Internet video patents - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 04:52 AM

Someone said they don't have a patent on this in Canada, what other countries do they not have a patent in?

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 04:55 AM

Have they actually gone to court against any company yet?

bhutocracy · 11-18-2002, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brown Bear
Someone said they don't have a patent on this in Canada, what other countries do they not have a patent in?

Australia's in the clear.

bhutocracy · 11-18-2002, 05:57 AM

Acacia Media Technologies owns U.S. and International pioneering patents covering the transmission and receipt of digital audio and/or video content via several means including the Internet, cable and satellite. This technology is called Digital Media Transmission ("DMT") Technology and is also commonly referred to as video-on-demand and audio-on-demand.
The worldwide patent portfolio includes five issued U.S. patents and a pending U.S. patent, which will provide coverage until 2011. The U.S. patents include: U.S. Patent No. 5,132,992, U.S. Patent No. 5,253,275, U.S. Patent No. 5,550,863, U.S. Patent No. 6,002,720, and U.S. Patent No. 6,144,702.

The European Patent Office has granted patents which provide coverage until 2012 in the following 14 countries: Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, Monaco, the Netherlands, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, and the United Kingdom.

International patents have been issued covering Mexico, Taiwan, and Japan.

they must be tripping.. this garbage from a company called "acacia" and patents on "DMT".

quiet · 11-18-2002, 05:58 AM

no Canada. cool.

Loch · 11-18-2002, 06:38 AM

We got the letter about 3 months ago if not longer.
You all know by now basically what it said, only mine had 23 patent violations...i got on the phone right away and talked with the company president.

I set-up a login for the guy and guided him thru the site, showed him everything.
I cut him down in every try to uphold their fucking patents, in the end he was more confused then a blond at a science convention.

I then gave him 2 days to get back to us.
When he got back i only had 5 patent violations.
I called him back, asking why and explained to him how streaming/video on demand and so on works....

After this i havent heard a word!!
(i might, but havent yet)

This tells me that they dont know enough about this (yet) to really do something about it.
But one thing is for sure, just sitting back doing nothing wont help any one of us.

If they continue ill just zip the video previews and let our clients download them till this is solved....

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 06:57 AM

This is just another good reason to be an offshore company.

notjoe · 11-18-2002, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Loch
We got the letter about 3 months ago if not longer.
You all know by now basically what it said, only mine had 23 patent violations...i got on the phone right away and talked with the company president.

I set-up a login for the guy and guided him thru the site, showed him everything.
I cut him down in every try to uphold their fucking patents, in the end he was more confused then a blond at a science convention.

I then gave him 2 days to get back to us.
When he got back i only had 5 patent violations.
I called him back, asking why and explained to him how streaming/video on demand and so on works....

After this i havent heard a word!!
(i might, but havent yet)

This tells me that they dont know enough about this (yet) to really do something about it.
But one thing is for sure, just sitting back doing nothing wont help any one of us.

If they continue ill just zip the video previews and let our clients download them till this is solved....

Well, that might work for now as long as you buy a zip program or find one for free which you can use commerically.

I dont beleive this will solve anything because some fucker is going to get the patent on the "Download/upload" technology used on the internet, regardless of the protocol used..then what, pay for each file downloaded downloaded off your site? 40 images on your tour = 40 downloads.

I think if/when these guys ever become a large threat to any content provider/site owners that maybe we should stick together and fuck them up.

Seems like the impact would affect absolutely everyone.

just my 2cents worth.

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 07:29 AM

If all you are doing is putting an MPEG file on a server, how is that streaming?

Surfers are the one streaming it.

How is putting a file on a server infringing on a patent?

Loch · 11-18-2002, 07:41 AM

Acacia prices on the content provider license agreement.

Initial prepaid royalty:
Projected gross sales Initial prepaid royalty:
$1 - 100,000 $ 1,500,-
$100,001 - 500,000 $ 6,000,-
etc etc etc

Aditional royalty:
Actual gross sales Additional royalty:
$100,001 - 500,000 $ 8,100,-
$500,001 - 1,000,000 $ 20,250,-
etc etc etc

Loch · 11-18-2002, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brown Bear
If all you are doing is putting an MPEG file on a server, how is that streaming?

Surfers are the one streaming it.

How is putting a file on a server infringing on a patent?

If you are the one offering the vids for streaming.

Loch · 11-18-2002, 07:45 AM

I think it will be a cold day in hell before they get anywhere with this, but if they do prices on videos will skyrocket.

So yes i do think its in everyones interest to get this solved one way or the other.

notjoe · 11-18-2002, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brown Bear
If all you are doing is putting an MPEG file on a server, how is that streaming?

