Child Porn - GoFuckYourself.com

Dopy · 02-23-2002, 05:29 PM

I am sick of listening to the same old misconceptions about child porn on this board. Get to understand what CP is all about before you go ranting about sites that have been around for years and operate well within the law.

Paedophiles don't want to look at 16 year old girls, they are more interested in pre-teen and explicit child sex material which is what you guys should be fighting against. The number of pre-teen sites coming out of Russia has more than doubled since Oct 2001 and 80% are using US based billing systems and servers without hindrance.

Sites like Club17 and MET are not even close to child pornography, they simply cater for a fantasy shared by thousands of adult males.
Over the past 20 years, the age of puberty has changed, girls grow up more quickly and the age for presenting themselves as sexually available has in some countries fallen by up to 3 years. This change has greatly affected the way men perceive young girls and what would have been seen as outrageous 20 years ago is now an every day occurrence in the media world.

I have been promoting the Teen, Teen Sex , Lolita Fantasy niches for almost 2 years now and know exactly what kind of men sign up to sites like C17, they are not paedophiles.

If anyone here is having difficulty differentiating between what?s CP and what?s a fantasy dream, send me an ICQ and I will show you the difference.

Pipecrew · 02-23-2002, 05:37 PM

No thanks, your freaking me out

And if you have CP on your computer then delete it you sick fuck, go promote a normal niche

Dopy · 02-23-2002, 05:46 PM

What are normal niches - Schoolgirl Fantasy ?

UnseenWorld · 02-23-2002, 06:00 PM

The age of consent is determined by a political body in a given jurisdiction. There is nothing magical about "18." It is 16 in some other countries. As far as I know, there may be countries with no opinion on the subject. A lot of CP seems to come from Russia. I'm not sure if this is because they have no particular laws there or enforcement is simply lax.

The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls. The photos are NOT pornographic by any non-hysterical standard, and are simply a celebration of the beauty of a girl at this stage in her development. It is the idea (which seems almost more common among guilt-plagued webmasters who want to divert attention from themselves) that ANY nude image of a sub-adult is pornographic which is pathetic. After all, there are nude children (cherubs) on the ceilings of
Catholic and Protestant places of worship all around the world.

By contrast, a depiction of a pre-pubescent child being subjected to or engaging in sex with an adult or another child IS patently obscene and revolting to anyone with normal sensibilities and any degree of empathy for children.

But even that is cultural to some degree.

There are cultures where adults introduce young adolescents to sex in a ritual context (not sneaking off and creating guilt and shame). This happens in some Pacific Island cultures, and did happen in some Native American tribes, in Africa, and elsewhere. The strange thing seems to be that, if you take away the guilt and shame, these practices actually seemed to cause no harm.

So, what does that tell me? That the culture which induces shame and guilt is as much a partner in the damage done to the child as the "perpetrator" himself.

Strangely and ironically, one of the ways we might reduce the damage done to children by pedophiles is to try to be a bit less hysterical about it.

And this is not to say that pedophiles are good. They are not. Just that there's enough blame to go around.

SR · 02-23-2002, 06:05 PM

I'm from Holland and I believe that the legal age to act in pornmovies was 16 years and you had to be 18 to be a prostitute.
I believe that you have to be 18 now for both and I'm glad about that.
16 years and acting in porn is just wrong.
And if a girl behaves like an adult when she is 16 or so doesn't mean she can play in a pornmovie if she wants.
A kid doesn't belong in the pornbiz period.

And I would never want to make money with a site that "pretends" that they have young girls, lolitas etc."
Like some big sites promote the site "theincest"... might be legal but I would never want to make a dime of people that get a hardon from words like "young girls underage girls lolitas daddy fucking his girl etc".

My

Dopy · 02-23-2002, 06:17 PM

Nice post unseen.

The laws in Russia are as strict as anywhere else its just that they don?t have the infrastructure or recourses to enforce them properly. Lack of money also plays a big part too of course.

What concerns me the most is the number of services supporting these sites with billing and hosting facilities

the bulldog · 02-23-2002, 06:24 PM

RUSSIA

Dopy · 02-23-2002, 06:33 PM

SR

Underage and daddy fucking are both bad news words but "Lolita" has become a fantasy word which like "Young" can be interpreted in many ways. I totally agree with the rule of no pornographic sex until 18 simply because anything younger would open the flood gates for exploitation.

I have a 14 year old daughter myself, and would hate to think of her acting in pornographic movies at the age of 16.

TopTGP · 02-23-2002, 06:54 PM

You said you know what kind of men sign up to these sites? You don't know the slightest thing about them. Its not like you do fucking backround checks before you give someone a membership to your site...

anything below 18 is CP, thats my theory.

SykkBoy · 02-23-2002, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TopTGP

anything below 18 is CP, thats my theory.

so, your theory should take precedence over law? context is what the CP laws are all about...so acording to your "theory" is the movie "Titanic" CP? The charcter Rose was only 17, yet the movie showed her nude and engaged in simulated sex...ever see a Porky's movie? Most of the "chacrters" were 16 and 17....

my problem with the under 18 "artistic" nudes isn't that they may or not be legally considered "pornographic", rather the way the sites are presented and advertised...

ldinternet · 02-23-2002, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SykkBoy2
The charcter Rose was only 17

Reeeally?

