rochard what is your assessment of

[Grapesoda]

this 'opinion'?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opini...cid=spartandhp


I truly am interested. I see this a clear look at the situation... you?

[tony286]

Eric Trump tolld golf digest in 2014 that all their financing came from russia. Everyone around them seems to have some type of connection to russia. Mueller is a republican put in by republicans. As much as the gop like linder scream democrats, they arent in power the gop is.Thy are grasping at anything because they see the writing on the wall.

This is a drip drip drip but righties have no loyaltiy to the country its to party only. When Mitt was running he said the big problem was russia and now the gop is russia isnt that bad. Putin isnt a bad guy. Its almost funny.

[Bladewire]

^^^ Truth

[OneHungLo]

Russia Russia Russia

[BaldBastard]

Here's mine

you link to this like its on MSM so must be true, where its just in the user written opinion section

the article actually comes from The Daily Caller a site founded by Tucker Carlson, the FoxNews host.

Deflecting any Russian investigations seems to be a priority with anything fox related..

and before anyone goes trump.. think Murdoch

Murdoch swims in Russian money and has a long and verified past of working with Russians at the highest levels of Government.

As a word of advise from someone's whose been watching Murdoch infiltrate, manipulate and finally own the Government in their own adopted country, Do not under any circumstances believe anything Murdoch business post regarding Russia

because its in their interest more than anyone.. to have that investigation stopped.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

this 'opinion'?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opini...cid=spartandhp


I truly am interested. I see this a clear look at the situation... you?

Actually, Id like to hear how you guys on the right can constantly choose to ignore the many sources dealing with Trump and his cronies ties to Russia. How is it you can contonue to turn a bland eye all because of party politics..

You know damn well if Hillary had even 1/10th of this stuff related to her, you'd be craying blood murder. So how is it you can lke to yourself that its all fake because its your team on the shit?

I mean, really you have to know deep down in side that Trump is lying.. Right?

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by tony286

Eric Trump tolld golf digest in 2014 that all their financing came from russia. Everyone around them seems to have some type of connection to russia. Mueller is a republican put in by republicans. As much as the gop like linder scream democrats, they arent in power the gop is.Thy are grasping at anything because they see the writing on the wall.

This is a drip drip drip but righties have no loyaltiy to the country its to party only. When Mitt was running he said the big problem was russia and now the gop is russia isnt that bad. Putin isnt a bad guy. Its almost funny.

well, the ONLY way there will EVER be peace in the Mideast is IF Russia, China and the US work together. I was very excited that there were Russian connections and to try and say there is NO Clinton, Russian connection would be insane

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

well, the ONLY way there will EVER be peace in the Mideast is IF Russia, China and the US work together. I was very excited that there were Russian connections and to try and say there is NO Clinton, Russian connection would be insane

lay off the crack man it is fucking with your head

[shiraz9944]

You guys still at this LOL. I said I'll come back in a year or so and nothing will have happened. Oh guess what, nothing has LOL. Mueller has one charge on ONE guy for lying to the FBI..........That's it. Bill Clinton lied to the DOJ and Congress. He finished his term and is considered a very good president.

Economy booming, stock market and cryptocurrencies at all time highs......Unemployment dropped again and manufacturing jobs had biggest gain since the 08 crisis. Keep on posting and keep on dreaming LOL. It takes 2/3 of the senate to impeach to remove plus the house judiciary and majority leader have to put the resolutions forth. So the dems would need to completely take control of both houses and that isn't happening in the HOR. Not gonna happen ever so get over it and concentrate on who you'll run in 2020. My bet is HRC will run again and you will all line up behind her like sheep. A 74 year old has been, living off her husband's legacy as a great president.

Oh and Hillary and Bill have plenty of connections to Russia that are fact. Not POSSIBLE connections. They've been paid many millions to give speeches for Russian and Putin so please. Stop with all the hypocrisy, it's sad.

[shiraz9944]

The process starts in the House. Individual members can introduce impeachment resolutions like ordinary bills, or the House can initiate proceedings by passing a resolution authorizing an inquiry.

In modern history, the House Judiciary Committee has overseen impeachment proceedings. A simple majority vote is needed to move an impeachment resolution, like other legislation, out of the committee.