Surfers are the one streaming it.

How is putting a file on a server infringing on a patent?

Data is coming off your server, you're the one broadcasting it not the user. Streaming/Downloading are pretty much the same (more or less), the client is merely accepting the stream of data (video) off your server.

It would be like that porno company who tried to patent the affil program

notjoe · 11-18-2002, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Loch
I think it will be a cold day in hell before they get anywhere with this, but if they do prices on videos will skyrocket.

So yes i do think its in everyones interest to get this solved one way or the other.

It'll be a cold day in hell before they would ever get a dime out of me. upto 8% of gross sales to these fuckers for absolutely nothing, i dont think so.

let me know how it goes. if you run into any problems let me know as i would be interested in helping to fight it

Joe

awu · 11-18-2002, 07:51 AM

I received 2 letters about 6 weeks ago and I called them. What they are doing is sending out thousands of these letters in the hope that a site is actualy streaming video which I wasn't. I told them my videos are in a zip format and the webmasters download it so it's not streaming video.

He then told me if that's the case he also owns the copyright for that which is bullshit. I haven't heard from them since and that was 6 weeks ago.

If there patents could stand up in court then they would be after Microsoft but they know the costs would be to high and they would loose. The easiest is to scare the smaller Companies into paying and when they have built up their cash cow they will try and go for the bigger ones. IMHO.

Braincash Fred · 11-18-2002, 07:52 AM

We received the same kind of letter from another company named PANIP ... I'll never answered them until I get a court order.

But read this you'll learn a lot about all those scam
http://www.youmaybenext.com/

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 07:56 AM

Solution #1:

Change your DNS contact info to a Canadian P.O. Box (or any other country not on their patent list).

They will probably assume you're a Canadian company and just go on to the next victim.

It's not a bulletproof solution, but it's cheap and easy and it sounds like this company doesn't do too much research into who it goes after anyways.

Solution #2:

Register an offshore company in a country not on their patent list, then tell them to go fuck a donkey!

awu · 11-18-2002, 07:59 AM

I'm in Australia and we aren't on their patented list of countries and I received a letter from them.

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by awu
I'm in Australia and we aren't on their patented list of countries and I received a letter from them.

Sounds like they're hoping you don't know your country isn't on their list.

Paul Markham · 11-18-2002, 08:38 AM

This is very interesting. This Patent scam is an industry and unles one of the big boys gets involved it will just go on and on.

Read this.

http://www.informationweek.com/story/IWK20021004S0040

I found it off a link on www.youmaybenext.com

Read it it's very interesting.

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 08:46 AM

I'm going to patent the process of posting messages to a message board, then all you guys will have to pay ME for every post you make. Amp and boneprone are fucked. I will milk you guys like the tits on a goat!

Muahahhahahah!

G-D · 11-18-2002, 09:53 AM

Solution #1:

Change your DNS contact info to a Canadian P.O. Box (or any other country not on their patent list).

They will probably assume you're a Canadian company and just go on to the next victim.

It's not a bulletproof solution, but it's cheap and easy and it sounds like this company doesn't do too much research into who it goes after anyways.

Solution #2:

Register an offshore company in a country not on their patent list, then tell them to go fuck a donkey!

You live up to your nick BB, you have the IQ of a bear. When they slam that door shut in the steel bar hotel, remember the sage advice you give on everything.

A US citizen cannot escape law by moving things to a different address, country or your seemingly favorite suggestion, Offshore.
You're just full of bullshit. What are you doing out of school? Don't they still have truent officers?

x582 · 11-18-2002, 10:00 AM

If you have some concerns, just open a offshore IBC for $1,500 and make a contract between this offshore company and a company in your country of residence. Put all the porn stuff under that offshore IBC and you should be fine.

Sign contracts between the 2 companies, so your company in USA will pay all payables and move the profit (less a little profit margin) to your IBC in an offshore account in UK and that's it!

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G-D

You live up to your nick BB, you have the IQ of a bear. When they slam that door shut in the steel bar hotel, remember the sage advice you give on everything.

A US citizen cannot escape law by moving things to a different address, country or your seemingly favorite suggestion, Offshore.
You're just full of bullshit. What are you doing out of school? Don't they still have truent officers?

Did you miss the part where I said this:

Quote:

It's not a bulletproof solution

Did you even read my post? Obviously not.

x582 · 11-18-2002, 10:04 AM

Quote:

[i]Originally posted by G-D
A US citizen cannot escape law by moving things to a different address, country or your seemingly favorite suggestion, Offshore.
You're just full of bullshit. What are you doing out of school? Don't they still have truent officers? [/B]

You sure can if you do it the right way. Contact consultants like KPMG and they will teach you how do to it in accordance of the law.

