Let's talk about guns, gun control, school shootings, and the "law abiding gun owner"

[crockett]

[davidCRM]

interestingly, just found this today


the way i count it it's 25 IF i respect the england-scotland divide and separate that into 2 countries AND if i consider every county on the map, incl. Azerbaijan, Russia (some of their shootings may have happened at the asian part, idk) and Israel. otherwise, the number is 22.
Citation needed though.

[pimpmaster9000]

its not the guns its the americans...my war torn shit hole is the #2 per capita in the world for gun ownership right after the USA...0 school shootings ever...

americans <--- the root of the problem

[just a punk]

Originally Posted by davidCRM

interestingly, just found this today


the way i count it it's 25 IF i respect the england-scotland divide and separate that into 2 countries AND if i consider every county on the map, incl. Azerbaijan, Russia (some of their shootings may have happened at the asian part, idk) and Israel. otherwise, the number is 22.
Citation needed though.

As a Russian, I can say that everybody here can buy a semi-automatic rifle or a shotgun, but I remember only one school shooting in Crimea: Kerch Polytechnic College massacre - Wikipedia

[pimpmaster9000]

its the US gun culture and the glorifying of murder with "good excuses"...

a great example would be "future weapons" that airs on discovery and national geographic...a show that glorifies weapons and murder...if my country had such a show it would be nowhere near as popular as in the USA simply because we are not obsessed with killing and murder like americans...it would be strange as fuck to see such a show on our TV...

in the USA you are very very likely to get shot...this is the other thing...in my 3rd world shit hole you really really have to go out of your way to get shot...I mean you really have to put in an effort...

police in my country do not shoot somebody dead for years...the last time it happened was last year when this crazy guy had a hand grenade...the police did not kill anybody for years before this...I have never seen police pull out a gun on somebody...

[just a punk]

Originally Posted by crucifissio

iin the USA you are very very likely to get shot...

Aha, just like L-Pink, who was shot on his road from Florida to Texas

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by crockett

lets talk about russian collusion... you know like hillary and the dnc paying 5 mill and change for fake info from a fake russian spy and obama opening an illegal investigation into trump and the trump campaign.... much more interesting

[pimpmaster9000]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

Aha, just like L-Pink, who was shot on his road from Florida to Texas

well that sucks...

[escorpio]

I like pocket pistols. My favorite is a KelTec P32. Come at me, bro.

[Paul Markham]

He has a point the problem is an American one and American culture. The choice is solving the culture problem or removing the guns from the problem.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

He has a point the problem is an American one and American culture. The choice is solving the culture problem or removing the guns from the problem.

Finally we agree on something.

There is something seriously wrong with Americans and their love of guns. We are the only country that has this problem. It's not video games or violence on TV or movies; All countries have these things. The problem is much deeper than this.

[BaldBastard]

Facts are : Americans are buying more guns and those guns are more accurate and powerful by the year. No laws will stop that, your constitution ensures it, even though its written in the time of single fire muskets.

Keeping that in mind, I predict the USA will be one of the first to use robotic AI Police Officers.. Robocop is coming.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Finally we agree on something.

There is something seriously wrong with Americans and their love of guns. We are the only country that has this problem. It's not video games or violence on TV or movies; All countries have these things. The problem is much deeper than this.

From a man who owns too many and too powerful guns. You sir are part of the problem, saying you're a responsible gun owner means nothing until you admit you're part of the problem.

[tfto]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

Aha, just like L-Pink, who was shot on his road from Florida to Texas

What happened to L-Pink?

[escorpio]

Say "hello" to my little friend.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by tfto

What happened to L-Pink?

Pot smoker from Margaritaville goes to Texas.. WHat could have possibly gone wrong. I tried to warn him but he said any place I said was fucked up he thought must be great..

Those Texas cops dont like them guys with long hair and pot habits.

I'm pretty smart in my travels so I can fit in most places with out liftingan eyebrow. Example I do not look like a guy that would travel around in in a VW van when I do that.

LPink very much looked like a drinker and a pot smoker...

[crockett]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

As a Russian, I can say that everybody here can buy a semi-automatic rifle or a shotgun, but I remember only one school shooting in Crimea: Kerch Polytechnic College massacre - Wikipedia

The guy in the video pretty much nails it. It's not the amount of gun, they type but the people buying them.


They essentially worship the guns.. They dont treat their power drill the same way. Yet they try to claim their gun is a tool.

The people buying the guns are the problem not the guns themselves. This is reason I've always said I'm not for gun control laws but rather education and safety training.

You have to change the mindset of all these morons who think having a AR15 or AK makes them a man.

I must admit, every video of his I've watched was pretty spot on. Troll through a few of his YouTube vids he's pretty on point with almost everything.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

lets talk about russian collusion... you know like hillary and the dnc paying 5 mill and change for fake info from a fake russian spy and obama opening an illegal investigation into trump and the trump campaign.... much more interesting

Ok Let's talk about that...

