US bank account.

[Sid70]

Since Payoneer and US Paypal don't work anymore, is there any way to get a private US bank account online?

[Adraco]

No
All real American banks require you as a foreigner to personally walk in the door, sit down with a banker, verify your passport, creditcard and address.

Some banks, like Chase, even requires you to show that you have some type of US connection, like an employment, a rental agreement or similar documents before they even consider to open even a simple checking account for you.

[Serge Litehead]

it used to be easy pre 9/11, same as for anonymous bank accounts anywhere in the world

nowadays, i don't think so, US bank regulations stiffened around KYC and AML rules. if you find one though, please post here

solution that does work and the only method I believe: you can register a US company through some agent that handles corp registration, receiving and forwarding mail correspondence and then, they or you will be able to open a US business account for the corp with that address.
Also keep in mind you will need to pay income taxes for that business to Uncle Sam's IRS

You can open personal US bank account if you've got SSN and proof of US mail address in a form of utility bills or lease agreement to your name along with proof of identity.

dude, switch to bitcoins.
it's easy to get them now, even with a CC. and there are even bitcoin debit cards that work with regular ATMs. As well not that difficult to cash them out.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Since Payoneer and US Paypal don't work anymore, is there any way to get a private US bank account online?

Try to incorporate online in Delaware? Probably a workable scenario with skype and that. Hard to say. Americans can get very anal. Banks themselves are simply racist.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

Try to incorporate online in Delaware? Probably a workable scenario with skype and that. Hard to say. Americans can get very anal. Banks themselves are simply racist.

Originally Posted by holograph

solution that does work and the only method I believe: you can register a US company through some agent that handles corp registration, receiving and forwarding mail correspondence and then, they or you will be able to open a US business account for the corp with that address.
Also keep in mind you will need to pay income taxes for that business to Uncle Sam's IRS

I had a word with a Delaware co agent. Seems to be fairly straight to open and pay each year. But I still don't understand how would i report income and do the books. Would probably need an accountant, but that stays behind the doors - they don't tell.

So, I'm missing that part to make a decision.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

So, I'm missing that part to make a decision.

It's a tax haven ffs bro. You are buying tax exemption. Give to charity with the extra proceeds. Call it philanthropy. Rinse and repeat. It's what they do. All the rage.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

It's a tax haven ffs bro. You are buying tax exemption. Give to charity with the extra proceeds. Call it philanthropy. Rinse and repeat.

Does it work for all sorts of income? The idea is to withdraw paypal to that account. Should PayPal account be US based or non-US to make income source USA/NON-USA for a Delaware co?

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Does it work for all sorts of income? The idea is to withdraw paypal to that account. Should PayPal account be US based or non-US to make income source USA/NON-USA for a Delaware co?

It would make sense to sign up to paypal USA as a domestic LLC. You want to come at these institutions as you are. I presume it will let you declare at least some owners as foreign nationals. Again though, very anal after 9/11 particularly in this regard. You could take your Delaware LLC and bank in Europe. I'd use representation in the States in any regard. The process is a fucked one no matter how you slice it and it's also intentionally expensive to an extent that can prove itself to be prohibitive.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

It would make sense to sign up to paypal USA as a domestic LLC. You want to come at these institutions as you are. I presume it will let you declare at least some owners as foreign nationals. Again though, very anal after 9/11 particularly in this regard. You could take your Delaware LLC and bank in Europe. I'd use representation in the States in any regard. The process is a fucked one no matter how you slice it and it's also intentionally expensive to an extent that can prove itself to be prohibitive.

To sum up:
US LLC as a foreign owner.
US PayPal account in USD
Banking in EU, USD account.

Means no tax in EU? Where does the LLC get taxed then?

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Where does the LLC get taxed then?

https://corp.delaware.gov/frtax.shtml

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

In Delaware. That's the whole point after all.

Does it mean no accounting, no books, no reporting just pay once a year a certain amount?

[Serge Litehead]

you do your taxes, hiring your own accountant, no matter where you're banking at
if you have US LLC physically headquartered somewhere else, then, you will have to figure to whom you pay how much taxes.

i submit all accounts for biz: checking account, paypal, paxum to my accountant. used to epass too.


Paypal is anal though, they need proof of you and your biz. how that goes for foreign owners with US corps - that is something that you may need to research further.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Does it mean no accounting, no books, no reporting just pay once a year a certain amount?

No, the Americans will want books but the tax rate is low to non existent in anywhere regarded as a tax haven. It's a shift from paying unlawful taxes to paying legal bribes. Not going to sugar coat it for you, the system works this way. Good luck having fun.

