The Seinfeld "bottle scam"
 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110211/...us_bottle_scam

A memorable "Seinfeld" episode features Kramer and Newman taking thousands of cans and bottles to Michigan so they can get a nickel more per container than they would in New York, but beverage distributors say there's nothing funny when it happens for real.
In Maine, which has a more expansive bottle-redemption law than neighboring states, three people have been accused of illegally cashing in more than 100,000 out-of-state bottles and cans for deposits, the first time criminal charges have been filed in the state over bottle-refund fraud, a prosecutor said.

An estimated 90 million cans and bottles are fraudulently cashed in each year in Maine, costing beverage distributors $8 million to $10 million, said Newell Augur, executive director of the Maine Beverage Association.

---------------------------


funny thing is

" Containers sold in other states, however, carry the Maine deposit stamp because it's not cost-effective to change labeling for each state. "

so the beverage companies create the problem by putting the maine deposit stamp on all containers because its too expensive to only put it on maine containers.

So they are wasting taxpayer money to prosecute people for something the beverage companies don't even care about because it isn't cost effective for them.

99 thousand bottles and cans
99thousandbottles and canss
at ten cents a bottle
and ten cents a can
we're pulling in $500 dollars a man!


Yes, I remember that episode well. As I recall it didn't end quite the way those two boobs expected.

bottle-refund fraud fuck

how is that fraud? sounds like any other biz, buy low, sell high...

Wow i collect my cans here in AZ and when i go to CA to visit family i bring my cans to sell i didnt know i can get arrested for that.

It's fraud because you are supposed to be getting the deposit you made on the bottle or can when you bought it back. So if you paid $.05 as a deposit in NY and drove to another state and redeemed it for a $.10 depost you have defrauded the recylcing system out of $.05

so if you found a bottle on the street and redeemed it would be fraud too? You didn't buy that bottle, and are getting back someone else's deposit = fraud?

I used to drive from NY to MI to visit a girlfriend in college. I'd load up my trunk with all the empties and cash them in once I got to MI for double back.

No because you are getting the deposit that was paid on that bottle. Somebody paid the bottle deposit when they bought. If they decide to discard it and not return it, it's not fraud for you to return it.

Think of it like this. You are returning the bottle for the deposit paid on it. If you return it for a larger sum of money than the deposit that was paid on it, you're defrauding the system.

what if the discarded bottle came from another state with a lower deposit?

either way, its dumb. make despoits all the same or accept the fact that its going to happen from time to time. i do it all the time here. buy in quebec 5 cent deposit, sell in ontario, get 10 cents.

in the article they explain that they can simply label the ones made in maine and avoid the whole problem, but it would cost more to label them properly than the amount they lose to people who double dip.

I couldn't agree with you more. If it's costing the beverage companies $$ and preventing the fraud is 100% in the beverage companies hands.. if it's not cost effective for them to prevent it the state should come back to the beverage companies that it's not cost effective for them to prosecute it. :2 cents:

Exactly. how would anyone know that it's illegal to cash in a can/bottle whatever in Maine, if it was bought in another state.

It clearly states here in California at least, that the redeem value is double in Maine, nowhere on the lable does it say it's illegal to redeem the deposit in Maine.

The whole thing has no merit and I suspect will be thrown out of court.

Image going on a state wide road trip, with a bunch of friends in a camper van, save all the empties and cash them in in Maine, not knowing you are breaking a law.

Buba would love that story lol.

If you found the bottle on the side of the road, then how are you supposed to know in what state the bottle was bought and how much of that recycling tax thing was ever paid on it?

Look I don't make the laws, I'm just explaining them. Here's the definition of Fraud:

Maybe you can figure out by yourself which element is missing from your scenario.

I'm sure these people who find and collect tens of thousands of disgarded bottles and cans find a lot of those left on the streets as litter (because there are a lot of piglets walking around out there thinking the world is their toilet). These people picking up this litter are doing society a service, thus I see very little wrong with them choosing the highest paying vendor to go to for deposit money.

Hey, the problem exists because of the bottling/deposit system itself. If they had a uniform deposit across all states and provinces there would BE no issue at all. Offering 5 cents more in the next state is, by human nature, going to attract some scavengers to make the trip for the extra payout. Calling it "fraud" and complaining about it is just, well, stupid.

Either fix the problem or shut up about it I say.

The assumption you are making is that a person necessarily needs to have knowledge about a certain law in order for that person to break that law.

That is an erroneous assumption.

I think i am in the wrong business.. big money in cans

When I was a kid, a bottle of pop was 25 cents. 15 for the pop, and 10 for the bottle.

If I only had 15 cents on me, they'd let me drink it there and give the bottle right back.

Hasn't been deposits on bottles here for a loooooong time but I can remember doing quite well out of returning bottles other people were too lazy to take back when i was about 8 or 9 :)

I never remember having that in the UK. You must be old :winkwink: just playing, could have been around when I was young but never knew of it.

I quite like the deposit system though. I'm in NB Canada, certain cans are 5c or 10c deposit here, but 20c deposit in quebec. Could make a nice little earner off them.

But anyway,

It's almost like a bonus taking them back, some neighbours even use them for charitable causes, like after xmas they come round and take anyone's empties and put them into a fund for anyone who needs emergency treatment or whatever that can't afford it.

As for the making a bit extra taking them elsewhere, I say fuck it why not!

36

I think they were Schweppes bottles and i'm sure it was a 10p deposit on 1 litre which seemed a lot at the time and I could never understand other people being so lazy they would rather I got the deposit than walk back to the shop themselves.