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by x582

You sure can if you do it the right way. Contact consultants like KPMG and they will teach you how do to it in accordance of the law.

Watch out, G-D might say you're just full of bullshit.

Loch · 11-18-2002, 10:11 AM

I really dont hope anyone have paid them!

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G-D
A US citizen cannot escape law by moving things to a different address, country or your seemingly favorite suggestion, Offshore.
You're just full of bullshit. What are you doing out of school? Don't they still have truent officers?

First, most people working in porn have a registered corporation, they don't operate their business out of their personal bank account (unless they're a newbie like you).

Second, the corporation would get sued, not the citizens who own or run the corporation. So a US citizen could own a Canadian corporation (or a corporation in any other country in which their patent doesn't apply in) and probably avoid legal action from them.

G-D · 11-18-2002, 10:20 AM

Yes I read the post BB, as well as alot of other ones from you. I will admit you amended this one to say not bullet proof.

Insofar as legally transferring offshore, better check on the little rider they have on such things. I'm not sure of the exact wording but it goes something like this...

If you are moving offshore to ESCAPE for illegal purposes, IE: income tax evasion or to escape legalities that would be brought against you... Bang.

I think that shifting offshore in most of these threads are just for the two things above. Band together and fight it but don't try to outrun it. That will go against you in court, if and when they take you there.

I believe Canada also follows along... (accepts US patents as their own)... with the patents in most of cases on the US's coattails. Or so I read some years ago. Might want to check on that now. Run and it just hurts when they catch you. John Walsh is always looking. :D

tony286 · 11-18-2002, 10:32 AM

You know we talked about this when Visa happened and now this is happening. We have to start, a group pay dues get a lawyer to represent that group and when shit like this happens we can deal with it much more effectively. Also if you get 500 webmasters pay dues of $250 each thats $100k for lawyers. That is a nice chunk of money, most will think twice before fucking with us. We have to start acting like real businesses not toy ones. Real industries have trade asociations and guilds to protect them selves. Dont we all work too fucking hard to give our money way to every cocksucker that sees us as sheep.

Brown Bear · 11-18-2002, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G-D
Yes I read the post BB, as well as alot of other ones from you.

Awwww...shucks....I didn't know I had a fan.

I nominate you as the president of the Brown Bear fan club.

Sambuka · 11-18-2002, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G-D
Solution #1:

Change your DNS contact info to a Canadian P.O. Box (or any other country not on their patent list).

They will probably assume you're a Canadian company and just go on to the next victim.

It's not a bulletproof solution, but it's cheap and easy and it sounds like this company doesn't do too much research into who it goes after anyways.

Solution #2:

Register an offshore company in a country not on their patent list, then tell them to go fuck a donkey!

You live up to your nick BB, you have the IQ of a bear. When they slam that door shut in the steel bar hotel, remember the sage advice you give on everything.

A US citizen cannot escape law by moving things to a different address, country or your seemingly favorite suggestion, Offshore.
You're just full of bullshit. What are you doing out of school? Don't they still have truent officers?

DUH, YES opening a offshore company would make these dickhead scam artists with there patents leave you alone, they are not some big ass company who is going to track you down, there just some piss ass scam artists trying to extract some cash from the porn biz. And other biz i'm sure.

Wake up and smell what your eating dude, opening a US company or changing your DNS WOULD solve this problem for most people. So dissing this guy for his post is pure bullshit, you need to go back to school.

Sammy

x582 · 11-18-2002, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G-D
Yes I read the post BB, as well as alot of other ones from you. I will admit you amended this one to say not bullet proof.

Insofar as legally transferring offshore, better check on the little rider they have on such things. I'm not sure of the exact wording but it goes something like this...

If you are moving offshore to ESCAPE for illegal purposes, IE: income tax evasion or to escape legalities that would be brought against you... Bang.

You do not MOVE but SELL to another corporation. And this other corporation is incorporated in an other Country. It's like when ARS sold their sites to Global in Toronto/Canada - and recently Global sold the sites to another corporation (AskCs Inc.) in the USA.

What I was saying is : If you are concern for whatever the reasons of being in the USA, well you can think about SELLING to another corporation in another Country where it will be more convenient for you and your corporation to do business in.

If you are curently in court and you want to move offshore to avoid paying royalties to a company like Acacia - well it might be too late.

G-D · 11-18-2002, 11:04 AM

they are not some big ass company

No, but when they turn the IRS on you, and the Feds get to looking, most of the court litigation costs would be levied on your own head. If the govt wants to ever get after this industry, this sort of case would open the ball.

