Saudi Arabia believe in man-made climate change ?

[2MuchMark]

This is... incredible!

Historic moment: Saudi Arabia sees End of Oil Age coming and opens valves on the carbon bubble

Most analysts believe Saudi Arabia refuses to cut production because it wants to shake out its higher-cost competitors or because it wants to punish Iran and Russia. There may be some truth in those theories, writes Elias Hinckley, strategic advisor and head of the energy practice with international law firm Sullivan and Worcester, but they miss the deeper motivation of the Saudis. Saudi Arabia, he says, sees the end of the Oil Age on the horizon and understands that a great deal of global fossil fuel reserves will have to stay underground to avoid catastrophic global warming. ?That?s why it has opened the valves on the carbon asset bubble.?

Full story at Historic moment: Saudi Arabia sees End of Oil Age coming and opens valves on the carbon bubble - EnergyPost.eu

[bronco67]

Maybe they can talk to the mental midgets in Congress.

[pornmasta]

They need more electric cars

[EonBlue]

This about sums it up right here:

More important is the acknowledgement, demonstrated by the action of world?s most important oil producer, of the beginning of the end of the most prosperous period in human history ? the age of oil.

Man made climate change is bullshit and all of you who seek to limit our future based on it are doing more damage to humanity than any of the supposed damages it would cause.



.

[ITraffic]

only heavily propagandized dumbed down american plebes deny it still. the rest of the world is changing / preparing.

[420]

Originally Posted by ITraffic

only heavily propagandized dumbed down american plebes deny it still. the rest of the world is changing / preparing.

Nobody can even prove the world is not flat to me.

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by ITraffic

only heavily propagandized dumbed down american plebes deny it still. the rest of the world is changing / preparing.

Bullshit. Pure bullshit on so many levels.

Even the publisher of the site Mark Prince linked to in the original post wrote a book in Dutch:

"Het Broeikaseffect Bestaat Niet: De Mythe van de Ondergang van het Milieu"

Translated:

"The Greenhouse Effect No More: The Myth of the Environment Perdition"




.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by EonBlue

This about sums it up right here:



Man made climate change is bullshit and all of you who seek to limit our future based on it are doing more damage to humanity than any of the supposed damages it would cause.



.

Do you avoid vaccinations as well.. I mean it's science and all..

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by crockett

Do you avoid vaccinations as well.. I mean it's science and all..

Nope, my kids are all up to date on all of their vaccinations. Had the twinrix hepatitis vaccination myself a couple of years ago. I think anti-vaxxers are idiots.

What you fail to realize is that there is actual science out there done by actual scientists that dispels most, if not all, of all the AGW alarmism. At some point in the future it will be you alarmists, not the sceptics, who will be equated to the anti-vaxxers. Because science.



.

[slapass]

Originally Posted by EonBlue

Nope, my kids are all up to date on all of their vaccinations. Had the twinrix hepatitis vaccination myself a couple of years ago. I think anti-vaxxers are idiots.

What you fail to realize is that there is actual science out there done by actual scientists that dispels most, if not all, of all the AGW alarmism. At some point in the future it will be you alarmists, not the sceptics, who will be equated to the anti-vaxxers. Because science.



.

We have debated this to death. Do you get paid somehow by spewing this stuff?

[TheSquealer]

Climate change is not "man made". The climate is always changing... and was changing well before the existence of man. Further, the climate has been warming for 1000s of years.

Man might contribute the current warming.

You clowns love distortion and dishonesty to support a point.

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by slapass

We have debated this to death. Do you get paid somehow by spewing this stuff?

Yes. Yes I do. I am making bank off of it. The Koch brothers personally hand-deliver me a cheque once a month.




.

[420]

Originally Posted by TheSquealer

Climate change is not "man made". The climate is always changing... and was changing well before the existence of man. Further, the climate has been warming for 1000s of years.

Man might contribute the current warming.

You clowns love distortion and dishonesty to support a point.

Overpopulation is the root of the problem. There's no need to debate about it though. Earth will take care of it herself through her natural cycles.

[fappingJack]

this will give way to electric cars which are less expensive

[TheSquealer]

Originally Posted by 420

Overpopulation is the root of the problem. There's no need to debate about it though. Earth will take care of it herself through her natural cycles.

