Well Chavez just closed a TV station

[kektex]

Chavez has just closed the oldest TV station in Venezuela and one of the most critical of his government.
How democratic of him... fucking idiot

[CaptainHowdy]

I was checking the protesters on TV... Chavez it's a fucking madman.

[Sly]

Thats just the beginning. I have to admit, this is going to be interesting to watch.

[SmokeyTheBear]

who did you vote for ?

[juz]

Gotta love censorship

[kektex]

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

who did you vote for ?

When he was first elected I was too young to vote.
Never voted for him . You could see his true colors a mile away.
But today Venezuela is paying for the ignorance the past governments inflicted upon the poor people.

[juz]

If you live in Venezuela, I feel for you Chavez is going to run that country into the ground. Picture the flourishing economies of Cuba and The Soviet Union, that is your future

[kektex]

Originally Posted by juz

If you live in Venezuela, I feel for you Chavez is going to run that country into the ground. Picture the flourishing economies of Cuba and The Soviet Union, that is your future

If you had told me that a couple of years ago I wouldn´t believe you.
But today I feel we are closer than ever to that sad reality.
Everyday I think about the opportunities this country is missing with the highest oil prices ever and Chavez has wasted it all promoting his "revolution".

[DeadFidel]

I like him.

[CWeb]

Originally Posted by kektex

If you had told me that a couple of years ago I wouldn´t believe you.
But today I feel we are closer than ever to that sad reality.
Everyday I think about the opportunities this country is missing with the highest oil prices ever and Chavez has wasted it all promoting his "revolution".

Sounds very much like another country to the north of you

You know if Chavez is actually dumping oil revenues into infrastructure or is this being syphoned off?

[kektex]

Originally Posted by DeadFidel

I like him.

Hehe I like your sig...that pic rocks.
I´m gonna have to photoshop Chavez in there somehow.They would be soooo happy together in hell!

[kektex]

Originally Posted by CWeb

Sounds very much like another country to the north of you

You know if Chavez is actually dumping oil revenues into infrastructure or is this being syphoned off?

There has been a lot of infrastructure work here I have to admit, but when you take in to account that he has been in power for 8 years with the highest oil revenues in the history of the country, it amounts to nothing. What the hell do I care about a bridge or a highway when the hospitals dont have any beds?

Corruption is rampant in PDVSA, the state owned oil company, and it´s starting to show in oil production numbers and in the international reserves.

Meanwhile, over 50 people are killed every single weekend here and the bastard criticizes Bush over the dead in Iraq....

[GatorB]

Originally Posted by juz

If you live in Venezuela, I feel for you Chavez is going to run that country into the ground. Picture the flourishing economies of Cuba and The Soviet Union, that is your future

Cuba's economy sucks because of the embargo. If there was no embargo Cuba's economy would be fine. Do you think most Americans would care about it being communist if they were allowed to vacation there? Do you think people would care about it being communist when they buy Cuban made products? People don't have a problem visiting China or buying products made in China. And Chinas economy is doing just fine.

[GatorB]

Originally Posted by kektex

Meanwhile, over 50 people are killed every single weekend here and the bastard criticizes Bush over the dead in Iraq....

That's a slow week in Detroit.

[CWeb]

Originally Posted by kektex

There has been a lot of infrastructure work here I have to admit, but when you take in to account that he has been in power for 8 years with the highest oil revenues in the history of the country, it amounts to nothing. What the hell do I care about a bridge or a highway when the hospitals dont have any beds?

Yep... can see your point. Smells like the usual govt inefficiency and lack of coordination.

Originally Posted by kektex

Corruption is rampant in PDVSA, the state owned oil company, and it´s starting to show in oil production numbers and in the international reserves.

Kinda normal in a state owned monopoly - once you open one file there is a can of worms and with each sheet of paper you touch - there is another can of worms underneath that ad nausea....

I like Venezuela - amazing place with plenty opportunties ahead. Suspect it will take time to stabilize - the killer is always poverty and where people may prefer to vote for more extreme candidates who may claim to be fighting on their behalf. It's the same trend in Nicaragua and a few other SA countries at the moment - and a backlash against historical interference in a number of these countries.

[kektex]

Originally Posted by GatorB

That's a slow week in Detroit.

I´m talking about a weekend not a week. From midnight friday to sunday at midnight.

[kektex]

Originally Posted by CWeb

Yep... can see your point. Smells like the usual govt inefficiency and lack of coordination.

Kinda normal in a state owned monopoly - once you open one file there is a can of worms and with each sheet of paper you touch - there is another can of worms underneath that ad nausea....

