Think Tubes are ruining your biz?! - well, then check THIS:

[itto]

..they aren't. While some of 'em might be immoral and some of them are straight up illegal, that's just the way it is. Accept it. Improve your sites, improve your sales technique.

Learn. And then, learn more.

Personally, i never had a ratio above 1:600 - from 2001 to now, no matter what sponsor.

But you know what, it might be the times where you just can't be lazy anymore - get your ass in gear and actually WORK for your money.

[beerptrol]

but...but...it's so much easier to blame others. Blame tubes for shitty sales, and blame the wet backs for taking all the shitty jobs and driving down salaries for doing those shitty jobs cheap.......Blaming Lays potato chips for my fat ass...nobody can eat just one

[Agent 488]

no i think it's better to stick with techniques last updated in 2004.

[itto]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

but...but...it's so much easier to blame others. Blame tubes for shitty sales, and blame the wet backs for taking all the shitty jobs and driving down salries for doing those shitty jobs cheap.......

hm you're right, that MIGHT be easier.. solution = let's all stop working and hail to them mexicans.. and them tubes

[Agent 488]

fucking mexicans stole my sales.

[epitome]

Originally Posted by itto

Personally, i never had a ratio above 1:600 - from 2001 to now, no matter what sponsor.

Seeing this always makes me sad. Yes, I have a lot of sponsors that can't even do 1:2000 right now, but I also have multiple bread and butter ones doing better than 1:100; including on tubes.

I always think that gay porn is over-saturated until I see some of the straight porn ratios.

It probably all evens out in the end though -- I'd say at most, the gay porn traffic is 20% of all porn surfers ... so someone peddling straight porn has an opportunity for more traffic in the first place, me thinks.

[D Ghost]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

but...but...it's so much easier to blame others. Blame tubes for shitty sales, and blame the wet backs for taking all the shitty jobs and driving down salaries for doing those shitty jobs cheap.......Blaming Lays potato chips for my fat ass...nobody can eat just one

LMAO

[Dirty Dane]

I don't mind tubes, because they follow the same principles as any other market situation. But I can never "accept" theft or other crime. Its not a natural part of that equilibrium, and that is why we have laws and regulations. Unfornately there are loopholes. For now...

[LeRoy]

Our cam sites are converting big time with Tube traffic

[Agent 488]

yeah the gay traffic pool is much smaller. takes some getting used to. ratios much better though.

Originally Posted by epitome

Seeing this always makes me sad. Yes, I have a lot of sponsors that can't even do 1:2000 right now, but I also have multiple bread and butter ones doing better than 1:100; including on tubes.

I always think that gay porn is over-saturated until I see some of the straight porn ratios.

It probably all evens out in the end though -- I'd say at most, the gay porn traffic is 20% of all porn surfers ... so someone peddling straight porn has an opportunity for more traffic in the first place, me thinks.

[itto]

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

I don't mind tubes, because they follow the same principles as any other market situation. But I can never "accept" theft or other crime. Its not a natural part of that equilibrium, and that is why we have laws and regulations. Unfornately there are loopholes. For now...

you don't have to accept theft and crimes, that's for sure.. but the point is: in the current situation, some big players get away with it, using grey area stuff and loopholes, as you say.

but if you target long tail niche kw's, you still can make sales - al lot of 'em in fact, that's my point of view.. you just need to put in a little bit more work.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by itto

..they aren't. While some of 'em might be immoral and some of them are straight up illegal, that's just the way it is. Accept it. Improve your sites, improve your sales technique.

Learn. And then, learn more.

Personally, i never had a ratio above 1:600 - from 2001 to now, no matter what sponsor.

But you know what, it might be the times where you just can't be lazy anymore - get your ass in gear and actually WORK for your money.

I have no idea whom you're talking to. But a lot of us have never been lazy and do work our ass off. It doesn't help me to bust ass and do everything by hand to sell a membership to a site that has it's entire members area available for free from a thousand different places.