Yeah, that's another funny thing. "Stop having kids and doubling the population every few years" never comes up in the discussion either. It is 100% irrelevant what the North America / EU does in the big picture. Pakistan, China and India and others are going to fuck it up anyway.

[ilnjscb]

People do realize that the trillions spent managing man made climate change will come from food, schools, vaccines, etc? What exactly are you willing to cut? If indeed you are correct, will the people who die from reduced access to food, healthcare, and education outnumber those who perish from man made climate change? If you are incorrect, as many staunch advocates of various "impossible to deny" positions have been throughout history, how will you mitigate the loss and suffering you caused by forcing action based on something you didn't understand?

Do you have a solution for the above that doesn't involve a personal insult?

[pimpmaster9000]

batteries are coming in a big way and saudi is looking to unload the oil while it still has value...

saudi is also investing billions in solar power...

something tells me when the world moves to solar, the USA will start invading the countries with the most sun

[H-Tom]

oh, no. not that crap again...



we where living in a little ice age. everything is going back to normal.

this global warming hoax is just a way to introduce a new tax - a carbon tax

[iamBoogieman]

Originally Posted by H-Tom

oh, no. not that crap again...



we where living in a little ice age. everything is going back to normal.

this global warming hoax is just a way to introduce a new tax - a carbon tax

Nice chart youve got there.

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by H-Tom

we where living in a little ice age. everything is going back to normal.

The climate history of the world begins in 1880 for these people. They ignore anything beyond that because it invalidates their theory.



.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by H-Tom

oh, no. not that crap again...



we where living in a little ice age. everything is going back to normal.

this global warming hoax is just a way to introduce a new tax - a carbon tax

For starters we are living at ice age. And whatever you define as normal in here, is actually ice age (milder period). Also, we are already over the little ice age. Have an updated cart.

About that human made climate change, maybe you should familiarize yourself with the concept. It doesn't matter what is our starting point, when observing the change per se. Of course if it is fucking cold, it might be beneficial to let it warm a tad more.

And you should take great care with those charts; when googling it is full of blog posts.

[EonBlue]

.

[aka123]

Isn't this climate change supposed to cause extreme weathers? Like blizzards?

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by aka123

Isn't this climate change supposed to cause extreme weathers? Like blizzards?

Yep. It causes everything.

warmlist



.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by EonBlue

Yep. It causes everything.

warmlist

.

Thank god, I like big tits.

"Great tits cope well with warming "

BBC NEWS | Science/Nature | Great tits cope well with warming

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by **********

This is... incredible!



Full story at Historic moment: Saudi Arabia sees End of Oil Age coming and opens valves on the carbon bubble - EnergyPost.eu

that's the stupidest fucking article posted at teh gfy that I've ever read.

let's get this straight, the author is claiming SA is NOT cutting oil production in order to save the planet.

what. the. fuck.

2) the author completely distorts the following quote to make that ridiculous claim:

In 2000, Sheikh Ahmed Zaki Yamani, former oil minister of Saudi Arabia, gave an interview in which he said:

“Thirty years from now there will be a huge amount of oil – and no buyers. Oil will be left in the ground. The Stone Age came to an end, not because we had a lack of stones, and the oil age will come to an end not because we have a lack of oil.”

[2MuchMark]

Originally Posted by H-Tom

oh, no. not that crap again...



we where living in a little ice age. everything is going back to normal.

this global warming hoax is just a way to introduce a new tax - a carbon tax

Hi H-Tom,

You do realize that this chart comes from an outfit called "American Thinker" which has lots of gems like "How to Make Young People Conservative"? (It's right on the front page!).

Why don't you show charts from NASA instead?

[2MuchMark]

Originally Posted by EonBlue

Man made climate change is bullshit

Nasa, Noaa, and thousands of scientists disagree with you.

Originally Posted by ITraffic

only heavily propagandized dumbed down american plebes deny it still. the rest of the world is changing / preparing.

Originally Posted by EonBlue

Nope, my kids are all up to date on all of their vaccinations. Had the twinrix hepatitis vaccination myself a couple of years ago. I think anti-vaxxers are idiots.
.

