Republicans are irrelevant

[Snake Doctor]

Word
http://thehill.com/markos-moulitsas/...009-02-10.html

[IllTestYourGirls]

Keep giving the government more power and porn on the internet will be a thing of the past. I dont get why left wing nutjobs cant understand that.

[Khulan]

Republicans all suck!

[Snake Doctor]

IllTestYourGirls
This message is hidden because IllTestYourGirls is on your ignore list.

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls

Keep giving the government more power and porn on the internet will be a thing of the past. I dont get why left wing nutjobs cant understand that.

Why didnt YOU understand that when you were pulling that lever for Dubya???????

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

Why didnt YOU understand that when you were pulling that lever for Dubya???????

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

Why didnt YOU understand that when you were pulling that lever for Dubya???????

Yeah, the Internet sucks now without porn. Fuck Bush

//No I didn't vote for him. Just sayin'...

[Agent 488]

geithner is an ideologically blinded idiot and wall street stooge and obama was an idiot for picking him - sorry, but you are fucked.

welcome to america's "lost decade."

[xanx]

The Republicans have done more to kill porn then any Dem could ever do, .. They spout less government, but that's not even close to how they act. They want less government in the things that are important to them! The Republicans are 120% for total government intervention in adult. Bet on it.

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by xanx

The Republicans have done more to kill porn then any Dem could ever do, .. They spout less government, but that's not even close to how they act. They want less government in the things that are important to them! The Republicans are 120% for total government intervention in adult. Bet on it.

Both sides want to run our lives. I am not taking sides. Fuck Republicans and Fuck Democrats.

[$5 submissions]

Originally Posted by budsbabes

welcome to america's "lost decade."

It's too soon to tell. Give it a few more years and a few more stimulus bills/bailouts. If, after stimulus 4, we're still fuxor3d, then yeah, call it a lost decade. Japan had a shitload of stimulus bills and it didn't do shit. Plus they have a higher savings rate than the US.

[IllTestYourGirls]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

Why didnt YOU understand that when you were pulling that lever for Dubya???????

I didnt vote for Bush or McCain. Unlike some brainwashed sheep I understand there are more than two parties to vote for. Some of those parties would bring REAL change, not this bull shit charade.

[LiveDose]

Both parties suck.

[Snake Doctor]

Originally Posted by $5 submissions

It's too soon to tell. Give it a few more years and a few more stimulus bills/bailouts. If, after stimulus 4, we're still fuxor3d, then yeah, call it a lost decade. Japan had a shitload of stimulus bills and it didn't do shit. Plus they have a higher savings rate than the US.

Their problem mainly was that they cut spending in other areas in order to fund the stimulus bills, so the net effect on the economy was close to zero.

Japan waited 17 months to cut interest rates, and it wasn't until 5 years in that they got them below 0.5%.

Plus, they didn't have "mark to market" accounting, so the banks never wrote down the massive real estate losses in a timely manner....they kept those loans on the books at full value for way too long and that's one of the reasons their credit market took so long to recover.

[pocketkangaroo]

What's up with the daily talking points?

[pocketkangaroo]

The funny thing is that Democrats cried when Republicans shut them out of policy. Both sides are hypocrites. No such thing as "change" in Congress.

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

Their problem mainly was that they cut spending in other areas in order to fund the stimulus bills, so the net effect on the economy was close to zero.

Japan waited 17 months to cut interest rates, and it wasn't until 5 years in that they got them below 0.5%.

Plus, they didn't have "mark to market" accounting, so the banks never wrote down the massive real estate losses in a timely manner....they kept those loans on the books at full value for way too long and that's one of the reasons their credit market took so long to recover.

So if Japan handled it like the US is now how you think things would have been better?

[Snake Doctor]

Originally Posted by Ethersync

So if Japan handled it like the US is now how you think things would have been better?

Based on what we know from Japan's lost decade and the great depression....what we're doing now (quantitative easing of the money supply by the fed and deficit spending by the federal government) is the right thing....even if it offends someone's conservative sensibilities.

George Soros had a really good explanation for this.

The bursting of bubbles causes credit contraction, the forced liquidation of assets, deflation and wealth destruction that may reach catastrophic proportions. In a deflationary environment, the weight of accumulated debt can sink the banking system and push the economy into depression. That is what needs to be prevented at all costs.

