Relentless

Brilliant.

Give Aaron Paul another Emmy

Also Loved Walt's DVD

JFK

thanks for no spoilers ;)

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AllAboutCams

Great episode

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L-Pink

I always liked "Malcom in the Middle"

Sarah_Jayne

God damn, what an episode.

kane

Wow!

Fantastic stuff all around. Dean Norris and Aaron Paul were both brilliant. I get the feeling that the roller coaster has just about hit the top of the hill and we are in for one hell of a ride.

dyna mo

wow, i've been waiting for an epic jesse scene and there's 2! when he calls walt out in the desert was spot on i thought, the dialogue made a lot of sense to me how he finally did that. and the scene with saul was just as well-done.

spoiler alert"::::::::::KJJ)OUPGIFRRRRRRRRR(*FOO*




. how did he finally figure out the ricin cigg thing while standing on the curb? why would his reaction be to torch the house?

i'll be watching it again though.

Relentless

***Spoiler Alert*****




Huel stole his dope by pick-pocketing him. Not sure if you have ever had anything stolen, but its a very intense emotional moment when you notice what happened. Watch Jessie's face during the scene as he figures it out. I've watched it 3 times now. You can practically hear him thinking out loud.

His mind starts racing, he wonders if he lost the dope, or who could have stolen if. Then he retraces his steps in his mind: "Was it Huel, when we bumped up together in the doorway on the way out of Saul's office, maybe another moment along the way. The feeling is unsettling, like that time I knew I had the ricin cigarette, but it suddenly wasn't there anymore. Hey, Huel was around then too...FUCK he must have stolen the cigarettes the same way, but if he stole the cigarettes... How did Brock get poisoned? Huel wouldn't... Well, he doesn't do anything without orders from Saul... Which all comes from mr. White. That asshole has been playing Saul, Huel, me, everybody the whole time... Now he wants me gone... Holy shit HE must have poisoned Brock!!! I'm gonna kill that mutherfucker and send his wife and kids to hell along with him!"


Watch his face, and hand him another Emmy.

bronco67

I thought that was a little weird too. The doctors told Jesse that Brock got sick from that Lilly of the Valley plant, and not ricin.

Also, in Walt's video he said he gave Hank $177,000 for his medical bills. If Hank was the ring leader of the operation and coercing Walt into cooking, then why would he need to borrow money from his subordinate?

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dyna mo

it was certainly good acting, and about time for some serious jesse shit no doubt imo, i felt like his character has been flailing about and it was very good to see that solidify into something real.

i can see his sorting that out as a brain dump, even if it was a bit of a logic stretch as bronco67 pointed out, obviously jesse won't be teaming up with shrader and ww has a 2 front war to wage, i think the only partnership formed now is ww/skyler and i am not even certain skyler is 100% in.

the mind fuck ww is playing with and on walt jr is fucking pathetic, but certainly accurate as many people in life use their children as pawns like that.

i noticed that too, sometimes (rarely) the writing seems to me to miss easy dialogue, they could have made it out like shrader got the $177K from ww some other way, obviously against ww's will.

dyna mo

i'm also confused about the opening scene, the audio is muffed for some reason on this so it's difficult to make out what meth damon is saying on the phone and if it's forshadowing, because he's then in the diner chatting with the nazi dudes and then off to what, kidnapp ww to cook with a trailer full of chemicals? what do yuu think was up with this scene?

bronco67

I think the whole point of that scene was to just get us up to speed with those guys. They're most likely going to be some kind of antagonist during the last few episodes, and we really haven't spent much time with them. The most telling thing about them -- and this why I love the writing on Breaking Bad -- was the part when the guy wiped the blood from his boot, like it's just a normal everyday thing. You feel like you know how bad those guys are, even though the conversation was innocuous.

That opening scene was very Tarantino.

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dyna mo

you know, there's a lot of tarantino/pulp fiction sorta things going on it seems.

say what again motherfucker, comes to mind when jesse flips out on saul, hell mr white and mr. pink-man, lolz. some other things too i think.

i went back and caught some more of the audio from the opening scene, todd says things changed violently, no biggie. hrmmmmmmmm...

maybe this is what that m60 is for, but what's odd about that gun is that's a team gun, ww can't strap that gun on and go on a spree, i believe you have to tripod that weapon and have a multi-man team work it, which would mean ww teams up, but at this point it seems the writers want us to think every man for himself.

on another note, i flipped out over that purple rug in the shrader house (when marie tell hank she took the $177k), hahahaha, with that zebra sttriped chair, over-the-top! i know colors are hugely important in the show and they use purple with marie often, i just cracked up though when i saw that!

