People who complain about Tubes / Xsells, and whatever else, killing the industry are incorrect....
 

I am NOT talking to content producers who have their stuff stolen and put on tubes, I totally get that!!!

Im talking about people who go on and on saying there is no money in adult because of tubes, xsell scammers etc etc. are killing the industry and scaring away customers.


The truth is, there are FAR more joins being made now that there have ever been (and those making them and taking them know Im right). They are consolidated amongst a smaller group of affiliates and sponsors than they used to be. Sure, 2001 was great for those without a lot of marketing skill. You could close your eyes, trip over your laptop and make 46 sales a day. Like any industry, its easier in the beginning. Things have changed. I talk about it often with those still around. The people who are creative marketers. Who can think outside the box are still around, doing better than ever. The rest have fallen off.

I Am writing this for NEW people to the industry. DONT LISTEN to this BS. There is MUCH more money being made online now than ever, and that trend will continue. You need to be better / different than you did in 2000. Customers can find anything for free, I get it. Its not easy. But if you are good at what you do there is massive amounts of $$$ to be made.

HOW TO BE SUCCESSFUL in 2015: If you are new (or old and having trouble because the one meted you know doesn't work anymore) You need to do what people have done to become successful in business from the beginning....GET A MENTOR!! You want to make 200 sales a day?? Surround yourself with those who have what you want. If your new, go to shows, dedicate yourself, meet people. When you find someone who seems to be on the right track, offer to work for them....FOR FREE. Offer your services, maybe they need what you have and you can soak up their knowledge. Maybe you just need to offer to do whatever they need done for little or no pay. I can tell you, as someone who has been around awhile, I get excited when I meet someone who seems to have "it" and wants to learn. Most of the people I know feel the same way. We know that someone with potential who needs a shot, or some guidance is a future partner, affiliate etc etc. The more people in your circle who you trust and work well with, the more opportunities you have to create new products, campaigns, methods, sites etc. Everyone falls into their little niche, the more people around you, the more opportunity to create teams using these different skills and hence, create one more source of revenue.

IMHO anyway

Too many dumbies coming back thinking there genius

Sure, because you have a bunch of people that did great because they were just in the right place at the right time, but think it was all skill, lol.

Ive gone some great stuff I Knew was because Im good, and done well at other things 10000% because I fell into something at the right time. You HAVE to know the difference :)

Everything is a skill. Skills take time and effort to develop and improve. The rewards are never immediate.

This industry attracts the exact opposite kind of people who can't understand why their blog created in 2 minutes is not making them 5k a day..... then they leap right into "it's not my fault,.... it's the....."

There IS money in porn. I make more of it every year. I started LATE in this Adult game (VERY late, compared to those bitching how there's no money anymore in porn). In fact, all my friends thought I was crazy for even trying this - in 2008!!!

Now, seven years later, here I am motherfuckers. Growing and stronger than ever. WITH PAYSITES ALONE.

(However I do not recommend starting with paysites unless you do pretty much what I have done, and very few are willing to go through what I did to get where I am now. And THAT'S the only thing holding anyone back, a willingness to bust their ass.)

Great thread. :)

I think its a mix of that and people getting frustrated because they do ONE thing well. When that one thing stops working, it must be because of xxxxxxx. Not because things just change. The Model T was pretty impressive at the turn of the century, I doubt you'd do well selling them now.

I think you're hallucinating or in denial.

You have to think quality over quantity these days. Plus affiliates think that they're in the adult industry, but are really just salesmen and aren't trying at all compared to real salesmen making a good living selling items you thought were stupid and overpriced or unsellable for any other reason..

I started selling porn in '09 :321GFY

:upsidedow

When some of us say to newbies "There's no money in porn" it's a mixture of sarcasm and trying to scare a potential competitor off.

nah.......

I always remind myself what I learned 40 years ago ...

Yesterday's heroes are tomorrow's shit-heads.

Tip: If you have a tube that make $5 a day don't make 100 and think your going to make $500 a day.

I wasn't talking about you but if you want to play this game: how come, since we both started around the same time, I'm 10x more successful than you?

:321GFY

Oh I know, I get it. I do the same thing - except the scaring off competition part. That doesn't work anyway. If someone is really determined no words from me (or anyone else) will stop them. But I get what you are saying. :)

Actually, it probably would :D

Of course, it'd just be for a whole lot of money per unit and a specialized niche demographic. To that end, as it translates to adult, specialized niches also perform well.

Again, this time in English.

I don't do this full time all the time and never took the next step to try anything with paysites, even though I still have an account on PornCMS and a biller free to use whenever I get around to that... :Oh crap

No worries man. Just answering the 123gfy icon. LOL

I've had my coffee now and I'm in a MUCH better mood. :thumbsup

Porn site joins or dating site joins?

Tubes do help. Legit tubes..

Meh, for as many blogs that I've made and everything else that I know, I should have made more than I have by now (Even though it's decent 6 figures :winkwink:)

I did make up for the 321gfy with my usual smiley, though :upsidedow

As it goes with anything...

create a good following with a good product made with passion, and people will line up to pay you for it.

