Obama / Haiti vs Bush/ Katrina disaster resonse time

[justinsain]

Major relief effort of epic proportions in full effect for the earthquake victims in Haiti.

How does Obama's effort compare to that of Bush's effort for the victims of Hurricane Katrina?

[Jman]

Stop living in the past...

[justinsain]

Originally Posted by Jean-Francois

Stop living in the past...

I don't live in the past but I do think we learned from it.

[Les Grossman]

Considering how close we are to Haiti, I feel our response time was too slow. We should have had help there within 12 hours tops. In an event such as this, HOURS and sometimes minutes make the difference between life and death.

[HeelCash]

It just never ends.

[fatfoo]

The ghosts thought Hurricane Katrina efforts were some intense action.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

Considering how close we are to Haiti, I feel our response time was too slow. We should have had help there within 12 hours tops. In an event such as this, HOURS and sometimes minutes make the difference between life and death.

Umm...What crack pipe are you smoking?

We had Coast Guard and Nato in Haiti when it happened. The coast guard checking out run ways shortly after it was safe to check.. the reponse time was instant, the ability to get more help in, isn't instant...

It's not like they can drop a 5k lb vacuum bomb and clear out a runway..

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by fatfoo

The ghosts thought Hurricane Katrina efforts were some intense action.

[David!]

People just do not realize what kind of logistics it takes to mount a significant rescue effort.
In this case, you're talking about tons and tons of supplies coming from all over the world. Those coming from outside the United States have to stop in the Dominican Republic to refuel before landing in Haiti since there is no more kerosene there. The DR is about to run out of kerosene now unless there is a viable effort to supply them ASAP.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

Considering how close we are to Haiti, I feel our response time was too slow. We should have had help there within 12 hours tops. In an event such as this, HOURS and sometimes minutes make the difference between life and death.

We did have people there with in 24/hrs.. However you can't pick up a naval vessel and move it instantly. We also can't just send in aircraft when there was no functioning airport. Our Naval vessels were in route in under 24/hrs but they don't just show up instantly.

US special forces went in by the second day and were setting up a temporary control tower, after that was done planes started moving things in. (don't forget this happened late in the day, meaning nothing could be sent in till the second day anyway)

Not to mention Hatti is it's own country, we can't just start rolling in troops with out their permission, or until it become apparent that their own govt is in cable of requesting the help. I believe it was a mix of the two that happened.

This wasn't like a Hurricane that people were prepared to send in aid right away, this was a normal day in Hatti then 5 mins later it's destroyed.

The time it took us to get troops into Hatti and get things moving, was actually a bit faster than what it took under Bush with Katrina, which shows how incompetent the Bush admin was. What happened under Bush should have been criminal TBH.

[baddog]

Idiots affect the lives of many. There is still no known cure for stupidity, but we can raise awareness

[directfiesta]

" Heck of a job, Brownie "

[Iron Fist]

Originally Posted by crockett

We did have people there with in 24/hrs.. However you can't pick up a naval vessel and move it instantly. We also can't just send in aircraft when there was no functioning airport. Our Naval vessels were in route in under 24/hrs but they don't just show up instantly.

US special forces went in by the second day and were setting up a temporary control tower, after that was done planes started moving things in. (don't forget this happened late in the day, meaning nothing could be sent in till the second day anyway)

Not to mention Hatti is it's own country, we can't just start rolling in troops with out their permission, or until it become apparent that their own govt is in cable of requesting the help. I believe it was a mix of the two that happened.

This wasn't like a Hurricane that people were prepared to send in aid right away, this was a normal day in Hatti then 5 mins later it's destroyed.

The time it took us to get troops into Hatti and get things moving, was actually a bit faster than what it took under Bush with Katrina, which shows how incompetent the Bush admin was. What happened under Bush should have been criminal TBH.

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

Considering how close we are to Haiti, I feel our response time was too slow. We should have had help there within 12 hours tops. In an event such as this, HOURS and sometimes minutes make the difference between life and death.

