Are PUBLIC SECTOR unions really needed?
 

No doubt private unions are needed. No one here remembers how fucked up things were. Dangerous mines. Serf-like conditions. Fucked up meat packing plants. Private unions push worker safety and helped alleviate the conditions of the working masses. Amen.

But what about PUBLIC (aka government sector) unions? Anyone hear of the great DMV Flood or Title Registration Cave-In or slave-like toil at the DMV (except if you're unlucky enough to be in line) or overseer beatdowns of teachers in classrooms? Me neither.

What have been the effect of public unions on pensions, state deficits, and flexibility in state hiring?

Voice your support or concern here.

no comment

NO,
Most of the money in Union Dues, goes back to the political people supporting these Gov unions, and giving raises. Never ending circle!

Say it, man. We're all adults here :thumbsup

power to the workers ...

The money from dues going to political issues was the only thing I had against being in a union. They made sure we got better pay and the working conditions were taking care of by osha, but the unions set mileage, tools, training, things like that. I just think that being in a union working for the public, you shouldn't be excempt from a recession. After thinking about it for a while, I'm against them taking away bargaining rights, but I'm also against having to join a union to get a job with the state. Conflicted!

Very simply. NO!

Unions ... especially public sector unions can often get too much power and go way too far.

I used to work in an office where if you wanted to move a piece of equipment like a photocopier we actually had to have a union representitive present and in some cases union permission. You virtually had to kill someone to get the sack, and if you worked too hard you often got in trouble with your union. It was crazy. Unions do serve some important roles, but more often than not they just stand in the way of progress and productivity.. especially public sector unions.


But what I don't understand over there about this fiasco that is playing out, is how can politicians just up and leave and go into hiding, yet not get sacked or get in any trouble? You pulled that stunt here and your career would be toast.

you are funny lol If union didnt deal with political issues and big corps did. Then they can push for laws that make the unions ineffective and fuck the workers in the ass.
Also WI isnt about money it was about union busting. The middle class is stinking they keep cutting money fucking the worker. Considering the schooling one needs to be a teacher and considering the hours they work. I know a teacher he puts in a about 12 hrs a day for work. For what 50 K ? Also I dont hear the republican politicians saying cut our pay ,benefits and life long pension. Its all talk to get people like yourself to vote against your own interests. Its very sad

they have pros and cons. cons being bad employees are hard to fire, too much red tape, etc. pros being, cuts can't be made without the union agreeing to them.

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A higher tax rate hurts the low and middle class.

You know I'm a libertarian, so I guess you already know my answer.

Sadly the answer is really yes and no.

Right to Work is the only way, screw unions... :pimp

Been giving the rich and big biz all types of taxes breaks and dont see all types of employment coming back. The unions been giving back years and they are greedy thats too funny. When people wake up it will be too late.fuck its already too late. And when the repub president comes in and 10 percent unemployment is the new normal and the middle class will keep strinking. People will actually have the balls to be surprised.

So if you are a union member, something you can't avoid if you want the job and those dues you pay go toward beliefs that are not yours, you're ok with that?

I just put a kid thru the public school system, it's fucked. It's needs an overhaul. There are a lot of shitty teachers out there that either don't care or because of whinny little politically correct attitudes can't manage the kids in the class room and have a 22% drop out rate in the US because of it, tell me where this is working?

In June the house voted down a Republican proposal to cut federal employees' 2011 pay raise.

The 227-to-183 vote against the pay freeze was applauded by federal unions and other employee groups, which said it would have unnecessarily hurt federal employees at a time when the government is facing many challenges.

http://www.federalsoup.com/forum_pos...-raise-in-2011


I'm waiting for your rebuttal!

Lets see first, the reason the job has good pay and benefits is because of the union. Then if u dont like unions viewpoint dont take the job. Now wi they are number two in the country for educatuon, in madison 94 percent of the students go on to college. Its union busting plain and simple.its ashame aworking man like yourself has drank this bullshit koolaid

Unions have been giving back? Then why do they only pay 0.5% to their own retirement?

Taxing business will create jobs? Please....lol

If you do not like working 12 hour days and the terms you employer sets dont take the job.

I don't think unions are needed at all. They might have been needed at the time - a long time ago - to protect the workers, but now it's gotten out of control. Employees use unions to get a good paying job, do as little work as possible, and stay in an entry level position for decades.