[bronco67]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Finally we agree on something.

There is something seriously wrong with Americans and their love of guns. We are the only country that has this problem. It's not video games or violence on TV or movies; All countries have these things. The problem is much deeper than this.

Our freedom from tyranny is originally tied to the ownership of guns....so the obsession makes sense.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

From a man who owns too many and too powerful guns. You sir are part of the problem, saying you're a responsible gun owner means nothing until you admit you're part of the problem.

You have a valid point here. That's twice in one thread. Are you off your meds or... back on your meds?

I do not have an obsession with firearms. I bought my firearms after my friend bought his. I've discussed my friend here before; His name is John and he has "water on the brain" and the short story is he has had a dozen operations on his brain, operates as a fully functioning adult, yet in reality he operates at the level of a sixteen year old. He is pissed at the world. He lost his wife, his house, his kids; He has been robbed of his life. He sort of knows this, knows he is "limited", but doesn't know how or why. He hasn't gotten laid in over twenty years and he is pissed at the world. Yet no one said anything when he legally purchased an M16.

Please don't tell me this "isn't an assault rifle". It is. It's the same exact rifle I trained with in the Marines. My friend John was an armorer in the US Army; His rifle is fully automatic.

I bought my rifles after he bought his just because "I could" and because I thought it would be fun. I surely don't use them for home protection; You don't use an M4 for home protection. I need to get rid of mine.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by crockett

Ok Let's talk about that...

Don't you think it's odd that we 100% know Russia is attacking us on multiple fronts, using various groups of targeted people. Yet Trump isn't interested in doing anything about it.. He calls it fake news as do you..

In the case he's talking about above, it was Russia attempting to help radicalize the BLM movement.

Trump and Republicans wont even move on that even though it had nothing to do with his campaign and they can even blame black people for something, yet Trump still does nothing..

Why? Why, because if Trump/Republicans moved on Russia trying to radicalize BLM that means they'd have to admit Russia was behind much of the radicalized tea party and Trump's rise to power.

Couldn't edit my post so I quoted it, was replying to grapefruit

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by bronco67

Our freedom from tyranny is originally tied to the ownership of guns....so the obsession makes sense.

Exactly, and this is why I am 100% pro gun.

I'm also pro car and not against driver's licenses and driving tests to be able to drive a car because I care about my safety and the safety of others.

This is why I'm Pro responsible gun ownership people need to have their gun licenses and they need to be tested just like you do to have a vehicle; both things can kill a lot of innocent people quickly.

[just a punk]

Originally Posted by bronco67

Our freedom from tyranny is originally tied to the ownership of guns....so the obsession makes sense.

How exactly the ownership of guns may protect you against a tyranny? As far as I know, you can't buy military weapon in the USA. I mean full automatic assault riffles, grenades, mortars, bazookas etc. All your semi-automatic weapon is a kiddie toy in case of if you would try to use it against the regular army. As I said above, all these semi-automatic riffles and shotguns are available for everyone here in Russia (it takes about two weeks to get a license). But this is a civilian weapon which can't be used vs military one.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

As a Russian, I can say that everybody here can buy a semi-automatic rifle or a shotgun, but I remember only one school shooting in Crimea: Kerch Polytechnic College massacre - Wikipedia

It's not the fact that people here can buy guns.. It's the mindset they have. They obsess over the guns like it's a fucking cock extension. Most of these people buying these things are quite simply not mature enough to own them.. Doesn't matter their age, they simply do not have the maturity or respect of it as a weapon to own it..

This is why I say education is key for solving these issues..

[crockett]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

How exactly the ownership of guns may protect you against a tyranny? As far as I know, you can't buy military weapon in the USA. I mean full automatic assault riffles, grenades, mortars, bazookas etc. All your semi-automatic weapon is kiddie toy in case of if you would use it against the regular army. As I said above, all these semi-automatic riffles and shotguns are available for everyone here in Russia (it takes about two weeks to get a license). But this is a civilian weapon which can't be used vs military one.

To be fair it's not hard to make a gun fully automatic. In a follow up video to this series the guy in the vid makes a very valid point about it. Say you try to ban semi autos as example.

There will then be black market gun manufactures and at that point they will just build full auto guns because it's easier to build full auto than semi and why bother building semi vs full auto if you are going to jail anyway once caught..

That M4 "replica" you buy at the gun store can easily be made fully auto.. Those AK surplus rifles and reproductions can easily be made fully auto..

As example simply go to youtube and look up the black market gun smith in Pakistan/Afghanistan.. When your guys the Soviets tried to take over Afghanistan the govt there tried to outlaw guns.

Because of this places popped up all over where villagers started building guns to support the rebellion against the soviets. They still do it today..

few example vids..