There must be some " inner city black dna " in your blood ....

[justinsain]

Originally Posted by crockett

We did have people there with in 24/hrs.. However you can't pick up a naval vessel and move it instantly. We also can't just send in aircraft when there was no functioning airport. Our Naval vessels were in route in under 24/hrs but they don't just show up instantly.

US special forces went in by the second day and were setting up a temporary control tower, after that was done planes started moving things in. (don't forget this happened late in the day, meaning nothing could be sent in till the second day anyway)

Not to mention Hatti is it's own country, we can't just start rolling in troops with out their permission, or until it become apparent that their own govt is in cable of requesting the help. I believe it was a mix of the two that happened.

This wasn't like a Hurricane that people were prepared to send in aid right away, this was a normal day in Hatti then 5 mins later it's destroyed.

The time it took us to get troops into Hatti and get things moving, was actually a bit faster than what it took under Bush with Katrina, which shows how incompetent the Bush admin was. What happened under Bush should have been criminal TBH.

Perfect analysis

[sweetcuties]

Obama is handling shit right

[GetSCORECash]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

Considering how close we are to Haiti, I feel our response time was too slow. We should have had help there within 12 hours tops. In an event such as this, HOURS and sometimes minutes make the difference between life and death.

I agrea! But unless the relief effort would of been ready prior to the Earthquake like in a Huricane where you know it is comming, it does seam adequate, atleast something has been done.

Originally Posted by crockett

We did have people there with in 24/hrs.. However you can't pick up a naval vessel and move it instantly. We also can't just send in aircraft when there was no functioning airport. Our Naval vessels were in route in under 24/hrs but they don't just show up instantly.

US special forces went in by the second day and were setting up a temporary control tower, after that was done planes started moving things in. (don't forget this happened late in the day, meaning nothing could be sent in till the second day anyway)

Not to mention Hatti is it's own country, we can't just start rolling in troops with out their permission, or until it become apparent that their own govt is in cable of requesting the help. I believe it was a mix of the two that happened.

This wasn't like a Hurricane that people were prepared to send in aid right away, this was a normal day in Hatti then 5 mins later it's destroyed.

The time it took us to get troops into Hatti and get things moving, was actually a bit faster than what it took under Bush with Katrina, which shows how incompetent the Bush admin was. What happened under Bush should have been criminal TBH.

Great Response Crockett.

[Tom_PM]

Rush Limbaugh says that Obama responded faster to Haiti than he did to the christmas day underpants non-bomber, as if idiots should be angry over that.

He also claimed that Obama was just making a political ploy out of aiding Haiti, saying he's doing it to shore up support from blacks.

[spunkmaster]

During Katrina there were 2500 choppers picking people off the roofs within 12 hours and these were federal aircraft that Bush ordered there.

The reason it took 4 days for troops on the ground was because the President doesn't have the authority to deploy fereral troops without the states approval. The
Govenor of Lousianna didn't approve the federal troops until the 4th day !

[danclips]

Last I checked, Haiti was not a part of the US. Correct me if I'm wrong....

Perfect response, crockett. I could not have said it any better myself.

[Les Grossman]

Originally Posted by crockett

We did have people there with in 24/hrs.. However you can't pick up a naval vessel and move it instantly. We also can't just send in aircraft when there was no functioning airport. Our Naval vessels were in route in under 24/hrs but they don't just show up instantly.

US special forces went in by the second day and were setting up a temporary control tower, after that was done planes started moving things in. (don't forget this happened late in the day, meaning nothing could be sent in till the second day anyway)

Not to mention Hatti is it's own country, we can't just start rolling in troops with out their permission, or until it become apparent that their own govt is in cable of requesting the help. I believe it was a mix of the two that happened.

For those of you who think you are know it alls:

It is only just over 200 miles from Guantanamo (US Military Naval Base) to Port Au Prince, Haiti.