* runs to video store *

Seriously though, Dopy knows her shit.
Interesting thread.

TopTGP · 02-23-2002, 07:08 PM

You also realise that 'rose' is like 25 in REAL LIFE? It doesn't matter if they say someone is 16 or 17, as long as they are obviously older.

You see, there is a difference between hollywood productions and real life. Same with the porn industry.

SykkBoy · 02-23-2002, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TopTGP
You also realise that 'rose' is like 25 in REAL LIFE? It doesn't matter if they say someone is 16 or 17, as long as they are obviously older.

You see, there is a difference between hollywood productions and real life. Same with the porn industry.

Do you even know what the CP laws are???

Do you know what would happen if Unseen (strictly as an example) advertised a 16-17 year old girl (even though she may well be 18)? Even implying they are underage can get you in deep shit...
I think you need to look into what the laws really are...

bhutocracy · 02-23-2002, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SykkBoy2

so, your theory should take precedence over law?

heheh.. so true.. im sure in a lot of areas it's legal (like here) to fuck a 17 year old so why in hell would clubseventeen be CP??????.. sure it's illegal to sell content of 17 year olds in many places.. and thats cool - thats the law, in this field give it the utmost respect.. but i wouldn't consider it CP - you're applying cultural bias towards an offshore law. (just as i am)

heymatty · 02-23-2002, 07:35 PM

18 is not that old.

some of the girls getting ass fucked on blacks on blondes etc. are only 18 or so. Legally fine. A softcore shoot of 17 year old coming from holland is not as morally challenging in my view.

I am from Britain originally, I grew up with topless 16 year olds in the top selling daily newspaper, but porn that we have on cable here in Canada is still illegal at home. No erect penises let alone, cum shots and all that.

Anyways, I seemingly have no point, but I think everyone agrees that whole russian industry is the problem.

bhutocracy · 02-23-2002, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by heymatty
No erect penises let alone, cum shots and all that.

yeah it's a pity.. lol.. j/k

neewwman · 02-23-2002, 07:58 PM

Are these the moral equivalent of CP?

http://www.lilamber.com
http://www.mollirama.com

Can you imagine what kind of parent decides to let guys jack off to their kids to bring in some extra money?

bhutocracy · 02-23-2002, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by neewwman
Are these the moral equivalent of CP?

http://www.lilamber.com
http://www.mollirama.com

Can you imagine what kind of parent decides to let guys jack off to their kids to bring in some extra money?

now thats just sad..... gives you that sick feeling in the pit of your stomach..... it's only a matter of time before clothed minor sites get shut down in the states

Dopy · 02-23-2002, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by neewwman
Are these the moral equivalent of CP?

http://www.lilamber.com
http://www.mollirama.com

Can you imagine what kind of parent decides to let guys jack off to their kids to bring in some extra money?

Now they are both paedophile magnets !

eroswebmaster · 02-23-2002, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TopTGP
You also realise that 'rose' is like 25 in REAL LIFE? It doesn't matter if they say someone is 16 or 17, as long as they are obviously older.

You see, there is a difference between hollywood productions and real life. Same with the porn industry.

Yes but the girl who played the daughter and flashed her breast in American Beauty was only 16 at the time of filming.

And as far as "it doesn't matter if they someone is 16 or 17, as long as they are obviously older." You should read a little bit more about 2257.
A porn site cannot in no way shape or form imply that their models are younger even for fantasy reasons.

This whole is it "art" or cp thing is such a tricky issue that it's best to stay away from it unless you have plenty of cash to fight off the government.

In one case discussed on Adult Web Law a man was arrested and convicted for receiving videos of young girls dancing in leotards etc. What made it cp was the fact that the videographer zoomed in for long periods of times on their genital and pubic area.

So even these so called "art" sites with nude modeling of girls under the age of 18 I'm sure are tested on this issue at all times so they must be careful of the context and the composition of their photographs.

As far as these girl model sites are concerned. You are not going to stop it. It is the most unadulturated form of pimping out your child legally, but it's still legal and it's making them shit loads of money.

One young girl they wrote about in an article on Wired had actually earned enough money to pay her entire way through college including medical school and she was if I remember correctly just entering into the 9th grade.

It's a sad fact in this world...it's a shame what people do at the expense of their child...but is it really any worse than parent's who pushed their children into acting in movies?

IMHO I don't think so...exploitation is exploitation...hell even if the child really wants it if the parents motives are anything other than keeping their child's best interests at heart then it is wrong.

Exxxotica · 02-23-2002, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dopy

Paedophiles don't want to look at 16 year old girls

Oh thank God! All this time I thought I was a dirty Pedophile!

playa · 02-23-2002, 09:06 PM

what you guys fail to realize is that you must remember the INTERNET,,, the net is whole different ball game,,,
trying to compare Movies and other media is wrong

the reality is that surfers want something and they search for it,,,

hence getting target traffic,, as we all know there are plenty of them and are very specific ie...

movie traffic,teen traffic, asian, gay, and black traffic
these surfers are looking for particular sites,,,

lotta these sites give the perception of 'CP'
so what if there non-nude or the girls are really 25
perception is a muthafucker and i myself will not feed these sickos their desires

playa · 02-23-2002, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by UnseenWorld

The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls.

sorry for my non-artistic self,,, but if you ask me there is damn reason for a grown adult to see a naked 12-15 year old girl....

seriously,,, do you think a 12-15 year old has the mental capacity and be able make concious choice that they won't mess up there future by posing nude?

wired1 · 02-23-2002, 09:56 PM

"The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls. The photos are NOT pornographic by any non-hysterical standard, and are simply a celebration of the beauty of a girl at this stage in her development. It is the idea (which seems almost more common among guilt-plagued webmasters who want to divert attention from themselves) that ANY nude image of a sub-adult is pornographic which is pathetic."

