Here We Go Again - CCBill Inside Please
 

Now before anyone goes thinking I'm posting this thread as a knee-jerk reaction please understand that I have already sent emails to my CCBill reps with absolutely no response. Therefore this thread. Plus, this "pattern" which I will describe has been going on for at least 2 weeks.

Sales are down on the CCBill side, obviously. Anyone else experiencing this?

I sent a shitload of traffic to my network these past couple weeks, thinking it's the Holidays, time of year, etc, accounting for low sales. But then I see my percentages/form hits/submissions/denials going whackadoodle so I reach out to CCBill: Hey CCBill, what's going on? Are you scrubbing like a motherfucker again? Because my denials have been through the roof....

No response. Test signups, everything seems fine. But then hours - HOURS - go by without a single sale. Now, I don't run a single website y'all, I run 26! So we never, ever go more than 2 hours (max) without a sale, and even that is highly unusual.

So I switch the cascade to my secondary processer, Epoch (wouldn't you?) and sales come flooding in like it's Noah and the Ark.

"Keep the cascade at Epoch then Mister Peabody!" Oh, I would, and I will if this shit continues, but Epoch does not do "splits", you see, and I need to pay my models, plus my Affiliate Program is a CCBill program...

Bottom Line: I increase traffic, I increase traffic, I increase traffic - and still (it appears) CCBill has me "topped off" at a maximum number of transactions (sales and rebills) per day. No other explanation for why, no matter WHAT I do (lately), including quadrupling (good) traffic, my sales always, somehow, miraculously, remain about the same. WTF?

HOW, CCBill, can I, or anyone else for that matter, grow a business if sales "max out" and "level off" to a consistent, steady sales rate? 4 x the traffic = the same sales.

Sorry to go public but, as I said, I have tried for a couple weeks now to find out what the Christ is going on to no avail.

Anyone else experiencing anything similar?

I await some (positive) explanation and action regarding my account CCBill. Thank you.

how did you get 4 times the traffic?

where did it come from?

Interesting read top notch.
:2 cents:

me love those weekly ccbill fuckup stats threads
:(

Am I reading correctly that you feel CCBill is limiting the amount of money they can make as a company by capping your sales?

CCBill fucking sucks, something is going on. Im only an small affiliate but the patterns are too obvious to ignore if you ask me. Its like clock work with ccbill, for 2-3 days I'll do 10 sales then nothing for 2 weeks then sales again for 2-3 days then back to nothing.

Ive been slowly selling off my sites promoting ccbill programs. Done with them

If only it were quite that simple.... and if Mr. Peabody could have a day of 200% join form submissions like I posted about in another thread he might not be so upset.

I can ditto and confirm 100% the same patterns and weirdness as Mr. Peabody

Its sad when someone thinks within the box and says..."why would ccbill not want you to make money"


He is right and I can concur that a ceiling is placed on certain accounts for how many transactions can be made...

the big question is why??

Hi BV, thanks for popping in. :)

The increased traffic is coming from 3 of the biggest tube sites on the planet and my sites convert like crazy from tube traffic. :)

THey are spinning the Scrub dial hard right now..

you do realize that they are CHARGED on denials? Why would they want to deny cards? ;/

I am sorry for my delay. I received your email last night and have been investigating but I still owe you a reply.

We have not had any problems processing sales this week that I am aware of and I can guarantee you that there is no limit or "max out". We are in the business of processing sales and it would do us absolutely no good to reject good sales on any account.

Our analysts are taking a look at your sales and decline data and I will get back to you here as quickly as I can.

Thank you Paul, I do really appreciate that. While I do understand the perpetual argument CCBill (and others make, even here in this thread) "why would a processing company deny/block sales when they are in the business of making max money, etc," I also understand scrubs, merch accounts, Visa regs, bank regs, limits, put-throughs and a zillion other factors that would not affect an account specifically but could "contribute" to an overall change in how CCBill puts through transactions. For a limited time, of course. :)

Anyway, it's frustrating to wake up to 2-3 sales when, if you look Paul for transactions that occur between Midnight and Noon in the past, my "norm" is 3-5 times that. Thanks for checking into this Paul tho, very much appreciated! :)

I am sorry but you are incorrect. This is not the case and never has been.

All billers have these cycles.

No way to prove whether it's intentional or not, all you can do is diversify and then optimize.

Billers are optimizing too, but what's optimal for them might not be optimal for you.

Get a few of them and try to make sure that you can swap out cascades when you need to. Just do what works best for you and don't burn bridges unless you have to. In a few weeks you may find Epoch converting your traffic less and get a boost when you switch back.

First, you mustn't have logged into Epoch's admin lately because there's an announcement when you do that Epoch now does offer splitting accounts.

I don't notice sales being any better at Epoch when sales through CCBILL are very slow - 9 out of 10 times when I switch things are the same at Epoch.

So a 4 month span with varied traffic, varied content, varied price points, various days of week,etc..