Relentless

Yeah, it's a weird spot for the writers. It's the kind of thing that Jessie would figure out but the viewers would not as easily... so they could have added a bit more context. If I were writing the show, when Saul walks out of the room and tells Jessie to wait there and not light up again, I'd have shown an additional scene where Saul tells Huel in privacy to be sure he lifts the dope off Jessie... the same way he lifted the cigarettes, so Jessie can get a fresh start. That may have been a bit too heavy handed for their writers to go with, but it would have made the facts easiest to digest for casual viewers.

Walt is headed for a multi-front war where everyone wants him dead and nobody wants to be allies. Hank wants him dead for his sins against the family, Jessie wants him dead for his sins against innocent victims, I'm sure the drug cartel will eventually want him dead for his sins against his former business associates, I'm hoping Skylar will want him dead for something terrible happening to Walt Jr. and so on...


That's pretty minor. Walt could explain that away as 'Hank just kept saying all his money was tied up or was too hot to access and he needed clean laundered funds to pay out all the medical 'on the books' expenses. The DEA would have a much bigger problem with Hank taking 177K from Walt for any reason than they would have believing the story or wondering why Hank borrowed it exactly. Even if they believe Hank, how does he explain he took 177K in 'illegal gambling winnings' from his brother in law who happens to be a meth kingpin? And Walt didn't even bother getting into the times Hank abused his power to get Marie out of custody when she stole jewelry during the klepto episodes... that's proof Hank operated outside the law in the past and can be corroborated by other law enforcement officials.

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Relentless

By the way....if you want to see how much Walt has changed...

Go back and watch the end of the very first episode. Walter White is standing in his underwear recording a full confession on a camcorder to explain what went wrong (before he realizes they are going to be fine and destroys the confession).

Then go forward and watch the confession on the DVD Heisenberg gave Hank last night.

Just comparing the two confession tapes from the start and from now, you can see the incredible transformation that Walt has gone through in becoming Heisenberg.

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LAJ

As much as I love the show, I still can't get over the fact that I have a relative who works on the show who didn't bother responding to me in my request to be a walk on character. Would have paid my way and room and board in ABQ. Even a friggen one line of dialogue customer at the car wash.

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Choopa_Pardo

Walt's confession video was incredible.

Jesse's epiphany seemed a bit forced, but I think it was needed to hurry the plot along.

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dyna mo

hah, the underwear confession! full circle

Relentless

If it's any consolation...

Have an A-1 Day!

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Relentless

Also... the part about Hank having guys following Jessie and then the other cop calling them off before Hank leaves the office early for the day seemed to be full of clues....

Was hank leaving early to go follow Jessie... to Saul's office and then to Walt's house? Did the 2 DEA agents not get called off in time and will they be in the driveway soon as well? What happens when they all meet up in Walt's kitchen and Jessie is holding an empty gas can? hahahaha

That's my bet for next week...

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Sarah_Jayne

Beat any good suspects lately?

Relentless

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dyna mo

one thing is for certain, jesse doesn't set the house on fire- at all, i just went back and checked the opening scene of blood money and there isn't a burnt anything in that house. it's ransacked but not the least bit burned so someone shows up and gets jesse's revenge pointed in anotther direction, could very well be shrader.

seeandsee

this show will explode!

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dyna mo

best guess for the ending yet!

kane

My theory is that Walt will have to take them out. At some point they could be the last thing that links him to the meth business. Assume he eventually takes care of Hank and Jesse one way or the other, those guys, at least Todd, know who he is and what he did. They are also well armed and obviously not shy about using their weapons.

That M60 Walt is packing might just be to use against them.

kane

I might not be remembering this correctly, but didn't Walt tell Jesse he could make Ricin from a plant?

This does seem, at first, a little out of place. The leader of the big meth ring wouldn't need help paying those bills. However, if he wanted to keep things quiet he might have someone else give him the money and come up with a story as to how they have that money to give him this way he doesn't have to explain how he got the money.

Either way, it fucks Hank over. Right now if he turns Walt in they will look heavily into him and want to know about this money. I wouldn't be shocked to find out that Walk has set up a few other things that he could tell the DEA about that would point them to Hank instead of himself.

Relentless

That's the thing with being framed... the longer Hank waits, the more time Walt has to put things in place and generate 'evidence' against him. Hank's best legal move is turning Walt in and taking his lumps as quickly as possible... but he will likely opt for an illegal move like working with Jessie to try and kill Walt. The only ways to deal with blackmail are to get out in front of it and come clean, or to go off the rails and end it at the source

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looky_lou

It gives the impression that he is going to torch the house with gas.

Since the house is not burned in that opening scene, I am guessing that he is really splashing some of the Methlamine chemical used in cooking the meth all over inside the house. That is why it is condemned and fenced off in that scene. The house is contaminated with the chemicals.