At that point, it is up to the House majority leader, currently Republican Kevin McCarthy, whether to put the measure to a vote by the full chamber, and when to hold such a vote.

The full House can approve the articles of impeachment by a simple majority vote.

Impeachment is like an indictment and the Senate then tries the official. A two-thirds vote of the Senate is required for conviction, which results in removal from office.

If a president is impeached and removed, the vice president takes over until the next scheduled presidential election picks the next occupant of the White House.

Only two American presidents have been impeached: Andrew Johnson in 1868 and Bill Clinton in 1998. Neither was convicted by the Senate. President Richard Nixon, facing almost certain impeachment over the Watergate scandal, resigned in 1974.

[Bladewire]

^^^ Off it's meds

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by shiraz9944

The process starts in the House. Individual members can introduce impeachment resolutions like ordinary bills, or the House can initiate proceedings by passing a resolution authorizing an inquiry.

In modern history, the House Judiciary Committee has overseen impeachment proceedings. A simple majority vote is needed to move an impeachment resolution, like other legislation, out of the committee.

At that point, it is up to the House majority leader, currently Republican Kevin McCarthy, whether to put the measure to a vote by the full chamber, and when to hold such a vote.

The full House can approve the articles of impeachment by a simple majority vote.

Impeachment is like an indictment and the Senate then tries the official. A two-thirds vote of the Senate is required for conviction, which results in removal from office.

If a president is impeached and removed, the vice president takes over until the next scheduled presidential election picks the next occupant of the White House.

Only two American presidents have been impeached: Andrew Johnson in 1868 and Bill Clinton in 1998. Neither was convicted by the Senate. President Richard Nixon, facing almost certain impeachment over the Watergate scandal, resigned in 1974.

I don't remember Clinton leaving office?

[Rochard]

My assessment is that we need to allow the investigation to run it's course.

It's painfully obvious the Russian government tried to directly influence our election. This is the most serious attack on the United States government and our democracy. This is not a political issue - the very security of our country as been threatened. If Trump loves our country as much as claims, why isn't he leading the charge here and demanding this investigation to continue? That in itself speaks volumes.

This investigation is far from over.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

I don't remember Clinton leaving office?

He never said Clinton left office. He said Clinton was impeached, not removed from office.

[nico-t]

Originally Posted by crockett

Actually, Id like to hear how you guys on the right can constantly choose to ignore the many sources dealing with Trump and his cronies ties to Russia. How is it you can contonue to turn a bland eye all because of party politics..

You know damn well if Hillary had even 1/10th of this stuff related to her, you'd be craying blood murder. So how is it you can lke to yourself that its all fake because its your team on the shit?

I mean, really you have to know deep down in side that Trump is lying.. Right?

Hillary has 9/10th of the stuff related to her, but the media failed to report on any of it during the elections because she was the establishments pick. Simple as that. Trump is about a 100 times less worse than Hillary. Easy choice.

She lies about deaths, invasions, overthrowing governments, pay for play, destroying domestic companies for foreign money, russia to provoke WW3. World destroying, citizen killing, greedy evil lies.

Trump lied about how much money he has. A simple, narcissistic lie. I prefer that over the above.

[nico-t]

Originally Posted by Rochard

My assessment is that we need to allow the investigation to run it's course.

It's painfully obvious the Russian government tried to directly influence our election. This is the most serious attack on the United States government and our democracy. This is not a political issue - the very security of our country as been threatened. If Trump loves our country as much as claims, why isn't he leading the charge here and demanding this investigation to continue? That in itself speaks volumes.

This investigation is far from over.

Funny. You idiots demanded the investigation on Hillary's deleted emails to stop on the day it was announced. And that was based on actual wrongdoing directly done by Hillary herself. Yet this fake witch hunt, with no direct connection to Trump whatsoever, cannot be dragged on long enough for you idiots.

The media has you by the balls with their pathetic witch hunt and make you peep every time they choose to squeeze

[OneHungLo]

Originally Posted by shiraz9944

You guys still at this LOL. I said I'll come back in a year or so and nothing will have happened. Oh guess what, nothing has LOL. Mueller has one charge on ONE guy for lying to the FBI..........That's it. Bill Clinton lied to the DOJ and Congress. He finished his term and is considered a very good president.