Some goat herders in the mountains can build almost exact replicas with hammers on dirt floors.. What do you think some guy in his garage can do here in America who has a basic shop mill and lathe.

[just a punk]

Originally Posted by crockett

This is why I say education is key for solving these issues..

Yes, the education does matter a lot of course. I was taught to use firearms (semi-automatic .22 LR pistols) since 10 year old and I do respect firearms, but... I have no one. The only guns I have are sport ones (sport versions of PM pistol and AK-103 assault rifle). So even I who was trained to use guns since a childhood, don't need to have a gun at home. I feel absolutely secure w/o it. When we are talking about others who know guns only from movies and computer games, so 99% of them should not be allowed to buy firearms. Spend at least a couple of years on training and prove your responsibility and after that you may be allowed to buy it.

Originally Posted by crockett

To be fair it's not hard to make a gun fully automatic.

Do you mean a bumpstock? No, this doesn't make a riffle full automatic. Try to use it say for a weekly war in the city. The army weapon must be reliable, easy and troubleproof. It can't just fail in your hands. When you pull the trigger, it should shot in 100% cases even if it was dropped to asphalt from 3 meters and worked in a cement dust or mud.

Course you can do a technical modification, but in this case you may face a jail time in both the USA and Russia, because it's considered as a crime.

P.S. In case of some apocalypses (say the aliens will attack the Earth) or China will invade the country, I won't need a shotgun at home. There is a police station right near my home and they have a few AKSU assault riffles. So I'll just go there and take what I need. I won't be interested in a hand gun or a semi-automatic shit, because they both will be useless in case of an urban war.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

Yes, the education does matter a lot of course. I'm was taught to use firearms (semi-automatic 22. LR pistols) since 10 year old and I do respect firearms, but... I have no one. The only guns I have are sport ones. So even I who was trained to use guns since a childhood, don't need to have a gun at home. I feel absolutely secure w/o it. When we are talking about others who know guns only from movies and computer games, so 99% of them should not be allowed to buy firearms. Spend at least a couple of years on training and prove your responsibility and after that you may be allowed to buy it.



Do you mean bumpstock? No, this doesn't make a riffle full automatic. Try to use it say for a weekly war in the city. The army weapon must be reliable, easy and troubleproof. It can't just fail in your hands. When you pull the trigger, it should shot in 100% cases even if it was dropped to asphalt from 3 meters and worked in a cement dust or mud.

This is the same as me.. While no I have no military training I do know how to handle a gun. I have a conceal carry permit and a pistol because I wanted a gun when I traveled. With that said, the amount of times I've ever carried the gun on me in public is almost non existent..

I feel perfectly safe almost anywhere I go in the US. In fact the only real times I have carried my gun on me were usually when I was out hiking in the forest.

With that said, I did have 1 time late at night that I had my gun in my backback and I was walking across a empty parking lot. I could see a vehicle parked at the other side but it was very dark no lights, so I was walking carefully to my Westy..

I got about midway across the parking lot and the headlight of that vehicle came on and he drove straight at me. He turned and circled around directly behind my van with his lights pointed right at me..

Keep in mind it's pitch black and we are the only ones in this parking lot was at a trail head parking area. I managed to get in my van at that point as he pulled behind me with lights shining at my van.

I made my gun accessible but never actually pulled it, instead I kept eyes on my mirrors, started my van then took off across the parking lot, to re-angle with my high beams on this truck so I could at least see what I was dealing with. (now one thing I had going for me is there was no curb in front of me, so had I been blocked into a parking spot unable to move it might of been different)

Turns out it was some stupid teenagers trying to "scare me" because they thought it would be funny. Now just imagine if I was one of these gun ho radicalized gun nuts. I could have easily shot these kids claiming I was standing my ground and there would be 2 dead teenagers because I claimed I was in fear of mt life.

Can you imagine someone like George Zimmerman or someone like Vendildo who is a self proclaimed hot head in the same position? These dumb ass kids did everything by the book to make themselves a victim of someone defending themselves..

Instead they were fucking lucky it was someone who isn't scared to death of their surroundings to the point everyone is a threat. Someone who took a minute to assess the threat and acted with in reason..

[MatureKing]

Originally Posted by escorpio

Say "hello" to my little friend.

[just a punk]

Originally Posted by crockett

This is the same as me.. While no I have no military training I do know how to handle a gun. I have a conceal carry permit and a pistol because I wanted a gun when I traveled. With that said, the amount of times I've ever carried the gun on me in public is almost non existent..

I feel perfectly safe almost anywhere I go in the US. In fact the only real times I have carried my gun on me were usually when I was out hiking in the forest.

With that said, I did have 1 time late at night that I had my gun in my backback and I was walking across a empty parking lot. I could see a vehicle parked at the other side but it was very dark no lights, so I was walking carefully to my Westy..