I like Venezuela - amazing place with plenty opportunties ahead. Suspect it will take time to stabilize - the killer is always poverty and where people may prefer to vote for more extreme candidates who may claim to be fighting on their behalf. It's the same trend in Nicaragua and a few other SA countries at the moment - and a backlash against historical interference in a number of these countries.

That is definitely what we are seeing here.A sector of the population that has been ignored feels identified by this guy that comes and talks to them about socialism and how everyone is going to be equal after they have been historically ignored,etc.
Ask anyone of those people what socialism is.Or why so many of their socialist leaders are now moving out of the barrios and in to the classiest and most expensive neighborhoods. Or why Chavez gets a $75million plane while the hospitals dont have any beds.
For some reason they are still blind to all of this.

[he-fox]

Originally Posted by kektex

That is definitely what we are seeing here.A sector of the population that has been ignored feels identified by this guy that comes and talks to them about socialism and how everyone is going to be equal after they have been historically ignored,etc.
Ask anyone of those people what socialism is.Or why so many of their socialist leaders are now moving out of the barrios and in to the classiest and most expensive neighborhoods. Or why Chavez gets a $75million plane while the hospitals dont have any beds.
For some reason they are still blind to all of this.

dude, run away while you still can.

mark my words.

[GrouchyAdmin]

Originally Posted by he-fox

dude, run away while you still can.

mark my words.

Hey man. Just wanted to say that it was great meeting you at Del Ray, and I owe you drinks next time we go out!

[he-fox]

Originally Posted by GrouchyAdmin

Hey man. Just wanted to say that it was great meeting you at Del Ray, and I owe you drinks next time we go out!

[kektex]

Originally Posted by he-fox

dude, run away while you still can.

mark my words.

I think about that every day.It´s so sad that I have to think about leaving the country I love because we ended up with a president that has no respect for people that do not agree with him and that his followers are as intolerant as him.

[juz]

Originally Posted by GatorB

Cuba's economy sucks because of the embargo. If there was no embargo Cuba's economy would be fine. Do you think most Americans would care about it being communist if they were allowed to vacation there? Do you think people would care about it being communist when they buy Cuban made products? People don't have a problem visiting China or buying products made in China. And Chinas economy is doing just fine.

Maybe so, but the Soviet Unions was a disaster, Chinas is not comparable to Cuba for several factors but lets start with the most obvious- population.

The short and sweet of it is that foreign oil companies are pulling out of VZ, and PDVSA does not have the technology or the money to step right in and take over. Even with the presence of China and India there is going to be a delay of 5-8 years to ramp E&P back to todays levels. VZ's product isn't like most crude, its extremely thick and hard to move, now toss in that the majority of the worlds refineries that can process it are in.. The USA.

So tell me what is going to happen to VZ's economy when their GDP is shit for 5-8 years?

[GatorB]

Originally Posted by kektex

I´m talking about a weekend not a week. From midnight friday to sunday at midnight.

Yeah you guys are only #4 in murder rate. Hell JAMAICA is ahead of you. Work harder at murder.

[GatorB]

Originally Posted by juz

Maybe so, but the Soviet Unions was a disaster, Chinas is not comparable to Cuba for several factors but lets start with the most obvious- population.

The fact that Cuba would become a tourist mecca if it was allowed and the fact is that if Cuban products were allowed to be bought by Americans there is ZERO doubt Cubas economy would be much greater. That was the whole point fo the the embargo in the first place, to cripple Cubas economy.

So tell me what is going to happen to VZ's economy when their GDP is shit for 5-8 years?

A better question to ask is if I give a shit, which I don't. Do think I care if some protestor puts a bullet is Chavez's brain? Nope.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by kektex

Chavez has just closed the oldest TV station in Venezuela and one of the most critical of his government.
How democratic of him... fucking idiot

Chavez is just the next Fidel Castro or Saddam in Training. Starts out as a "for the people" guy, then turns into a dictator. Nothing new it's happened many times in the past. Sad part is the people in his country can't see it coming.

[kektex]

Originally Posted by GatorB

Yeah you guys are only #4 in murder rate. Hell JAMAICA is ahead of you. Work harder at murder.

Well I was referring to your Detroit comment, not Jamaica.
And I dont see Jamaica´s PM trying to solve the problems of the world like Chavez is...

[CWeb]

Originally Posted by kektex

That is definitely what we are seeing here.A sector of the population that has been ignored feels identified by this guy that comes and talks to them about socialism and how everyone is going to be equal after they have been historically ignored,etc.
Ask anyone of those people what socialism is.Or why so many of their socialist leaders are now moving out of the barrios and in to the classiest and most expensive neighborhoods. Or why Chavez gets a $75million plane while the hospitals dont have any beds.
For some reason they are still blind to all of this.