Read the case on Al Capone. Once the IRS gets involved EVERYone involved gets looked at.

Something I learned in the mid 80's, when an accountant tells you something, check with a criminal lawyer before trusting it. An accountant knows taxes (and laws to a degree involving them). Criminal action - law, civil as well, do not always agree with an accountants thoughts on a subject. Few accountants could ever handle being an attorney at the same time. There are just too many changes each year for any one person to be aware of AND remember.

Do as you wish, but when you err, it's better to be on the safer side of it.

tony286 · 11-18-2002, 11:14 AM

Capone was in a cash business, we are not in a cash business but a very tracable business. Now if some fool doesnt pay his taxes thats not a adult internet thing, thats a person who is stupid thing. We pay all our taxes and I think it is safe to assume 97% of web masters in the US pay their taxes because there is no where to hide income. Its not like when I worked in adult entertainment in the strip bars there were gobs of cash and the owners could hide that. You cant hide ibill checks or cc money transfered into your account.

x582 · 11-18-2002, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G-D
No, but when they turn the IRS on you, and the Feds get to looking, most of the court litigation costs would be levied on your own head. If the govt wants to ever get after this industry, this sort of case would open the ball.

Why the IRS will be on you if you pay your tax in time? Selling assets from a company to another is fully legit. I don't see why the Feds will get involved in something like this - there is nothing illegal here if this "transition" is done within the rules and by informing the government.

Some country like Canada, you can legally MOVE things offshore if you pay a "departure tax". Anyway, consult your tax lawyer and accounting firm. Everything can be done legally, it's not costing a forture and it can saves tons of nightmares.

E-Randy · 11-18-2002, 11:48 AM

These guys are tyring to patent the idea of a content provider selling streams to a webmaster for the purpose of resale to end users. They are also trying to force webmasters that use video on their sites to pay royalties. It's definitely a case of extortion. Not to worry, if we all work together on this one, we should be able to keep these fuckers out of our industry.

Far-L · 11-18-2002, 12:04 PM

ACACIA
A very important message to all webmasters:

A company called ACACIA is threatening our entire community, from content companies to amateur webmasters, with a lawsuit aimed at requiring anyone using online video, streams, server push, or downloads, to pay an exorbitant license fee. They are demanding that all companies pay them 15% of their online earnings!

In essence, they claim to own the patent for all digital video transmitted via the internet!

Many have been already served. A lot of us thought this problem would go away and considered it too ridiculous to even merit attention, but the sad truth is that this is a real problem that is now going to certainly be determined in court.

Already a movement is underway to challenge this assault of our industry and many companies and individuals are coming together to fight in a unified front and share the burden resulting from this action.

Please contact [email protected] or call, or have your attorney call Holio's attorney, Saul Reiss, at 310-360-8840. We will attempt to coordinate this effort on behalf of anyone who is faced with threats and or litigation from Acacia.

Please cut and paste this post and share it on other boards that you may frequent. Thank you.

Farrell Timlake

President, Homegrown Video
Office: 206-524-4540
cell: 206-391-6509

erotictrance · 11-18-2002, 12:35 PM

Here's the Acacia patent language I could find on the government's website.

I'm only guessing, but it looks like they've been filing the same patents since 1991, the latest in 2000, all with what seems to be the same language. To wit:

"A system of distributing video and/or audio information employs digital signal processing to achieve high rates of data compression. The compressed and encoded audio and/or video information is sent over standard telephone, cable or satellite broadcast channels to a receiver specified by a subscriber of the service, preferably in less than real time, for later playback and optional recording on standard audio and/or video tape."

Kinda weird since they've been filing the same patents for several years with apparently the same language. If I recall correctly, a patent usually only lasts for 7 years, so their first would have expired in 1998.

I guess that's why they've kept filing, although I wonder if that's allowed. It's also odd that they haven't attempted to make case until now.

KingK7 · 11-18-2002, 12:51 PM

I received a letter from them as well for my EU company, today actually.
Fuck'em, they arent getting shit from me.

tony286 · 11-18-2002, 01:02 PM

As I had read earlier, if you are not building a competing technology how can they go after us? I am use technologies I bought licenses from Microsoft, Macromedia,Adobe, Pinnacle, if they want to sue for patent infringement thats who they should be going after. Its like the guy who owns the patent for digital imaging going after me because I take digital pictures. Also if they were smart they would of made the yearly license $100 a year, a large number would of paid and not said a word but greed is an awful thing. We have to take a goal line stand on this one, so others will think twice. Isnt it interesting that after the visa thing it seems they really started to make a push.Maybe after seeing how most are so willing to bendover, it gave them hope that they would win.

