Kids watching porn - is this thought about it WRONG?

[SleazyDream]

ok. on a pannel and the topic comes up. I'm against it of course, and even donate thousands to the ASACP every year and have for many years.


but when asked about on a pannel my first response for stopping kids from watching porn is that Kids can't buy porn. at the end of the day this is a business and bringing porn to kids isn't profitable.

ok sure I agree with all the social aspects of not wanting kids to buy porn but I choose to highlight the simple fact that kids don't own credit cards and any good parent doesn't give their kids a credit card thus kids can't buy porn so any kids looking at your porn sites are freeloaders costing you money in bandwidth and you want to stop it for that reason alone amoung others. I'm a businessman - i see things in dollars and cents first.

does that make sense?

cause I caught a lot of heat for that idea from the audience and other pannelists

[pornguy]

I agree with you. But what I find so sad, is that we are the ones that they think need to stop kids from seeing porn. They dont care that the parents are no place to be found.

Just blame us.

[kane]

I agree fully. Every now and then you see extremist say how we are targeting kids. No, I don't want kids on my site. The social reasons aside, they can't buy what I am selling. Targeting them makes no sense.

[SleazyDream]

Originally Posted by kane

I agree fully. Every now and then you see extremist say how we are targeting kids. No, I don't want kids on my site. The social reasons aside, they can't buy what I am selling. Targeting them makes no sense.

my point exactly

[Deej]

Originally Posted by pornguy

I agree with you. But what I find so sad, is that we are the ones that they think need to stop kids from seeing porn. They dont care that the parents are no place to be found.

Just blame us.

Fucking A

the parents are even the ones bitching is what boggles me.

They take more than 15 minutes to bitch about it....but, how long does it take to download and install a decent content filter?

[fuzebox]

Whenever I've been to one of these panels that talk about keeping high school aged kids away from porn, I always want to ask how many people in the room didn't view porn shortly after hitting puberty.

[Mr Pheer]

Originally Posted by SleazyDream

but when asked about on a pannel my first response for stopping kids from watching porn is that Kids can't buy porn.

yeah everybody knows that you need a credit card to see all the porn on the thousands of TGPs out there

the credit card argument is never going to work, kids dont need to 'buy' porn when its free all over the internet

[Brujah]

They should never let Sleazy on a panel.

[demetrio27]

Blocking porn from kids is as easy as retaining a handful of water in your hands.

[Michaelious]

Kids from a very younge age are curious about sex...if as a parent you can't do your job then they will use porn as a learning tool...if you do your job ur kid will look anyway but at least they wont need protection.

[Dirty Dane]

Most adults do not buy porn either.

[Dirty Dane]

Originally Posted by Mr Pheer

yeah everybody knows that you need a credit card to see all the porn on the thousands of TGPs out there

the credit card argument is never going to work, kids dont need to 'buy' porn when its free all over the internet

Agree to that. "Problem" is not paysites, but freesites. The only way to stop kids from watching it is filters, and guide parents to install it.

[Digipimp]

kids being able to buy porn really has nothing to do with the subject for the most part, you're just feeding your ego as usual

[just a punk]

I saw the porn first time when I was 7y.o. I think it happens because porn was forbidden in USSR and as many other kids I always like to do something what's not allowed (we even have some saying here which sounds like "forbidden fruit has a sweet taste") However I can't say it was affecting me somehow. I just saw it but I didn't turn into some perverted rapist or something like that...

I even came into this industry not because I saw the porn when I was a kid, but because I was working in IT industry for about 5 years and found some good article on making money in porn in one of IT-related magazines. I just was in need of money, so I came into adult business.

[pink_in_the_middle]

Kids could just buy a prepaid credit card without a parents consent and buy all the porn they want

[scottybuzz]

I was always caught looking at porn when i was younger. Like how when my dad next logged on the pc, there would be dozens of toolbars installed and dailers loading up.

Scary times they were.

[pink_in_the_middle]

Originally Posted by fuzebox

Whenever I've been to one of these panels that talk about keeping high school aged kids away from porn, I always want to ask how many people in the room didn't view porn shortly after hitting puberty.

There is a HUGE difference in the porn that?s out there today then what was there when I was growing up, and I'm only 27.

[cool1]

Originally Posted by pink_in_the_middle

Kids could just buy a prepaid credit card without a parents consent and buy all the porn they want

yep they can get the MuchMusic prepaid Mastercard from muchmusic.com
not the best example

[Jace]

majority of the ADULTS out there don't pay for porn, what makes you think kids would try?