Yep... the sales pitch always captures people with great promises for the future - they want to believe it, and agree, it is a kinda blindness and refusal to accept reality. It's the same on the extreme opposite of the political fence - a complete dumbing and inability to think.

It is a great pity Chavez removed RCTV's broadcasting license. Understand RCTV will still be available on cable tho the network infrastructure is being moved over to the new channel? Bill Phelps will be turning in his grave at the concept that any govt would shut RCTV down. It's not the case that they broadcast utter junk/propaganda, but one of the oldest and most respected broadcasters.

[juz]

Originally Posted by GatorB

The fact that Cuba would become a tourist mecca if it was allowed and the fact is that if Cuban products were allowed to be bought by Americans there is ZERO doubt Cubas economy would be much greater. That was the whole point fo the the embargo in the first place, to cripple Cubas economy.



A better question to ask is if I give a shit, which I don't. Do think I care if some protestor puts a bullet is Chavez's brain? Nope.

If you don't give a shit don't hit the quote and reply buttons

[kektex]

Originally Posted by CWeb

Yep... the sales pitch always captures people with great promises for the future - they want to believe it, and agree, it is a kinda blindness and refusal to accept reality. It's the same on the extreme opposite of the political fence - a complete dumbing and inability to think.

It is a great pity Chavez removed RCTV's broadcasting license. Understand RCTV will still be available on cable tho the network infrastructure is being moved over to the new channel? Bill Phelps will be turning in his grave at the concept that any govt would shut RCTV down. It's not the case that they broadcast utter junk/propaganda, but one of the oldest and most respected broadcasters.

They are working out deals with some of the cable companies so they can broadcast via cable. The thing is, that when you operate in a country where one man controls everything ,it´s not easy to get help.
Cable companies have been receiving pressure byt the government for some time already.

If broadcasting junk and propaganda was the real reason for shutting down RCTV then the government owned stations should have been shut down long ago. RCTV had the highest ratings of any TV station in the country (around 43%) for some reason.

[CWeb]

Originally Posted by kektex

They are working out deals with some of the cable companies so they can broadcast via cable. The thing is, that when you operate in a country where one man controls everything ,it´s not easy to get help.
Cable companies have been receiving pressure byt the government for some time already.

Good news And hope they do work out deals and spread that risk over a number of cable operators :-)

Seen all this crap before in another country where there was an element of "deviancy" and false claims about broadcasting licenses. Knew the people involved - they were honorable and genuine journalists. It took .. think 10 years and a series of court hearings/appeals, but - they got their broadcasting license returned and are now free to blast the govt to hell and back if they misbehave When broadcasts started again, it was amazing to listen to phone-in programming where the public were given an opportunity to speak or ask questions - they obviously loved being given a voice

Irrespective of Chavez's views or his revolution - messing with broadcasting, especially respected broadcasting, is a big mistake and karma has it's ways

There is the other side to broadcasting - basically propaganda for the brain dead (prob worst in the world outside China is alleged Fox News) - could not care less if they were junked. Let's hope Chavez's new station is not another broadcaster to the brain dead, with the only difference of political extremism from the other side of the fence.

[Sly]

Originally Posted by crockett

Chavez is just the next Fidel Castro or Saddam in Training. Starts out as a "for the people" guy, then turns into a dictator. Nothing new it's happened many times in the past. Sad part is the people in his country can't see it coming.

Hitler basically did the same thing. Brought the country out of the depression, put foods on tables and people were ready to follow that man anywhere... I can't blame them.

When you give a starving family food and drink, they're going to ignore what's taking a hit around the country. All of these poor people in the South America's see a little food and a little medicine and their Saviour has arrived.

[Sly]

What's up Webby? New nick?

[CWeb]

Originally Posted by Sly

Hitler basically did the same thing. Brought the country out of the depression, put foods on tables and people were ready to follow that man anywhere... I can't blame them.

When you give a starving family food and drink, they're going to ignore what's taking a hit around the country. All of these poor people in the South America's see a little food and a little medicine and their Saviour has arrived.

Exactly Sly - the Saviour has arrived

It's not just in Ven at the moment - there are similar scenarios in Peru, Boliva, Nicaragua, Chile etc. The root prob comes from poverty and also a degree of historical backlash from interference in these countries.

In many ways you can't blame them - they have walked that walk and been ignored. Some of their families have been murdered in the "South American Holocaust" and it's inevitable they will support any person who says he will stand up against this conduct and represent them.