I got about midway across the parking lot and the headlight of that vehicle came on and he drove straight at me. He turned and circled around directly behind my van with his lights pointed right at me..

Keep in mind it's pitch black and we are the only ones in this parking lot was at a trail head parking area. I managed to get in my van at that point as he pulled behind me with lights shining at my van.

I made my gun accessible but never actually pulled it, instead I kept eyes on my mirrors, started my van then took off across the parking lot, to re-angle with my high beams on this truck so I could at least see what I was dealing with. (now one thing I had going for me is there was no curb in front of me, so had I been blocked into a parking spot unable to move it might of been different)

Turns out it was some stupid teenagers trying to "scare me" because they thought it would be funny. Now just imagine if I was one of these gun ho radicalized gun nuts. I could have easily shot these kids claiming I was standing my ground and there would be 2 dead teenagers because I claimed I was in fear of mt life.

Can you imagine someone like George Zimmerman or someone like Vendildo who is a self proclaimed hot head in the same position? These dumb ass kids did everything by the book to make themselves a victim of someone defending themselves..

Instead they were fucking lucky it was someone who isn't scared to death of their surroundings to the point everyone is a threat. Someone who took a minute to assess the threat and acted with in reason..

I've got your point. But in most cases in real life, a knife is much more effective than a gun. I mean for a self protection, not for war of course I don't know the US policy regarding knives, but in Russia you can carry it absolutely legally. Also you may heard about a 21-foot rule (~6.5 meters). This is the distance there a guy with a knife has an advantage against a guy with a gun. Personally I can shoot a human-like target at about 10 meters within a half of a second. I need this time to remove the gun from the fuse, distort the shutter, aim and fire. But even I would not want to face a guy with a knife at a close distance, because he will make a foie gras from my liver much faster than I'll be able to shoot...

[crockett]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

Yes, the education does matter a lot of course. I was taught to use firearms (semi-automatic .22 LR pistols) since 10 year old and I do respect firearms, but... I have no one. The only guns I have are sport ones (sport versions of PM pistol and AK-103 assault rifle). So even I who was trained to use guns since a childhood, don't need to have a gun at home. I feel absolutely secure w/o it. When we are talking about others who know guns only from movies and computer games, so 99% of them should not be allowed to buy firearms. Spend at least a couple of years on training and prove your responsibility and after that you may be allowed to buy it.



Do you mean a bumpstock? No, this doesn't make a riffle full automatic. Try to use it say for a weekly war in the city. The army weapon must be reliable, easy and troubleproof. It can't just fail in your hands. When you pull the trigger, it should shot in 100% cases even if it was dropped to asphalt from 3 meters and worked in a cement dust or mud.

Course you can do a technical modification, but in this case you may face a jail time in both the USA and Russia, because it's considered as a crime.

P.S. In case of some apocalypses (say the aliens will attack the Earth) or China will invade the country, I won't need a shotgun at home. There is a police station right near my home and they have a few AKSU assault riffles. So I'll just go there and take what I need. I won't be interested in a hand gun or a semi-automatic shit, because they both will be useless in case of an urban war.

Those surplus AKs that are all over this country can easily be converted to full auto. Same with the M16/M4 clones.

I mean hell the Mini 14 is almost same gun as the M4 clones but has a rifle stock. It can be converted to full auto.

In fact one of the most well known FBI shoot outs was against a guy with a full auto Mini 14 back in the 80s.



It was the Dade County FBI shootout in 1986. Essentially 1 guy with a full auto Mini 14 took on 8 FBI agents.. He killed 2 and would 5 of the other 8.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout

[crockett]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

I've got your point. But in most cases in real life, a knife is much more effective than a gun. I mean for a self protection, not for war of course I don't know the US policy regarding knives, but in Russia you can carry it absolutely legally. Also you may heard about a 21-foot rule (~6.5 meters). This is the distance there a guy with a knife has an advantage against a guy with a gun. Personally I can shut a human-like target at about 10 meters within a half of a second. I need this time to remove the gun from the fuse, distort the shutter, aim and fire. But even I would not want to face a guy with a knife at a close distance, because he will make a foie gras from my liver much faster...

Not against multiple people.. A knife is effective if you are close, well built and generally fight one 1 person. However if you aren't a big guy or are against more than one a knife is not going to go well if they are armed.. With that said, you are also likely not getting in a shoot out with multiple people who are shooting back and waking away uninjured unless you are very good and have great fire position...


These guys with their bug out bags with 300 rounds of ammo across 10 mags are just idiots.. If you are in need of 10 mags you probably aren't walking away from that fight...

As far as knives we can carry them here and that's also what I'd carry most of the time if I felt the need.There are blade length restrictions but it's pretty fucking big. Now there maybe laws in certain cities regarding knives but for the most part you can carry them with out issue.