Obama's Immigration speech
 

Ok, so I'm for giving some of the immigrants a chance, but to do it half ass is pretty messed up. I know none of what he signed will go into effect till after the new congress is in place and hope the new congress will finish the job by securing the border.

As usual, you can't believe a fucking thing that asshat in office has said

OBAMA: "It does not grant citizenship, or the right to stay here permanently, or offer the same benefits that citizens receive. Only Congress can do that. All we're saying is we're not going to deport you."

THE FACTS: He's saying, and doing, more than that. The changes also will make those covered eligible for work permits, allowing them to be employed in the country legally and compete with citizens and legal residents for better-paying jobs.


OBAMA: "Although this summer, there was a brief spike in unaccompanied children being apprehended at our border, the number of such children is now actually lower than it's been in nearly two years."

THE FACTS: The numbers certainly surged this year, but it was more than a "brief spike." The number of unaccompanied children apprehended at the border has been on the rise since the 2011 budget year. That year about 16,000 children were found crossing the border alone. In 2012, the Border Patrol reported more than 24,000 children, followed by more than 38,800 in 2013. In the past budget year, more than 68,361 children were apprehended.

OBAMA: "Overall, the number of people trying to cross our border illegally is at its lowest level since the 1970s. Those are the facts."

THE FACTS: Indeed, in the 2014 budget year ending Sept. 30 the Border Patrol made 486,651 arrests of border crossers, among the fewest since the early 1970s. But border arrests have been on the rise since 2011.

The decline in crossings is not purely, or perhaps even primarily, due to the Obama administration. The deep economic recession early in his presidency and the shaky aftermath made the U.S. a less attractive place to come for work. The increase in arrests since 2011 also can be traced in part to the economy ? as the recovery improved, more people came in search of opportunity.


OBAMA: "When I took office, I committed to fixing this broken immigration system. And I began by doing what I could to secure our borders."

THE FACTS: He overlooked the fact that he promised as a candidate for president in 2008 to have an immigration bill during his first year in office and move forward on it quickly. He never kept that promise to the Latino community.

FACT CHECK: Obama's claims on illegal immigration - Yahoo News

Wouldn't it be nice to have a president that didn't talk like a lawyer and just told the truth?

I knew I could count on you!

http://compassionatesleepsolutions.c...ds-on-head.jpg

Lol Rochard. Haha.

What exactly did I say that's wrong, and do you still have me on ignore?

obama!! :thumbsup

He's just pandering to his ultra-left base and the hispanic groups, this is all about 2016 and really has nothing to do with immigration.

If he really wanted reform he would have given the new congress a deadline to pass a bill under the threat of executive action if they didn't, all this is doing is getting the base ginned up and guaranteeing that there will be some ultra-right republicans frothing at the mouth that he can point to and say "see how much they hate you immigrants?"

Poll: 48 percent of Americans oppose immigration executive action

I hate all these scumbag politicians, there really needs to be a gallows outside the capitol building. :mad:

I took you off ignore just now - mostly for the comedy value.

What did you say that's wrong? I have no idea. I didn't even read it. No matter what Obama did or didn't do, you are going to rant and rave about it. You just don't like Obama.

I honestly do not even know what the President said last night, and frankly, I don't care. It has zero impact on me. Five million people will now be able to stay in the United States and take jobs? So.... Nothing at all has changed because they are already here and already taking up jobs.

This is so much bigger than just an immigration policy. Obamaboy there just set up the entire Republican party. First, the Republican party was going on the offensive to attack a lame duck president but instead Obama just sucked the wind out of their sails and put them on the defensive. Then eventually the Republican party will have two options - pass a bill on immigration or this will become a huge issue for the next election, and the Republican party will need the Hispanic vote then. The Republican party will not be able to have a serious run at the White House without the Hispanic vote.

Exactly. He is a lame duck president so what any one thinks about him is irrelevant. Instead, he's setting the stage for the election in 2016.

I was thinking that too. The GOP is screwed. If they fight it, they lose the election in 2016 for sure. If they let it go, their base will be furious and they will lose the election anyway but for a different reason.