[woj]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Does it mean no accounting, no books, no reporting just pay once a year a certain amount?

you will have to file forms each year, federal + state + some forms in your country, so it's likely going to get somewhat expensive... it's certainly not just $200 (or whatever it is) annual corporation fee...

what are you trying to accomplish anyway?

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

you do your taxes, hiring your own accountant, no matter where you're banking at
if you have US LLC physically headquartered somewhere else, then, you will have to figure to whom you pay how much taxes.

i submit all accounts for biz: checking account, paypal, paxum to my accountant. used to epass too.


Paypal is anal though, they need proof of you and your biz. how that goes for foreign owners with US corps - that is something that you may need to research further.

Having a US / Delaware co I'd need a US accountant to file the Annual Report as I understand. How much does it usually cost? Also, running the books in the US/Delaware - what would that mean technically - how would I submit my operations to an accountant to prepare a Annual Report?

Before that happens - I will have to somehow open a US bank account remotely for that Delaware corp. Tell me it's easy to do.

[2MuchMark]

Check out Home | 1800company and LegalZoom: Start a Business, Protect Your Family: LLC, Incorporate, Wills, Trademark, Legal Advice

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

I will have to somehow open a US bank account remotely for that Delaware corp.

https://corp.delaware.gov/howtoform.shtml

https://www.delawareintercorp.com/

State fees and the first year's Registered Agent Fee. LLC = $189.00 CORP. = $188.00

Delaware LLC | Delaware Bank Account | Opening a Bank Account

Summary of Requirements to Open a Delaware Business Bank Account in the US

You may be surprised to learn US banks do not all have the same policies to open a business bank account (aka corporate bank account or commercial bank account)! Despite these differences, there are a few things you can be sure the bank will request:

Articles of Incorporation or Articles of Formation
Passport of the person authorized to open the account
Employer Identification Number (EIN) - Allow 4-6 weeks prior to traveling to the United States
Certificate of Good Standing
Banking Resolution
Proof of US physical address - signed office lease
All banks in the United States require an "in person" visit by at least one signer. Travel is REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Sid70

Tell me it's easy to do.

Good one Sid.

[King Mark]

Simple.com

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by woj

what are you trying to accomplish anyway?

The problem starts here:

So, PayPal was an alternative before, it was possible to withdraw any USD PayPal income to a US Bank account ( provided by Payoneer ). Now, US PayPal does not allow US accounts that Payoneer gives out to the clients.


Next, since many US based clients, for some reason, don't understand the difference between ACH ( that is a type of payment Payoneer allows ) and Wire Transfer my US based payments bounce back. I need to teach people each time. Many simply refuse to do ACH, especially if its micropayments.

I need a normal solution for that.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Many simply refuse to do ACH, especially if its micropayments.

I need a normal solution for that.

You sound like you need a merchant account.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Dead Eye

Simple.com

We can only offer accounts to permanent residents of the United States, over 18 years of age, with a Social Security number.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

You sound like you need a merchant account.

Don't send me to 2CO please.

[GrandeRevenueMark]

I know an option but it's pricey ... between $2k and $2.5 based on the services needed.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Don't send me to 2CO please.

Big selection of merchants. Not sure what you are selling so I can't recommend anything. Doing stuff isn't going to fly to a bank.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

https://corp.delaware.gov/howtoform.shtml

https://www.delawareintercorp.com/



Delaware LLC | Delaware Bank Account | Opening a Bank Account





Good one Sid.

Will there be "blood" in EU or US only?

Imagine, a non EU owner of the US based company opens a corp account in EU and starts operating. Will there be tax liabilities for the company in EU or US only?

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Will there be "blood" in EU or US only?

Imagine, a non EU owner of the US based company opens a corp account in EU and starts operating. Will there be tax liabilities for the company in EU or US only?

Just in the US if you don't go and start banking in France, lol. You can intelligently mix and match jurisdictions to your benefit however IRL.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

Big selection of merchants. Not sure what you are selling so I can't recommend anything. Doing stuff isn't going to fly to a bank.

Services. Web design.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

Just in the US if you don't go and start banking in France, lol.

So there might be variations per country? Why France in particular is that hard on that?

Basically it may be a solution - being close to your bank its easy to operate.

If we take that as an imaginable company, is there any preference between having a Delaware LLC or any other US based one? - it's about the cheapest handling, reporting and taxation.