I have to agree with playa. Art is one thing, but WE as Adult Webmasters, Run PORN SITES, and we send surfers (with the intention of jerking off) to Adult sites they can wack off too.

I have lots of friends who are artists, photographers, ect..,
and this issue of an ADULT site leading surfers to pics of underage
(you call it art or whatever) is hurting there industry as well. Someone
Makeing an art book is one thing, throwing that photograph on
page 53 of Hustler is another. There is a huge difference in
the traffic we work with and poeple who are simply looking
for Art.

My

titmowse · 02-23-2002, 10:22 PM

okay, fuck it...Thora Birch was 17 and her parents signed a relaese and were on the set the whole time...damn

please continue...

playa · 02-23-2002, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Exxxotica

Oh thank God! All this time I thought I was a dirty Pedophile!

only if you find yourself lurking around high schools after classes

FATPad · 02-23-2002, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by UnseenWorld
The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls. The photos are NOT pornographic by any non-hysterical standard, and are simply a celebration of the beauty of a girl at this stage in her development.

That's great. Now if I buy a bunch of David Birch's wonderful artsy pics of naked 12 year olds, build a kick ass artsy paysite, and advertise it on any of a zillion TGP's, what do we have?

Rip · 02-23-2002, 10:44 PM

I wonder how many people still own Tracy Lords videos?

And are they child porn lovers, or just normal guys who didn't know that the video store was selling them kiddy porn.

Rochard · 02-23-2002, 10:46 PM

Any "man" who desires to look at 12 year old to 15 year old girls naked are just plain fucked up. There is something wrong about it.

There is a huge double standard..... On the big screen it's okay for a sixteen year old to flash her breasts or a 25 year old to play the part of a seventeen year old girl in a sex scene.... But for a website to claim to have seventeen year old girls (that are really 18 and 19 years old) would lead them straight to jail.

The oddest part of it all is what "we" decide the legal age of consent is. A 17 year old girl can't get naked for my camera, yet that same 17 year old girl is "mature" enough to drive a guided missle down our streets..... We give teenagers the right to drive a car, puttin the lives of my family in their hands, but they can't drink, buy a pack of smokes, or get naked. If the legal age of consent is 18, then they shouldn't be able to drive until they are 18.

Dopy · 02-23-2002, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Exxxotica

Oh thank God! All this time I thought I was a dirty Pedophile!

No Exxxotica you are normal, its those that deny looking that worry me.

From the office window where I used to work I have watched a complete construction site come to a halt when the local school emptied, I wonder whats must have been on those guys minds, perhaps they were all potential peds LOL.

I just kept thinking that one day they might visit my site and act out the fantasy.

Fletch XXX · 02-23-2002, 10:52 PM

my all time fav is a site that links to a huge list of "yahoo briefcases" which are of course real teen girls email "profiles" which contain a briefcase full of images, thats just a bit too far.

UnseenWorld · 02-23-2002, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by playa

sorry for my non-artistic self,,, but if you ask me there is damn reason for a grown adult to see a naked 12-15 year old girl....

seriously,,, do you think a 12-15 year old has the mental capacity and be able make concious choice that they won't mess up there future by posing nude?

And WHO messes up their future? The kind of people who make them feel ashamed.

UnseenWorld · 02-23-2002, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FATPad

That's great. Now if I buy a bunch of David Birch's wonderful artsy pics of naked 12 year olds, build a kick ass artsy paysite, and advertise it on any of a zillion TGP's, what do we have?

Had you familiarized yourself with the subject (David Hamilton's photography), you'd realize it's not what the true pedophile is looking for. The photos are murky and leave much to the imagination. If you are in the porn industry, you realize that frequently the difference between porn and art is how sharply focused and well-lit the photo is.

eroswebmaster · 02-23-2002, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by titmowse
okay, fuck it...Thora Birch was 17 and her parents signed a relaese and were on the set the whole time...damn

please continue...

What's your point?
And according to Gear Magazine March 2000 page 46 first paragraph it states "But at 16, Thora Birch was harmlessly topless in the context of realism in American Beauty."

My point was just letting someone know that even though the character in Titanic was played by a 25 year old that there was someone much younger flashing her tits in American Beauty...and let's not forget the Movie Lolita...Dominique Swain did some partial nudity in that film at the age of 15 as did Brooke Shields at a much younger age in the critically acclaimed Pretty Baby of which I have seen all three...Lolita Sucked...American Beauty is an instant classic and Pretty Baby is a classic plain and simple.

So is Brooke Shields life ruined by her nudity? Not necessarily...I would probably assume no.

