Anyone into Audio (Voice) recording / editing on a PC - GoFuckYourself.com

jay23 · 12-07-2007, 03:54 PM

I need to record high quality (CD or high) voice. A Mic with a sound card did the job in the past but wanted to move to the next step in quality. So here is what I did

I bought a M-Audio Firewire-410

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_u...e410-main.html

And a Shure Microphone (Model 8900)

The problems

1. I thought the M-Audio device will let me monitor the recoding live using a head phone, I cant find a way to do it.

2. May be I made a bad choice in Microphone, unless I talk loud the voice quality is very quite, even if the Gain o the M-Audio device is turned to full.

Should I buy Condenser Microphone ? Some thing like RODE NT1A Cardioid ?

What other options I should look at. The key criteria is to get pure voice (no instruments) in to digital form

Thanks

Jay

thehand · 12-07-2007, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay23

I need to record high quality (CD or high) voice. A Mic with a sound card did the job in the past but wanted to move to the next step in quality. So here is what I did

I bought a M-Audio Firewire-410

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_u...e410-main.html

And a Shure Microphone (Model 8900)

The problems

1. I thought the M-Audio device will let me monitor the recoding live using a head phone, I cant find a way to do it.

2. May be I made a bad choice in Microphone, unless I talk loud the voice quality is very quite, even if the Gain o the M-Audio device is turned to full.

Should I buy Condenser Microphone ? Some thing like RODE NT1A Cardioid ?

What other options I should look at. The key criteria is to get pure voice (no instruments) in to digital form

Thanks

Jay

What recording software are you using & did you install the M-Audio Drivers?

JohnnyJames · 12-07-2007, 04:38 PM

The Firewire interface really only serves the purpose of getting the audio into the computer, and has little to do with controlling the kinds of things that make the audio "sound" good.

Assuming you are looking for a very "large" sound (like the sort of clean and precise recordings on albums or television, you probably want to research actual pre-amps as opposed to Firewire interdaces:

http://aphex.com/204.htm

Is a popular model for VO recording.

There are literally hundreds of similar products, whose goal is to capture sound clean and big without distortion.

Your mic will work for this, but needs to have the proper preamp on the front end (between mic and Firewire interface).

There are software programs that can do similar results, but you run a much higher risk of introducing digital distortion or audio artifacts if you send an uncontrolled voice signal directly to most Firewire interfaces.

For purposes of VO audio, especially, the "pre-amps" listed as part of the Firewire specs really mean nothing.

Run a search on mic pre amps for more.

The king of microphones are the large capsule Neumann condenser mics.

These are used on probably 70% of all major hit records in the last 50 years and range in price from a few hundred bucks to over 20k.

Good luck.

And don't skimp on the cables. They do make a difference.

jay23 · 12-07-2007, 04:46 PM

I instaleld the M-Audio drives and even talked to their Tech support. They want me to go and get a beeter mic, A condenser mic with XLR cabel.

Jay

jollyperv · 12-07-2007, 05:00 PM

You don't need a separate preamp, that thing has them built into it. I've got an maudio 1010lt and the preamps built into it boost the signal more than enough.

jollyperv · 12-07-2007, 05:02 PM

You can get a good, cheap but decent quality large diaphram condenser microphone that's designed as a vocal mic, just plug it in, turn on the phantom power on your maudio and crank the gain, but don't clip the signal (over 0db) or you'll get pops and clicks that you can't get rid of.

http://www.zzounds.com/item--MSEV57M

Boobzooka · 12-07-2007, 08:22 PM

Reality check: You have a cheap convertor with low budget built in preamps and (I'm assuming) an untreated recording space. Combine that with any cheap condenser mic and you've completed the Axis Of Crap.

I'm not suggesting you need to spend thousands of dollars to get a professional sound either. A Neumann won't solve your problems. A condenser can only sound as good as your room and your preamp and your converters. You don't just want to record all the hiss and computer noise and bad reflections more accurately.