Why do you choose to "believe" some science, but not all science? Vaccines are important and save lives. Humans are contributing to the warming of the planet, and the trend needs to be stopped or reversed. Both Because, Science.

Originally Posted by TheSquealer

Climate change is not "man made". The climate is always changing... and was changing well before the existence of man. Further, the climate has been warming for 1000s of years.

Man might contribute the current warming.

You clowns love distortion and dishonesty to support a point.

Yes the climate is always changing - that is not the issue. What is, is that now, the climate is changing VERY VERY FAST. We are seeing some effects Now, but much stronger effects will come in the next 50 to 100 years. This is the problem.

Originally Posted by 420

Overpopulation is the root of the problem. There's no need to debate about it though. Earth will take care of it herself through her natural cycles.

So add increased sickness, dirty air, poisoned water, lack of food to overpopulation? The whole point is that it doesn't have to be like that. With some careful thinking and changes to how we do things today, we can help make the future a better place and keep it at least as good as it is today.

Originally Posted by TheSquealer

Yeah, that's another funny thing. "Stop having kids and doubling the population every few years" never comes up in the discussion either. It is 100% irrelevant what the North America / EU does in the big picture. Pakistan, China and India and others are going to fuck it up anyway.

I disagree - while its true some countries may continue to pollute, Canada and the US has the power, money and brains to clean up our acts which alone would make a significant difference. It has to start somewhere, so why not here?

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by ITraffic

only heavily propagandized dumbed down american plebes deny it still. the rest of the world is changing / preparing.

are you not aware AMerica leads the world on cutting carbon? by far.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by **********

I disagree - while its true some countries may continue to pollute, Canada and the US has the power, money and brains to clean up our acts which alone would make a significant difference. It has to start somewhere, so why not here?

are you not aware AMerica leads the world on cutting carbon? by far.

[Joshua G]

mark.

if the saudis really believe oil is driving climate change & therefore they must stop all this production, they are going about it the wrong way.

by forcing prices lower with an oversupply, they are eliminating the economic viability of alternate energy initiatives, not just other oil producers.

if they believe the oil should stay underground, they should stop pumping & move their economy to something other than oil based, right?

in fact the saudi policy is shortsighted & will only accelerate the moment they themselves run out of oil. & the US with its shale tech will rule the market sooner.

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by **********

Hi H-Tom,

You do realize that this chart comes from an outfit called "American Thinker" which has lots of gems like "How to Make Young People Conservative"? (It's right on the front page!).

Why don't you show charts from NASA instead?

Actually Mark you should realize that that chart originally comes from this paper:

The Younger Dryas cold interval as viewed from central Greenland
Quaternary Science Reviews
Volume 19, Issues 1-5, 1 January 2000, Pages 213-226.

Richard B. Alley
Department of Geosciences and Environment Institute, The Pennsylvania State University, Deike Building, University Park, PA 16802, USA

It is labelled right there on the chart.

Here is a link to that very paper directly from the NOAA website:

NOAA Paleoclimatology Program - Alley 2000 Greenland Ice Core Data

Just because some "crazy right-wing" site posts the graph does not mean that the graph is not valid. The "crazy right-wing" site did not create the graph - the were simply reposting it from another source.

You do understand that many, many websites operate in this manner, right?

As for your awesome NASA temperature chart - would that be the raw data or is it the adjusted, homogenized data? And how do we know that that chart is even real? There is no source listed on it. That is very bad form. It could be from any "crazy left-wing" website with gems like "How to Make People More Progressive" or other such bullshit.




.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

are you not aware AMerica leads the world on cutting carbon? by far.

I am not aware of that, tell more about it? And you mean absolutely of proportionally?

"While the Bush administration opted against Kyoto-type policies, the Obama administration and various state, local, and regional governments have attempted to adopt some Kyoto Protocol goals on a local basis. For example, the Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative (RGGI),[8] is a state-level emissions capping and trading program, which was founded on January 18, 2007, by eight northeastern U.S. states."