But look at someone like Drew Barrymore who was obviously exploited by her mother Jade without any nudity...and it totally fucked her up. She may have her head on straight now but it took some wandering through the desert to get there and I may be mistaken but I do believe she still doesn't speak to her mother.

I mean there are tons of child stars to prove that point...what chew talkin' bout Willis? LOL

I think if a parent's intentions are to only help their child to fulfill their dreams and NOT THEIRS BY LIVING VICARIOUSLY THROUGH THEM OR THEIR PAYCHECK. Then it's okay within reason.

But it is clear that in the so called artistic sites coming from Russia it's someone exploiting poverty and a child's lack of a future...as is probably the case with these child model sites.

eros

HeadPimp · 02-23-2002, 11:31 PM

Here is my thought... Having models that are 18+ and advertising that they 18+ keeps me out of jail. This is a very good thing and plenty of reason for me to avoid the issue like the plauge!

wired1 · 02-23-2002, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dopy

No Exxxotica you are normal, its those that deny looking that worry me.

From the office window where I used to work I have watched a complete construction site come to a halt when the local school emptied, I wonder whats must have been on those guys minds, perhaps they were all potential peds LOL.

I just kept thinking that one day they might visit my site and act out the fantasy.

If they sleep with them = YES!!!! What I dont get is why those of
us who Dont exploit children are considered the sick ones with you?

Fantasy is one thing - acting on it is another = DUH!

Art is another thing = masterbateing to pics of naked children is fucken sick.

Another thing I dont get is how you cant see that!?!?!?!
Selling memberships to sites that do that is just as fucken sick.
And those that support it are trully the twisted ones here, dont
go telling me that because I choose to protect instead of exploit
children that I am twisted and in need of help. Fuck You!!!

AdultWire · 02-23-2002, 11:35 PM

I skimmed the end of this thread, but I didn't see anyone mention that CP laws and Sexual Consent laws are two ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THINGS in most countries. For example, in Canada, CP is images of girls under 18, but the age of sexual consent is 14. You can have sex with a 14 year old legally, but photographing it will land you in jail.

Kind of weird to call someone as sick fuck for promoting the youth "fantasy" when you live in a country where the law says you can have sex with 14 year olds .

UnseenWorld · 02-23-2002, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wired1
"The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls. The photos are NOT pornographic by any non-hysterical standard, and are simply a celebration of the beauty of a girl at this stage in her development. It is the idea (which seems almost more common among guilt-plagued webmasters who want to divert attention from themselves) that ANY nude image of a sub-adult is pornographic which is pathetic."

I have to agree with playa. Art is one thing, but WE as Adult Webmasters, Run PORN SITES, and we send surfers (with the intention of jerking off) to Adult sites they can wack off too.

I have lots of friends who are artists, photographers, ect..,
and this issue of an ADULT site leading surfers to pics of underage
(you call it art or whatever) is hurting there industry as well. Someone
Makeing an art book is one thing, throwing that photograph on
page 53 of Hustler is another. There is a huge difference in
the traffic we work with and poeple who are simply looking
for Art.

My

Basically, I couldn't agree more. I was writing to make a distinction between art and porn and not lumping anything depicting a nude child as automatically pornographic. Pedophiles seeking porn are looking for what all people seeking porn are looking for: something which is shocking, without anything obstructing the view, and lit so that nothing is left to the imagination. Looking at David Hamilton's work, for example, it is the absolute opposite of that. I urge anyone wanting to voice an opinion on the subject to seek out Hamilton's work via the search engines before voicing an opinion. BTW, in a less hysterical time, my wife of the time gave me two of his photo books for my birthday. SHE (the mother of our daughter) thought the pictures were beautiful herself.

Of course, as some are saying, presentation has much to do with it. A site with more explicit material truly qualifying as CP might include some David Hamilton material to pretend at having some artistic merit. That is sad and unfortunate.

wired1 · 02-23-2002, 11:44 PM

"Of course, as some are saying, presentation has much to do with it. A site with more explicit material truly qualifying as CP might include some David Hamilton material to pretend at having some artistic merit. That is sad and unfortunate."

Yes I agree UnseenWorld,

That was the destinction I wantd to make. I have no problem with art.

Sleepy · 02-23-2002, 11:46 PM

Theres nothing wrong with a nude human body no matter what age. It's all about the intentions of the photographer or painter.

TopTGP
Would you really put a guy in jail who had sex with Traci Lords when she was 16 ? Nobody knew how old she was, she was blowing 5-6 guys at a time. How could he know ? I dont think there was much "child" left to her by then and she made those choices on her own.

eroswebmaster · 02-23-2002, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by UnseenWorld

BTW, in a less hysterical time, my wife of the time gave me two of his photo books for my birthday. SHE (the mother of our daughter) thought the pictures were beautiful herself.

It's all about the context of the situation.

For instance if you were accused of some heinous crime involving harming children whether it be physical or sexual...and the police found those books in your possession they would be used to convict you proving you are of dubious character.

As an adult webmaster something like that should not be in your possession...it could really come back to haunt you regardless of how legal it is.

Once again it's all about the context of the situation

Incognito · 02-24-2002, 12:34 AM

Guys, You're a bit mislead in many ways.