With form hits as high as 100, with form hits as low as 4

with form submission percentages as high as 100%

with form submission percentages as low as 2%

How can you explain a maximum of 4 approvals as the highest approval number possible in a 4 month span?

Don't you think just one day in 4 months there would be 5 sales, or maybe 6 sales...no for 4 months straight highest amount of sales approved is 4...if there were 10 submissions there were only 4 approvals

You say no such thing as usual the data speaks a different language

just like you want me to believe a 200% join form submission percentage is "ACCURATE"

I have never understood all these types of threads. How would they scrub without you knowing? Are they taking potential members money and calling them denials? Then they wouldn't have a pass? You don't think you'd get any emails from customers if that was the case? Are they simply not notifying you about a transaction and giving out logins? Then you would be able to see logins that you don't recognize in your user management file. I simply don't see how they could do this to anybody without us knowing, especially with how many clients they have and how many customers use them. What are you actually implying could be a possibility here?

Im not saying there couldn't be something but I surely can't think of any way they could without us knowing.

I agree with what you wrote and I never accuse any processor of doing anything nefarious (at least I hope that's not the case and I apologize if it ever appears that I do). I also think it's just companies doing what's best for them and once in a while you get caught in the net, so to speak. But if a pattern continues for more than a few days I do begin to wonder. :)



This is why you are one of my marketing heroes Mutt! :) I wish I could have your experience.

I guess we are just two sad people asking the same "within the box" question :winkwink:

I'm happy that I've had one chargeback and two refunds, for the whole year so far.

I'm happy that in January my net with CCBill was 274% higher then it was in December.

I'm happy that in February my net with CCbill was 44% higher then is was in January.

I'm happy that in March my net with CCBill was 18% higher then it was in February.

The increase in net income was due to step one, of a new 5 step business strategy, being implemented.

Guess whos fault it's going to be if I don't adapt and continue to grow? mine.

My declining growth has nothing to do with my credit card processor and everything to do with indications that I need to implement the next phase of my business strategy.

Hey Mr. Peabody did you catch the other thread which is a very recent thread about logins and pass being issued by ccbill but joins not being credited this is the second or third I am aware of...

again don't say swirlsgirl is accusing them...these are not my words but the words of others

have a look here...
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1019086

not trying to start drama, but using investigative skills here to try and connect dots...

All of these concerns seem directly related....

1.suspiciously LOW join form submissions - as low as 0% - 2% when normally 35%

2.suspiciously HIGH join form submissions - as high as 200% for the day when 100% should be the highest possible join form submission percentage

3.Login and pass being added without sale credits...reported by multiple webmasters on gfy not my words just search GFY

4. zero to no sales with ccbill...then switch to alternate processors and sales flurries happens instantly

5. Ran a side by side test with merchant account and for 1 weekend end of march... the merchant account out performed ccbill almost 6 to 1

6. Vague and elusive and contradictory answers by ccbill reps

Its getting to the point where I don't even want to release any new content until I have a payment option for customers that will not give me such headaches.

Whats the point in releasing new stuff...and tripling your traffic, if your stats are going to not change with it?

This is a great observation and I am not in a postion to answer it 100% accurately as I only know MY account. LOL However, let me be clear here: I am NOT "accusing" CCBill (or anyone else) of "stealing" sales, or shaving, or doing anything like that. No, what I am trying to understand is how sales seem to "average out" over a period of time and not grow, even though traffic, content, sites, etc have all increased (and will continue to).

I don't think processers are doing anything that would be "noticed" as anything fishy. No, I think processors do what is in their best interest to stay in business and sometimes, SOMEtimes, a particular account may get affected, short-term.

I hope this doesn't come off sounding paranoid, cynical or accusatory. LOL

Don't mess with Mr. Peabody ...

you and SwirlsGirl should go into business together.

It's usually the fraud scrub going up and down. Processors can choose to allow or deny

1) traffic from countries with higher chargeback rates,
2) transactions where the billing address and join IP do not coincide
3) transactions from cardholders who have charged back in the past
4) transactions from card #'s/billing addresses/ip addresses that are in their private blacklist, or public blacklists
5) transactions that have been attempted more than one or two times

etc.

Most businesses that monitor quality will loosen up if they need more volume, and tighten up if the volume is spiking unexplainably or quality is lower than optimal.

I have thought ad infinite about this and that does become the big question how would we know...you mention the part about emails from customers...

I have noticed emails disappearing from my inbox before but of course that's just paranoia...no one could be that methodical as to remove emails from one's inbox

I also suggest you check around gfy and see there are others who have reported added logins from ccbill without being credited for sales... for everyone that posts about it...there just may be others who rather not post

We're doing just fine with CCbill :)

Hope you get your problems solved.

Thanks man - your shit is looking GOOD lately dude! Hope things are doing well for you. :)

I don't get it... Why are you still using a third party processor when you are making that many sales?