I'd love to see an Obama vs Boener chess game. Or Obama vs Mitch McConnel.

lame duck doesn't apply here.

an executive order is far from lame duck status, exact opposite actually.

Thanks Obama! Way to prioritize what's important.

At this point politics has become nothing more than a game. It's no longer about doing what is right, it's about keeping your party in power.

Here is a great example.... In NJ, they passed a law that prohibits inhumane confinement of breeding pigs in gestation crates, which was supported by 93% of the people in New Jersey. Instead, Governor Christie is going to veto it. An overwhelming majority of the residents in his state want this law, and Governor Christie is going to veto this because.... He doesn't want to upset the people of.... Iowa.... Really?

It turns out the Iowa caucuses is very important in politics and helps to determine who run for nomination at the upcoming national conventions for both parties. Governor Christie, in the event he decides to run, will need to be nominated so he needs to be friendly with the people of Iowa.

How does this law in NJ affect the people of Iowa? Iowa grows more pigs than any other state in the country.

That's pure bullshit right there.

The senate passed an immigration bill over 500 days ago and it was truly bipartisan. Congress sat on it and the speaker refused to give it a up or down vote. They were not planning on doing anything, the speaker was asked after their big win if they vote on the immigration bill and he was very vague.

I agree with everything that Obama said last night in his speech when he was talking about the people from Mexico in the U.S. "illegally".

But just like "Health Care"...the govt. is doing it all wrong.

Instead of all this bullshit and "securing the border" like the Republicans want to do (building our version of the Berlin Wall)...how about they simply re-write the rules to gain citizenship?

Why does it have to take years and cost a ton of money to become a citizen?

The United States that I grew up in was a beacon of hope and freedom. The Statue of Liberty is inscribed: "Give me your tired, your poor/Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free"

The United States I live in now seems to have lost it's way.

As I said, there is no need for "amnesty" or "securing the border" or any of this other nonsense.

People SHOULD be able to travel freely back and forth to Mexico. We certainly did for a couple of hundred years with no problems.

There shouldn't even be a "path to citizenship". It's already TOO FUCKING HARD if it takes a "path".
Most of us wouldn't even be here if our great-great-great grandparents had to try and jump through the hoops that our govt. has set up for immigrants.

If people want to come to live in the United States...let them. Especially the Mexican people.
My family owned citrus groves in Florida and I can first hand tell you that they are some of the most hard working people I have ever known.

I guess they had a plan, guess it worked

Right now I see 5 million entering the work force all at once, giving the unemployment rate some new numbers and potentially dropping the median wage further, and some how 5 million new people will get on the Obamacare dole and further adjust the cost of those that still have to pay for medical insurance.

Love how you can have an opinion on something you claim to have not read, there is the comedy

What makes this so entertaining is that you oppose Obama no matter what he does.

This is what made you sound so retarded, I agreed with what he did, just stated he didn't go far enough by securing the border. He did state he was going to do something about the border, but being so vague sounds like when the Obama Administration said the border was already secure.

He's giving immigrants a chance, I'm for that. Just want the secure the border. This post, if you had read it, just shows the real facts as opposed to the lies he said.

You're complaining about the truth!

The move is partly altruistic...partly political.

He wants to give the Republicans a chance to make themselves look bad, which they most surely will do because they can't help themselves. They're very skilled at it, in fact. Just look at the Obamacare lawsuit they're finally putting into action.

They're going to spend the next 2 years ensuring they don't get back into the White House. I honeslty wish they would get their act together, because the government can't function when one side is guided by special interest groups like Heritage Action. They're responsible for the government shutdown last year, and they'll be responsible for the shutdown that happens over immigration. Boehner really has no choice.

I don't agree with Obama taking this path, but we all know that congress will do nothing -- and they've been given more than a chance to be the heroes in this situation. The bill has been sitting in the House for over 500 days but Heritage won't let them take a vote on it because they're afraid it might pass.

With a new congress coming in that's a majority, just how the hell can you say they will do nothing? And as far as Obama making the congress look bad, did you sleep through the election results? Did you not see Obama's approval ratings?