The best purchase you could make given the current level of your equipment would be to pick up a Shure SM7b. The SM7b is a top quality dynamic marketed towards the radio crowd, but it's also been used as the main vocal mic on many hit albums, if that helps sell it to you. It's a "secret weapon" in the recording world and shouldn't be confused with cheaper but better known Shure offerings like the SM57/58 which IMO are over-rated. Your M-Audio box has 66db of gain, which should be just enough.

Don't let the affordable price fool you. When I was demoing gear, I picked the SM7b over 3 different Neumann models (and other equally expensive brands). It was much better at hiding what you don't want to hear and improving what you do. Though I recommend NOT using the foam cover. (no need to tear it, it comes off from the ring at the base with a bit of force)

JohnnyJames · 12-07-2007, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DareRing

Reality check: You have a cheap convertor with low budget built in preamps and (I'm assuming) an untreated recording space. Combine that with any cheap condenser mic and you've completed the Axis Of Crap.

I'm not suggesting you need to spend thousands of dollars to get a professional sound either. A Neumann won't solve your problems. A condenser can only sound as good as your room and your preamp and your converters. You don't just want to record all the hiss and computer noise and bad reflections more accurately.

The best purchase you could make given the current level of your equipment would be to pick up a Shure SM7b. The SM7b is a top quality dynamic marketed towards the radio crowd, but it's also been used as the main vocal mic on many hit albums, if that helps sell it to you. It's a "secret weapon" in the recording world and shouldn't be confused with cheaper but better known Shure offerings like the SM57/58 which IMO are over-rated. Your M-Audio box has 66db of gain, which should be just enough.

Don't let the affordable price fool you. When I was demoing gear, I picked the SM7b over 3 different Neumann models (and other equally expensive brands). It was much better at hiding what you don't want to hear and improving what you do. Though I recommend NOT using the foam cover. (no need to tear it, it comes off from the ring at the base with a bit of force)

This is good advice.

You can also get away with not treating a room acoustically if you know what you are doing.

Most software suites for audio come with "gating" programs. These can be your saviour and remove all unwanted noise and artifacts, if you spend a little time to get to know them.

The "pre amps" on your firewire interface are not your friend, though, and never believe they are. They serve one purpose-to get audio into the computer. The audio must be decent to begin with.

Shit in=shit out.

I own a stack of Neumanns, Shures, Senheuser, Rode and a bunch of other microphones, so I tend to be an arrogant prick about some of them.

Apologies if I came off that way.

I also have a Shure SM7, the original, and it has a sparkly clean sound.

Check for phantom power requirements, and check for gain settings. Some mics will work only if their impedance matches the gear it is being sent to.

It sounds complicated but really isn't. Hit a couple pro audio forums and you should lick the problem fast. It might be as simple as flipping one button.

jay23 · 12-07-2007, 09:13 PM

Thanks for the advice on Mics guys. Now I just need to see if the M-Audio was a waste of money and if I should go and get some thing else. M-Audio has a gain controle but still what ever I talk on the current mic sounds a quite, even if I set the gain to Max.

All I am trying to do is record voice into a digital format, no need for multi track input / MIDI etc etc.

12-07-2007, 03:54 PM	#1
jay23 Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1,444	Anyone into Audio (Voice) recording / editing on a PC I need to record high quality (CD or high) voice. A Mic with a sound card did the job in the past but wanted to move to the next step in quality. So here is what I did I bought a M-Audio Firewire-410 http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_u...e410-main.html And a Shure Microphone (Model 8900) The problems 1. I thought the M-Audio device will let me monitor the recoding live using a head phone, I cant find a way to do it. 2. May be I made a bad choice in Microphone, unless I talk loud the voice quality is very quite, even if the Gain o the M-Audio device is turned to full. Should I buy Condenser Microphone ? Some thing like RODE NT1A Cardioid ? What other options I should look at. The key criteria is to get pure voice (no instruments) in to digital form Thanks Jay

12-07-2007, 05:02 PM	#6
jollyperv Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 3,927	You can get a good, cheap but decent quality large diaphram condenser microphone that's designed as a vocal mic, just plug it in, turn on the phantom power on your maudio and crank the gain, but don't clip the signal (over 0db) or you'll get pops and clicks that you can't get rid of. http://www.zzounds.com/item--MSEV57M Last edited by jollyperv; 12-07-2007 at 05:04 PM..