Economy booming, stock market and cryptocurrencies at all time highs......Unemployment dropped again and manufacturing jobs had biggest gain since the 08 crisis. Keep on posting and keep on dreaming LOL. It takes 2/3 of the senate to impeach to remove plus the house judiciary and majority leader have to put the resolutions forth. So the dems would need to completely take control of both houses and that isn't happening in the HOR. Not gonna happen ever so get over it and concentrate on who you'll run in 2020. My bet is HRC will run again and you will all line up behind her like sheep. A 74 year old has been, living off her husband's legacy as a great president.

Oh and Hillary and Bill have plenty of connections to Russia that are fact. Not POSSIBLE connections. They've been paid many millions to give speeches for Russian and Putin so please. Stop with all the hypocrisy, it's sad.

Well said.

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by Rochard

My assessment is that we need to allow the investigation to run it's course.

It's painfully obvious the Russian government tried to directly influence our election. This is the most serious attack on the United States government and our democracy. This is not a political issue - the very security of our country as been threatened. If Trump loves our country as much as claims, why isn't he leading the charge here and demanding this investigation to continue? That in itself speaks volumes.

This investigation is far from over.

Like we never tried to manipulate the Russian politics LOL

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by nico-t

Hillary has 9/10th of the stuff related to her, but the media failed to report on any of it during the elections because she was the establishments pick. Simple as that. Trump is about a 100 times less worse than Hillary. Easy choice.

She lies about deaths, invasions, overthrowing governments, pay for play, destroying domestic companies for foreign money, russia to provoke WW3. World destroying, citizen killing, greedy evil lies.

Trump lied about how much money he has. A simple, narcissistic lie. I prefer that over the above.

Kind of my thinking too

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by Rochard

He never said Clinton left office. He said Clinton was impeached, not removed from office.

Let me see if I understand this if you're a Democrat and you get impeached you get a slap on the hand and yelled at and if you're Republican and you get impeached you leave office

[beerptrol]

Lol. Deflect, deny, and lie. Keep sucking the Putin and Chump cock

Originally Posted by nico-t

Hillary has 9/10th of the stuff related to her, but the media failed to report on any of it during the elections because she was the establishments pick. Simple as that. Trump is about a 100 times less worse than Hillary. Easy choice.

She lies about deaths, invasions, overthrowing governments, pay for play, destroying domestic companies for foreign money, russia to provoke WW3. World destroying, citizen killing, greedy evil lies.

Trump lied about how much money he has. A simple, narcissistic lie. I prefer that over the above.

[Vendzilla]

democrats said Bush lied about the WMD's in Iraq that our intelligence agencies said were there, now the democrats are saying the intelligence agencies are correct about Russia ties when there still hasn't been anything found and 9 out of 15 of the people that are working for Mueller donated to the Clinton campaign and they are using a dossier that was funded by the DNC.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

democrats said Bush lied about the WMD's in Iraq that our intelligence agencies said were there, now the democrats are saying the intelligence agencies are correct about Russia ties when there still hasn't been anything found and 9 out of 15 of the people that are working for Mueller donated to the Clinton campaign and they are using a dossier that was funded by the DNC.

You're so full of shit vendildo.. Bush cherry picked various intellengance groups intel to make a case for war. There were multiple agencies who had intell on Iraq it wasn't just US sources.

What Bush did, was cherry picked any intel that stated Saddam "might" have WMDs using that for proof, meanwhile he completely ignored intel that said Saddam didnt have WMDs..

For the fucking record there was much more info stating he didnt have them... Also this is same reason Bush/Cheney claimed Saddam was funding al Quadia which was 100% false..


Why do you lie Vendildo and try to rewite history ? Didnt the military teach you to have honor? Seriously why are you right wing nuts always so full of fucking shit? None of you have any honor or integrity. Your just partisan hacks who will lie about anything.

Fucking hack, you are seriously a piece of shit.

Also for the record you dumb fuck, Trump even stated Bush lied about WMDs.. Trump went as far as to say Bush should be impeached..