They are already in the "work force". Just not being counted.

Growing up in Florida, and now living in Vegas...I see them everywhere.

The only reason they are "illegal" is because the govt. created their "illegality".

As I said...the easiest and most sane way is to remove the insanity of bureaucracy that the govt. created for people to become citizens in the first place.

I've been hearing about this since the 1970's. And for it to take YEARS and thousands of dollars to become a citizen is ridiculous.

If a man wants to seek opportunity...then why shouldn't he be able to? What happened to the U.S. being a beacon of hope and freedom for the world?

We are a nation of immigrants. And as I said...you and I would not be here today if our ancestors had to apply for citizenship and go through the expense and long years of waiting (after being on the waiting list for several years)

That really gave me a chuckle :1orglaugh


Is it altruistic to say to people "I'm not going to kick you out for the next two years, but once I'm out of office and you are no longer my problem well then... good luck!"?

There is no such thing as a truly altruistic politician, from time to time they try to paint themselves as such by "... trying to better the plight of our fellow man" while they are gleefully giving away other people's money in an effort to buy more votes for their party and calling it altruism, but you have to remember that politicians are part of a sub-category of humanity along with pimps, rapists and telemarketers (with apologies to pimps and telemarketers) and as such shouldn't ever be trusted.

Obama never does anything that might not score him some political points, just like all the other political scum.

No, this was pure political theater using peoples lives and designed solely to try to get advantage over the "other" side.














In case you hadn't noticed the political ruling class pretty much makes me sick :throwup

We have fallen from the beacon of hope status in the last decade and we are a nation of immigrants. My family came from two different directions. First my name sake came thru legal means at Ellis island in 1901. My grandmothers side has been here all along as native Americans.

With all the recent scare of Eboli and other illness coming from people that should have never been allowed in the country, I think the open border idea has it's flaws. Security concerns should keep the border closed to all those that pose a threat to the country like that guy that crossed the border several times and was sent back with no punishment, even though it's a felony at that point, just to kill those police officers up by Sacramento.

With threats like Isis and other Islam Jihadist. I think it only prudent to close the southern border and to say we can't is not looking at the history of this country. We can do anything! I mean we do it at JFK airport, why not the southern border?

That IS pure bullshit. I heard about this yesterday - a real shame. Now tens of thousands of animals will suffer because Christie wants to be president some day.

@Vendzilla:
My point is that if your family had to go through what a person does today to gain citizenship...you wouldn't be here.

If it had taken years and years plus thousands of dollars to get through Ellis Island...we'd all be screwed.

As for Muslim "terrorists" coming through Mexico?
I'm not of the persuasion that any of us should be living our lives in fear of the "boogeyman".
Crazy motherfuckers are always gonna do crazy shit. And creating a wall just like the communists did in Germany after WW2 is NOT the answer to anything in my humble opinion.

This is 100% on point. If anyone had any idea the amount of time/money/lawyers/investment risk/education levels etc to get even a VISA into the united states (not guaranteed citizenship) Your head would spin.

That's why immigration reform has stalled for so long, because the people that have to go at it legally, don't want to take a backseat to the ones that didn't.

I agree with you. Making immigration easier for law abiding people is the way it should be.


Well, maybe...but aren't many of them already working, but just for "cash" or "under the table"?

And didn't Obama say in his speech that they could come forward, register, get their work permits, and then Pay Taxes? Assuming all 5 million are working, this sounds like a great way for the US Government to gain some much needed tax dollars...

You could also say that Obama just gained 5 Million new democratic voters which I'm sure pisses a few righties off too...


I keep hearing this expression but I'm not really sure what it means. What does it really mean to "Secure the border"? Do you mean build a fence, and secure it with cops or guards? Is this the literal meaning of "Secure the border" or am I missing something?

Why on Earth doesn't Washington D.C. simply CHANGE the criteria for citizenship back to a sane process?

Obviously they made it incredibly difficult some decades ago on purpose. It's time to change it back to a way for "the poor huddled masses" to once again be able to seek their future as U.S. citizens again.