We have military THERE, The US Navy (with boats & helicopters), and they are so close to Haiti that the Haitians use little sinking boats to try to get to Gitmo, and you're telling me we couldn't get there any faster? You STRONGLY underestimate the Navy. They could have been there, by boat or helicopter, with supplies very, very fast.

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Umm...What crack pipe are you smoking?

We had Coast Guard and Nato in Haiti when it happened. The coast guard checking out run ways shortly after it was safe to check.. the reponse time was instant, the ability to get more help in, isn't instant...

It's not like they can drop a 5k lb vacuum bomb and clear out a runway..

Comning from someone who appears to be a Marine, I have to ask, what crack are YOU smoking and did you not learn anything during your time of service? Every hear of a helicopter? Anyone clue you in that the Navy had boats and were in Cuba?

We had limited people in Haiti when it happened and the Navy should have been there within 12 hours max. It's great aid is pouring in, I'm only saying we should have been there faster considering the location of Guantanamo.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

Comning from someone who appears to be a Marine, I have to ask, what crack are YOU smoking and did you not learn anything during your time of service? Every hear of a helicopter? Anyone clue you in that the Navy had boats and were in Cuba?

We had limited people in Haiti when it happened and the Navy should have been there within 12 hours max. It's great aid is pouring in, I'm only saying we should have been there faster considering the location of Guantanamo.

The Coast Guard and Nato were already in Haiti and responded instantly...

They also had tsunami warnings, you can't drive ships into possible tsunami's or unknown aftershocks that could be even bigger. With that, 12 hour response time, with night fall, and getting ships loaded, is impossible... being a Marine, I know that.

[Les Grossman]

Originally Posted by MCO_David

Those coming from outside the United States have to stop in the Dominican Republic to refuel before landing in Haiti since there is no more kerosene there. The DR is about to run out of kerosene now unless there is a viable effort to supply them ASAP.

I'm surprised Cuba has not been opened up yet for flights. Both Havana and Guantanamo have airports and just a skip across the water.

I'm also a little disappointed that Cuba is not sending teams (100s) of doctors there as they usually offer for disasters such as this. Maybe they will, but they could also be quick on the scene.

[Les Grossman]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

The Coast Guard and Nato were already in Haiti and responded instantly...

They also had tsunami warnings, you can't drive ships into possible tsunami's or unknown aftershocks that could be even bigger. With that, 12 hour response time, with night fall, and getting ships loaded, is impossible... being a Marine, I know that.

The tsunami warning only lasted for a little bit, not long at all.

It would not take long to mobilize from Guantanamo to get soldiers on the ground to assist with the search and rescue, along with doctors and some medicine.

The Coast Guard and NATO didn't do a whole lot.

[Les Grossman]

Originally Posted by sweetcuties

Obama is handling shit right

He is doing a fine job. Much better than Bush with Katrina.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

The tsunami warning only lasted for a little bit, not long at all.

It would not take long to mobilize from Guantanamo to get soldiers on the ground to assist with the search and rescue, along with doctors and some medicine.

The Coast Guard and NATO didn't do a whole lot.

What doctors? The base doctors all 2 or 3 of them? Medicine? Do you think they have some special super supply on a non-supply base? That shit has to come in from like logistic bases, that takes 12-24 hours alone..

They did as much as they could and more than the Army could do in that short period of time.. they can't just over take a country, without permission. This place looks like a damn bomb went off, they can't just role down the streets in hummers and tanks, mowing shit out of the way simply to help people.

[V_RocKs]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

Considering how close we are to Haiti, I feel our response time was too slow. We should have had help there within 12 hours tops. In an event such as this, HOURS and sometimes minutes make the difference between life and death.

Why do we give a shit?

[justinsain]

Originally Posted by Les Grossman

The tsunami warning only lasted for a little bit, not long at all.

It would not take long to mobilize from Guantanamo to get soldiers on the ground to assist with the search and rescue, along with doctors and some medicine.

The Coast Guard and NATO didn't do a whole lot.

You're assuming that Gitmo has the personnel and supplies readily available for something like this. Perhaps there is just enough people down there to HOLD that position. If you take needed people away it leaves a hole that someone could exploit.