1. It's easy to solve the riddle about Hamilton and American Beauty being OK but lolita pay site not.

The difference lies in promotion.

Hamilton photos are OK as long as they are not advertised "kiddies fuck like bunnies, 5 y.o."

As far as I remember that's what laws also say.

2. Russia doesnt have specific laws against child pornography.
However child porn webmasters do get prosecuted and more than You think.

A child porn studio was busted a year ago in Moscow, 4 guys busted. 2 of them dead already, first one jumped out of the window and secod committed some other strange suicide as far as I remember.

The main problem lies withing a simple fact - companies which can be traced legally and legally prosecuted are american (hosting) or non existant fake crap (billing) .

3. What You fail to realise also is how many russian webmasers are out there. Most of them almost dont speak english. That's one of the problems why we get this CP blaming all the fucking time. Give this thought 30 seconds and You'll get the idea. I for instance never did anything even remote to child porn or lolitas.
But for three years already when I meet a new webmaster from USA for example, first 15 minutes on the phone are spent in the following way:

-"Hi my name's Incognito. I am Russian. I dont do CP"
-"Hi. My name John Smith, dont do CP"
-"I dont."
-"I beleive You"
-"Good"
-"By the way, You shouldn't do CP, there are other ways to earn money"
-"Thanks , I dont do CP"
-"I know - just dont do it. We'll be friends"
-"No problem. I dont do it"
-"Good. Now I'll tell You how to make money and You aint gonna do CP any longer..."
-"Really? Thanks! You know...just by the way, kinda surprise, I dont do CP"
-"Wow! That's great! Are You russian?"
-"Yes"
-"Dont do CP"
-"I wont"
-"Good. By the way, does it really sell good?"
-"What?"
-"What you're not doing, c'mon buddy, got phone tapped buddy?"

goes on for 15 minutes usually.

bhutocracy · 02-24-2002, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AdultWire
I skimmed the end of this thread, but I didn't see anyone mention that CP laws and Sexual Consent laws are two ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THINGS in most countries. For example, in Canada, CP is images of girls under 18, but the age of sexual consent is 14. You can have sex with a 14 year old legally, but photographing it will land you in jail.

Kind of weird to call someone as sick fuck for promoting the youth "fantasy" when you live in a country where the law says you can have sex with 14 year olds .

yar most will have consent laws at 14-17 or whatever.. but it's still illegal for a 30 year old to fuck them - if you look a little deeper you'll see that for instance a 16 year old can have sex.. just as long as the person isn't 5 years older than them.. or whatever arbitrary age you want to substitute that for.

AdultWire · 02-24-2002, 01:15 AM

Not here.. check the details: http://www.ageofconsent.com

AdultWire · 02-24-2002, 01:20 AM

Oh, but no bum sex or photographs till you're 18 young lady!!

wired1 · 02-24-2002, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AdultWire
I skimmed the end of this thread, but I didn't see anyone mention that CP laws and Sexual Consent laws are two ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THINGS in most countries. For example, in Canada, CP is images of girls under 18, but the age of sexual consent is 14. You can have sex with a 14 year old legally, but photographing it will land you in jail.

Kind of weird to call someone as sick fuck for promoting the youth "fantasy" when you live in a country where the law says you can have sex with 14 year olds .

I dont live in Canada, and I dont have any ideas about there laws...

bhutocracy · 02-24-2002, 01:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AdultWire
Not here.. check the details: http://www.ageofconsent.com

yeah i went there too... their information is wrong.. for australia at least.. the age of consent is indeed 16 -17 like on the site.. but a 40 year old can't fuck one..

"134. In South Australia the age of consent for heterosexual and homosexual sex is 17 years. In Tasmania the age of consent is 17 years for heterosexual sex. However, the consent of a person against whom a crime is alleged to have been committed is a defence to a charge of unlawful intercourse with a young person under the age of 17 years if at the time when the crime was alleged to have been committed:

* that person was of or above the age of 15 years and the accused person was not more than five years older than that person; or

* that person was of or above the age of 12 years and the accused person was not more than three years older than that person.

Jakke PNG · 02-24-2002, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TopTGP

anything below 18 is CP, thats my theory.

I must disagree strongly. CP as in photography maybe, real life no. I'm now 22, and I've been with my GF 2 years. She turned 18 2 weeks ago. Although in my defense I have to say she lied her age, and why in the fuck should I ask for ID. honestly. I couldn't tell she was under 18, none of my friends could tell that. I consider that CP is something where a girl has no idea what she's doing, why she's doing and the man takes advantage of this. I don't consider myself pedophile when I fucked her when she was 16 and I was 20. Perhaps it would have been different if I'd been over 40 or so. I dissaprove CP as anyone, but I don't see the CP limit @18. not even 16.Under that, perhaps.

Just my

pr0view · 02-24-2002, 04:12 AM

this whole conversation is really useless (no offence to anyone meant). it's all really very simple:

1) there are certain laws which have to be followed strictly
2) everything not banned by the law is allowed
3) if it's allowed, then it's up to the person to decide whether to do it or not.
4) don't forget that something can be immoral BUT still legal. in such an occasion, you can choose not to work with the respective webmaster/ company BUT you can't accuse them of imaginary sins.
5) the only thing you should do when you find "questionable" material is to contact the authorities. everything else is bullshit. let them cope with that - it's exactly what they get paid for.
6) don't EVER forget that you're guilty until proven innocent (as long as 2257 is converned)

of course, it's always better to stay out of the "shady areas" (which are STILL legal but not for long).