[TheLegacy]

kids don't have credit cards - parents do.

they'll always steal that and use it - but even when we have the disclaimer about leaving if your under 18, how many kids are actually going to go, "gee whiz, I better not visit that site, I'm under 18".

truth is that kids are going to go to sites to see porn - not having a cc is a great start - but what upsets me the most is all the free sites out there that give away hardcore material just for a click thru etc.

why don't we get pissed for that reason alone to all those who continue to promote free sites with porn on it - I have yet to hear, 'do this and your giving porn to children'. instead, webmasters jump all over paysite owners screaming that they are allowing kids to see porn through the tour pages etc.

I am with you Sleazy on this one - why they got after you makes no sense to me. they should be horrified at tgp's first, then at blogs that gives ready access to kids with no background checking or CC approvals required.

I know people will scream at me, but if you own a free site or promote them - there is more security set up in a paysite against underage viewers than a tgp - so I praise paysite owners

[BlackCrayon]

Like others have said kids don't need credit cards to look at porn. Kids today are tech savvy so early now, if they can figure out how to use bit torrent they have a never ending supply of full length hardcore dvd rips.

The net may make things a bit easier but kids will see porn one way or another if they want to. Before the net was around i was looking at swank,playboy, etc at the age of 7-8. I remember getting in trouble for brining a magazine to school and showing my friends. I found it on the side of the road when i was beer bottle hunting. Other times we would find movies and other magazines from my friends fathers, etc.

The best way to keep kids from looking at porn online is, in my opinion:
Keep the computer in the living room.
Always make sure you can see the screen from where you are.
Don't let them use the computer when you are not there.
Use filters and check history.

[Jarmusch]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

I know people will scream at me, but if you own a free site or promote them - there is more security set up in a paysite against underage viewers than a tgp - so I praise paysite owners

You praise paysite owners? It's the paysite owners that give away free content and make thousands of FHG's for affiliates to promote them on FREE sites. Not to mention most of them have lots of free hardcore vids on their paysite tours.

This thread makes no fucking sense at all, Sleazy must have been on drugs on that pannel.

[RP Fade]

I think the main problem is not kids buying porn, but accessing porn. You really don't need to buy porn to watch porn. And that's everyone's reponsibility, none more than parents. Here are some older statistics, the #'s have gone up since then from what I heard..

http://www.obscenitycrimes.org/espfo...AndNetporn.cfm

[Huggles]

Parents need to know that an unsecured, unfiltered PC is like leaving your front door open with a sign on the lawn: "curious 13 y/o girl inside" with a loaded gun, pile of blow, a porn magazine on your kitchen table.

[Penthouse Tony]

Scott never made the argument that unfiltered access to Internet was safe for kids who's parents didn't want them to see porn. The question was about porn sites targeting kids. Scott's response was that it would be stupid to target kids since they have no purchasing power.

He never claimed that parents should give unfiltered access to the Internet to kids. In fact he strongly urged parents to buy filters.

[LiveDose]

Everyone in this business should be 100% behind limiting access to porn by children obviously. It is in our best interest. Unfortunately many of the promotion business models in our industry operate completely opposite to this concept. There is responsibility on both sides, parents as well as site owners/operators.

Much of the 'access issue' has been brought on directly by people in this industry.

On top of that a lot of the free porn out there is not provided by adult industry people but by recluse losers with self esteem issues who are trying to 'be the man' by providing free porn to other losers out there and to see what kind of traffic that can generate to their free non-business sites.

There are really no absolute answers but as industry folk it is our responsibility to take a deep interest in this issue... Nice thread Sleazy.

[frostyimpressions]

It's absolutely the parents responsibility to limit and monitor their childrens use of the internet and consumption of buying things over the internet. Even if kids did have easy access to buy porn it's the parents fault for not keeping watch over them.

[SykkBoy]

It doesn't happen often, but I agree with Sleazy...

When the subject is TARGETING kids, I agree, there's no financial benefit in that at all...

Kids will always be seeking out adult content. It's no different than me rifling through my dad's dirty magazine stash when I was younger.

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by Huggles

Parents need to know that an unsecured, unfiltered PC is like leaving your front door open with a sign on the lawn: "curious 13 y/o girl inside" with a loaded gun, pile of blow, a porn magazine on your kitchen table.

Agreed. And might I add... interesting use of imagery.


Another thing about this discussion is that parents and general people out there don't think the same way in terms of "the porn problem" as we do.... for example, these days anyone with digital cable or satellite TV can access hardcore porn with a few clicks of the remote. My great-nephew (11 yrs old) was over visiting my parents and my sister who is his grandmother. He stayed at their house in a room in the basement which of course has a TV. During the night he ordered two movies from Shaw cable, one was a regular movie but the other was an adult flick. When I found out about this I strongly urged my dad to configure the controls to block those adult stations.

The problem is more than just the internet.


but as far as online porn goes the issue is two-sided. One is the point Scott makes, that it isn't in online porn's best interest to "target kids". There's no money in it, or very very little. But on the other side of it there ARE idiots who do put kid-friendly keywords into their sites and meta tags etc, words like "spongebob", "teletubbies", disney words etc. I guess they figure traffic is traffic. As far as I'm concerned those types need to be hunted down and shot.