It can be done ? by creating money to offset the contraction of credit, recapitalising the banking system and writing off or down the accumulated debt in an orderly manner. They require radical and unorthodox policy measures. For best results, the three processes should be combined.

If these measures were successful and credit started to expand, deflationary pressures would be replaced by the spectre of inflation and the authorities would have to drain the excess money supply from the economy almost as fast as they had pumped it in. There is no way to escape from a far-from-equilibrium situation ? global deflation and depression ? except by first inducing its opposite and then reducing it.

The republicans aren't pissed about the "spending", they're pissed about what the spending is for. If they were in charge, we'd still have a stimulus bill and it would be about the same size, but the money would go to building Army bases instead of building schools....and that's the flat out 100% truth.
Of course the money is being spent on things democrats like, the democrats have large majorities in the legislature and have the White House.


Complaining about what problems we might cause with these policies (i.e. inflation, devaluation of the dollar, rewarding irresponsible past behavior, etc) is like complaining about the known side effects of the heart attack medicine that's needed to save your life.
You can not take your medicine to avoid the side effects, but the end result would be much worse than taking the medicine and living with the side effects.

[tony286]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

Based on what we know from Japan's lost decade and the great depression....what we're doing now (quantitative easing of the money supply by the fed and deficit spending by the federal government) is the right thing....even if it offends someone's conservative sensibilities.

George Soros had a really good explanation for this.



The republicans aren't pissed about the "spending", they're pissed about what the spending is for. If they were in charge, we'd still have a stimulus bill and it would be about the same size, but the money would go to building Army bases instead of building schools....and that's the flat out 100% truth.
Of course the money is being spent on things democrats like, the democrats have large majorities in the legislature and have the White House.


Complaining about what problems we might cause with these policies (i.e. inflation, devaluation of the dollar, rewarding irresponsible past behavior, etc) is like complaining about the known side effects of the heart attack medicine that's needed to save your life.
You can not take your medicine to avoid the side effects, but the end result would be much worse than taking the medicine and living with the side effects.

well said len

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

Based on what we know from Japan's lost decade and the great depression....what we're doing now (quantitative easing of the money supply by the fed and deficit spending by the federal government) is the right thing....even if it offends someone's conservative sensibilities.

George Soros had a really good explanation for this.

The republicans aren't pissed about the "spending", they're pissed about what the spending is for. If they were in charge, we'd still have a stimulus bill and it would be about the same size, but the money would go to building Army bases instead of building schools....and that's the flat out 100% truth.
Of course the money is being spent on things democrats like, the democrats have large majorities in the legislature and have the White House.


Complaining about what problems we might cause with these policies (i.e. inflation, devaluation of the dollar, rewarding irresponsible past behavior, etc) is like complaining about the known side effects of the heart attack medicine that's needed to save your life.
You can not take your medicine to avoid the side effects, but the end result would be much worse than taking the medicine and living with the side effects.

You seem to assume that is someone does not agree with what the current administration is doing then they are Republicans. For the record I am not a Republican and I did not agree with the bailout that happened when Bush was in power.

I am sure you are right that the Republicans would be doing something similar if they were in power. That does not make it right.

What you are talking about has never worked in the history of mankind. You are telling us we should trust the people that fucked everything up to successfully pull off something that has been attempted and has always failed in the past.

There is no way to avoid a Depression any longer. That is an inevitability.

This is going to fail and people will be more hurt because of it. You seem to think the US can make as much money as it wants and burying ourselves in more debt is going to fix the problem of too much debt in the system.

I am glad you feel things are under control. I hope you are right.

[pocketkangaroo]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

Complaining about what problems we might cause with these policies (i.e. inflation, devaluation of the dollar, rewarding irresponsible past behavior, etc) is like complaining about the known side effects of the heart attack medicine that's needed to save your life.
You can not take your medicine to avoid the side effects, but the end result would be much worse than taking the medicine and living with the side effects.

There are people though who really don't think the stimulus will do much. Some that believe that it's better for the economy to devalue itself quickly and begin recovery. That the stimulus is simply delaying the inevitable. Then there are those that just think a lot of the stuff in the stimulus plan is silly like stop-smoking programs. That not having provisions in there to prevent using that money to hire illegals is stupid.

And you can't blame people for being skeptical. Remember that the TARP was necessary and the world would cease to exist as we know it without. Turns out they didn't even use half the money and the rest went into a blackhole that is being kept secret from the public. The boy can only cry wolf so many times with people.