Your post sounds like a lot of generalized nothingness to me. Go ahead...try and sell paysite memberships to sites that are completely ripped on a thousand torrents and/or tubes. Go ahead. "work for your money"

Show me ONE thing you think YOU can do to bring up ratios say for Naughty America for instance? You can't. Unless you are going to hold a gun to the heads of people and force them to take their credit card out.

Nice motivational speech. Maybe a good one for folks who are used to making a few hundred bucks a month. Not so much for the people who make tens of thousands of dollars a month.

[itto]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I have no idea whom you're talking to. But a lot of us have never been lazy and do work our ass off. It doesn't help me to bust ass and do everything by hand to sell a membership to a site that has it's entire members area available for free from a thousand different places.

Your post sounds like a lot of generalized nothingness to me. Go ahead...try and sell paysite memberships to sites that are completely ripped on a thousand torrents and/or tubes. Go ahead. "work for your money"

Show me ONE thing you think YOU can do to bring up ratios say for Naughty America for instance? You can't. Unless you are going to hold a gun to the heads of people and force them to take their credit card out.

Nice motivational speech. Maybe a good one for folks who are used to making a few hundred bucks a month. Not so much for the people who make tens of thousands of dollars a month.

Thanks for your opinion, Robbie, but really.. while my post may sound like a "lot of generalized nothingness" to you, i can assure you that i know what i'm doing. And your statement that i couldn't bump up ratios for a random program makes me think that you're either drunk or very unprofessional when it comes to talking with people you don't know.

[Agent 488]

naughty america tanked their own program long ago. not even jesus could raise that one from the dead.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I have no idea whom you're talking to. But a lot of us have never been lazy and do work our ass off. It doesn't help me to bust ass and do everything by hand to sell a membership to a site that has it's entire members area available for free from a thousand different places.

Your post sounds like a lot of generalized nothingness to me. Go ahead...try and sell paysite memberships to sites that are completely ripped on a thousand torrents and/or tubes. Go ahead. "work for your money"

Show me ONE thing you think YOU can do to bring up ratios say for Naughty America for instance? You can't. Unless you are going to hold a gun to the heads of people and force them to take their credit card out.

Nice motivational speech. Maybe a good one for folks who are used to making a few hundred bucks a month. Not so much for the people who make tens of thousands of dollars a month.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by itto

Thanks for your opinion, Robbie, but really.. while my post may sound like a "lot of generalized nothingness" to you, i can assure you that i know what i'm doing. And your statement that i couldn't bump up ratios for a random program makes me think that you're either drunk or very unprofessional when it comes to talking with people you don't know.

I'm neither drunk or unprofessional. My knowledge of being an affiliate is very sound. And no, you CAN'T sell paysites that there is common knowledge amongst the general population that their members areas are available for free.

Maybe in some dream world. And that's not a personal attack on you. It's just a fact my friend.

There are reasons that MAJOR studios are cutting production, cutting staff, and closing shop in some cases. There are reasons that affiliate programs are paying late. There are reasons that my own affiliate sales to other programs went from over 50 thousand dollars a month EVERY month for the last 13 years down to right at 25 thousand dollars a month NOW.

I work everyday. 10 to 12 hours a day. I can NOT make sales with my tgp getting 15 thousand uniques a day the same way I could 2 years ago when it was getting over a million uniques a day.

Yes there are some niches that are still underserviced. I agree. But to say that we all just need to work hard and not be lazy and tubes and torrents are not to blame is fucking ridiculous.

[stickyfingerz]

Lots of bs in this thread? Where do you think all those sales you would of had that now goto the tubes went?