I'm not scared of that. I agree with what Obama said in his speech. It's a GOOD thing. It's what made the U.S. such a strong country in the first place.

I don't mean to get into this with you, but are you personally afraid of immigrants? Do you think they carry disease?

It doesn't cost thousands, it cost $595 for an application and $85 for a finger print fee. Yes, congress has talked about raising that and there are ways of getting it for free.

I just had a good friend become a citizen, it took her a few years, but she did it legally.

And I'm not talking about a wall, a wall is useless in most areas along the border. We can build a virtual wall using sensors and drones. Enforce the law, they get caught, they get booked and sent back, period. If they do it again, it's a felony and they do time. This is the law now, but not enforced

You honestly have no idea what you are talking about.

Do you think you would personally have the balls to qualify for an Eb-5?
Are you ready to write that check for 1 million dollars? create 10 full time jobs?

All for 2 years of conditional residence?

No wonder people aren't lining up for that.


EB-5 visa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

How about an H1-b? You better have a graduate degree, experience and luck on your site. They give 65,000 out a year, does that sound like a lot? Sure, except that 160,000 + apply for it. That gets you a whopping 3 years in the united states.

I had no idea it was that difficult to get a visa....

Ask me if I give a shit how many get it, the million dollar one is for the people that can afford it.

My girls boss, his wife just became a citizen, it was from a country other than Mexico and she didn't have any problems. I think Citizenship, if you want it, you better earn it.

It's not suppose to be an open gate

Another friend, who has starred in several feature adult films just got her's. She's from near Prague. t took a few years, she worked on Visa's the whole time, but she's a citizen now.

Both of these people are not millionaires, so blow that out your ass.

Did you read that In the past budget year, more than 68,361 children were apprehended.

Kinda puts a different light on your number, we can't take them all, our economy can't handle that many.

Maybe not an "open gate", but it shouldn't be something that is so hard to do.

As I keep saying...if your family had to go through this kind of crazy process to go through Ellis Island, you wouldn't be here.

Entry to this country should be accessible to any man who wants to come here and be a part of it. Why not? It's what made this country great.

To me this is clearly a political power play.

If he really cared about passing immigration reform he could have tackled it years ago when they held all three houses, but I think he and the democrats knew this was a sensitive issue for republicans and they kept it in their pocket as a secret weapon.

There was a great article in the New York Times yesterday that talked about how some republican leaders are quietly very worried about this. They now have a fine like to walk. After the last presidential election they realize that they need to get a larger percentage of the minority vote if they are going to win the White House. If they come out too strongly against what Obama is doing it can turn off those Hispanic voters. If they don't come on strong enough it can turn off members of their base. They are in a rough situation here.

Right now Obama is pretty much a lame duck. He will likely spend the next two years defying the republicans and doing everything he can to hurt them and their chances in the next election.

It is all part of a bigger sad story that tells the tale of what our country has become. Our leaders no longer really seem to care about actually doing good things for the country, they seem to care about hurting each other so they can win the next election.

Annually, the United States grants lawful immigrant status to more than 1.1 million aliens, isn't that enough?

Yes it did, and many had to go thru a quarantine on Ellis Island.

Not as easy as you might think, I remember my history teacher in high school talking about this


Waiting and Long Lines

When ships arrived in harbor, inspectors boarded the ship to perform a cursory inspection of first- and usually second-class passengers. The government thought that passengers who could afford a first- or second-class ticket they were less likely to become a burden to the public. These passengers were only sent to Ellis Island if they failed the cursory health or legal inspection. Meanwhile, lower-class passengers were transported from the pier where their ship had docked to Ellis Island on barges or ferries, often in very crowded conditions. Passengers would often have to wait for hours on these barges to enter Ellis Island, lacking food, water, toilets or protection from the elements.

Health Inspection

As immigrants filed through Ellis Island's large registry room, doctors would briefly scan each immigrant for obvious physical or mental health issues. Doctors or nurses used chalk to write letters on an immigrant's clothes to indicate possible health problems. An "H" indicated a possible heart condition while "LCD" meant loathsome contagious disease. Eventually, these rapid-fire physical health inspections came to be known as "six-second physicals."