[Serge Litehead]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Having a US / Delaware co I'd need a US accountant to file the Annual Report as I understand. How much does it usually cost? Also, running the books in the US/Delaware - what would that mean technically - how would I submit my operations to an accountant to prepare a Annual Report?

Before that happens - I will have to somehow open a US bank account remotely for that Delaware corp. Tell me it's easy to do.

I'm not sure what that Annual Report is about

hiring accountant (CPA) to do your annual taxes filing for small biz will run you somewhere in the range of $200-500

you could find one on linkedin, craigslist, etc., you send them your bank statements and any other accounts for the business and they care of the rest. you will need to be able to chat or have a call with them and go through transactions to properly classify them.

i'm thinking a registering agent in delaware should be able to take care of that for you or refer to someone.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

I'm not sure what that Annual Report is about

hiring accountant (CPA) to do your annual taxes filing for small biz will run you somewhere in the range of $200-500

you could find one on linkedin, craigslist, etc., you send them your bank statements and any other accounts for the business and they care of the rest. you will need to be able to chat or have a call with them and go through transactions to properly classify them.

i'm thinking a registering agent in delaware should be able to take care of that for you or refer to someone.

Sergio, in short, does it make sense to have a Delaware co at all for the purpose of accepting US payments but banking in EU? I mean there is certainly a difference between Delaware and say NY LLC - but what is the difference for a non US citizen? Will I benefit somehow from having US income landing into a EU based Delaware company account comparing with NY registered one?

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

So there might be variations per country? Why France in particular is that hard on that?

Basically it may be a solution - being close to your bank its easy to operate.

If we take that as an imaginable company, is there any preference between having a Delaware LLC or any other US based one? - it's about the cheapest handling, reporting and taxation.

You can theoretically pay less by having an American presence both corporately and for banking. Flip side is more regulations, laws, restrictions, travel/vetting, general scrutiny and potentially even taxes. If you want to minimize cost you need jurisdictions that offer tax exemption status and then you are just stuck with yearly fees, about $2k/yr on average give or take.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

If you want to minimize cost you need jurisdictions that offer tax exemption status and then you are just stuck with yearly fees, about $2k/yr on average give or take.

This.

And in regards to why is that good, what would be a US tax for a non Delaware US co with gross income, say, of 60k ?

[Serge Litehead]

as I've said before, it doesn't matter where your bank is. unless your business has physical presence and doing business in another country you only have to take care of US taxes for the biz.

does it make sense to run such a set up? if you do good volume in revenue, sure. but also doing paypal paxum exchanges or such maybe a cheaper option then going though all that to be able cashout paypal

[Serge Litehead]

each state is different. Delaware and Nevada are know as offshore zones for non US, for minimal taxes

you don't pay taxes on gross income in the states for businesses. you do expenses first, then tax on the rest

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

a non Delaware US co

Incorporated where? Nevada?

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

as I've said before, it doesn't matter where your bank is. unless your business has physical presence and doing business in another country you only have to take care of US taxes for the biz.

does it make sense to run such a set up? if you do good volume in revenue, sure. but also doing paypal paxum exchanges or such maybe a cheaper option then going though all that to be able cashout paypal

I did not understand at first the "physical presence and doing business" thing you said. That would be a US co that has no US office but who would accept US payments ( wire, paypal ) into a EU based account. I might need to ask if that is somehow leads to a local fees or taxes, i cant tell for sure.

That would be ace at some point, I know what you mean. But not many people would want to do PayPal->Payoneer, even with a 100% paypal.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

Incorporated where? Nevada?

Say anywhere in the US, in NY or any 'normal' state.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

anywhere in the US

Tax exemption only occurs in havens.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_haven

Did you know your Delaware Corporation or Delaware LLC can bank anywhere in the world? If you are not interested in banking in the US we suggest you contact a reputable international bank with a branch conveniently located near you to learn what their requirements will be to open a business bank account (also known as Corporate account or Commercial account). Typically, a bank located outside the US will require Articles of Incorporation, By-laws or Operating Agreement and Certificate of Incumbency or Power of Attorney. You can also expect the bank to require at least one of the documents to bear an Apostille or to be legalized by the consular office in Washington, DC. All of our International Incorporation and LLC Formation service packages include an Apostille or Gold Seal Authentication on the Certificate of Incorporation. If you will not have a US Source of Income, will not be banking in the US and will not have employees in the US, you are not likely to need an EIN.