At the end of it all parents are the ones who must take 100% responsibility for what their little darlings are allowed to view, period. If they aren't happy with that role then they shouldn't have had kids in the first place.

[jonesonyou]

Parents need to lock the computer if they can not take the time to monitor their kid... IF they can not take the time to filter their internet use.

[tranza]

Kids buy porn pretty easily nowadays.....

[SilvercashJeanette]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Agreed. And might I add... interesting use of imagery.


Another thing about this discussion is that parents and general people out there don't think the same way in terms of "the porn problem" as we do.... for example, these days anyone with digital cable or satellite TV can access hardcore porn with a few clicks of the remote. My great-nephew (11 yrs old) was over visiting my parents and my sister who is his grandmother. He stayed at their house in a room in the basement which of course has a TV. During the night he ordered two movies from Shaw cable, one was a regular movie but the other was an adult flick. When I found out about this I strongly urged my dad to configure the controls to block those adult stations.

The problem is more than just the internet.


but as far as online porn goes the issue is two-sided. One is the point Scott makes, that it isn't in online porn's best interest to "target kids". There's no money in it, or very very little. But on the other side of it there ARE idiots who do put kid-friendly keywords into their sites and meta tags etc, words like "spongebob", "teletubbies", disney words etc. I guess they figure traffic is traffic. As far as I'm concerned those types need to be hunted down and shot.

At the end of it all parents are the ones who must take 100% responsibility for what their little darlings are allowed to view, period. If they aren't happy with that role then they shouldn't have had kids in the first place.

I was thinking the same thing. Porn isn't just on the internet, nor is it any easier to access via internet then it is on TV, or movies. I knew what sex was before I found my dad's stack of Hustlers and Playboys because he never bothered to filter what I was watching. When I was 6, he would let me watch movies with tons of nudity and sometimes very harsh sex or even rape scenes. It was actually the movies that made me more curious about sex.

Parents need to stop blaming companies, trends, music and the internet for their shitty parenting. If they can't handle being parents, then they shouldn't have children and they should stop being lazy when it comes to protecting their kids.

[Azoy?]

SleazyDream your thread title line doesn't make sense.

[Azoy?]

Originally Posted by SilvercashJeanette

Parents need to stop blaming companies, trends, music and the internet for their shitty parenting. If they can't handle being parents, then they shouldn't have children and they should stop being lazy when it comes to protecting their kids.

100% agree with this statement. people have to take responsibility instead of blaming others

[sumphatpimp]

don't be a lamer, swipe the old man's credit card and sign up.
he's too drunk most of the time to know what the hell is going on anyway.

[FightThisPatent]

The real issue that gets conservatives and religious folks going, isn't about children *buying* porn, since that is a very small percentage of sales, the issue is the exposure that children (ie. under 13) to pornographic images.

Teens have a better capacity to understand what they are looking at, they can circumvent computer measurers,etc...

The focus is really the prepubscent age group that is on the internet and comes across porn.

It used to be alot easier to trip across a porn site that was using keyword trickery (ie. using the word disney, etc).. but google has done a good job in cracking down on stuff like that as well various laws being passed.

There are still alot of affiliate websites that use the word 'lolita' as an adjective for 'teen' that creates some issues.

I agree with TheLegacy, paysites do a pretty good job on the whole in keeping inadvertent exposure through the use of the warning splash page (ie. the click if over 18) and labeling (ie. using ASACP's RTAlabel.org or ICRA) to do their part to allow parents to use technology to filter.

To me, its the literally millions of affiiate domains that are what anti-porners are crying about for the possibility of children finding them.

Affiliate websites don't label, they don't have splash screens, etc.

So the heat being generated are from the methods affiliates use to attract surfers.. which could include children.

So like the proposed labeling law that's up in congress right now.. to me, its really targeted at affiliate webmasters to do the labeling.

But i agree with the general sentiment, that labeling along won't protect children, parents must take responsibility to have software installed to utilize the filtering component.. but the issue is if websites have a label that a parent *could* have used to block exposure to their child, then the fault is clearly on the parent (tho, this point has been tested yet for obscenity issue).

Labeling with http://www.rtalabel.org is easy copy/paste and is doing the right thing for your business so you don't get caught in the fingerpointing.




Fight the three fingers pointing back!

[FightThisPatent]

What's interesting to follow, is teens taking nude pics and videos of themselves on their phones and posting up on websites.... they are creating CP, and then people are who are viewing it (ie. other teens) are looking at CP.

This happens on non-adult sites.. one of the many ironies out there that the CP stuff is occurring away from adult-biz, and on mainstream websites and hosting and being processed with mainstream credit card processors.

