promoted from their piracy forums.

This is most likely what you are seeing here. It's not about having the videos on XHamster , its about having the videos on their own video sites filled with embeds of their uploads from big tubes.

Quote for truth.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by Dankasaur

Pot meet kettle. My original post to Redrob was regarding SOPA/PIPA.

Can I be the "pot"? The "Kettle" sounds boring as hell.

[EriktheRabbit]

Originally Posted by Redrob

Friends,

According to Dankasaur, we should all stop fighting the tubes and give our content away for free like NIN. By making all our content free, we will make mad bucks.

Sign me up for the 'Bro' deal right away....

How could I have been so blind and stupid?????

He's got a tube api he is trying to slog and probably some sort of family to feed. feel sympathy man.

[TheSquealer]

Yeah right. The sites that get 1000s of videos submitted everyday... that have to constantly close submissions due to volume are busying themselves breaking the law.

Makes perfect sense.

Rather than actually trying to understand what that particular webmaster is doing... everyone keeps singing the same old song...

[mafia_man]

Originally Posted by AdultKing

Here's the MO of several pirates migrating from file lockers.

They set up scraping tubes that fetch only their uploads filled with CPA ads, popups and banners, then they upload the videos to sites that allow video embeds. These are promoted from their piracy forums.

This is most likely what you are seeing here. It's not about having the videos on XHamster , its about having the videos on their own video sites filled with embeds of their uploads from big tubes.

Xhamster.com has bursts of infringement reported to Google but it's certainly not anywhere near as consistently bad as sites like Netload.in , Rapidgator or Extabit.

http://www.google.com/transparencyre.../xhamster.com/

That way they can use legit titles on their site, instead of "Blonde teen takes facial" and avoid the change of a takedown.

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by Paul

People need to get more creative in protecting their material, we've had the same lazy placement of watermarks in the bottom right corner of videos for over a decade now by most people.

Time to start being more agressive with watermarks and their placement i.e. Having watermarks in the middle of the screen for 20 seconds every couple of minutes with the watermarks changing positions each time etc.

I just find it amazing that the majority of people haven't adapted their strategy with watermarks when this shit has been going on for years with the tubes. I'll also add this point because someone will make the point "The customers don't like that"

Spend a bit of money, make some impressive animated graphical watermarks that look awesome, check out Youtube there are 1000s of people creating amazing videos with a high end professional look.

Honestly even as a surfer it frustrates me the removal of watermarks from tube sites, there has been a number of times I've seen a video and thought "What site is that from" because I wanna check the site but can't because the watermark has been removed.

Hopefully I've made my 2000th post a useful one!

Get creative folks

Well, we can get as creative with watermarks as we want, have them jump around the screen, do all kinds of things. But guess WHAT? You do that and the tubes will reject your videos! So we ARE - some of us - trying to "adapt" but how can we when the end site (the tubes) sets the rules? Hmmm??

Originally Posted by Dankasaur

Are you fucking mental? Do you really think SOPA and PIPA are about making porn free? I think you need to go look into those bills and why people like Alexis Ohanian and Google were fighting against SOPA and PIPA... And it has NOTHING to do with porn.

Now you're just using conspiracy like theories to justify why LEGAL tubes are still up.

And ruining the business? Sorry to burst your bubble but it's far from ruining the business...

RIAA said that fucking tapes were ruining the music industry because anybody could just tape their favorite songs from the radio... Doesn't look like the industry is dead now does it? They've just moved onto MP3's as the problem... Yet people who have embraced the way music delivery is going have came out on top... But let me guess, you're gonna say NIN is just backing up pirates by giving their music away for free right?

Wrong, NIN has made more money by putting their music up for free on their own site than they ever did selling CD's, tapes, or anything else and that's saying something considering how HUGE NIN was in the 90's.

Stop fucking blaming other shit because you can't change and adapt to how the industry is moving.

There's tons of people who stopped fighting the tubes and work with them and are now making great money. Just because you're to fucking bullheaded to figure that out doesn't mean the whole fucking internet is trying to make porn free.

