Intelligent Design

[MarkTiarra]

No I'm not speaking about web site design, I mean the alternative "theory" presented by some people as to the origins of life. Just saw this whole 2 hour PBS thing about that old case in Penn.

What I want to know is how in the fuck anyone can believe this dribble? Even a couple of the people who sat through the case still want to believe it. Are people that afraid to die that they'll take whatever some book or some other people feed them so they can tell themselves it'll all be okay?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

[Mutt]

yep - that's the core of all religions - fear of death and fear of life, fairy tales aren't just for children.

[WarChild]

I don't believe in any organized religon or god but i'm not so ignorant to think that I have all the answers.

Let's face it, the universe is a highly organize system. Just Earth alone is pretty amazing when you consider it.

It's possible there's a higher power, or a collective intelligence formed from the energy that leaves humans when they die. How can we really know?

All I'm pretty sure about is that no human religion has got it right so far.

[D]

Yeah, that was a pretty decent episode of Nova.

Thankfully, we have organizations like the ACLU to pick up the torch in those cases, and do what needs to get done.

[BradM]

Yep, if you talk to the average Christian American (usually an overweight idiot) you would be frightened at how little they actually know about their own religion let alone any other option in life when it comes to design or religion or evolution.

I even got one to admit they believe in evolution (only micro evolution tho, since adam and eve where white and so how did blacks get here? well MICRO evolution of course, but the rest is all gods work)

Total insanity.

PS do not get me started on mormons or scientologists

[jollyperv]

We need a futurist president asap

[MarkTiarra]

Originally Posted by WarChild

I don't believe in any organized religon or god but i'm not so ignorant to think that I have all the answers.

Let's face it, the universe is a highly organize system. Just Earth alone is pretty amazing when you consider it.

It's possible there's a higher power, or a collective intelligence formed from the energy that leaves humans when they die. How can we really know?

All I'm pretty sure about is that no human religion has got it right so far.

I agree there might be some overwhelming intelligence in the infinite "the Tao that can be names is not the eternal Tao" kind of way. But for them to ignore heaps of empirical evidence about evolution of this earth's organisms is just amazing to me.

[MarkTiarra]

Originally Posted by BradM

Yep, if you talk to the average Christian American (usually an overweight idiot) you would be frightened at how little they actually know about their own religion let alone any other option in life when it comes to design or religion or evolution.

I even got one to admit they believe in evolution (only micro evolution tho, since adam and eve where white and so how did blacks get here? well MICRO evolution of course, but the rest is all gods work)

Total insanity.

PS do not get me started on mormons or scientologists

Oh yeah man that gets me too. How little of their own religion and history they know. It's like a lazy man's approach to life. "Mommy and daddy will tell me the whole truth and I don't have to figure out anything for myself."

[daveydude]

I read an interesting article by a British philosopher who argues that we are most likely living in a simulation run by a future civilisation - Matrix style. If you assume that future civilisations have vast computing power, and they have the will & the means to run realistic computer simulations of past civilisations, then it follows that the number of simulated humans would vastly outnumber the real ones at any point in time. They'd only have to have one "sim reality" running to make it a 50/50 chance that we're all artificial. If they had a lot of these simulations running at once (imagine the number of people playing The Sims right now for example), then it's highly probable that nothing is real!

So I'm torn between that and aetheism :D

[daveydude]

Has anyone been to the Creation Museum? I would LOVE to go but I think I'd be laughing too much to actually get round the whole thing.

http://web.mit.edu/gjordan/www/creat.../_DSC2403.html

And now for Ricky Gervais on Creationism...
https://youtube.com/watch?v=NaEj3g5GOYA

[BradM]

Originally Posted by daveydude

Has anyone been to the Creation Museum? I would LOVE to go but I think I'd be laughing too much to actually get round the whole thing.

http://web.mit.edu/gjordan/www/creat.../_DSC2403.html

And now for Ricky Gervais on Creationism...
https://youtube.com/watch?v=NaEj3g5GOYA

Evolutionists may have dates wrong and may be off here and there as they discover new evidence, but to say that dinosaurs existed 4,350 years ago seems like mental retardation to me.

[yumma]

people always have a choice...

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by MarkTiarra

No I'm not speaking about web site design, I mean the alternative "theory" presented by some people as to the origins of life. Just saw this whole 2 hour PBS thing about that old case in Penn.

What I want to know is how in the fuck anyone can believe this dribble? Even a couple of the people who sat through the case still want to believe it. Are people that afraid to die that they'll take whatever some book or some other people feed them so they can tell themselves it'll all be okay?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

why shouldn't you beleive something is possible if that something can't be proven not to be possible?

i would suggest that on the basis of simple reason and logic, you are more irrational than they are.