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dyna mo

it's interesting you say that, i had wondered if maybe the house was fenced off like that because it was declared a toxic waste zone due to meth, but i had discounted that because they never cooked there, if that was chemical he was sloshing that would make perfect sense, i bet you are right in fact, jesse is staining ww's house with meth chem, i also noticed things like the kitchen island had been removed, your angle would account for that.

bronco67

How would Jesse show up at Walt's house with Methlamine, and why would it be in gas cans? Wouldn't he put gas in a gas cans? He's out of the meth game, and it's not like you just walk into a bodega and buy Methlamine.

I think somehow he's going to be stopped. Maybe Walt Jr is in the house, or maybe Hank shows up.

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looky_lou

Yes, possibly he is stopped, but I still question why the house is condemned and fenced off in the end. Can't wait to find out.

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Captain Kawaii

Love that show. Cranston is a joy to work with.

bhutocracy

You'd have to think it's Walt Jr or Hank, I don't believe he would have any access whatsoever to methlamine.

LAJ

Nope, LOL... no consolation at all.

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John-ACWM

Saved it for tonight, can't wait

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howard

Fuck... Last episode during Amsterdam show 3am Monday morning...

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adendreams

GREAT episode but why was the weed taken out of his pocket? Not an easy thing to do - snag weed out of a pocket without someone noticing.

I thought that was a little unnecessary misdirection

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adendreams

Why would Jesse have Methlamine? He wouldnt have squirreled away any as he had no desire to ever cook again - just a few gallons of gas spread all over a house and furniture would render it pretty much uninhabitable anyway

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dyna mo

if the writers wanted jesse to douse that house with methlamine, all they would have to do is write it in and we would all be going wow, what a great scene.

we are talking about an over-the-top show, it's not out of the question. while doubtful, but certainly not far-fetched. jesse's not the most critical of thinkers, which was another glitch in the brainiac scene where he figured out the ricin ciggs, i don't have a prob with it, but he had to have used both of his brain cells to make that logic leap.

Cleo

One of the best shows on TV.

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Ricin is made from Castor beans.

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boziffous

Jesse pretty much had it figured out the first time when Huell switched the cigarette packs out, he just couldn't put together how Mr. White had access to Brock to poison him. When Saul is trying to get Jesse to give up the marijuana and tells him that if he shows up to the spot high it's 'both our asses'. You can tell Jesse thinks it's weird that Saul said that but doesn't really think much about it right then. Then when he realized that Huell took his weed off of him he puts it together that Huell did lift the ricin cigarette, like he had thought previously, but that it wasn't Mr. White that poisoned Brock it was actually Saul.

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dyna mo

these are not my words and shit, i just c&p'ed it all here for this thread:::::::::::::


much of the crucial action of the back story concerning Jesse’s revelation about Walter poisoning Brock takes place off camera at the end of season four. Here’s a step by step explanation of what happened in 511, and the Season 4 events leading up to it.

A recap of the confusing action at the end of Episode 511:

At around the 48-minute mark of the episode, we see Jesse is standing on that very creepy corner with the blocks that look like tombstones, waiting for Saul Goodman’s vacuum cleaner guy to “disappear” him.

Jesse is fidgeting, and suddenly begins frantically searching all his pockets.
He’s looking for the bag of weed that Saul had tried, unsuccessfully, to grab from him in Saul’s office.

The weed is missing.

Jesse finds his cigarettes instead.

Looking at the cigarette pack and thinking about the missing weed, Jesse has an epiphany.

Jesse thinks back to the action of Episode 412 and 413 , when he thought that his girlfriend Andrea’s young son Brock was poisoned by the Ricin cigarette that Walt had made and gave Jesse to poison Gus Fring.

Jesse now realizes that he didn’t just misplace the weed.

Jesse figures out that Saul’s very large bodyguard, Huell had pickpocketed it from him. Just as he had lifted the pack containing the Ricin cigarette in Season 4. (You can actually see Huell lift the weed from Jesse just before Jesse leaves the office, and Huell says “Excuse me.”

Jesse now realizes that Walter White had actually poisoned Brock, returns to Saul’s office, and generally raises hell.


Huh?

The chunk of backstory you’d need to make this leap of logic can be found in Episode 412 and 413. This off-camera action was discussed at great length’s on Breaking Bad discussion groups, but not fully explained within the show itself.

At the 27:00 mark of Episode 412, Jesse comes over to Walt’s house and confronts him, accusing him of poisoning Brock. At gunpoint. You can see a bit of that confrontation starting at 2:03 in the video below.



Crucially, Jesse, while pointing a gun at Walt, lays out the complicated scenario.


Walt: “You said it yourself. You had [the Ricin cigarette] this morning. When could I have possibly…?”
Jesse: “You had Saul do it. I went to his office. He called me and just had to see me today. His big Man Mountain body guard patted me down and that’s when he must have stole it off of me, right? Was that the plan?”