Jakke PNG · 02-24-2002, 04:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pr0view
this whole conversation is really useless (no offence to anyone meant). it's all really very simple:

1) there are certain laws which have to be followed strictly
2) everything not banned by the law is allowed
3) if it's allowed, then it's up to the person to decide whether to do it or not.
4) don't forget that something can be immoral BUT still legal. in such an occasion, you can choose not to work with the respective webmaster/ company BUT you can't accuse them of imaginary sins.
5) the only thing you should do when you find "questionable" material is to contact the authorities. everything else is bullshit. let them cope with that - it's exactly what they get paid for.
6) don't EVER forget that you're guilty until proven innocent (as long as 2257 is converned)

of course, it's always better to stay out of the "shady areas" (which are STILL legal but not for long).

Spoilsport

02-23-2002, 05:29 PM	#1
Dopy Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Puerto Del Carmen, Lanzarote, Canary Islands Posts: 1,572	Child Porn I am sick of listening to the same old misconceptions about child porn on this board. Get to understand what CP is all about before you go ranting about sites that have been around for years and operate well within the law. Paedophiles don't want to look at 16 year old girls, they are more interested in pre-teen and explicit child sex material which is what you guys should be fighting against. The number of pre-teen sites coming out of Russia has more than doubled since Oct 2001 and 80% are using US based billing systems and servers without hindrance. Sites like Club17 and MET are not even close to child pornography, they simply cater for a fantasy shared by thousands of adult males. Over the past 20 years, the age of puberty has changed, girls grow up more quickly and the age for presenting themselves as sexually available has in some countries fallen by up to 3 years. This change has greatly affected the way men perceive young girls and what would have been seen as outrageous 20 years ago is now an every day occurrence in the media world. I have been promoting the Teen, Teen Sex , Lolita Fantasy niches for almost 2 years now and know exactly what kind of men sign up to sites like C17, they are not paedophiles. If anyone here is having difficulty differentiating between what?s CP and what?s a fantasy dream, send me an ICQ and I will show you the difference.

02-23-2002, 06:00 PM	#4
UnseenWorld Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Portland, OR, USA Posts: 5,279	The age of consent is determined by a political body in a given jurisdiction. There is nothing magical about "18." It is 16 in some other countries. As far as I know, there may be countries with no opinion on the subject. A lot of CP seems to come from Russia. I'm not sure if this is because they have no particular laws there or enforcement is simply lax. The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls. The photos are NOT pornographic by any non-hysterical standard, and are simply a celebration of the beauty of a girl at this stage in her development. It is the idea (which seems almost more common among guilt-plagued webmasters who want to divert attention from themselves) that ANY nude image of a sub-adult is pornographic which is pathetic. After all, there are nude children (cherubs) on the ceilings of Catholic and Protestant places of worship all around the world. By contrast, a depiction of a pre-pubescent child being subjected to or engaging in sex with an adult or another child IS patently obscene and revolting to anyone with normal sensibilities and any degree of empathy for children. But even that is cultural to some degree. There are cultures where adults introduce young adolescents to sex in a ritual context (not sneaking off and creating guilt and shame). This happens in some Pacific Island cultures, and did happen in some Native American tribes, in Africa, and elsewhere. The strange thing seems to be that, if you take away the guilt and shame, these practices actually seemed to cause no harm. So, what does that tell me? That the culture which induces shame and guilt is as much a partner in the damage done to the child as the "perpetrator" himself. Strangely and ironically, one of the ways we might reduce the damage done to children by pedophiles is to try to be a bit less hysterical about it. And this is not to say that pedophiles are good. They are not. Just that there's enough blame to go around. __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-23-2002, 06:24 PM	#7
the bulldog Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Land of Chocolate!! Posts: 519	RUSSIA __________________ promote ME or suck my cock u bitch !!!

02-23-2002, 06:54 PM	#9
TopTGP Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: poco, BC, Canada Posts: 546	You said you know what kind of men sign up to these sites? You don't know the slightest thing about them. Its not like you do fucking backround checks before you give someone a membership to your site... anything below 18 is CP, thats my theory. __________________ I can't think of anything funny to say..

02-23-2002, 07:08 PM	#12
TopTGP Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: poco, BC, Canada Posts: 546	You also realise that 'rose' is like 25 in REAL LIFE? It doesn't matter if they say someone is 16 or 17, as long as they are obviously older. You see, there is a difference between hollywood productions and real life. Same with the porn industry. __________________ I can't think of anything funny to say..

02-23-2002, 05:37 PM	#2
Pipecrew Master of Gfy.com Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 14,887	No thanks, your freaking me out And if you have CP on your computer then delete it you sick fuck, go promote a normal niche

02-23-2002, 05:46 PM	#3
Dopy Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Puerto Del Carmen, Lanzarote, Canary Islands Posts: 1,572	What are normal niches - Schoolgirl Fantasy ?