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

Complaining about what problems we might cause with these policies (i.e. inflation, devaluation of the dollar, rewarding irresponsible past behavior, etc) is like complaining about the known side effects of the heart attack medicine that's needed to save your life.
You can not take your medicine to avoid the side effects, but the end result would be much worse than taking the medicine and living with the side effects.

You really have it all wrong.

TAKING OUR MEDICINE IS PURGING BAD DEBT FROM THE SYSTEM SO THE PATIENT IS HEALTHY AGAIN!

Using your analogy of a heart attack your solution is to jab syringe full of adrenaline to the heart of the patient while he is in the middle of having a heart attack and hope it does not kill him!

[lofasz]

Democrats are about to make republicans look like geniuses. I rate party affiliations somewhere between the white stuff that accumulates behind the head of my cock and the dingleberries on my hairy ass. What ever happened to being American?

You can't take a dump without Congressional approval. You don't own your land unless the Supreme Court concurs. And why is the Department of Homeland Stupidity still around?

I want America back, and the only party I give support to is the one with fine wine and even finer women. ALL other parties suck.

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by lofasz

I rate party affiliations somewhere between the white stuff that accumulates behind the head of my cock and the dingleberries on my hairy ass. What ever happened to being American?

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by lofasz

Democrats are about to make republicans look like geniuses.

Mike Tyson couldnt make a republican look like a genius, its impossible.

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by Ethersync

What you are talking about has never worked in the history of mankind. You are telling us we should trust the people that fucked everything up to successfully pull off something that has been attempted and has always failed in the past.

There is no way to avoid a Depression any longer. That is an inevitability.

This is going to fail and people will be more hurt because of it. You seem to think the US can make as much money as it wants and burying ourselves in more debt is going to fix the problem of too much debt in the system.

I am glad you feel things are under control. I hope you are right.

Govt spending on WWII is what got the US out of the depression and Hitler was able to turn the German economy around with govt spending. Doing nothing at this point is the worse thing we can do and its why we are in this to begin with. Bush ignored the warning signs and did nothing.

Unfortunately its a little to little to late. For this bailout to be effective it needs to be at least 10x what it is, we will be in a full blown depression by late summer.

[$5 submissions]

Originally Posted by pocketkangaroo

What's up with the daily talking points?

I don't mind. It adds to the topical diversity of the daily thread diet here at GFY.

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

Govt spending on WWII is what got the US out of the depression and Hitler was able to turn the German economy around with govt spending. Doing nothing at this point is the worse thing we can do and its why we are in this to begin with. Bush ignored the warning signs and did nothing.

Unfortunately its a little to little to late. For this bailout to be effective it needs to be at least 10x what it is, we will be in a full blown depression by late summer.

What you fail to understand it FDR's policies are what kept us IN a depression so long.

A bailout 10x the size of this one is impossible. We can not afford to pay for everything that is on the table right now...

[WhiplashDug]

Originally Posted by lofasz

Democrats are about to make republicans look like geniuses. I rate party affiliations somewhere between the white stuff that accumulates behind the head of my cock and the dingleberries on my hairy ass. What ever happened to being American?

You can't take a dump without Congressional approval. You don't own your land unless the Supreme Court concurs. And why is the Department of Homeland Stupidity still around?

I want America back, and the only party I give support to is the one with fine wine and even finer women. ALL other parties suck.

Exactly. Anyone who supports this stimulus bill is insane.

I've seen some talk about how 'money is going to build schools' cause Dem's are in control instead of military bases. Thats fine, but what do either have to do with creating jobs for the private sector? Both are equally stupid - as they both create something that has an ongoing cost to operate.

*** Worse than that... what i would like to know, is why the Milwaukee Public School System is getting almost $90 million for new school construction when they currently have 15 schools sitting empty.

*** Also - why is $4.2 billion going to community activist groups like ACORN?

In addition - where is all this irreverent desire to fall in line with the current administration thoughts on this coming from anyway? Perhaps I missed it, but I can't remember seeing anything on the Presidents economic degree, or anyone else's in the House or Senate. Why do people keep saying economist are for this? Why does Obama? Did everyone miss this full page ad?

http://www.cato.org/special/stimulus...o_stimulus.pdf

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by WhiplashDug

Did everyone miss this full page ad?

http://www.cato.org/special/stimulus...o_stimulus.pdf

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by Ethersync

What you fail to understand it FDR's policies are what kept us IN a depression so long.