Yes, Trump Said Bush 'Lied' - FactCheck.org


Trump, Feb. 13: You call it whatever you want. I want to tell you. They lied. They said there were weapons of mass destruction; there were none. And they knew there were none. There were no weapons of mass destruction



Blitzer, Oct. 15, 2008: Nancy Pelosi, the speaker?

Trump: Well, you know, when she first got in and was named speaker, I met her. And I’m very impressed by her. I think she’s a very impressive person. I like her a lot. But I was surprised that she didn’t do more in terms of Bush and going after Bush. It was almost — it just seemed like she was going to really look to impeach Bush and get him out of office, which, personally, I think would have been a wonderful thing.

Blitzer: Impeaching him?

Trump: Absolutely, for the war, for the war.

Blitzer: Because of the conduct of the war.

Trump: Well, he lied. He got us into the war with lies. And, I mean, look at the trouble Bill Clinton got into with something that was totally unimportant. And they tried to impeach him, which was nonsense. And, yet, Bush got us into this horrible war with lies, by lying, by saying they had weapons of mass destruction, by saying all sorts of things that turned out not to be true.

(CROSSTALK)

Blitzer: Their argument is, they weren’t lying, that that was the intelligence that he was presented, and it was not as if he was just lying about it.

Trump: I don’t believe that.

Blitzer: You believe that it was a deliberate lie?

Trump: I don’t believe it. And I don’t think you believe it either, Wolf. You are a very, very intelligent young man. I don’t think you believe it either.


You are a gullible fuck vendildo....

[crockett]

Just to further burry you with facts., This is Trump during the debates stright up stating Bush lied about WMDs in Iraq.. Gee what happened to the Trump from this debate, he almost sounded intelligent and like he cared for America...





Fake News? Guess Trump was running as a Democrat during the campain.. who knew?..

Do you feel gullible yet vendildo? Starting to get the picture that Trump will say anything as long as it benifits him for the moment? Why do you blindly accept these lies from Trump yet call democrats out?

Obviously, Trump was lying about Bush right or is he lying now? So hard to tell which "alt" facts are the correct ones with you right wing bats.. I guess it's what ever is convenient for the time being then you will rewrite history to claim the reverse later.

Will vendilo have the honor and integrity to reply to my posts or will he squirm away like a lying rat?? Just like grapesoda ignored my questions beca3ise they were too difficult for him and might of provoked him into actually having to think for himself...Stay tuned for the cliff hanger.....

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by nico-t

Funny. You idiots demanded the investigation on Hillary's deleted emails to stop on the day it was announced. And that was based on actual wrongdoing directly done by Hillary herself. Yet this fake witch hunt, with no direct connection to Trump whatsoever, cannot be dragged on long enough for you idiots.

The media has you by the balls with their pathetic witch hunt and make you peep every time they choose to squeeze

There was never a proper reason for any investigation into Hillary's emails. No matter how you spin it, it just isn't illegal for the Secretary of State to send classified email through a private server. Not only is it not illegal, it was a common practice at the State Department, Congress, and other government offices. We had an investigation into something that wasn't a crime and wasn't illegal. Then we had a second investigation. And then the investigations keep happening. We kept having investigations into something that just wasn't a crime. At the same time, we never focused on anyone other than Hillary Clinton. That's a witch hunt.

It was the same thing with Benghazi. No crime was ever committed. But we multiple investigations into Benghazi "just because".

Meanwhile we have one investigation into tRUMP, people are pleading guilty, and people are being charged. This isn't coming to a conclusion, but instead it seems to me like it's just getting started. Let the investigation run it's course.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

Let me see if I understand this if you're a Democrat and you get impeached you get a slap on the hand and yelled at and if you're Republican and you get impeached you leave office

It's not a Democrat vs Republican issue. It depends on the individual case.

In the case of President Bill Clinton, he was impeached because he lied about having sexual relations during the Whitewater investigation. When he was impeached, Congress did not feel strongly enough to remove Clinton from office.

It's interesting to note that Jeff Sessions lied under oath and yet is still in office. Again.... the man in charge of our entire legal system.... lied under oath... and is still in office.