A Barrage of Questions

The Immigration Service collected arrival manifests from incoming ships. The manifests contained passenger names as well as answers to several questions. An inspector, usually accompanied by an interpreter, asked each passenger a series of questions about potential destinations and job prospects.
Detention and Hearings
If immigrants failed the medical or immigration inspection, they were placed in detention until they could have a hearing in front of the Board of Special Inquiry, composed of inspectors. According to the National Archives at New York City, about 10 percent of immigrants had hearings, where evidence about the immigrant's medical health, economic conditions and beliefs was provided. Exclusion was often reversed if someone posted bond for an immigrant or an aid society took responsibility for the immigrant. Only about 2 percent of immigrants were deported, usually because they were considered a "likely public charge" on medical or economic grounds.

Paying the Way

Until 1909, immigrants entering the United States had to pay a head tax of 50 cents per person. This money contributed to the funding for the Office of Immigration. Ellis Island also hosted food vendors, immigrant aid societies and railroad ticket offices. When immigrant was detained, often for weeks, unscrupulous food contractors, money changers and sometimes even federal employees preyed on the vulnerable immigrant hopefuls.

What Process Did Immigrants Go Through When They Arrived at Ellis Island in the Late 1800s? | The Classroom | Synonym

Totally agree, but if the republicans can work together and the only thing that is holding up things getting done is Obama, then that will hurt Hillary's chance. Time will tell!

It all depends on what the republicans are working together on. If they are trying to pass laws that the democrats see as bad and Obama blocks them it will help the democrats in 2016.

Let's not forget, the republicans blocked everything Obama and the democrats tried to do when he first took office. The democrats got frustrated and started using technicalities and loopholes to get things passed and that obstruction helped the republicans win back the house.

By blocking the republican agenda Obama can help fired up the liberal base for whoever may run in 2016 (likely Hilary).

Vendzilla...I don't think that having to go through a medical quarantine, answer some questions and pay 50 cents is the same as what our govt. forces people to do today.

I'm an American citizen...and when I drive down to Mexico I get waved on in. When I come back to the United States it's like I'm entering the Soviet Union in 1950! Searched, questioned, treated like a criminal.

And that's what happens to ME as a U.S. citizen.

You can only imagine how a Mexican citizen must see it trying to drive into San Diego.

Anyway, I digress.
I don't think it should be up to what we think as far as the amount of people who come to the U.S. to be citizens.

I'm not even sure that the U.S. allowing "lawful immigrant status to more than 1.1 million aliens" is even applicable to this discussion.

"lawful immigrant aliens" aren't the same as becoming a U.S. citizen is it?

Is that what your family wanted to be when they came here through Ellis Island?
"Hey, let's travel from Europe with nothing but the clothes on our back looking for a better life and become...lawful immigrant aliens"

See what I'm saying? Bureaucracy is out of control in our govt.
They create these problems and then spend years "fixing" them when the answer is ludicrously simple: Stop making it so hard for people to come to the United States.

Not quite true Kane. The Democrats had a big advantage of seats in the House, and a super majority 60 seat caucus in the Senate. They could have done anything and everything they wanted to do. The Republican had absolutely zero power to stop anything at all in Congress. That changed when Senator Kennedy passed away, and was replaced by Scott Brown to give the Dems only 59 seats, and no longer the super majority they enjoyed for nearly 2 years.

Then the Republicans had a way to filibuster in the Senate, which is why the Democrats did the around the bout, hack job rush bill with the Reconciliation maneuver.

Then in Jan 2011, the new congress took hold where the Republicans then had the House again, and more seats in the Senate. That is when you saw the House start to block the Senates moves, and the Senate start to shelve all bills from the House that Obama didn't want to veto or deal with. That is when the full on grid lock truly started.

Did the Republicans want to block and slow down Obama the first 2 years? Of course they did. They just were absolutely powerless to do so.