Probono · 11-18-2002, 01:05 PM

I cannot find the link at the moment but there is a similar tactic being used against small businesses using online stores. Some one claims the patent rights to ecommerce and is suing small guys, one at a time.

Found a link on Slash Dot

http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?s...thread&tid=155

They have a website, very similar effort

http://www.youmaybenext.com/

tony286 · 11-18-2002, 01:41 PM

I just chated with a freind of mine ,who knows this patent shit pretty well this was his response to me . "Anyway, the camera analogy is on point. They are claiming rights to an expressive work that has become fixed in a tangible medium of expression.That's as old as copyright law itself.And they are very clearly defined in the definitions. Well, they own "patents" But they are trying to claim copyright interest. No go, no fly, move to dismiss, bye bye. File a counterclaim for abusive litigation and even if they don't sue, file a claim for extortion."

gregtx · 11-18-2002, 01:44 PM

THis is extortion... they are offering "low" licensing fees to those who sucumb to thier demands.. but in the fine print, they also want your customer lists and rights to audit your company... if they get enough "small" clients to agree.. they then use those company names as "proof" to the courts that they are legit...

WE are planning to band together and fight back... if you are a content provider and or webmaster who has gotten a letter from Acacia... and would like to join us... please e-mail

[email protected]

peace

gregtx · 11-18-2002, 01:45 PM

sorry.. basically we would all split the costs for an attourney to represent us... so everyones costs would be much lower....

scoreman · 11-18-2002, 04:40 PM

Acacia's 3rd quarter 10-Q:

$36 million in the red for the last 9 months , $136 million in losses for the history of the company.

Total revenues of $179,000 in 3rd Q 2002.

$57.8 million in cash/short term investments.

erotictrance · 11-18-2002, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by scoreman
Acacia's 3rd quarter 10-Q:

$36 million in the red for the last 9 months , $136 million in losses for the history of the company.

Total revenues of $179,000 in 3rd Q 2002.

$57.8 million in cash/short term investments.

Yep. Might explain why they're coming after the adult industry after ten years of supposedly holding these patent rights.

bhutocracy · 11-18-2002, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by awu
I'm in Australia and we aren't on their patented list of countries and I received a letter from them.

well then i guess someone can go eat a dick then lol

Jade · 11-18-2002, 10:43 PM

Has anyone paid?

Jade

The Other Steve · 11-19-2002, 03:36 AM

I wonder if living in a country that is not on their lists is any protection if the video we are providing is sitting on a server in a country that is on their lists.

11-18-2002, 04:52 AM	#51
Brown Bear Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,982	Someone said they don't have a patent on this in Canada, what other countries do they not have a patent in? __________________ Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.

11-18-2002, 04:55 AM	#52
Brown Bear Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,982	Have they actually gone to court against any company yet? __________________ Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.

11-18-2002, 05:58 AM	#55
quiet we'll miss you our friend. RIP Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Fernie, BC Posts: 25,115	no Canada. cool. __________________ we'll miss you our friend. RIP

11-18-2002, 06:38 AM	#56
Loch Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 7,674	We got the letter about 3 months ago if not longer. You all know by now basically what it said, only mine had 23 patent violations...i got on the phone right away and talked with the company president. I set-up a login for the guy and guided him thru the site, showed him everything. I cut him down in every try to uphold their fucking patents, in the end he was more confused then a blond at a science convention. I then gave him 2 days to get back to us. When he got back i only had 5 patent violations. I called him back, asking why and explained to him how streaming/video on demand and so on works.... After this i havent heard a word!! (i might, but havent yet) This tells me that they dont know enough about this (yet) to really do something about it. But one thing is for sure, just sitting back doing nothing wont help any one of us. If they continue ill just zip the video previews and let our clients download them till this is solved.... __________________ Contact us for Beta store access (4000 HD/SD productions) - Editing - Encoding/Post production ICQ - 277 862 930 E-mail casper /@/ cool-content.com

11-18-2002, 06:57 AM	#57
Brown Bear Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,982	This is just another good reason to be an offshore company. __________________ Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.

11-18-2002, 05:57 AM	#54
bhutocracy Not making A Comeback Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 10,218	Acacia Media Technologies owns U.S. and International pioneering patents covering the transmission and receipt of digital audio and/or video content via several means including the Internet, cable and satellite. This technology is called Digital Media Transmission ("DMT") Technology and is also commonly referred to as video-on-demand and audio-on-demand. The worldwide patent portfolio includes five issued U.S. patents and a pending U.S. patent, which will provide coverage until 2011. The U.S. patents include: U.S. Patent No. 5,132,992, U.S. Patent No. 5,253,275, U.S. Patent No. 5,550,863, U.S. Patent No. 6,002,720, and U.S. Patent No. 6,144,702. The European Patent Office has granted patents which provide coverage until 2012 in the following 14 countries: Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, Monaco, the Netherlands, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, and the United Kingdom. International patents have been issued covering Mexico, Taiwan, and Japan. they must be tripping.. this garbage from a company called "acacia" and patents on "DMT".