I worked for the phone company. I was stunned to see fifty year old men and women who had the same entry level position for thirty years.

:thumbsup:thumbsup

Wisconsin as a state has one of the highest graduation levels for high school at 90%.

Which is still a lot lower than when I went to high school.

Why?

Right now those teachers you say are so saintly are getting doctor notes from doctors in the crowds that aren't even their doctors, which is breaking their contract agreement, they are public employee's, they shouldn't be allowed to walk off the job, what about the kids?

You want to know who to blame? Barry has had control of the house and senate for 2 years and what has improved in the US? He even ignored his own words in saying that we need to cut spending in his proposal for a new spending and investing budget?

if you think libya is bad, they did that in america too.. dropping bombs on striking workers etc

those whom forget history..

Yes, of course ...

It changed since you went to school for two reasons first one there was a mother and father in a house and dad could work and make enough alone to take care of his family. Secondly tax rates were higher more money for education.

unions are more or less broken in the US anyway. this is just the final attack.

We didn't have illegal aliens sucking up free breakfast and lunches and getting bi lingual teachers.

Local high school had to hire one teacher for 10 students that immigrated here from Laos.

My parents were divorced, step dad didn't join a union till I was over 21

We didn't have money from the state lottery

You know what im talking about your not stupid. Im done go on drinking the koolaid.

This is the key here. Participation % in retirement and other benefits. Private participation, if its even available, is much higher. :Oh crap

Generalize much, i know union people that work harder than you could imagine. Physical back breaking labor. Unions arent needed anymore lets see wages have been flat for yrs. No more pension so wall st can disolve your. 401k tomorrow the market goes in the shitter.benefits are getting smaller and smaller while exec pay is getting larger and larger. It seems they are needed more than ever maybe when we are making 30 cents an hr. Then maybe people will realize we were drinking the bullshit koolaid we arent one of them they just needed us to get their agenda thru.

Tony I posted this in another thread. But carter did this to the federal workers when he was in office. Are they suffering? Federal employees don't have collective bargaining anymore and they are doing fine

Should public unions exist?

Do government officials fuck people over?

Yes and yes.

PS. Vendzilla, aren't you the diehard Republican, who loves his freedom, privacy, individual rights, and all that good stuff? If anything, you should be all for unions. It's a band of individual citizens getting together, to speak out against the government.

I stopped being a republican when they brought in the religious right. I do believe in unions with some exceptions.
I don't think that it's appropriate for government workers to be forced into a union then have their dues used towards one party, and be told to vote for one party.
I have two union cards, IUEC and Teamsters.

And everyone, democrat and republican, independent and libertarian should be for individual citizens getting together to speak out against the government, anything less is not American.

The unions are blaming the republicans for wanting to get rid of them, when it was the democrats that got rid of the unions representing the federal government.

But we have been fed the BS for a long time, like we are lead to believe that the Mayflower landed on Plymouth rock to be free from religious persecution, when in fact, the Americas was the second stop and Plymouth rock was the second stop in the Americas, they landed in Plymouth rock because according to ships logs they were out of beer!

Barry has been caught in so many lies it isn't very funny, all he wanted was the backing of the unions, but has he done anything to help the unions? the unions as we know them will be pretty much dead after this. And with it the funding to the democrat party, that's sad!
We need a balance and we haven't had one in 10 years, last time we had a balanced budget, 10 years!

Unions Needed
 

Work in the US & get hurt or get killed on the job, the state & and union will help you fight for collecting workers comp. If you're a federal employee, even the union is barred from helping you.
Look at any contract you sign with a bank, car rental, credit card, software purchase, etc. They dictate all the terms, you can't change anything. Same as employees with no unions.

Indiana state workers had their collective bargaining taken away 6 years ago. Why didn't that make the news like this and how have the state workers suffered?

ALways interesting about workers who go on about the "the right not to join a union", when the union wins a pay rise, do they then refuse to take it?

A union is a democratic organisation of it members to promote the interests of it members and workers in general. What is wrong with excepting the majority decision if you work in the same place?

All depends on where you work!
I work at a job where the union was strong, and now they were bought out.
This company now, fuckes everyone, fires you for no good reson. People that have been there 5,10,15,18 years all let go for any reason, why it is a Right to work state.

Anyone who says find another job, can GFY.