You Sir have NO IDEA how much money NIN is making now as opposed to when they were huge in the 1990's. And when it comes to CDs the band (like ALL bands then) had record contracts and had to split revenue with the record companies. Now they can cut the labels out and release songs on their own BUT you STILL have ZERO idea how much NIN is making, and in relation to past success.

I work with the tubes, they generally treat me well. But I ALSO find my own videos with watermarks removed and have to DMCA my "friends" at the tubes! So it happens to everyone.

The bigger problem now with tubes and watermarked-removed videos? Playlists and channels. Now a tube surfer can grab video after video, start a channel or a playlist (or both) so now, instead of searching for videos on the tubes you can just go to a single page and voila! Hundreds of videos.

(The 'related videos' section on most tubes is a major problem, too; underneath one of your "legal" videos are usually a ton of un-watermarked "related" vids on YOUR video page! So the surfer just bounces around until he's spermed out then leaves. Horrible situation and we should be lobbying to change this practice.)

[helterskelter808]

Originally Posted by MisterPeabody

when it comes to CDs the band (like ALL bands then) had record contracts and had to split revenue with the record companies. Now they can cut the labels out and release songs on their own

Indeed. Even if you accept they are making more now, all it really demonstrates is how much they and other bands were being screwed by their label in the past, along with the costs of manufacture and distribution.

[Redrob]

Originally Posted by helterskelter808

Indeed. Even if you accept they are making more now, all it really demonstrates is how much they and other bands were being screwed by their label in the past, along with the costs of manufacture and distribution.

Conversely, if they are making less, it shows how necessary the music industry's manufacturing and distribution channels are to the band's overall marketing and financial success.

The truth is most bands fail miserably at making money.

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by Redrob

Conversely, if they are making less, it shows how necessary the music industry's manufacturing and distribution channels are to the band's overall marketing and financial success.

The truth is most bands fail miserably at making money.

Absolutely 100% true. Most musicians are not businessmen, they're artists. I ALWAYS tell artists, even in this Adult Industry (directors, producers, writers, shooters, designers, etc) YOU make the porn, let ME sell it. Same with music; bands try to "sell it themselves" but they're half-stoned, HS dropout grunge kids who smoke pot and play bass. WTF do they know about "moving product"?

What is needed - in music, porn, anything - is a BALANCE between "art" and "commerce". Hard to achieve tho as greed and incompetency tend to ruin things. LOL

[Robbie]

Guys please don't let the fantasy of a handful of bands being "successful" (not compared of course to the days before piracy) by giving away their music for free blind you to the reality.

Reality is...the music biz is decimated. The vast majority of the money being made in 2013 is done by touring.

No way in hell a band selling a million downloads on ITunes in 2013 (and you can count those artists on one hand) comes even close to the money being made by a band like KISS in the 1970's with multi-platinum (which "platinum" back then meant one million) ALBUM sales.

Anybody that's been to L.A. and seen the giant empty Tower Records building knows the truth.

There's a reason that no big bands are breaking anymore. There is no modern day Rolling Stones, Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Who, Black Sabbath, Nirvana, Soundgarden...and there aren't going to be any.

What we have now are bands making a few online sales from their faithful fans. But they will never break into a wider market and become superstars like the bands used to do.

As for porn...we can't tour. So we don't even have that kind of revenue base to turn to.

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Guys please don't let the fantasy of a handful of bands being "successful" (not compared of course to the days before piracy) by giving away their music for free blind you to the reality.

Reality is...the music biz is decimated. The vast majority of the money being made in 2013 is done by touring.

No way in hell a band selling a million downloads on ITunes in 2013 (and you can count those artists on one hand) comes even close to the money being made by a band like KISS in the 1970's with multi-platinum (which "platinum" back then meant one million) ALBUM sales.

Anybody that's been to L.A. and seen the giant empty Tower Records building knows the truth.