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by MarkTiarra

No I'm not speaking about web site design, I mean the alternative "theory" presented by some people as to the origins of life. Just saw this whole 2 hour PBS thing about that old case in Penn.

What I want to know is how in the fuck anyone can believe this dribble? Even a couple of the people who sat through the case still want to believe it. Are people that afraid to die that they'll take whatever some book or some other people feed them so they can tell themselves it'll all be okay?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

here's an interesting example: take your watch apart and put the pieces in a box, now shake that box until the watch goes back together. -bmb

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by WarChild

I don't believe in any organized religon or god but i'm not so ignorant to think that I have all the answers.

Let's face it, the universe is a highly organize system. Just Earth alone is pretty amazing when you consider it.

It's possible there's a higher power, or a collective intelligence formed from the energy that leaves humans when they die. How can we really know?

All I'm pretty sure about is that no human religion has got it right so far.

how about this: apple trees produce apples, i.e. they 'apple'. the universe 'peoples'

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by MarkTiarra

I agree there might be some overwhelming intelligence in the infinite "the Tao that can be names is not the eternal Tao" kind of way. But for them to ignore heaps of empirical evidence about evolution of this earth's organisms is just amazing to me.

the idea of "intelligent design" does not discount the obvious existence of evolution

[TheLegacy]

I for one do not believe in man made religion - though I do believe in a God. I've just seen too much in my life to know its fake. Trust and believe what you want - or not... I personally know from experience that there is something else out there beyond our understanding.

[J. Falcon]

Originally Posted by MarkTiarra

No I'm not speaking about web site design, I mean the alternative "theory" presented by some people as to the origins of life. Just saw this whole 2 hour PBS thing about that old case in Penn.

What I want to know is how in the fuck anyone can believe this dribble? Even a couple of the people who sat through the case still want to believe it. Are people that afraid to die that they'll take whatever some book or some other people feed them so they can tell themselves it'll all be okay?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

I saw that same show you did and then, just like you, I came to GFY and made a thread about it:

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=757732



LOL!

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by TheLegacy

I personally know from experience that there is something else out there beyond our understanding.

"our" understanding?
or "your" understanding?

how do we know the world is "complex" as others like to say? we don't. complex compared to what? the other 75,000 inhabited planets we are comparing it to? ... i must have skipped the day in school where these comparison studies happened.



we are all just dumb fucking monkeys fumbling through life, devoting most of our time to eating, fucking, sleeping and convincing our own selves that its all not without meaning.

meanwhile, the world keeps spinnning on its axis.. and somewhere in the blackness, the universe is watching this and quietly weeping

[J. Falcon]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

"

meanwhile, the world keeps spinnning on its axis.. and somewhere in the blackness, the universe is watching this and quietly weeping

Your words touched me.

[daveydude]

Originally Posted by bm bradley

here's an interesting example: take your watch apart and put the pieces in a box, now shake that box until the watch goes back together. -bmb

That's not interesting because it's not how evolution works. Evolution doesn't just cause things to spring into being - it's a long drawn out process of natural selection.

[daveydude]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

why shouldn't you beleive something is possible if that something can't be proven not to be possible?

You can't, but you can hypothesise that given the lack of ANY evidence, some things are highly likely to be impossible, and direct your belief toward things that are more likely.

i would suggest that on the basis of simple reason and logic, you are more irrational than they are.

By that argument, it's rational to worship the Flying Spaghetti Monster, because you can't PROVE He doesnt exist.

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by daveydude

You can't, but you can hypothesise that given the lack of ANY evidence, some things are highly likely to be impossible, and direct your belief toward things that are more likely.

and who decides what is "more likely"? and based on what evidence? its all subjective reasoning.

By that argument, it's rational to worship the Flying Spaghetti Monster, because you can't PROVE He doesnt exist.

no... i am saying its no less rational or reasonable to worship the Flying Spaghetti Monster as the creator of the universe because you can't disprove it, nor can you prove its less likely.

[WarChild]

Originally Posted by bm bradley

here's an interesting example: take your watch apart and put the pieces in a box, now shake that box until the watch goes back together. -bmb

No, that's a perfect illustration of one of the laws of thermodynamics: Order never increases in a closed set.

Another one would be that if you piled lumber, nails and a hammer on your lawn, no matter how long you waited, it would never build its self in to a shed.

[DaddyHalbucks]

"Intelligent Design" is just a some fancy new window dresssing, a re-naming of that old discredited non-sense called "Creationism."

[Porn Farmer]

Originally Posted by WarChild

No, that's a perfect illustration of one of the laws of thermodynamics: Order never increases in a closed set.

Another one would be that if you piled lumber, nails and a hammer on your lawn, no matter how long you waited, it would never build its self in to a shed.

Yeah, except the Earth is not a closed system. There is a constant stream of energy from the sun.