11-18-2002, 07:29 AM	#59
Brown Bear Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,982	If all you are doing is putting an MPEG file on a server, how is that streaming? Surfers are the one streaming it. How is putting a file on a server infringing on a patent? __________________ Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.

11-18-2002, 07:41 AM	#60
Loch Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 7,674	Acacia prices on the content provider license agreement. Initial prepaid royalty: Projected gross sales Initial prepaid royalty: $1 - 100,000 $ 1,500,- $100,001 - 500,000 $ 6,000,- etc etc etc Aditional royalty: Actual gross sales Additional royalty: $100,001 - 500,000 $ 8,100,- $500,001 - 1,000,000 $ 20,250,- etc etc etc __________________ Contact us for Beta store access (4000 HD/SD productions) - Editing - Encoding/Post production ICQ - 277 862 930 E-mail casper /@/ cool-content.com

11-18-2002, 07:45 AM	#62
Loch Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 7,674	I think it will be a cold day in hell before they get anywhere with this, but if they do prices on videos will skyrocket. So yes i do think its in everyones interest to get this solved one way or the other. __________________ Contact us for Beta store access (4000 HD/SD productions) - Editing - Encoding/Post production ICQ - 277 862 930 E-mail casper /@/ cool-content.com

11-18-2002, 07:51 AM	#65
awu Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 228	I received 2 letters about 6 weeks ago and I called them. What they are doing is sending out thousands of these letters in the hope that a site is actualy streaming video which I wasn't. I told them my videos are in a zip format and the webmasters download it so it's not streaming video. He then told me if that's the case he also owns the copyright for that which is bullshit. I haven't heard from them since and that was 6 weeks ago. If there patents could stand up in court then they would be after Microsoft but they know the costs would be to high and they would loose. The easiest is to scare the smaller Companies into paying and when they have built up their cash cow they will try and go for the bigger ones. IMHO.

11-18-2002, 07:52 AM	#66
Braincash Fred Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Montreal Posts: 1,589	We received the same kind of letter from another company named PANIP ... I'll never answered them until I get a court order. But read this you'll learn a lot about all those scam http://www.youmaybenext.com/

11-18-2002, 07:56 AM	#67
Brown Bear Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,982	Solution #1: Change your DNS contact info to a Canadian P.O. Box (or any other country not on their patent list). They will probably assume you're a Canadian company and just go on to the next victim. It's not a bulletproof solution, but it's cheap and easy and it sounds like this company doesn't do too much research into who it goes after anyways. Solution #2: Register an offshore company in a country not on their patent list, then tell them to go fuck a donkey! __________________ Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.

11-18-2002, 07:59 AM	#68
awu Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 228	I'm in Australia and we aren't on their patented list of countries and I received a letter from them.

11-18-2002, 08:38 AM	#70
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	This is very interesting. This Patent scam is an industry and unles one of the big boys gets involved it will just go on and on. Read this. http://www.informationweek.com/story/IWK20021004S0040 I found it off a link on www.youmaybenext.com Read it it's very interesting. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

11-18-2002, 08:46 AM	#71
Brown Bear Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,982	I'm going to patent the process of posting messages to a message board, then all you guys will have to pay ME for every post you make. Amp and boneprone are fucked. I will milk you guys like the tits on a goat! Muahahhahahah! __________________ Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.

11-18-2002, 09:53 AM	#72
G-D Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 14	Solution #1: Change your DNS contact info to a Canadian P.O. Box (or any other country not on their patent list). They will probably assume you're a Canadian company and just go on to the next victim. It's not a bulletproof solution, but it's cheap and easy and it sounds like this company doesn't do too much research into who it goes after anyways. Solution #2: Register an offshore company in a country not on their patent list, then tell them to go fuck a donkey! You live up to your nick BB, you have the IQ of a bear. When they slam that door shut in the steel bar hotel, remember the sage advice you give on everything. A US citizen cannot escape law by moving things to a different address, country or your seemingly favorite suggestion, Offshore. You're just full of bullshit. What are you doing out of school? Don't they still have truent officers?