The depression started in 1929, FDR was not president until 1933.

'The turning point in the depression was in 1933. Some economists attribute the subsequent recovery to monetary expansion that began after the bank holiday a few days after Roosevelt was inaugrated on March 4, 1933 and devaluation of the U.S. dollar that was then tied to gold.'

[$5 submissions]

Originally Posted by lofasz

You don't own your land unless the Supreme Court concurs.

I wouldn't go that far but yes, the KELO decision was a bitch.

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

The depression started in 1929, FDR was not president until 1933.

'The turning point in the depression was in 1933. Some economists attribute the subsequent recovery to monetary expansion that began after the bank holiday a few days after Roosevelt was inaugrated on March 4, 1933 and devaluation of the U.S. dollar that was then tied to gold.'

Yes, I am aware and it was not until December '41 that we were in the war.

Hoover's policies were awful too...

While "some" economists may credit FDR with fixing this many do not.

[pocketkangaroo]

Originally Posted by WhiplashDug

I've seen some talk about how 'money is going to build schools' cause Dem's are in control instead of military bases. Thats fine, but what do either have to do with creating jobs for the private sector? Both are equally stupid - as they both create something that has an ongoing cost to operate.

When you build schools, you need labor from this country to do so. Not to mention the buying of materials. You're creating money making opportunities for builders, electricians, plumbers, painters, carpenters, and so on. People to setup telephone lines, computer networks and so on.

And many of the construction isn't for "new schools". It's for fixing existing infrastructure. New library at a school, a new water heater at another. That doesn't necessarily have to create new ongoing costs to operate, just upgrading the current facilities.

[pocketkangaroo]

Originally Posted by WhiplashDug

In addition - where is all this irreverent desire to fall in line with the current administration thoughts on this coming from anyway? Perhaps I missed it, but I can't remember seeing anything on the Presidents economic degree, or anyone else's in the House or Senate. Why do people keep saying economist are for this? Why does Obama? Did everyone miss this full page ad?

http://www.cato.org/special/stimulus...o_stimulus.pdf

CATO is a libertarian group so they are going to be opposed to almost any government interjection.

[Lester Burnham]

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls

Keep giving the government more power and porn on the internet will be a thing of the past. I dont get why left wing nutjobs cant understand that.

LMAO. I guess I missed the memo where right wing conservative evangelical christians announced to the world that they are pro-porn and have no issue with government or judicial regulation of pornography. You do realize that for the most part, conservative judges find some reason to uphold anti-porn and smut laws, whereas liberal judges strike them down (normally at the prodding of liberal groups like the ACLU)...

There is a reason that the state's with the toughest porn laws are CONSERVATIVE states ROFL...

[Ethersync]

Originally Posted by Lester Burnham

LMAO. I guess I missed the memo where right wing conservative evangelical christians announced to the world that they are pro-porn and have no issue with government or judicial regulation of pornography. You do realize that for the most part, conservative judges find some reason to uphold anti-porn and smut laws, whereas liberal judges strike them down (normally at the prodding of liberal groups like the ACLU)...

There is a reason that the state's with the toughest porn laws are CONSERVATIVE states ROFL...

I do not think anything is denying that Republicans tend to want to go after "obscenity". It's just not completely black and white. Democrats do it too...

[Tipper] Gore watched other rock music videos and concluded: "The images frightened my children, they frightened me! I am frightened! Way frightened! The graphic sex and the violence were too much for us to handle."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parents...esource_Center

[tony286]

Originally Posted by Ethersync

What you fail to understand it FDR's policies are what kept us IN a depression so long.

A bailout 10x the size of this one is impossible. We can not afford to pay for everything that is on the table right now...

not true about fdr http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/0..._n_166044.html

[seeandsee]

yes they are

[Snake Doctor]

It's all academic at this point anyways.

The one thing those of you who don't like what's being done have going for you is that if it doesn't work, the people responsible for implementing it will get kicked to the curb in 2010 and 2012, likely for people who are their opposites, philosophically speaking.

If it does work, then we'll all be better off and all you'll have to do is eat some crow.