[WarChild]

Originally Posted by Porn Farmer

Yeah, except the Earth is not a closed system. There is a constant stream of energy from the sun.

No, Earth is not a closed system. But what he was describing was.

[LadyMischief]

I think Frances Crick had a better idea :P

[MarkTiarra]

Originally Posted by daveydude

You can't, but you can hypothesise that given the lack of ANY evidence, some things are highly likely to be impossible, and direct your belief toward things that are more likely.



By that argument, it's rational to worship the Flying Spaghetti Monster, because you can't PROVE He doesnt exist.

As usual you said it better than I could have. =] I will add that if you get right down to it what can truly be disproven or or proven. All reality seems to be subjective on some level. But here we are talking over the Internet on computers using electricity all made possible by people who work off logic based on things experimentally proven (or disproven) over time. There is a stack of evidence supporting evolution as big as the stack that backs the science that makes these computers work. There is NO evidence to support creationism and many pieces of evidence that refute it.

[MarkTiarra]

Originally Posted by J. Falcon

I saw that same show you did and then, just like you, I came to GFY and made a thread about it:

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=757732



LOL!

Happens all to often here. =]

[Shaze]

Here's something to think about:

Why can't we just say that the "higher being" is doing intelligent design through "evolution". Maybe evolution is part of creation!

[who]

We are living in a computer simulation.

http://www.simulation-argument.com/simulation.html

[million]

Originally Posted by daveydude

I read an interesting article by a British philosopher who argues that we are most likely living in a simulation run by a future civilisation - Matrix style. If you assume that future civilisations have vast computing power, and they have the will & the means to run realistic computer simulations of past civilisations, then it follows that the number of simulated humans would vastly outnumber the real ones at any point in time. They'd only have to have one "sim reality" running to make it a 50/50 chance that we're all artificial. If they had a lot of these simulations running at once (imagine the number of people playing The Sims right now for example), then it's highly probable that nothing is real!

So I'm torn between that and aetheism :D

and is that a philosopher? sounds like spielberg to me

[MarkTiarra]

Originally Posted by Shaze

Here's something to think about:

Why can't we just say that the "higher being" is doing intelligent design through "evolution". Maybe evolution is part of creation!

I have no disagreement there. What I did disagree with was the content of this particular "Intelligent Design" case which was just creationism repackaged. They had the whole world at 4000 years old. This isn't some philsophical debate on if there is an ultimate ad infinite intelligent source... it's if the book of Genesis version of that belongs being taught in science class.

[V_RocKs]

My brother in law just went the Christ road... It is funny because around me he hangs his head down low because he was so against it before. But then his Christ centered wife (my sister) wanted to leave him so she could develop a Christ centered relationship...

Fucking kids these days.... they never learn.

[ichauch]

The fact that they made a trial in court out of this question tells you the insanity of the whole story.

Christians scare me. They sit in the highest positions and believe in total man-made crap.

[justFred]

Originally Posted by WarChild

I don't believe in any organized religon or god but i'm not so ignorant to think that I have all the answers.

Let's face it, the universe is a highly organize system. Just Earth alone is pretty amazing when you consider it.

It's possible there's a higher power, or a collective intelligence formed from the energy that leaves humans when they die. How can we really know?

All I'm pretty sure about is that no human religion has got it right so far.

normally I shake my head at your posts but not this one,

[BlueDesignStudios]

it's a fucking crazy world!!

[drjones]

Originally Posted by Shaze

Here's something to think about:

Why can't we just say that the "higher being" is doing intelligent design through "evolution". Maybe evolution is part of creation!

Most catholics believe just that. The crazies are the evangelicals/fundamentalists who are biblical literalists. They think the bible (including genesis) is literally true, word for word. World was created in 6 days, adam and eve, etc etc. Because they wont budge on their crazy interpretation of the bible, they dont have any wiggle room to believe anything else, or incorporate science that may contradict parts of the bible into their worldview.

[Fletch XXX]

Intelligent Design is not even debated within the scientific community, they realize it is not true and only promoted by christians trying to get it taught in public school.

"A key strategy of the intelligent design movement is convincing the general public that there is a debate among scientists about whether life evolved, in order to convince the public, politicians and cultural leaders that schools should "teach the controversy".[118] There is no such debate, however, within the scientific community;"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_design

pay attention to last line.

and it continues...

"Intelligent design is widely viewed as a stalking horse for its proponents' campaign against what they say is the materialist foundation of science, which they argue leaves no room for the possibility of God.

[daveydude]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

and who decides what is "more likely"? and based on what evidence? its all subjective reasoning.

no... i am saying its no less rational or reasonable to worship the Flying Spaghetti Monster as the creator of the universe because you can't disprove it, nor can you prove its less likely.

I have some magic beans for sale, $1000 each. Can I put you down for 100? ;)