We need to go back to blurring out pussy and nipples and when it was hard to find a naked vagine on the internet. Imagine your conversion ratios then. lol

[itto]

Robbie, i agree with you to certain point and i totally don't take this as a personal attack. Of course the tubes are hurting the biz, i think we all agree on this point.
What i'm trying to say is, you can't change that fact - it is like it is - but if you just adapt a BIT and learn e.g. some new seo techniques, or target better search terms, you CAN (and believe me, i tested that and i'm not bullshitting and i also work 8h's a day) improve your ratios - not only in microniches.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by itto

Robbie, i agree with you to certain point and i totally don't take this as a personal attack. Of course the tubes are hurting the biz, i think we all agree on this point.
What i'm trying to say is, you can't change that fact - it is like it is - but if you just adapt a BIT and learn e.g. some new seo techniques, or target better search terms, you CAN (and believe me, i tested that and i'm not bullshitting and i also work 8h's a day) improve your ratios - not only in microniches.

Oh yeah I agree there. I personally have used this time to optimize every site I have. I'm only about halfway through the long frustrating process.

It's especially hard on me to work for weeks on redesign on my TGP's which have literally lost all their traffic. But there is still enough there to make money. And when the shit clears...my stuff will be in a position to make money again. So it can be motivational, I just took it the wrong way when you posted that it's all my fault that sales aren't what they used to be and piracy wasn't the major blow that it is.

[fmltube]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

but...but...it's so much easier to blame others. Blame tubes for shitty sales, and blame the wet backs for taking all the shitty jobs and driving down salaries for doing those shitty jobs cheap.......Blaming Lays potato chips for my fat ass...nobody can eat just one

fuck it, Im starting a Mexican Tube site. Think Lays will sponsor me?

[plsureking]

Originally Posted by itto

hm you're right, that MIGHT be easier.. solution = let's all stop working and hail to them mexicans.. and them tubes

wait, we can hire mexicans do this shit?? where's that thread?

[HerPimp]

word lets get some mexicanos

[VicD]

now your talking

[qxm]

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by stickyfingerz

Lots of bs in this thread? Where do you think all those sales you would of had that now goto the tubes went?

We need to go back to blurring out pussy and nipples and when it was hard to find a naked vagine on the internet. Imagine your conversion ratios then. lol

yeah and imagine how many buggy whips i could sell if those annoying cars were eliminated.

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by itto

Robbie, i agree with you to certain point and i totally don't take this as a personal attack. Of course the tubes are hurting the biz, i think we all agree on this point.
What i'm trying to say is, you can't change that fact - it is like it is - but if you just adapt a BIT and learn e.g. some new seo techniques, or target better search terms, you CAN (and believe me, i tested that and i'm not bullshitting and i also work 8h's a day) improve your ratios - not only in microniches.

Its only a matter of time before tubes are number 1 for more and more search terms. Its nearly impossible to fight their organic backlinks.

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

yeah and imagine how many buggy whips i could sell if those annoying cars were eliminated.

that analogy is so DUMB man. Its more like this

Car lot A is stealing cars from lot B and giving them away and only asking in return to consider buying a keychain from them. They seem to think its easier to sell a million keychains than the cars themselves because giving away cars ensures the more people visiting their lot than anyone elses.

[cykoe6]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I have no idea whom you're talking to. But a lot of us have never been lazy and do work our ass off. It doesn't help me to bust ass and do everything by hand to sell a membership to a site that has it's entire members area available for free from a thousand different places.

Your post sounds like a lot of generalized nothingness to me. Go ahead...try and sell paysite memberships to sites that are completely ripped on a thousand torrents and/or tubes. Go ahead. "work for your money"

Show me ONE thing you think YOU can do to bring up ratios say for Naughty America for instance? You can't. Unless you are going to hold a gun to the heads of people and force them to take their credit card out.

Nice motivational speech. Maybe a good one for folks who are used to making a few hundred bucks a month. Not so much for the people who make tens of thousands of dollars a month.

Thanks for slapping down these idiots. Anyone who thinks the easy availability of free porn on tubes, forums and torrents has not effected this business is an idiot. Anyone can easily download full length high quality porn movies in any niche within minutes. You like GGG and 666???...... download the entire catalog for free. Like zoophilia???............ as easy as getting the latest Hollywood blockbuster. Very small micro niches survive for now....... but I can personally find most micro niches for free in under 15 minutes so it will not be long before everyone else can too.