02-23-2002, 06:05 PM	#5
SR Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,239	I'm from Holland and I believe that the legal age to act in pornmovies was 16 years and you had to be 18 to be a prostitute. I believe that you have to be 18 now for both and I'm glad about that. 16 years and acting in porn is just wrong. And if a girl behaves like an adult when she is 16 or so doesn't mean she can play in a pornmovie if she wants. A kid doesn't belong in the pornbiz period. And I would never want to make money with a site that "pretends" that they have young girls, lolitas etc." Like some big sites promote the site "theincest"... might be legal but I would never want to make a dime of people that get a hardon from words like "young girls underage girls lolitas daddy fucking his girl etc". My

02-23-2002, 06:17 PM	#6
Dopy Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Puerto Del Carmen, Lanzarote, Canary Islands Posts: 1,572	Nice post unseen. The laws in Russia are as strict as anywhere else its just that they don?t have the infrastructure or recourses to enforce them properly. Lack of money also plays a big part too of course. What concerns me the most is the number of services supporting these sites with billing and hosting facilities

02-23-2002, 06:33 PM	#8
Dopy Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Puerto Del Carmen, Lanzarote, Canary Islands Posts: 1,572	SR Underage and daddy fucking are both bad news words but "Lolita" has become a fantasy word which like "Young" can be interpreted in many ways. I totally agree with the rule of no pornographic sex until 18 simply because anything younger would open the flood gates for exploitation. I have a 14 year old daughter myself, and would hate to think of her acting in pornographic movies at the age of 16.

02-23-2002, 07:35 PM	#15
heymatty Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Scottsdale :) Posts: 2,188	18 is not that old. some of the girls getting ass fucked on blacks on blondes etc. are only 18 or so. Legally fine. A softcore shoot of 17 year old coming from holland is not as morally challenging in my view. I am from Britain originally, I grew up with topless 16 year olds in the top selling daily newspaper, but porn that we have on cable here in Canada is still illegal at home. No erect penises let alone, cum shots and all that. Anyways, I seemingly have no point, but I think everyone agrees that whole russian industry is the problem.

02-23-2002, 07:58 PM	#17
neewwman Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA Posts: 1,737	Are these the moral equivalent of CP? http://www.lilamber.com http://www.mollirama.com Can you imagine what kind of parent decides to let guys jack off to their kids to bring in some extra money? __________________ Porn Wealth Everything the newbie adult webmaster needs to know. Buy it, or sell it through our 50% affiliate program!

02-23-2002, 09:06 PM	#22
playa Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: atlanta, GA Posts: 6,432	what you guys fail to realize is that you must remember the INTERNET,,, the net is whole different ball game,,, trying to compare Movies and other media is wrong the reality is that surfers want something and they search for it,,, hence getting target traffic,, as we all know there are plenty of them and are very specific ie... movie traffic,teen traffic, asian, gay, and black traffic these surfers are looking for particular sites,,, lotta these sites give the perception of 'CP' so what if there non-nude or the girls are really 25 perception is a muthafucker and i myself will not feed these sickos their desires

02-23-2002, 09:56 PM	#24
wired1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: North Posts: 279	"The photographer David Hamilton takes lovely pictures of nude 12-15 year old girls. The photos are NOT pornographic by any non-hysterical standard, and are simply a celebration of the beauty of a girl at this stage in her development. It is the idea (which seems almost more common among guilt-plagued webmasters who want to divert attention from themselves) that ANY nude image of a sub-adult is pornographic which is pathetic." I have to agree with playa. Art is one thing, but WE as Adult Webmasters, Run PORN SITES, and we send surfers (with the intention of jerking off) to Adult sites they can wack off too. I have lots of friends who are artists, photographers, ect.., and this issue of an ADULT site leading surfers to pics of underage (you call it art or whatever) is hurting there industry as well. Someone Makeing an art book is one thing, throwing that photograph on page 53 of Hustler is another. There is a huge difference in the traffic we work with and poeple who are simply looking for Art. My

02-23-2002, 10:22 PM	#25
titmowse Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: TEXAS Posts: 5,320	okay, fuck it...Thora Birch was 17 and her parents signed a relaese and were on the set the whole time...damn please continue... __________________ I still love everybody Last edited by titmowse; 02-23-2002 at 10:27 PM..

02-23-2002, 10:44 PM	#28
Rip Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: somewheres wet Posts: 1,456	I wonder how many people still own Tracy Lords videos? And are they child porn lovers, or just normal guys who didn't know that the video store was selling them kiddy porn. __________________ ...

02-23-2002, 10:46 PM	#29
Rochard Jägermeister Test Pilot Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: NORCAL Posts: 74,051	Any "man" who desires to look at 12 year old to 15 year old girls naked are just plain fucked up. There is something wrong about it. There is a huge double standard..... On the big screen it's okay for a sixteen year old to flash her breasts or a 25 year old to play the part of a seventeen year old girl in a sex scene.... But for a website to claim to have seventeen year old girls (that are really 18 and 19 years old) would lead them straight to jail. The oddest part of it all is what "we" decide the legal age of consent is. A 17 year old girl can't get naked for my camera, yet that same 17 year old girl is "mature" enough to drive a guided missle down our streets..... We give teenagers the right to drive a car, puttin the lives of my family in their hands, but they can't drink, buy a pack of smokes, or get naked. If the legal age of consent is 18, then they shouldn't be able to drive until they are 18. __________________ “The choice is no longer between right or left. The choice is between normal and crazy.” - Sarah Huckabee Sanders YNOT MAIL \| THE BEST ADULT MAILING SOLUTION