11-18-2002, 10:00 AM	#73
x582 Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: heh? Posts: 609	If you have some concerns, just open a offshore IBC for $1,500 and make a contract between this offshore company and a company in your country of residence. Put all the porn stuff under that offshore IBC and you should be fine. Sign contracts between the 2 companies, so your company in USA will pay all payables and move the profit (less a little profit margin) to your IBC in an offshore account in UK and that's it!

11-18-2002, 10:11 AM	#77
Loch Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 7,674	I really dont hope anyone have paid them! __________________ Contact us for Beta store access (4000 HD/SD productions) - Editing - Encoding/Post production ICQ - 277 862 930 E-mail casper /@/ cool-content.com

11-18-2002, 10:20 AM	#79
G-D Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 14	Yes I read the post BB, as well as alot of other ones from you. I will admit you amended this one to say not bullet proof. Insofar as legally transferring offshore, better check on the little rider they have on such things. I'm not sure of the exact wording but it goes something like this... If you are moving offshore to ESCAPE for illegal purposes, IE: income tax evasion or to escape legalities that would be brought against you... Bang. I think that shifting offshore in most of these threads are just for the two things above. Band together and fight it but don't try to outrun it. That will go against you in court, if and when they take you there. I believe Canada also follows along... (accepts US patents as their own)... with the patents in most of cases on the US's coattails. Or so I read some years ago. Might want to check on that now. Run and it just hurts when they catch you. John Walsh is always looking. :D

11-18-2002, 10:32 AM	#80
tony286 lurker Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: atlanta Posts: 57,021	You know we talked about this when Visa happened and now this is happening. We have to start, a group pay dues get a lawyer to represent that group and when shit like this happens we can deal with it much more effectively. Also if you get 500 webmasters pay dues of $250 each thats $100k for lawyers. That is a nice chunk of money, most will think twice before fucking with us. We have to start acting like real businesses not toy ones. Real industries have trade asociations and guilds to protect them selves. Dont we all work too fucking hard to give our money way to every cocksucker that sees us as sheep.

11-18-2002, 11:04 AM	#84
G-D Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 14	they are not some big ass company No, but when they turn the IRS on you, and the Feds get to looking, most of the court litigation costs would be levied on your own head. If the govt wants to ever get after this industry, this sort of case would open the ball. Read the case on Al Capone. Once the IRS gets involved EVERYone involved gets looked at. Something I learned in the mid 80's, when an accountant tells you something, check with a criminal lawyer before trusting it. An accountant knows taxes (and laws to a degree involving them). Criminal action - law, civil as well, do not always agree with an accountants thoughts on a subject. Few accountants could ever handle being an attorney at the same time. There are just too many changes each year for any one person to be aware of AND remember. Do as you wish, but when you err, it's better to be on the safer side of it.

11-18-2002, 11:14 AM	#85
tony286 lurker Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: atlanta Posts: 57,021	Capone was in a cash business, we are not in a cash business but a very tracable business. Now if some fool doesnt pay his taxes thats not a adult internet thing, thats a person who is stupid thing. We pay all our taxes and I think it is safe to assume 97% of web masters in the US pay their taxes because there is no where to hide income. Its not like when I worked in adult entertainment in the strip bars there were gobs of cash and the owners could hide that. You cant hide ibill checks or cc money transfered into your account.

11-18-2002, 11:48 AM	#87
E-Randy Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 176	These guys are tyring to patent the idea of a content provider selling streams to a webmaster for the purpose of resale to end users. They are also trying to force webmasters that use video on their sites to pay royalties. It's definitely a case of extortion. Not to worry, if we all work together on this one, we should be able to keep these fuckers out of our industry. __________________ ElectraContent.com 31 KICK ASS plugin products for $399! Massive Rods, College Girls, Panties, Lesbians, Toys and dildos, Dirty Blondes, Petite, Interracial, Sexy Housewives........

11-18-2002, 12:04 PM	#88
Far-L Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 6,065	ACACIA A very important message to all webmasters: A company called ACACIA is threatening our entire community, from content companies to amateur webmasters, with a lawsuit aimed at requiring anyone using online video, streams, server push, or downloads, to pay an exorbitant license fee. They are demanding that all companies pay them 15% of their online earnings! In essence, they claim to own the patent for all digital video transmitted via the internet! Many have been already served. A lot of us thought this problem would go away and considered it too ridiculous to even merit attention, but the sad truth is that this is a real problem that is now going to certainly be determined in court. Already a movement is underway to challenge this assault of our industry and many companies and individuals are coming together to fight in a unified front and share the burden resulting from this action. Please contact [email protected] or call, or have your attorney call Holio's attorney, Saul Reiss, at 310-360-8840. We will attempt to coordinate this effort on behalf of anyone who is faced with threats and or litigation from Acacia. Please cut and paste this post and share it on other boards that you may frequent. Thank you. Farrell Timlake President, Homegrown Video Office: 206-524-4540 cell: 206-391-6509 __________________ HomegrownCash.com, the affiliate program of Homegrown Video - The Largest Collection of Amateur XXX - Est. 1982. Contact - Email: farrell AT homegrownvideo D com Skype: hgfarl Newsweek Magazine - "Homegrown Video, the longest running series in the history of porn."