That's a fair explanation to what could potentially be happening, however I would think that's a pretty reasonable thing they would be doing if that were the case. Theyve been in business a long time and if they think it's good to approve them or not good enough to approve them, shouldn't we trust them? I mean, they make money when we make money. That's why I am always curious about people not trusting them. I mean, we should never be blind and always question but unless there is a sign of something besides sales spiking, then I don't see a reason to worry. Mainly because we're dealing with people, there will always be odd trends and spikes. Hell I just went the past two weeks with having all my sales in the first 12 hours of the day and none the next. Two weeks before that, all of them were in the other 12 hour period. Sometimes there are good mornings, sometimes there are bad evenings. When you've been in business long enough, youre going to notice some very strange trends and bad patches eventually.

Also what Chris said

"you do realize that they are CHARGED on denials? Why would they want to deny cards? ;/"

This deserves to be quoted. This has been on my to do list for a while and I am only running 1 site. It was my first paysite on this network so I wanted to start off with a well known third party processor. I don't see myself using one down the road, that's for sure. You should definitely be looking into that.

:2 cents::2 cents::2 cents:

why not?
FTV is huge, so are several others, and they only use ccbill maybe epoch now

Also. The percent of denials going up could potentially be from certain traffic sources giving you more traffic. Some traffic sources have higher international traffic than others and if you are receiving higher traffic levels from them, your denials will rise. Try to see if you can find a matching trend with Google Analytics. Just an idea

Then what's your explanation for myself and many other webmasters and program owners reporting exactly what Mr Peabody is noticing? This is not the first or the third or the fifth thread I've seen saying the same exact thing. It's gotten to the point for me personally where I'm not writing any new posts for CCBill sponsors or building new sites because while my NATS sponsors are still converting CCBill sponsor sales come in spurts, then nothing, then fine for a few days then nothing. Overall sales are way down compared to NATS.

I changed my Sterling Cash ref code to CCBill last year and had to change it back across my entire network because I got ZERO sales from them using CCBill for months where before that I averaged 3-4 sales a week. After I switched back to NATS my sales miraculously reappeared.

So nice try.

Don't forget to deduct your credit card processing fees on your taxes :thumbsup

Just because some big companies are doing it, doesn't mean there aren't better options. lol theres room for improvement within all companies

Some people simply don't like dealing with certain areas and will pay people to handle them. I think he was simply pointing out that there is a better option. Some people just don't think to do it themselves.

yeah a 200% join form submission percentage should not make anyone paranoid...its quite normal and can be explained away as a glitch or bug

Why not? Because you make more money per sale, that's why not.

Just because FTV does it or anyone else for that matter doesn't make it right. It just means they are throwing away income to percentage fees that could be going in their own pocket. Or maybe they have a special sweetheart deal. I don't know. Do you?

Besides, do you know how many companies I've watched go out of biz over the years doing something just because they saw someone else doing it.. and had no idea besides what they saw on the surface what the reality of the situation really was.

CCBill are great people and they run a great company, but with that said you need the right tools to grow your business. You need some NATS :) We've spoken before and you know we'll help you get transitioned over well and make sure it's as painless as possible for you.

There are a tremendous amount of features in NATS which you can use to monitor your sites & sales and to tweak everything to maximize your potential. An increase of 5% here, 2% there, 3% here, it all adds up after a while to quite a bit. Even if you ONLY increased your sales by 5% with NATS, that's surely worth $150/mo (the starting price of NATS).

There are endless ways you can optimize your business with NATS, you need to be taking advantage of as many of them as you can these days. Don't limit yourself or your business by being dependent upon one company. If you want to throw a merchant account or an alternative payment system in the mix, don't be limited by your backend. If you want to get complex reporting and A-B testing of various options & price points, don't be limited by your backend. If you want to offer your affiliates EVERYTHING they need to make the most off of your sites, don't be limited by your backend. The list goes on and on. Don't limit yourself.

NATS 4.1 is finally ready for its official release. You can be installed directly onto it within the next few days, and it is absolutely amazing.

An EXCELLENT question! here's my answer(s):

I've been in business for exactly 2 years and 4 months. LOL (My OWN biz, I mean; been online with other companies since about '06). I've seen almost miraculous growth these past 2 years, busting my ass (as many of you do). I've added a new website about once a month (started with 5 sites, now have 26, with 2 more being finished this week).

So:

1. I've been bizzy. LOL
2. Getting a merch account is not as easy as it may appear (ask Robbie, who has shared his experiences with getting one here on GFY)
3. WHICH merch account to get? Not all banks will deal with porn, or a "small guy" like me
4. I don't want to switch to a merch account 100% - considering NATS integrated with several processors instead - because I'm way too bizzy to write checks and all the other things needed with a merch account
5. My affiliates like the stability and certainty of payment through CCBill.

Just a few reasons. But basically, it's on my 'To Do' List. LOL


We will be speaking soon John, promise. :)