I was a hardcore Republican at the time when President Bill Clinton was impeached. This was a witch hunt, and completely improper. That was when I left the Republican party. I refuse to be a member of a party that unfairly and unjustly attacks their opponents with only purpose of making the other side look bad. Clearly this hasn't changed with the Republican party.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

Let me see if I understand this if you're a Democrat and you get impeached you get a slap on the hand and yelled at and if you're Republican and you get impeached you leave office

Impeachment is a 2 step process. Assuming you are whining about Bill Clinton then you as usual are not informed of the facts.

Bill Clinton was successfully impeached by the House. Bill Clinton was successfully acquitted by the Senate therefore he wasnt removed from office as the impeachment failed to pass both the House and the Senate and he wasnt removed from office. In other words the impeachment failed.

If only the House had the power to impeach, every president of the opposite party would likely get impeached, instead we have checks and balances..

Try to watch less fox news..

[ilnjscb]

Impeachment and removal is a political process. The senate will never get to two thirds unless there is clear collusion from Trump or verifiable collusion under Trump's personal direction. And it won't be Crockett or Bladewire "proof" it will need to be actual factual proof that would convince a person who voted republican.

Bill Clinton left office with 66% approval after being acquitted by the senate 55 (acquit) -45 and 50-50. Acquittal actually gave him a big bump.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by ilnjscb

Impeachment and removal is a political process. The senate will never get to two thirds unless there is clear collusion from Trump or verifiable collusion under Trump's personal direction. And it won't be Crockett or Bladewire "proof" it will need to be actual factual proof that would convince a person who voted republican.

Bill Clinton left office with 66% approval after being acquitted by the senate 55 (acquit) -45 and 50-50. Acquittal actually gave him a big bump.

But there is a huge difference between the two.

Clinton lied under oath when answering a highly personal question in front of his wife that had nothing to do with the investigation. This was (for lack of a better term) a "nothing burger".

If there is any level of collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russian government, Trump would most likely be impeached and removed from office. Even if there is no collusion, they could try to pin him with obstruction of justice. At the same time we have no idea what his finances is turning up.

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by Rochard

I was a hardcore Republican at the time when President Bill Clinton was impeached. This was a witch hunt, and completely improper. That was when I left the Republican party. I refuse to be a member of a party that unfairly and unjustly attacks their opponents with only purpose of making the other side look bad. Clearly this hasn't changed with the Republican party.

where have you been the last 2 years? every day for over 2 years the Dems have been making shit up, lying, one which hunt after another...




and you actually have the motherfucking balls to say none of that ever happened? the Dems do NOT target people and fuck their lives up?

seruoisly you are fucked up... I can't converse with anybody that fucking blind and deluded and bigoted

[crockett]

Big surprise everyone.. vendido ran away just like grapeboy runs aways from answering questions..

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

where have you been the last 2 years? every day for over 2 years the Dems have been making shit up, lying, one which hunt after another...




and you actually have the motherfucking balls to say none of that ever happened? the Dems do NOT target people and fuck their lives up?

seruoisly you are fucked up... I can't converse with anybody that fucking blind and deluded and bigoted

You really are damaged goods.. Its quite interesting to watch how this all came about over the last 8 to 10 years. Just reading GFY posting history can allow you to see how somewhat normal republicans turned into the far right frindge that thinks everyone's out to get them..

You guys are all wound up in a case of mass hystera which has driven you all out of your minds. I guess we can see the damage that happens to people's brains when they are fed a continuous diet of far right hate agenda for years..

Do your self a favor.. stop listening to far right news sources like it was entertainment TV... go out side and ride a bike or something. Take a vaction away from your safe space bubble where you interact with people diffrent from yourself.. You and all your little buddies have gone off your rockers..

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by nico-t

Funny. You idiots demanded the investigation on Hillary's deleted emails to stop on the day it was announced. And that was based on actual wrongdoing directly done by Hillary herself. Yet this fake witch hunt, with no direct connection to Trump whatsoever, cannot be dragged on long enough for you idiots.

The media has you by the balls with their pathetic witch hunt and make you peep every time they choose to squeeze

Which investigation? There was over a dozen of them.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

where have you been the last 2 years? every day for over 2 years the Dems have been making shit up, lying, one which hunt after another...