Yes, that was the plan. Jesse had it perfectly right down to the last detail, but Walt convinces him–and us–that he couldn’t have done it. “Jesse,” Walt argues. “Why would I poison a child?”

Fast forward to the very end of Episode 413. Walt has already killed Gus. Jesse tells Walt that Brock is going to recover.
Jesse: “They’re still saying it wasn’t the ricin.”
Walt: “What was it?”
Jesse: “They’re saying it was a flower called Lily of the Valley.”

The very last shot of Episode 413 and indeed the last shot of the season shows the Lily of the Valley Plant in Walter’s yard, revealing to us that Walter had, indeed, poisoned Brock

But how exactly did Walt poison Brock?

The complete timeline goes something like this:

Walt is sitting in his yard with the gun, waiting for Gus’s men to kill him. He sees the Lily of the Valley plant on the patio. (5:30 into Episode 512)
Off camera, Walt crushes up some of the poison from the Lily of the Valley plant and injects it into a juice box.
Also off camera, Walt delivers the juice box to Brock’s school. (Having seen Brock the day before at Jesse and Andrea’s place.)
Walt puts the juice box in Brock’s lunch. (Again off camera)
Walt calls Saul, and has Huell lift the pack of cigarettes from Jesse. (More off camera)
Huell, Saul’s bodyguard, lifts the pack with the Ricin cig from Jesse, and replaces it with a clean pack with one cigarette missing. (This can be seen in Episode 412 if you know what you’re looking for)
Walt lies to Jesse about all this in Episode 412 about this and Jesse believes him and is now willing to help him kill Gus.
(For his part, Bryan Cranston hadn’t read the Episode 413 script so he, too, believed that Walt was telling the truth, making it easier to give a convincing performance.)
“The way we worked it out, [Walt] had just enough time to do it but it would have been very tricky indeed. It was improbable perhaps, but not impossible,” said Gilligan about the missing backstory. “But he was a very motivated individual at that point.”

(Reader Andrea Ball BLL -0.97% reminded me of this scene below from Epside 502. In the aftermath of Brock’s near poisoning, Jesse is freaking out, wondering what happened to the ricin cigarette, worrying that someone else will get poisoned with it. Walt comes over to “help Jesse look.” But before arriving at Jesse’s, Walt makes a dummy ricin capsule out of salt, stashes the real ricin behind the switchplate–where it stays until the flash forward scene in the beginning of episode 509. Walt “finds” the Ricin in the Roomba and helps Jesse dispose of it, easing his mind, while further manipulating him.)

this is a badass scene too!!!




It was pretty clear that the writers wouldn’t find it dramatically satisfying to put Jesse on a bus to Alaska. Which sets up the inevitable climactic confrontation with Walt.

At the end of 511, we see Jesse splash gasoline all over the White household, but the flash forward in Episode 509 reveals no fire damage to the house.

Who stops Jesse? The smart money seems to be on Walt, Jr, in a face off between Walt’s real son and his surrogate son that reveals to Flynn just what Mom and Dad have been up to this last year.

Does rampaging Jesse give Hank the actual evidence he needs to go after Walt?
Let’s not forget about Todd and Uncle Jack moving the meth operation from Arizona to New Mexico.

boziffous

Nice find.

I was always under the impression that it was Saul who actually delivered the poison that Walt had made using the Lily of the Valley to Brock. It just didn't seem like Walt had enough time to do it himself, plus Saul seemed to be friendly with the kid as well.

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Relentless

Yeah, they discussed it all on Charlie Rose... and admitted it was one of the tighter timeline stretches of the series...

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dyna mo

it certainly squared-away on the progression but it leaves my "jesse's 2 brain cells" comment hanging out there. and tbh, maybe his character is the one i've grappled with the most of all (i always thought it was skyler), but he obviously have enough brains to figure out ww's plans pretty quickly, even if he then buys into ww's manipulative speeches following. maybe that's confusing to me for some reason. but also, even in the early seasons, with jesse saying "bitch!" every other word to this last season throwing drug moneys out the window, it's hard to reconcile the unthinking acts with the ones where he does logically sort shit out. not to mention the emotional outbursts or blank stare into space times.

not that that is a flaw in the character or writing, in fact, i think it prolly most mimics reality right? i know very few people that easily fit into pre-conceived labels when it comes right down to it.

bhutocracy

I agree entirely, I felt it was very cheap for him to magically make this connection. I thought it was a cheap set up to HAVE to lift the pot off him to give him a chance to figure it out as well, as if they'd bother, really rather than straight up demanding it from him pretending for a moment it was really that important. I just don't see how a near catatonic Jesse works it all out to be that sure. I mean they "found" the salt cigarette. Honestly I don't even know why he's still alive given the trouble he could cause.

adendreams

Dyna mo - why was jesse freaking out at the end? he realized his cigs were poisioned? Im just a casual watcher so I got a little lost there

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