Dunno what effect Chavez may have on Venezuela in the end - the national economy prob won't change - tho depends where the revenues are spent.

[Sly]

Originally Posted by CWeb

Exactly Sly - the Saviour has arrived

It's not just in Ven at the moment - there are similar scenarios in Peru, Boliva, Nicaragua, Chile etc. The root prob comes from poverty and also a degree of historical backlash from interference in these countries.

Right. All of those countries you listed have leftist leaders. They're all facing the same problem. This is case in point why the population of a country does not always know what's best for it.

I just want bananas.

[CWeb]

Originally Posted by Sly

I just want bananas.

No problemo - how many you want?

Kinda funny... normally supermarkets price product by barcode or whatever. The cost of bananas is just too cheap to even price and it's hardly even worth using good shelf space for them. You just throw some in a bag and pay little at the cashpoint - think around 2 cents each.

[kektex]

The students have taken over the protests and things are getting out of hand for the government! This is backfiring quickly on them internationally.

Their new tear gas hurts a lot! They made us run like three blocks with their fucking water trucks but in the end they gave up chasing and we took the streets again.The people threw stuff at the National Guard from the buildings and they had to back down.

[xxxdesign-net]

The US was pulling the strings at that station.. Its no secret that they want Chavez out.. If Iran was pulling the strings at NBC and pushing their propaganda, you think Bush wouldnt close it.. ?

[kektex]

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

The US was pulling the strings at that station.. Its no secret that they want Chavez out.. If Iran was pulling the strings at NBC and pushing their propaganda, you think Bush wouldnt close it.. ?

Did you know that the government has 6 tv stations?
With the closing down of RCTV there is only one TV station left that is critical of the Government.That says a lot about the freedom of speech here.

It´s also no secret that Fidel Castro (or what´s left of him) is controlling most of the country.What´s the difference with the supposed "US string-pulling" in this TV station?

[xxxdesign-net]

Originally Posted by kektex

Did you know that the government has 6 tv stations?
With the closing down of RCTV there is only one TV station left that is critical of the Government.That says a lot about the freedom of speech here.

It´s also no secret that Fidel Castro (or what´s left of him) is controlling most of the country.What´s the difference with the supposed "US string-pulling" in this TV station?

Fidel Castro the puppet master? LOL.. where the hell did you hear that?
As for as your question, can you rephrase it.. didnt understand..

[kektex]

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

Fidel Castro the puppet master? LOL.. where the hell did you hear that?
As for as your question, can you rephrase it.. didnt understand..

I didn´t hear it.My mother works in one of the ministries in the government. Every single meeting for the "revolution" has cubans running it. The cuban G2 is constantly offering intelligence services for the government.Fidel is Chavez´s inspiration and advisor.If you don´t know that you are not very well informed.

My question is: what is the difference between the supposed "U.S string pulling" behind this TV station and the obvious cuban interference in government issues?

If Bush closed down NBC would you stand for it?

[xxxdesign-net]

Originally Posted by kektex

I didn´t hear it.My mother works in one of the ministries in the government. Every single meeting for the "revolution" has cubans running it. The cuban G2 is constantly offering intelligence services for the government.Fidel is Chavez´s inspiration and advisor.If you don´t know that you are not very well informed.

My question is: what is the difference between the supposed "U.S string pulling" behind this TV station and the obvious cuban interference in government issues?

If Bush closed down NBC would you stand for it?

First off.. Castro doesnt have any power.. if Chavez wants cooperation with Cuba and use Fidel as his adviser, its because he chooses to.. and not the other way around.. And btw.. many countries are being informed by foreign intelligence services.. it happens all the time..

As for your question.. you are assuming that Cuba is pulling the strings.. which I dont believe.. Btw.. whats the difference between the relation between Cuba/Venezuella and Israel/US .. ?

[xxxdesign-net]

Originally Posted by kektex

If Bush closed down NBC would you stand for it?

If a hostile country to the US, that tried an unsuccessful coup against the president earlier and openly shared their intent to get rid of the guy, was, along with their secret services pulling the string at NBC and were continuously pushing propanga.. mmh.. I guess I would agree that it needs to be shut down..

[kektex]

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

First off.. Castro doesnt have any power.. if Chavez wants cooperation with Cuba and use Fidel as his adviser, its because he chooses to.. and not the other way around.. And btw.. many countries are being informed by foreign intelligence services.. it happens all the time..