Greenhouse gas emissions by the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[aka123]

Originally Posted by Joshua G

mark.

if the saudis really believe oil is driving climate change & therefore they must stop all this production, they are going about it the wrong way.

by forcing prices lower with an oversupply, they are eliminating the economic viability of alternate energy initiatives, not just other oil producers.

if they believe the oil should stay underground, they should stop pumping & move their economy to something other than oil based, right?

in fact the saudi policy is shortsighted & will only accelerate the moment they themselves run out of oil. & the US with its shale tech will rule the market sooner.

This thread's title, etc. won't match with that story. As stated in article; Saudis pump what they can before oil comes more or less obsolete. They don't give a shit about climate change, they just want to get rid of their oil before it's too late.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by aka123

I am not aware of that, tell more about it? And you mean absolutely of proportionally?

"While the Bush administration opted against Kyoto-type policies, the Obama administration and various state, local, and regional governments have attempted to adopt some Kyoto Protocol goals on a local basis. For example, the Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative (RGGI),[8] is a state-level emissions capping and trading program, which was founded on January 18, 2007, by eight northeastern U.S. states."

Greenhouse gas emissions by the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

well, it's a fact. Over the last several years USA has reduced it's carbon output back to 1996 levels and we are still on the job reducing it more. We've embraced alt energies more also.

USA has taken the lead on reducing carbon/greenhouse gases.

respect.

[dyna mo]

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by **********

Nasa, Noaa, and thousands of scientists disagree with you.

NASA and NOAA are the ones fudging the data. Why should anyone believe anything they say? I don't suffer from the same appeal to authority that you do. Besides, they have proven nothing even with their fudged data. There is no incontrovertible proof that man is causing warming and no incontrovertible proof that any warming, whether man-made or otherwise, will be catastrophic.

Also, there are thousands of scientists who disagree with you.

Originally Posted by **********

Why do you choose to "believe" some science, but not all science? Vaccines are important and save lives. Humans are contributing to the warming of the planet, and the trend needs to be stopped or reversed. Both Because, Science.

I tend to believe science that is based on actual experimentation that can provide reasonable expectations for outcomes. There is no such science for the climate. The best we can do is examine past climate and when we do it becomes obvious that all of the current alarm is unfounded.

The part of your quote in bold above is speculative and unproven.

Originally Posted by **********

Yes the climate is always changing - that is not the issue. What is, is that now, the climate is changing VERY VERY FAST. We are seeing some effects Now, but much stronger effects will come in the next 50 to 100 years. This is the problem.

Again, that's just hype, fear mongering and more speculation.




.

[crockett]

It's pretty sad, that even a country such as Saudi Arabia whom has everything to gain by denying fossil fuels are helping cause global warming. Yet they admit it's a cause.

Meanwhile everyone else in the world pretty much agrees with the scientific findings as well.. yet here in America we have right wingers whom pray to their talking point Messiahs and turn everything into a political argument. Of course deny that fossil fuels have anything to do with green house gasses and global warming, because Al Gore made a movie and their talking point Messiahs tell them to deny it because it's a conspiracy to make Al Gore rich..

If it wasn't so fucking sad it would actually be funny..

[dyna mo]

let's not let reality cloud a blogger's skewed view of the world:::::::::::

Saudi Arabia is a major dissident at the global climate conference in Copenhagen, where representatives of more than 190 countries are trying to agree on a new international initiative to combat climate change.

Many environmental groups say the oil-producing giant has long played an obstructionist role in climate change negotiations. Saudi officials fear that reducing emissions will reduce oil exports and be catastrophic for their economy.

For years, Saudi Arabia and other oil-producing countries claimed that scientific evidence that people cause climate change was inconclusive. Then, a few years ago, the Saudis shifted their focus to stall tactics and demanding payments of $100 billion to $200 billion to offset future losses in oil revenue.


Saudi Arabia Tries To Stall Global Emissions Limits : NPR



SA giving a shit about the planet? please.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

let's not let reality cloud a blogger's skewed view of the world:::::::::::

Saudi Arabia is a major dissident at the global climate conference in Copenhagen, where representatives of more than 190 countries are trying to agree on a new international initiative to combat climate change.

Many environmental groups say the oil-producing giant has long played an obstructionist role in climate change negotiations. Saudi officials fear that reducing emissions will reduce oil exports and be catastrophic for their economy.