11-18-2002, 12:35 PM	#89
erotictrance Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southern California Posts: 328	Here's the Acacia patent language I could find on the government's website. I'm only guessing, but it looks like they've been filing the same patents since 1991, the latest in 2000, all with what seems to be the same language. To wit: "A system of distributing video and/or audio information employs digital signal processing to achieve high rates of data compression. The compressed and encoded audio and/or video information is sent over standard telephone, cable or satellite broadcast channels to a receiver specified by a subscriber of the service, preferably in less than real time, for later playback and optional recording on standard audio and/or video tape." Kinda weird since they've been filing the same patents for several years with apparently the same language. If I recall correctly, a patent usually only lasts for 7 years, so their first would have expired in 1998. I guess that's why they've kept filing, although I wonder if that's allowed. It's also odd that they haven't attempted to make case until now. __________________ erotictrance

11-18-2002, 12:51 PM	#90
KingK7 Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 6,372	I received a letter from them as well for my EU company, today actually. Fuck'em, they arent getting shit from me.

11-18-2002, 01:02 PM	#91
tony286 lurker Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: atlanta Posts: 57,021	As I had read earlier, if you are not building a competing technology how can they go after us? I am use technologies I bought licenses from Microsoft, Macromedia,Adobe, Pinnacle, if they want to sue for patent infringement thats who they should be going after. Its like the guy who owns the patent for digital imaging going after me because I take digital pictures. Also if they were smart they would of made the yearly license $100 a year, a large number would of paid and not said a word but greed is an awful thing. We have to take a goal line stand on this one, so others will think twice. Isnt it interesting that after the visa thing it seems they really started to make a push.Maybe after seeing how most are so willing to bendover, it gave them hope that they would win.

11-18-2002, 01:05 PM	#92
Probono Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Under the Rainbow Posts: 2,731	I cannot find the link at the moment but there is a similar tactic being used against small businesses using online stores. Some one claims the patent rights to ecommerce and is suing small guys, one at a time. Found a link on Slash Dot http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?s...thread&tid=155 They have a website, very similar effort http://www.youmaybenext.com/ Last edited by Probono; 11-18-2002 at 01:10 PM..

11-18-2002, 01:41 PM	#93
tony286 lurker Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: atlanta Posts: 57,021	I just chated with a freind of mine ,who knows this patent shit pretty well this was his response to me . "Anyway, the camera analogy is on point. They are claiming rights to an expressive work that has become fixed in a tangible medium of expression.That's as old as copyright law itself.And they are very clearly defined in the definitions. Well, they own "patents" But they are trying to claim copyright interest. No go, no fly, move to dismiss, bye bye. File a counterclaim for abusive litigation and even if they don't sue, file a claim for extortion."

11-18-2002, 01:44 PM	#94
gregtx Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,929	THis is extortion... they are offering "low" licensing fees to those who sucumb to thier demands.. but in the fine print, they also want your customer lists and rights to audit your company... if they get enough "small" clients to agree.. they then use those company names as "proof" to the courts that they are legit... WE are planning to band together and fight back... if you are a content provider and or webmaster who has gotten a letter from Acacia... and would like to join us... please e-mail [email protected] peace __________________ Processing Partners http://www.processingpartners.com

11-18-2002, 01:45 PM	#95
gregtx Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,929	sorry.. basically we would all split the costs for an attourney to represent us... so everyones costs would be much lower.... __________________ Processing Partners http://www.processingpartners.com

11-18-2002, 04:40 PM	#96
scoreman Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,491	Acacia's 3rd quarter 10-Q: $36 million in the red for the last 9 months , $136 million in losses for the history of the company. Total revenues of $179,000 in 3rd Q 2002. $57.8 million in cash/short term investments. __________________

11-18-2002, 10:43 PM	#99
Jade Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 329	Has anyone paid? Jade __________________ Cum see me at http://BlowjobJade.com

11-19-2002, 03:36 AM	#100
The Other Steve Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Sunny Queensland - perfect one day and better the next. Posts: 2,106	I wonder if living in a country that is not on their lists is any protection if the video we are providing is sitting on a server in a country that is on their lists. __________________ Left intentionally blank ... just like my brain