Democrats didn't pass all their dream projects and ideas those first 2 years, for one reason only. They wanted to be reelected. Healthcare was going to take all the political capital they could get away with, and still have Obama win in 2012. If they went full bore on EPA, Immigration, Healthcare etc in those first 2 years, he would have been a one and done.

Funny how Immigration wasn't a massive, urgent, must fix at any costs issue those 2 years :)

Robbie, while I agree that the immigration situation must be repaired and fixed, I think you have to be very careful with just how lose you make your requirements. If not for all the massive entitlement programs in the Country, I'd agree more with you about more of an open gate per say. But the nation is all about entitlement payments these days, and if you flood the country with too many poor, uneducated and worse than that, lazy people, you risk serious issues on all levels of government funding with these bloated entitlement programs.

I have a feeling those first few years the democrats felt like they were going to be in power for a while. They had swept into office and there was a strong anti-republican feel in the nation.

The super-majority didn't stop the republicans from filibustering. From 2007-the first few months of 2010 there were at least 142 filibusters and votes for cloture. The democrats had the 60 votes to pass things, but since there were actually 58 democrats and 2 independents it was't a 100% guaranteed thing that they could get 60 votes on ever bill. not to mention the stalling tactics the republicans used in the house to delay things.

To me both parties during that time laid down a blueprint on how to cause problems for the other party. The republicans showed that if you are the minority and you just adopt the "Say no to everything" attitude you can be rewarded during the election. The democrats showed that there are ways to get around the filibuster and stall tactics so you can still do what you want. Both of those plans can come back to bite you if the roles are reversed.

I won't be shocked to see the democrats trying to block anything and everything republican based over the next two years and I won't be shocked to see the republicans use some of the same tactics they slammed the democrats for using to get around it.

Already hearing how the republicans are changing their approach to everything, we'll wait and see.

By blocking everything the republicans on every turn, it will piss off more people than fire up any base. Then Obama can't blame everything on the republicans

The last time we had a Clinton in office and a republican controlled congress, the nation as a whole did pretty good, I'm all for that

Bingo!

It's no longer about doing what's right. It's about blocking the other party.

Obamacare is the perfect example. It's Romneycare. If it was Romney passing that same bill when he was in the White House, the Republicans would have loved it.

I have a little different opinion on the amount, I live in LA, Los Angeles County is over 50% hispanic now. Caucasian makes up around 27%. And the traffic just gets worse. We don't need more people here.

Maybe if the government in Mexico wasn't so corrupt and we didn't give the cartels guns, we wouldn't have so many immigrants coming here?

I have no problem with the ones that are here legally and become citizens, they are usually the hardest working people in the group and make the best friends.

I think this last election showed that pissing off the people doesn't really matter. Congress had a historically low approval rating often dipping down into the low teens yet 96% of all incumbents were re-elected.

Romneycare wasn't passed on lies.

exactly ...

Reagan's and Bush's actions were conducted in the wake of a sweeping, bipartisan immigration overhaul and at a time when "amnesty" was not a dirty word. Their actions were less controversial because there was a consensus in Washington that the 1986 law needed a few fixes and Congress was poised to act on them. Obama is acting as the country ? and Washington ? are bitterly divided over a broken immigration system and what to do about 11 million people living in the U.S. illegally.

And he wants to do it before the new congress comes in, why can't he wait, they have already promised to act on it.

He did so promising to go thru it without the congress, neither Reagan Nor Bush was such an ass about it

I agree with your thoughts on entitlement programs.

Which proves what I said...the Federal govt. CREATES these problems. And then struggles to "fix" them.

If the feds themselves didn't create massive entitlements, then citizens wouldn't try to get them. And if the feds hadn't went down to Columbia and went after the cocaine cartels...the Mexican cartels wouldn't exist. If the feds would go ahead and legalize marijuana and other recreational drugs then there wouldn't be the violence on the border.

It's a fucked up situation for sure. But you and I didn't create it.

It was created by lifetime/career bureaucrats in Washington D.C. taking money from special interests to pass stupid laws that only benefit the companies best interests.

People want to get high? Not unless we can hook 'em on prescription drugs and make billions! :(