Delaware LLC | Delaware Bank Account | Opening a Bank Account

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by Relic

Tax exemption only occurs in havens.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_haven





Delaware LLC | Delaware Bank Account | Opening a Bank Account

"If you will not have a US Source of Income" - it would be dealing with the US customers paying via paypal or wire internationally. Is that a US source of income? I guess it is.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Sid70

"If you will not have a US Source of Income" - it would be dealing with the US customers paying via paypal or wire internationally. Is that a US source of income? I guess it is.

It's whatever they say it is, and that changes regularly. Like fees

[Serge Litehead]

Originally Posted by Sid70

I did not understand at first the "physical presence and doing business" thing you said. That would be a US co that has no US office but who would accept US payments ( wire, paypal ) into a EU based account. I might need to ask if that is somehow leads to a local fees or taxes, i cant tell for sure.

That would be ace at some point, I know what you mean. But not many people would want to do PayPal->Payoneer, even with a 100% paypal.

Your US co will have a US address, presumably that what you'll be using to open accounts and doing business as.
Doing business elsewhere - like big companies that run headquarters, retail or manufacturing in other countries will have some tax obligations to those countries. You, on the other hand will be doing business as a US co with an US address, no matter where you are located personally, your own personal taxes is another matter though. having bank in US or EU doesn't make any difference in terms of taxes.

Paypal to Payoneer yeah, i feel ya. It's easier to get Paxum and do PP exchanges, although many complains recently around here re Paxum cannot be not worrisome, it feels like Paxum is struggling with their own banking set ups, unfortunately.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

Your US co will have a US address, presumably that what you'll be using to open accounts and doing business as.
Doing business elsewhere - like big companies that run headquarters, retail or manufacturing in other countries will have some tax obligations to those countries. You, on the other hand will be doing business as a US co with an US address, no matter where you are located personally, your own personal taxes is another matter though. having bank in US or EU doesn't make any difference in terms of taxes.

Paypal to Payoneer yeah, i feel ya. It's easier to get Paxum and do PP exchanges, although many complains recently around here re Paxum cannot be not worrisome, it feels like Paxum is struggling with their own banking set ups, unfortunately.

On the PP/Payoneer/Paxum - i'm not related to adult anymore and i dont deal with anyone who pays via Paxum... that leaves me the US co option to calculate the real cost of.

[Serge Litehead]

Originally Posted by Sid70

On the PP/Payoneer/Paxum - i'm not related to adult anymore and i dont deal with anyone who pays via Paxum... that leaves me the US co option to calculate the real cost of.

yeah, but if you've got paxum, it's easier to exchange PP to it around here

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

your own personal taxes is another matter though.

In the regards with the US co what do you mean? Say, I'd be the only co owner, but I'm not a US resident. What is considered my income dealing with the US co that pays tax in USA, the whole profit / part of it / expenses excluded? to report in the country of residence? Damn, that shit is complicated.

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

yeah, but if you've got paxum, it's easier to exchange PP to it around here

I see, agreed. But, as you mentioned, and its not a secret, the anal probe, retina scan and posing with my passport on a photo in a public toilet to send to Paxum is against my policy

[Serge Litehead]

not sure, i know you have to consider country of citizenship and country of residence, all this varies, with some countries you've got to pay to your country of citizenship, in some cases only to country of residence

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by holograph

not sure, i know you have to consider country of citizenship and country of residence, all this varies, with some countries you've got to pay to your country of citizenship, in some cases only to country of residence

Correct.... but the income on the US company without transferring $$ to a personal account is not creating any personal income, am I wrong? And ATM withdrawals from a corporate card, or payments are just company's money.

[woj]

one option might be to let some 3rd party take payments for you for a fee, might be a lot cheaper and easier than setting everything up yourself...

[Sid70]

Originally Posted by woj

one option might be to let some 3rd party take payments for you for a fee, might be a lot cheaper and easier than setting everything up yourself...

Well, if 2CO was not that complicated for a customer, someone on a smaller scale who'd take PayPal from me or on my behalf to ACH /DEBIT CARD into Payoneer for a free... let me know if you have someone in mind.

[Serge Litehead]

Originally Posted by Sid70

Correct.... but the income on the US company without transferring $$ to a personal account is not creating any personal income, am I wrong? And ATM withdrawals from a corporate card, or payments are just company's money.

well if you take money from a business card it should be justifiable as a business expense, because just like you said, it's company's finances.

if you take it for personal reasons and if by some chance you get audited by IRS, they surely will ask about those transactions, you may get a fine or will be asked to pay difference in taxes, maybe they will report you to your country's tax agency, who knows..