Fight the hypocrisy!

[magicmike]

Originally Posted by pink_in_the_middle

There is a HUGE difference in the porn that?s out there today then what was there when I was growing up, and I'm only 27.

Not really, if you ever sit down and watch some of the titles that came out in the 70's and 80's. There is a difference but I wouldn't call it huge.


Todays stuff is much more Gonzo style, which might lead one to believe that its more hardcore or whatever, but there was fisting, facials, and a lot of other taboo subjects in 70's and 80's porn that people don't touch today.

[cattivo-3xeg]

Originally Posted by pornguy

I agree with you. But what I find so sad, is that we are the ones that they think need to stop kids from seeing porn. They dont care that the parents are no place to be found.

Just blame us.

amen to that

[RP Fade]

Originally Posted by FightThisPatent

The real issue that gets conservatives and religious folks going, isn't about children *buying* porn, since that is a very small percentage of sales, the issue is the exposure that children (ie. under 13) to pornographic images.

Exactly what I said above

[xclusive]

Originally Posted by scottybuzz

I was always caught looking at porn when i was younger. Like how when my dad next logged on the pc, there would be dozens of toolbars installed and dailers loading up.

Scary times they were.

Yeah last week was a tough week for toolbars

[Dennis69]

Originally Posted by SleazyDream

ok. on a pannel and the topic comes up. I'm against it of course, and even donate thousands to the ASACP every year and have for many years.


but when asked about on a pannel my first response for stopping kids from watching porn is that Kids can't buy porn. at the end of the day this is a business and bringing porn to kids isn't profitable.

ok sure I agree with all the social aspects of not wanting kids to buy porn but I choose to highlight the simple fact that kids don't own credit cards and any good parent doesn't give their kids a credit card thus kids can't buy porn so any kids looking at your porn sites are freeloaders costing you money in bandwidth and you want to stop it for that reason alone amoung others. I'm a businessman - i see things in dollars and cents first.

does that make sense?

cause I caught a lot of heat for that idea from the audience and other pannelists

So I'm just assuming that you need a credit card to look at all the porn on your site?

[SleazyDream]

Originally Posted by Mr Pheer

yeah everybody knows that you need a credit card to see all the porn on the thousands of TGPs out there

the credit card argument is never going to work, kids dont need to 'buy' porn when its free all over the internet

you're missing the point. kids and veiw free porn but free porn exists as a teaser to BUY porn.

kids don't have credit cards so i don't want kids looking at my free stuff

[SleazyDream]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

kids don't have credit cards - parents do.

they'll always steal that and use it ........

your kids steal your credit cards?

[Huggles]

Originally Posted by SilvercashJeanette

Parents need to stop blaming companies, trends, music and the internet for their shitty parenting. If they can't handle being parents, then they shouldn't have children and they should stop being lazy when it comes to protecting their kids.

Parents these days expect all of the above to raise their children for them. Who here wasn't raised on at least SOME form of media?

i.e. Sesame street


Now kids just have many more sources to "learn" from, and an unfiltered internet will teach them anything they are curious about!

[SleazyDream]

Originally Posted by Sagi_AFF

Scott never made the argument that unfiltered access to Internet was safe for kids who's parents didn't want them to see porn. The question was about porn sites targeting kids. Scott's response was that it would be stupid to target kids since they have no purchasing power.

He never claimed that parents should give unfiltered access to the Internet to kids. In fact he strongly urged parents to buy filters.

thank you.


what blows me away is who when you mention kids people suddenly stop listening to what was said or reading what was wrote and put words in your mouth.


fucking idiots always take things out of context

[SleazyDream]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

I know people will scream at me, but if you own a free site or promote them - there is more security set up in a paysite against underage viewers than a tgp - so I praise paysite owners

dude you are on fucking CRACK

paysites PROVIDE the free porn that exists on TGPs

if you know you history tgps started as links to raunchy tours of paysites.



get a fucking CLUE

[FightThisPatent]

Originally Posted by SleazyDream

paysites PROVIDE the free porn that exists on TGPs

sure, but the paysites don't have the responsibilities (or liabilities),since the webmaster puts those images up on their site. perfect example is 2257.

sponsors were handing out sexually explicit images for affiliates to use. with the laws today, the affiliate webmaster is responsible for their decision to use such images. the paysite doesn't have the 2257 problem.. its the affiliate.

same to an analogy as a bullet manufacturer... they provide the ammo, but they aren't held accountable for the damage (or laws) that are passed in relation to the use of such material.

some smart TGP operators license their own content for use on websites or get the 2257 docs from sponsors, so they don't have these issues.

as far as FHG goes...surfer got there from an affiliate website.. and with good marketing, its an adult that is clicking through to view the pages.


Fight the kiddie clicks!