Castro might not have any power right now that he is dying, but Chavez has said countless times that his first inspiration after Bolivar is Castro.
Castro has been trying to intervene in Latin America for ages.He sent his guerrillas during his 60´s/70´s and they even killed venezuelan troops and now we have to stand that this traitor Chavez brings them in to the country.
What good advice can Chavez get from a dictator that has held his country hostage for decades?
The Cuban G2 does not "inform" the venezuelan intelligence services.The intervene and operate here freely.The venezuelan intelligence department is called the DISIP.The DISIP is completely intervened by the cuban G2 .Once again, I´m not making this up.My mother works for the government and she´s seen it as have countless other family members and government employees.

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

As for your question.. you are assuming that Cuba is pulling the strings.. which I dont believe.. Btw.. whats the difference between the relation between Cuba/Venezuella and Israel/US .. ?

You are obviously not very well informed. The Venezuela/Cuba relationship is widely known.It´s not purely a commercial or diplomatic relationship.
If I was an israeli citizen I wouldn´t be happy at all about a foreign government intervening in government issues either.But since I am not, I can´t say anything about that.How do you feel about that relationship?

I think you are missing the point that Chavez is closing down any channels for disidence in the country.

[xxxdesign-net]

Originally Posted by kektex

You are obviously not very well informed. The Venezuela/Cuba relationship is widely known.It´s not purely a commercial or diplomatic relationship.
If I was an israeli citizen I wouldn´t be happy at all about a foreign government intervening in government issues either.But since I am not, I can´t say anything about that.How do you feel about that relationship?

lol.. I guess you're the one not very well informed...Israel has tremoundeous pull in the US government.. you know AIPAC? The US gives billions to Israel each year.. etc..

[kektex]

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

If a hostile country to the US, that tried an unsuccessful coup against the president earlier and openly shared their intent to get rid of the guy, was, along with their secret services pulling the string at NBC and were continuously pushing propanga.. mmh.. I guess I would agree that it needs to be shut down..

I have yet to see any solid evidence that the US had anything to do with the events of 2002. These "revolutionary" leaders always need to blame the US and imperialism for all the problems , to arouse poor people´s nationalism.
I also have yet to see any evidence that the US was pulling the strings at RCTV.There were some papers that surfaced last week about some of the reporters receving grants from U.S organizations but that´s it.
RCTV was hardly "continuously pushing propaganda". Most of their programming consists of soap operas and entertainment shows.
What the government didnt like was one of the morning shows with one of the most critical reporters and the evening news for showing the population the constant corruption and huge problem with crime in the country.

Chavez closed it and now we only have one news station reporting on what´s going on.
During all the protests yesterday this was the only station that reported what was going on in the streets.

[12clicks]

Originally Posted by kektex

Chavez has just closed the oldest TV station in Venezuela and one of the most critical of his government.
How democratic of him... fucking idiot

wait, wait, don't you understand? Bush is the dictator! Chavez is a man of the people!

[kektex]

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

lol.. I guess you're the one not very well informed...Israel has tremoundeous pull in the US government.. you know AIPAC? The US gives billions to Israel each year.. etc..

That´s the point....I´m not an israeli or US citizen so I don´t care.It´s your choice if you want to stand for it.
I choose not to stand for cuban intervention in Venezuela and the closing down of one of the two independent TV stations here.

[xxxdesign-net]

Originally Posted by kektex

I have yet to see any solid evidence that the US had anything to do with the events of 2002. These "revolutionary" leaders always need to blame the US and imperialism for all the problems , to arouse poor people´s nationalism.
I also have yet to see any evidence that the US was pulling the strings at RCTV.There were some papers that surfaced last week about some of the reporters receving grants from U.S organizations but that´s it.
RCTV was hardly "continuously pushing propaganda". Most of their programming consists of soap operas and entertainment shows.
What the government didnt like was one of the morning shows with one of the most critical reporters and the evening news for showing the population the constant corruption and huge problem with crime in the country.

Chavez closed it and now we only have one news station reporting on what´s going on.
During all the protests yesterday this was the only station that reported what was going on in the streets.

I have yet to see any evidences that someone can juggle with 10 balls.. So what? lol .. Do better research you'll find some..

[kektex]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

wait, wait, don't you understand? Bush is the dictator! Chavez is a man of the people!

That´s what gets me about these seudo-leftists. Just because they hate Bush and Chavez is constantly insulting Bush then: Chavez=good guy

Dont get me wrong. I dont agree with most of the stuff Bush does but I dont see him closing TV stations critical of the government and constantly sending his armed circles to terrorize journalists.

[kektex]

Originally Posted by xxxdesign-net

I have yet to see any evidences that someone can juggle with 10 balls.. So what? lol .. Do better research you'll find some..

I live here.I am constantly bombarded by the government propaganda about it which is far form objective.I was there during the april events and saw people getting shot.
What is your evidence? The government paid websites?