02-23-2002, 10:52 PM	#31
Fletch XXX GFY HALL OF FAME DAMMIT!!! Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: that 504 Posts: 60,840	my all time fav is a site that links to a huge list of "yahoo briefcases" which are of course real teen girls email "profiles" which contain a briefcase full of images, thats just a bit too far. __________________ Want an Android App for your tube, membership, or free site? Need banners or promo material? Hit us up (ICQ Fletch: 148841377) or email me fletchxxx at gmail.com - recent work - About me

02-23-2002, 11:31 PM	#35
HeadPimp Bad Mo-Fo Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 2,772	Here is my thought... Having models that are 18+ and advertising that they 18+ keeps me out of jail. This is a very good thing and plenty of reason for me to avoid the issue like the plauge!

02-23-2002, 11:35 PM	#37
AdultWire Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 962	I skimmed the end of this thread, but I didn't see anyone mention that CP laws and Sexual Consent laws are two ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THINGS in most countries. For example, in Canada, CP is images of girls under 18, but the age of sexual consent is 14. You can have sex with a 14 year old legally, but photographing it will land you in jail. Kind of weird to call someone as sick fuck for promoting the youth "fantasy" when you live in a country where the law says you can have sex with 14 year olds . __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-23-2002, 11:44 PM	#39
wired1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: North Posts: 279	"Of course, as some are saying, presentation has much to do with it. A site with more explicit material truly qualifying as CP might include some David Hamilton material to pretend at having some artistic merit. That is sad and unfortunate." Yes I agree UnseenWorld, That was the destinction I wantd to make. I have no problem with art.

02-23-2002, 11:46 PM	#40
Sleepy Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Porn Peddler Posts: 679	Theres nothing wrong with a nude human body no matter what age. It's all about the intentions of the photographer or painter. TopTGP Would you really put a guy in jail who had sex with Traci Lords when she was 16 ? Nobody knew how old she was, she was blowing 5-6 guys at a time. How could he know ? I dont think there was much "child" left to her by then and she made those choices on her own.

02-24-2002, 12:34 AM	#42
Incognito Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Location: RU Posts: 371	Guys, You're a bit mislead in many ways. 1. It's easy to solve the riddle about Hamilton and American Beauty being OK but lolita pay site not. The difference lies in promotion. Hamilton photos are OK as long as they are not advertised "kiddies fuck like bunnies, 5 y.o." As far as I remember that's what laws also say. 2. Russia doesnt have specific laws against child pornography. However child porn webmasters do get prosecuted and more than You think. A child porn studio was busted a year ago in Moscow, 4 guys busted. 2 of them dead already, first one jumped out of the window and secod committed some other strange suicide as far as I remember. The main problem lies withing a simple fact - companies which can be traced legally and legally prosecuted are american (hosting) or non existant fake crap (billing) . 3. What You fail to realise also is how many russian webmasers are out there. Most of them almost dont speak english. That's one of the problems why we get this CP blaming all the fucking time. Give this thought 30 seconds and You'll get the idea. I for instance never did anything even remote to child porn or lolitas. But for three years already when I meet a new webmaster from USA for example, first 15 minutes on the phone are spent in the following way: -"Hi my name's Incognito. I am Russian. I dont do CP" -"Hi. My name John Smith, dont do CP" -"I dont." -"I beleive You" -"Good" -"By the way, You shouldn't do CP, there are other ways to earn money" -"Thanks , I dont do CP" -"I know - just dont do it. We'll be friends" -"No problem. I dont do it" -"Good. Now I'll tell You how to make money and You aint gonna do CP any longer..." -"Really? Thanks! You know...just by the way, kinda surprise, I dont do CP" -"Wow! That's great! Are You russian?" -"Yes" -"Dont do CP" -"I wont" -"Good. By the way, does it really sell good?" -"What?" -"What you're not doing, c'mon buddy, got phone tapped buddy?" goes on for 15 minutes usually. __________________ -=almost fucking incognito=-

02-24-2002, 01:15 AM	#44
AdultWire Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 962	Not here.. check the details: http://www.ageofconsent.com __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-24-2002, 01:20 AM	#45
AdultWire Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 962	Oh, but no bum sex or photographs till you're 18 young lady!! __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-24-2002, 04:12 AM	#49
pr0view Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Europe Posts: 270	this whole conversation is really useless (no offence to anyone meant). it's all really very simple: 1) there are certain laws which have to be followed strictly 2) everything not banned by the law is allowed 3) if it's allowed, then it's up to the person to decide whether to do it or not. 4) don't forget that something can be immoral BUT still legal. in such an occasion, you can choose not to work with the respective webmaster/ company BUT you can't accuse them of imaginary sins. 5) the only thing you should do when you find "questionable" material is to contact the authorities. everything else is bullshit. let them cope with that - it's exactly what they get paid for. 6) don't EVER forget that you're guilty until proven innocent (as long as 2257 is converned) of course, it's always better to stay out of the "shady areas" (which are STILL legal but not for long).