[LadyMischief]

Originally Posted by itto

..they aren't. While some of 'em might be immoral and some of them are straight up illegal, that's just the way it is. Accept it. Improve your sites, improve your sales technique.

Learn. And then, learn more.

Personally, i never had a ratio above 1:600 - from 2001 to now, no matter what sponsor.

But you know what, it might be the times where you just can't be lazy anymore - get your ass in gear and actually WORK for your money.

This is so right. The only way to do well in these trying times is to have an excellent product that differentiates you from the multitude of other companies/sites that are available bombarding a surfer at every opportunity. People underestimate the intelligence of the consumer, to their detriment. They are willing to PAY for a good product if they feel they get value from it, no matter how much free shit is out there. A good product, good customer service, and value for price, and they will pay, and stay.

[LadyMischief]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

but...but...it's so much easier to blame others. Blame tubes for shitty sales, and blame the wet backs for taking all the shitty jobs and driving down salaries for doing those shitty jobs cheap.......Blaming Lays potato chips for my fat ass...nobody can eat just one

If we're going to be totally honest with ourselves, it's already been proven that it's not tubes that have killed sales. MGPs and TGPS were giving away free stuff for years. The social networking sites and the different ways people are using the internet has been more of a harbringer of destruction for the current business model in adult than anything. Why should people pay to see chicks get naked when they can actually meet real people, who might actually fuck them, and still see what all their other friends are doing while they're at it.

This has been proven time and again, and honestly? It's human nature for things to go that way:

http://www.wired.com/culture/lifesty.../sexdrive_0523
http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...31943720080916
http://www.4hoteliers.com/4hots_fshw.php?mwi=4395
http://www.beneaththebrand.com/2009/...ia-beats-porn/

And this is the reason why, overall, it's still the dating sites that are faring better than the "porn" sites.

[LadyMischief]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I'm neither drunk or unprofessional. My knowledge of being an affiliate is very sound. And no, you CAN'T sell paysites that there is common knowledge amongst the general population that their members areas are available for free.

Maybe in some dream world. And that's not a personal attack on you. It's just a fact my friend.

There are reasons that MAJOR studios are cutting production, cutting staff, and closing shop in some cases. There are reasons that affiliate programs are paying late. There are reasons that my own affiliate sales to other programs went from over 50 thousand dollars a month EVERY month for the last 13 years down to right at 25 thousand dollars a month NOW.

I work everyday. 10 to 12 hours a day. I can NOT make sales with my tgp getting 15 thousand uniques a day the same way I could 2 years ago when it was getting over a million uniques a day.

Yes there are some niches that are still underserviced. I agree. But to say that we all just need to work hard and not be lazy and tubes and torrents are not to blame is fucking ridiculous.

In a way, this as much the paysite's fault as anyone elses. Not because they have content that's been stolen and put all over, but that they rely SOLELY on that content to give value to their customers. Look at mainstream companies...they have realized that the average web surfer in this day and age wants more than a place to just go and buy things...they want a place to hang out, share their opinions, spend time with people of like mind, or even just a place to go to argue. They have changed their business models accordingly, created communities for their users and outlets for those people to do what they expect to be able to do.. interact. Adult companies are really the only companies left online that have done little to nothing to actually embrace the concept of being more than just a place a person goes to get off and leave, but to actually give them something they feel is worth more than just that 10 minutes of the day. You can't run a business and not to expect to have to adapt with the times.. but let's face it... Adult companies are dinosaurs for the most part, still struggling to the same format, the same model, the same layout, the same everything, while the market changes around them, and still expect to do the same numbers. Einstein's theory of insanity is when someone does the same thing every single time, and expects a different result. The ONLY way to bring things back is to re-evaluate, and adapt to the times. Wishing things were the way they used to be is about as useful as wishing the Great Depression never happened.