I know, right? The fourteen investigations we had into Paul Ryan were a blast.

Good times.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Rochard

I know, right? The fourteen investigations we had into Paul Ryan were a blast.

Good times.

Not to mention the 5 investigations into the millions of deleted Dick Cheney and Bush Jr emails. Soo much dirt!

I'm still waiting for the. 12th investigation into the Iraq war and the WMDs

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by crockett

Not to mention the 5 investigations into the millions of deleted Dick Cheney and Bush Jr emails. Soo much dirt!

I'm still waiting for the. 12th investigation into the Iraq war and the WMDs

See, I didn't give a shit about Bush or Cheney. Not good, but not really bad either.

They lost millions of emails? Whatever. This shit happens. Just not caring.

WMDs, not caring about that either. I've seen enough proof that there was WMDs in Iraq and... They were shooting at our planes on a daily basis and we were bombing them daily too. Most of this happened under Clinton. It was past due time to take action.

These issues.... Are not Republican vs Democrat for me. I am not either. Something a politician does is either right or wrong. The problem we have now is everything is just wrong. Every last decision tRUMP makes is just wrong.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by ilnjscb

Impeachment and removal is a political process. The senate will never get to two thirds unless there is clear collusion from Trump or verifiable collusion under Trump's personal direction. And it won't be Crockett or Bladewire "proof" it will need to be actual factual proof that would convince a person who voted republican.

Bill Clinton left office with 66% approval after being acquitted by the senate 55 (acquit) -45 and 50-50. Acquittal actually gave him a big bump.

See this is your problem..you mistake facts and breaking the law with the need to convince someone about political opinions..

The law doesnt give a rats ass if its in agreement of your political opnion.. due to Trump's business dealings he can be convicted at the state level in NY or other states he does business if its found out he illegally launderd money.

If congress fails to act, Trump will get taken down by the NY DA office once this all plays out. You seem to not be paying much attention to how this is going down. Muller is worki g with the NY DA office on this for that very reason... in case Trump tries to pardon himself or others or if Congress fails to act.. at that point the NY DA office goes forward with the criminal case.

Trump thanks to his businesses is in a unique position to be charged at the state level if congress fails to act or if he tries to use the power of pardon. Congress and presidential pardons have no athority over a state DA..

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Rochard

See, I didn't give a shit about Bush or Cheney. Not good, but not really bad either.

They lost millions of emails? Whatever. This shit happens. Just not caring.

WMDs, not caring about that either. I've seen enough proof that there was WMDs in Iraq and... They were shooting at our planes on a daily basis and we were bombing them daily too. Most of this happened under Clinton. It was past due time to take action.

These issues.... Are not Republican vs Democrat for me. I am not either. Something a politician does is either right or wrong. The problem we have now is everything is just wrong. Every last decision tRUMP makes is just wrong.

The invasion of Iraq and Bush admins lack of planning for the aftermath was the direct result of a vacuum of power, led to the formation of ISIS and tens of thousands of deaths.. including many American soldiers and countless civilians world wide. With out the Bush invassion, Islamic terrorist would have never had to ability or recruiting grounds to hone their skills and build their terror network.

You should care..that war reshaped the world we live in today.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by crockett

The invasion of Iraq and Bush admins lack of planning for the aftermath and the direct result of a vacuum of power, led to the formation of ISIS and tens of thousands of deaths.. including many American soldiers and countless civilians.

You should care..

I disagree. There is always a power vacuum at the end of a war. However, this was vastly different than Germany or Japan after WWII.

First, there is a new way fighting wars. We are "too nice". At the close of WWII the governments, military, and general population of Germany and Japan were just utterly exhausted. They had five or six years of unrestricted warfare that brought everyone to their knees. This never happened with Iraq - it was over too quick, and they just picked up their pieces and went back to what they doing as if nothing ever happened.

Second, for political reasons, we didn't want to occupy Iraq. Look at how we treated Germany and Japan for decades. To this day the United States still has large military bases and both countries. And we will for decades to come.

War is a final option, and it needs to be brutal. Not only do you need to destroy the will of the government and the military to continue the fight, but you also have to break the will of the people. The people themselves have to say "Holy shit, I am going through that again and I will spend the rest of my life ensuring it doesn't happen again". We don't that have now. Instead of rising up from the ashes and discovering every last person in their family is dead, they just brush themselves off and are back in business in three days.