There's a reason that no big bands are breaking anymore. There is no modern day Rolling Stones, Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Who, Black Sabbath, Nirvana, Soundgarden...and there aren't going to be any.

What we have now are bands making a few online sales from their faithful fans. But they will never break into a wider market and become superstars like the bands used to do.

As for porn...we can't tour. So we don't even have that kind of revenue base to turn to.

This is a brilliant post. I know your time in the Music Biz is part of the reasons for your great insight here. Seeing that empty Tower Records building makes me wanna cry; I never thought I'd live in a world without record stores!!

The economics are simple: sell a million songs on iTunes for $1 = $1,000,000. Sell a million ALBUMS in 1985 for $6.98 = 6,980,000.

The band would get about 20-30% of that revenue (exceptions, of course) so: band cut = 2.1 million. Add touring, merchandise, publishing, radio play....an artist could walk away with millions (and a huge, loyal fan base). Today? Sell a million songs on iTunes and barely make your private jet payment. LOL

I shouldn't laugh, it's so freaking sad! We want - NEED - another Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin. Shit, I'll take another U2 or Pearl Jam at this point. Will we ever get them? Nope. Crank up Exile On Main St. y'all and drift away to a better time....

<////////////////>~~~


(Man, I am TOO YOUNG to be talking like such an old fart but there ya go. Welcome to today's shitty world of music.)

[Captain Kawaii]

Bands that sell a million albums are often still in the red with the record company. They hope for touring and for publishing and for merch, unless the label or the manager fucked them in the contracts. Bands are much better off being completely DIY. Unfortunately most cannot.

GooGoo Dolls were a prime example. Sold over 2 million records and still in debt to label.
I was an editor at some rock mags in the 80's and 90's. What labels did and do to bands accounting-wise is shameful to the point I can only laugh when labels cry about piracy.

I remember a NARM bulletin that once said only 5% or less of bands sell more than 5k units. Those numbers must be pretty down these days.

[Captain Kawaii]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Guys please don't let the fantasy of a handful of bands being "successful" (not compared of course to the days before piracy) by giving away their music for free blind you to the reality.

Reality is...the music biz is decimated. The vast majority of the money being made in 2013 is done by touring.

No way in hell a band selling a million downloads on ITunes in 2013 (and you can count those artists on one hand) comes even close to the money being made by a band like KISS in the 1970's with multi-platinum (which "platinum" back then meant one million) ALBUM sales.

Anybody that's been to L.A. and seen the giant empty Tower Records building knows the truth.

There's a reason that no big bands are breaking anymore. There is no modern day Rolling Stones, Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Who, Black Sabbath, Nirvana, Soundgarden...and there aren't going to be any.

What we have now are bands making a few online sales from their faithful fans. But they will never break into a wider market and become superstars like the bands used to do.

As for porn...we can't tour. So we don't even have that kind of revenue base to turn to.

Wouldn't it be cool if we could put a couple porn sets on a flatbed and do tent shows on the road? Probably make some pretty good money that way. If it were legal in any way shape or form.

[Redrob]

"Hollywood accounting" is famous for screwing clients...

[PromoterX]

Wonder when these threads will stop happening daily.

[nikki99]

I see some of our videos without watermark now makes it harder to catch, still stolen

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by Captain Kawaii

Bands that sell a million albums are often still in the red with the record company. They hope for touring and for publishing and for merch, unless the label or the manager fucked them in the contracts. Bands are much better off being completely DIY. Unfortunately most cannot.

GooGoo Dolls were a prime example. Sold over 2 million records and still in debt to label.
I was an editor at some rock mags in the 80's and 90's. What labels did and do to bands accounting-wise is shameful to the point I can only laugh when labels cry about piracy.

I remember a NARM bulletin that once said only 5% or less of bands sell more than 5k units. Those numbers must be pretty down these days.

Heh - you may have been an editor of mine at some point.


But hell yeah, what you say is true! I have friends who are in bands. They sell 500k records, tour, etc. At the end of the day each band member is lucky to pocket 50k a year!

Sex, drugs and rock 'n roll.