FWIW, I didn't like the "bailout" either....and people are using that word for everything. Don't confuse the $700 billion bank bailout with this stimulus package....they are two totally different things.
One was supposed to help the credit markets....the second is to create jobs and demand in the economy.
The first is something we'd never done before....the second is something that has worked in the past.

[tony286]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

It's all academic at this point anyways.

The one thing those of you who don't like what's being done have going for you is that if it doesn't work, the people responsible for implementing it will get kicked to the curb in 2010 and 2012, likely for people who are their opposites, philosophically speaking.

If it does work, then we'll all be better off and all you'll have to do is eat some crow.

FWIW, I didn't like the "bailout" either....and people are using that word for everything. Don't confuse the $700 billion bank bailout with this stimulus package....they are two totally different things.
One was supposed to help the credit markets....the second is to create jobs and demand in the economy.
The first is something we'd never done before....the second is something that has worked in the past.

When I heard tim geithner speak my stomach turned. Its like why do we have members of the club watch over the club. Their interests are more important to him then we are.

[pocketkangaroo]

Originally Posted by Snake Doctor

FWIW, I didn't like the "bailout" either....and people are using that word for everything. Don't confuse the $700 billion bank bailout with this stimulus package....they are two totally different things.
One was supposed to help the credit markets....the second is to create jobs and demand in the economy.
The first is something we'd never done before....the second is something that has worked in the past.

Opening the credit markets is much more important.

They are two totally different things. Doesn't make one good and one bad. The "stimulus" plan is filled with tons of pork. STD programs, anti-smoking programs, etc. I'd be fine with a stimulus package that didn't include the pork. But Dems showed their true colors on this one and showed the American people they are just like the Republicans. Out for themselves and their little friends.

[ThunderBalls]

Originally Posted by Ethersync

What you are talking about has never worked in the history of mankind.

Huh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression

The Great Depression did not strongly affect Japan. The Japanese economy shrank by 8% during 1929?31. However, Japan's Minister of Finance (MoF) Osachi Hamaguchi implemented the first version of Keynesian economic policies: first, by increasing deficit spending; and second, by devaluing the currency. The MoF believed that the deficit spending could easily be paid for when productivity improved.

The devaluation of the currency had an immediate effect. Japanese textiles began to displace British textiles in export markets. The deficit spending, however proved to be most profound.

[DaddyHalbucks]

Paul Begala said as much the other night on CNN. He pointed out with glee that "there are only 5 red states left."

What he forgot to mention is that those red states all have balanced budgets, while most of the blue socialist states are all running huge budget deficits.

[tiger]

Why the fuck is there still debate with this whole tax cuts are the best thing for the economy bullshit?

[tony286]

Originally Posted by tiger

Why the fuck is there still debate with this whole tax cuts are the best thing for the economy bullshit?

because they really arent.

[DaddyHalbucks]

Tax cuts are a vital engine, but they aren't much help for a vehicle that has crashed into a brick wall at 100 MPH.

[Lester Burnham]

Originally Posted by DaddyHalbucks

Paul Begala said as much the other night on CNN. He pointed out with glee that "there are only 5 red states left."

What he forgot to mention is that those red states all have balanced budgets, while most of the blue socialist states are all running huge budget deficits.

Those "red states" have tiny populations and are not exactly cradles of civilization - utah, alaska, wyoming, Idaho and Nebraska. Yea, cool that Nebraska has a balanced budget, but who the fuck wants to live in Nebraska?

The next most "red" states are "Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kentucky, and West Virginia." Said states rank near the bottom in education, income, infant mortality rates, etc. etc.

Red states are usually the states you don't want to live in...

[pocketkangaroo]

Originally Posted by DaddyHalbucks

Paul Begala said as much the other night on CNN. He pointed out with glee that "there are only 5 red states left."

What he forgot to mention is that those red states all have balanced budgets, while most of the blue socialist states are all running huge budget deficits.

Actually, the red states are the broke states. Their budgets are balanced because they mooch off the blue states. Take Alaska, they get $1.84 for every $1 they pay in federal taxes. California only gets back $0.78 for every $1 they put in. The red ones are the broke ones who can't survive on their own. You give the blue states the same dollar for dollar back, and they all thrive.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/266.html

[nation-x]

I hope the Republicans start talking even louder and obstructing even more... if Obama is successful (which I think he will be) in the next 2 years they will be out of jobs.