[dillonaire]

Not sure if some of you are aware, but the election is over. Trump won. The country didnt fall into the ocean. Stock Market went up and the unemployment rate down. Its been a year already. Who cares! Move the fuck on dot com

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Rochard

I disagree. There is always a power vacuum at the end of a war. However, this was vastly different than Germany or Japan after WWII.

First, there is a new way fighting wars. We are "too nice". At the close of WWII the governments, military, and general population of Germany and Japan were just utterly exhausted. They had five or six years of unrestricted warfare that brought everyone to their knees. This never happened with Iraq - it was over too quick, and they just picked up their pieces and went back to what they doing as if nothing ever happened.

Second, for political reasons, we didn't want to occupy Iraq. Look at how we treated Germany and Japan for decades. To this day the United States still has large military bases and both countries. And we will for decades to come.

War is a final option, and it needs to be brutal. Not only do you need to destroy the will of the government and the military to continue the fight, but you also have to break the will of the people. The people themselves have to say "Holy shit, I am going through that again and I will spend the rest of my life ensuring it doesn't happen again". We don't that have now. Instead of rising up from the ashes and discovering every last person in their family is dead, they just brush themselves off and are back in business in three days.

You making the same mistake Bush made and thinking the middle east is comparable to world war 2.

We are not fighting govts there, we are fighting relgious ideology that goes back thousands of years. We are not going to bomb them into submission.. Has that worked for Iseral with the Palestinians? Iseral, literally bulldozes these peoples homes to build walls and these people havent given up..They still fight back..

If the shoe was on the other foot and Muslims had invaded the West and overthrown our govts and patrolled our streets with their armies do you think westerners would give up a d not fight back and live in submission?


We are dealing with two very different ideologies betwen tne west and middle east. As long as each are left to do their own thing we can live side by side with little conflict. The problem is when one side starts interfearing with the other...

This history goes back to bibical times and fighting of the crusades.. Our invasion of Iraq was looked at as yet another crusade by the west to the extreme Islamist and they were able to use that as a recruiting tool.

The iraq war is the dirrect result in what has happened with the golbal jihad we now face. That war along with Afghan war allowed then to provoke goat herders into a gobal jihadist which had very little world wide support prior to us bombing their holy lands..


Bush Sr then Bush hr had a hard on for oil in Iraq and now the world deals with their mistake of poking sticks in the bees nest. Russia made the same mistake in the 80s and it bankrupted them.

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by dillonaire

Not sure if some of you are aware, but the election is over. Trump won. The country didnt fall into the ocean. Stock Market went up and the unemployment rate down. Its been a year already. Who cares! Move the fuck on dot com

Trump said the unemployment numbers are fake and easily manipulated.

Trump removed the safeguards that Obama put in place to avoid another recesdion due yo market bubbles, of course the stock market is soaring.

And when Trump pushed us into another recession, you'll blame Obama

[ilnjscb]

Originally Posted by crockett

See this is your problem..you mistake facts and breaking the law with the need to convince someone about political opinions..

The law doesnt give a rats ass if its in agreement of your political opnion.. due to Trump's business dealings he can be convicted at the state level in NY or other states he does business if its found out he illegally launderd money.

If congress fails to act, Trump will get taken down by the NY DA office once this all plays out. You seem to not be paying much attention to how this is going down. Muller is worki g with the NY DA office on this for that very reason... in case Trump tries to pardon himself or others or if Congress fails to act.. at that point the NY DA office goes forward with the criminal case.

Trump thanks to his businesses is in a unique position to be charged at the state level if congress fails to act or if he tries to use the power of pardon. Congress and presidential pardons have no athority over a state DA..

You have no idea what you're talking about. The NY DA? - they have NO jurisdiction over federal statutes and could not impact Trump at all. That was done to intimidate witnesses so Trump could not just pardon all the players. That was also done to apply pressure to Trump's SIL.

[ilnjscb]

Originally Posted by Rochard

But there is a huge difference between the two.