12-07-2007, 08:22 PM	#7
Boobzooka Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: BOOBZOOKA.COM Posts: 626	Reality check: You have a cheap convertor with low budget built in preamps and (I'm assuming) an untreated recording space. Combine that with any cheap condenser mic and you've completed the Axis Of Crap. I'm not suggesting you need to spend thousands of dollars to get a professional sound either. A Neumann won't solve your problems. A condenser can only sound as good as your room and your preamp and your converters. You don't just want to record all the hiss and computer noise and bad reflections more accurately. The best purchase you could make given the current level of your equipment would be to pick up a Shure SM7b. The SM7b is a top quality dynamic marketed towards the radio crowd, but it's also been used as the main vocal mic on many hit albums, if that helps sell it to you. It's a "secret weapon" in the recording world and shouldn't be confused with cheaper but better known Shure offerings like the SM57/58 which IMO are over-rated. Your M-Audio box has 66db of gain, which should be just enough. Don't let the affordable price fool you. When I was demoing gear, I picked the SM7b over 3 different Neumann models (and other equally expensive brands). It was much better at hiding what you don't want to hear and improving what you do. Though I recommend NOT using the foam cover. (no need to tear it, it comes off from the ring at the base with a bit of force) __________________ BOOBZOOKA: Amateur Affiliate Program featuring SellYourSexTape: Real couples document their lovelife for one week. HerBedroomWindow: Girls recording themselves alone at home. \| DareRing: "Truth Or Dare?" themed adult party games.

12-07-2007, 04:38 PM	#3
JohnnyJames Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 621	The Firewire interface really only serves the purpose of getting the audio into the computer, and has little to do with controlling the kinds of things that make the audio "sound" good. Assuming you are looking for a very "large" sound (like the sort of clean and precise recordings on albums or television, you probably want to research actual pre-amps as opposed to Firewire interdaces: http://aphex.com/204.htm Is a popular model for VO recording. There are literally hundreds of similar products, whose goal is to capture sound clean and big without distortion. Your mic will work for this, but needs to have the proper preamp on the front end (between mic and Firewire interface). There are software programs that can do similar results, but you run a much higher risk of introducing digital distortion or audio artifacts if you send an uncontrolled voice signal directly to most Firewire interfaces. For purposes of VO audio, especially, the "pre-amps" listed as part of the Firewire specs really mean nothing. Run a search on mic pre amps for more. The king of microphones are the large capsule Neumann condenser mics. These are used on probably 70% of all major hit records in the last 50 years and range in price from a few hundred bucks to over 20k. Good luck. And don't skimp on the cables. They do make a difference.

12-07-2007, 04:46 PM	#4
jay23 Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1,444	I instaleld the M-Audio drives and even talked to their Tech support. They want me to go and get a beeter mic, A condenser mic with XLR cabel. Jay

12-07-2007, 05:00 PM	#5
jollyperv Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 3,927	You don't need a separate preamp, that thing has them built into it. I've got an maudio 1010lt and the preamps built into it boost the signal more than enough.

12-07-2007, 09:13 PM	#9
jay23 Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1,444	Thanks for the advice on Mics guys. Now I just need to see if the M-Audio was a waste of money and if I should go and get some thing else. M-Audio has a gain controle but still what ever I talk on the current mic sounds a quite, even if I set the gain to Max. All I am trying to do is record voice into a digital format, no need for multi track input / MIDI etc etc.