There's a much bigger picture out there and the US is doing a fine job of covering all the bases while working ASAP to help the earthquake victims.

[Vendzilla]

The country is on ruins, the fact that the US can mount a rescue effort of the magnitude that we do is amazing, talking about the time it takes is superfluous. Support was on the ground in a very good time, people that it affected will never be happy with the time if they had to wait 5 minutes.
One Aircraft carrier can supply water and power and medical help like no other one thing that the president can send. As it's being sent it can stock up on supplies from incoming aircraft. My daughter was on the Ronald Reagan when it lent aid to the Philippines.
I just hope that the aid that is sent is used in the positive way, unlike the reported money we have already sent that country over the last five years that has been stolen by a corrupt government

[justinsain]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

The country is on ruins, the fact that the US can mount a rescue effort of the magnitude that we do is amazing, talking about the time it takes is superfluous. Support was on the ground in a very good time, people that it affected will never be happy with the time if they had to wait 5 minutes.
One Aircraft carrier can supply water and power and medical help like no other one thing that the president can send. As it's being sent it can stock up on supplies from incoming aircraft. My daughter was on the Ronald Reagan when it lent aid to the Philippines.
I just hope that the aid that is sent is used in the positive way, unlike the reported money we have already sent that country over the last five years that has been stolen by a corrupt government

Isn't it funny how some people think you can just start up an aircraft carrier and get right to the scene like it was your local ambulance responding to a 911 call.

They lost power. No electricity at the airport means no lights on the landing strip. The port was heavily damaged. So many variables to contend with. I too hope the aid is used in a positive way. It will take a military presence to distribute the supplies to keep desperate people from taking drastic actions.

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by crockett

We did have people there with in 24/hrs.. However you can't pick up a naval vessel and move it instantly. We also can't just send in aircraft when there was no functioning airport. Our Naval vessels were in route in under 24/hrs but they don't just show up instantly.

US special forces went in by the second day and were setting up a temporary control tower, after that was done planes started moving things in. (don't forget this happened late in the day, meaning nothing could be sent in till the second day anyway)

Not to mention Hatti is it's own country, we can't just start rolling in troops with out their permission, or until it become apparent that their own govt is in cable of requesting the help. I believe it was a mix of the two that happened.

This wasn't like a Hurricane that people were prepared to send in aid right away, this was a normal day in Hatti then 5 mins later it's destroyed.

The time it took us to get troops into Hatti and get things moving, was actually a bit faster than what it took under Bush with Katrina, which shows how incompetent the Bush admin was. What happened under Bush should have been criminal TBH.

not sure if this is entirely correct, considering there is still areas surrounding new orleans that would have been able to be used and to get supplies in, as well as different avenues such as helicopters etc that could have been utilized to drop basic foodstuffs such as water/supplies in the major areas of disaster.. they had the warnings..

canada offered to get our search and rescue teams and support ships there within 48 hours.. the naval vessels were denied for whatever reason i'm not judging on, our search and rescue teams were accepted and upon arrival were not utilized due to 'safety' issues of looting etc

your point of 'waiting for request of assistance' is a good one, but i would have thought due to the international base and past history of assitance, not to mention the Haiti ambassador requesting assistance within hours of the disaster, it would matter very little for formal permission, considering the capital is a waste land and there is no more effective government

[The Heron]

Haiti isn't america, why the fuck should we send help instantly??

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by The Heron

Haiti isn't america, why the fuck should we send help instantly??

It's a double edge sword of sorts
We as a nation try to help in any catastrophe
We are never thanked, but are vilified

Some reports say we have given Haiti about a billion dollars over the last 5 years, now we're going to give them more, yet most that live there live on about $2 a day. Just a little corruption.

[EscortBiz]

we always help others quicker than we help our own, remember how fast we helped after the tsunami

[PornMD]

Unfortunately we haven't developed teleportation yet. 12 hours is not bad.