For years, Saudi Arabia and other oil-producing countries claimed that scientific evidence that people cause climate change was inconclusive. Then, a few years ago, the Saudis shifted their focus to stall tactics and demanding payments of $100 billion to $200 billion to offset future losses in oil revenue.


Saudi Arabia Tries To Stall Global Emissions Limits : NPR



SA giving a shit about the planet? please.

If they care about the planet or not is not what is at debate here.. It's the fact they see the writing on the wall and are making a push to pump & sell as much oil as they can before it gets cut off..

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by crockett

It's pretty sad, that even a country such as Saudi Arabia whom has everything to gain by denying fossil fuels are helping cause global warming. Yet they admit it's a cause.

Meanwhile everyone else in the world pretty much agrees with the scientific findings as well.. yet here in America we have right wingers whom pray to their talking point Messiahs and turn everything into a political argument. Of course deny that fossil fuels have anything to do with green house gasses and global warming, because Al Gore made a movie and their talking point Messiahs tell them to deny it because it's a conspiracy to make Al Gore rich..

If it wasn't so fucking sad it would actually be funny..

The hypocrisy on display in this post is unbelievable.

You are a very, very simple minded person.



.

[dyna mo]

change in carbon emission between 1990 and 2011.

1. congrats Canada on doing absolutely jack shit about it.

2. clearly SA doesn't give 1 single shit about carbon

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by crockett

If they care about the planet or not is not what is at debate here.. It's the fact they see the writing on the wall and are making a push to pump & sell as much oil as they can before it gets cut off..

it states right in the title that this is about SA changing production due to man-made global warming.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by EonBlue

The hypocrisy on display in this post is unbelievable.

You are a very, very simple minded person.



.

Please.. You keep talking about how you know more than all those silly scientist whom work on this stuff for a living.. Yet here you are arguing on a message board and can't even offer up any proof of your claims.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

it states right in the title that this is about SA changing production due to man-made global warming.

That doesn't mean they are doing it to save the planet.. It just means they see the writing on the wall, that govt's of the world will start acting, which means their oil production revenues will go down. As a result, they intend to pump out as much oil as they can now to make as much money as possible.

The point being is they see the writing on the wall that the rest of the world understands fossil fuels are a primary cause and will start reducing usage in the future. They are making a business decision not a decision to save the planet.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by crockett

That doesn't mean they are doing it to save the planet.. It just means they see the writing on the wall, that govt's of the world will start acting, which means their oil production revenues will go down. As a result, they intend to pump out as much oil as they can now to make as much money as possible.

The point being is they see the writing on the wall that the rest of the world understands fossil fuels are a primary cause and will start reducing usage in the future. They are making a business decision not a decision to save the planet.

that what i said earlier and exactly why the op article is silly. It was a business deciison in an attempt to maintain market share and manipulate the market and drive out competition. just like most all of us already knew.

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by crockett

Please.. You keep talking about how you know more than all those silly scientist whom work on this stuff for a living.. Yet here you are arguing on a message board and can't even offer up any proof of your claims.

I have never once said I know more than any scientist. But I am willing to consider the work of some scientists who may know as much as, or more than, other scientists.

There is no proof of any of my "claims" - just as you cannot offer any proof of any of your claims while you also argue here on this message board. There is scientific evidence that contradicts and/or calls into question other scientific evidence. Therefore I remain unconvinced that the science is settled as you so eagerly believe without question. That is a political position not a scientific one.

You and Mark Prince are the only ones here trying to put things into absolute and unassailable terms.



.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

well, it's a fact. Over the last several years USA has reduced it's carbon output back to 1996 levels and we are still on the job reducing it more. We've embraced alt energies more also.

USA has taken the lead on reducing carbon/greenhouse gases.

respect.

Well, respect. Although per capita US is still one of the biggest carbon emissions producer. So, more simpler terms: shitty student has got little better.

List of countries by carbon dioxide emissions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by aka123

Well, respect. Although per capita US is still one of the biggest carbon emissions producer. So, more simpler terms: shitty student has got little better.

List of countries by carbon dioxide emissions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

USA leads the globe on reducing carbon. Its as simple as that. Spin it any way you need to make it a slight on USA but the simple fact is very clear.

[dyna mo]

Oh and Canada could not care less about reducing its carbon.