Clinton lied under oath when answering a highly personal question in front of his wife that had nothing to do with the investigation. This was (for lack of a better term) a "nothing burger".

If there is any level of collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russian government, Trump would most likely be impeached and removed from office. Even if there is no collusion, they could try to pin him with obstruction of justice. At the same time we have no idea what his finances is turning up.

I agree with you, Clinton should never have been impeached. But it doesn't matter. The process is not described as, nor has it ever been, a legal process. It is a political process.

Trump will not be impeached without a Democrat majority, and he will never be convicted and removed without a clear showing of collusion.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by ilnjscb

You have no idea what you're talking about. The NY DA? - they have NO jurisdiction over federal statutes and could not impact Trump at all. That was done to intimidate witnesses so Trump could not just pardon all the players. That was also done to apply pressure to Trump's SIL.

You dont pay attention much do you? Trump's empire is based out of NY.. if his companies committed fraud the NY DA sure the fuck can and will go after him.. Just because he's potus it doesnt make him untouchable at the state level.

The diffrence in Trump vs previous presidents os all others removedthemselves from any business interest they had before coming to office. Trump didnt do this and now it makes him vunerable where ever he hold business interest.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by crockett

You making the same mistake Bush made and thinking the middle east is comparable to world war 2.

We are not fighting govts there, we are fighting relgious ideology that goes back thousands of years. We are not going to bomb them into submission.. Has that worked for Iseral with the Palestinians? Iseral, literally bulldozes these peoples homes to build walls and these people havent given up..They still fight back..

You are correct - they are vastly different wars. And I am saying we treated them vastly different. With Germany - and Japan - we firebombed entire cities out of existence. They were exhausted and done. What we did with Iraq and Afghanistan we did with little pinpicks.

I understand there are vast differences, however, we didn't give them all war. We gave them a limited war.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by ilnjscb

I agree with you, Clinton should never have been impeached. But it doesn't matter. The process is not described as, nor has it ever been, a legal process. It is a political process.

Trump will not be impeached without a Democrat majority, and he will never be convicted and removed without a clear showing of collusion.

The entire thing was ridiculous. They had no right to interview them about the investigation. They had no right to put under oath. And they had on valid reason to ask such questions that were unrelated to the original investigation.

That's fine. The Republican party established, through Kenneth Starr, that we can in fact put a sitting president under oath for an investigation, and then ask him if he has ever cheated on his wife.

Do you see where this can go now? We now have a perfectly valid reason to put Trump under oath, and we now have a valid reason to ask Trump if he has had sexual relations with any of the sixteen women who have accused him of whatever. When he lies under oath about not knowing them, or not being there that day, we can charge with lying under oath.

#winning.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by crockett

You dont pay attention much do you? Trump's empire is based out of NY.. if his companies committed fraud the NY DA sure the fuck can and will go after him.. Just because he's potus it doesnt make him untouchable at the state level.

The diffrence in Trump vs previous presidents os all others removedthemselves from any business interest they had before coming to office. Trump didnt do this and now it makes him vunerable where ever he hold business interest.

Oh.... The Whitewater investigation tells us the President is in fact not above the law, and will be called to testify.

[OneHungLo]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Do you see where this can go now? We now have a perfectly valid reason to put Trump under oath, and we now have a valid reason to ask Trump if he has had sexual relations with any of the sixteen women who have accused him of whatever. When he lies under oath about not knowing them, or not being there that day, we can charge with lying under oath.

#winning.

LOL wow you guys are seriously delusional. Do you actually believe that has a snowball's chance in hell at happening? I guess that whole Russian collusion thingy isn't working out so you're grasping at straws now.

[dillonaire]

Originally Posted by Bladewire

Trump said the unemployment numbers are fake and easily manipulated.

Trump removed the safeguards that Obama put in place to avoid another recesdion due yo market bubbles, of course the stock market is soaring.

And when Trump pushed us into another recession, you'll blame Obama

I dont care who is president. To me, it doesnt make a difference.

I can tell you the jobs numbers are real from my own experience. I've been trying to hire an in-office position (not in bay area), but in a decent size city and I am getting the lowest response rate to a job posting i have ever experienced. Crazy. I rewrote and reposted several times.