Mentors are a great concept. The big problem with that in adult is that 99% of the people willing to be Mentors are clueless asshats looking to fleece newbies. If you do want a mentor, be sure to exhaustively look into their references and know who you are dealing with BEFORE you start taking their advice. :2 cents:

:winkwink::thumbsup:pimp

Ah I missed the upside down smiley! I'm a bleary-eyed prick before my java. LOL Sorry about that. :)

(And six figs from blogs IS impressive.)

Ditto this. One of the best ways to find a 'mentor', or someone to model, is to begin doing it right NOW. Without their knowledge. You can learn a lot by listening here on GFY and looking at their sites (especially over time, to see how they change/adapt). THEN, if it's appropriate, you can reach out and try to ask specific questions you are stuck on. How would they do it etc.

BTW I had 3 really great mentors in this biz. All of them are here on GFY. I've met two in real life so far. One trusted me enough he even sold me his paysite network and affiliate program when he was done with them. :)

You stop learning you start dying is how I look at it. And viva la porn (nerd)!!

Would someone like to mentor me, or trade knowledge since I do know a lot and have worked with probably more companies than you know?

The main question I have is, how do you get funding for everything? Do you start small and use what you've earned by commission on affiliate programs then build a small affiliate program yourself then hire employees as that grows, or is it about finding funding up front? :upsidedow

Did you find someone new to sell you somebody else's methods?

Obviously not pay site joins, BUT people would be shocked at how many stl get made every day. But who cares, a Join is a join. One market closes, one must look to market what's hit at the moment

100%. But is that different from any industry? Lol

Yeah, gotta adapt :pimp

Yeah, totally, got to enjoy doing new things, and ready to learn that your not a know it all

Maybe more joins because of more surfers.
But if you take 1000 porn surfers from 2005 and 1000 porn surfers from 2015 and you try to claim that second group buys more paysite memberships - you would be absolutely wrong.

Good question. I can only speak from my own experience, and everybody has different ways of doing things. I think people who have a huge idea and spend every last penny and months on wnd working to build something that may or may not take off, are running a huge risk. It's very similar to the.com starts up with the hopes of one day selling to a larger company. The odds are staggering on the side of any single project not taking off. We are very lucky, the barrier of entry in this business is unbelievably low. With A few thousand dollars or less, somebody can get hosting, creative, software and have a little bit of money to test their ideas. I myself usually get involved in projects or ideas that we can test and play with without having to invest huge sums of money. I prefer ideas that can be tested small in scal I prefer ideas that can be tested small And scaled up. That's not to say that we haven't purchased larger companies and networks, we have, but I prefer being in a situation where if anyone idea doesn't take off or work well then so be it. I like to keep things at the level where if we lose 100% of the money testing something it doesn't affect the company as a whole. Don't keep all your eggs in one basket, and always keep you ideas and things in the pipeline. I've made the mistake of having projects running that were making huge sums of money and sitting back and getting comfortable. The problem is, nothing last forever, and if you get used to making a certain amount of money and that project takes a big hit for one reason or another you find yourself scampering.

As for funding, if you don't even have a small amount of money to get things rolling, aside from the usual asking friends, relatives etc., the Internet has made small loans for project funding pretty unbelievable. I'm NOT talking about kick starter, well you have to sell somebody on your vision, I'm talking about companies like Peerform etc. check them out. There are more than a few. i've actually invested in a few of them on the lending side, very interesting stuff

It doesn't matter. Yes, if you follow a methodology that in 2002 was doing a good ratio and now you have the same traffic and one third of the sales, it just means you need to find different ways to get traffic, or promote different products and use different methods. if somebody's doing the exact same thing that was successful in 2002 they will be doing less sales on the same amount of traffic. Anybody who is expecting things to stay exactly the same in any industry is going to have a rough time of it lol

Well, you already said that you were not talking about paysite sales, so we agree.

:warning:warning :thumbsup:thumbsup:warning:warning

Agreed, but you also have to consider the state of the Internet and technology back in 2005. No social media to speak of (Myspace anyone? LOL). No Twitter, slow internet connections (still dial-ups in many places!), streaming almost non-existent (again because of low tech). Cams and "dating" still in their infancy....

So paysites were about IT back in 2005. Today those same potential customers have much more to choose from (yes, including free). So while you are correct you are also wrong. Paysite customers back in 2005 may have preferred cams or dating even then but had little choice. My theory is: those who will buy then will buy now. Those who wouldn't buy then (but were forced to) have fled. Bye-bye. So guess who I focus on? LOL

(I didn't get into paysites till late 2008 so what do I know about 'The Good Old Days'? All I've ever known is bust-your-ass hard work and struggle.)

I love making money with adult stuff online, because resources are unlimited basically, and it doesnt require a fortune to test new approachs to get traffic. It has a good profit margin too. Though money to be make is usually limited due to alot of limitation, but if u have experiences, some luck, some determination, its not hard to make 10k 20 or even 50k a month, thats after expense deducted of course.

lol, what a load of bullshit :1orglaugh:1orglaugh
maybe thats why - "far more joins being made" - I'm getting 4 times worse results than I was doing 4 years ago on PURE SEO traffic. and i'm talking about traffic that is simply the best, cream of the cream - pure se gold traffic....

So what are you selling?

"When you find someone who seems to be on the right track, offer to work for them....FOR FREE."

He wants you to work for him. For free.

I don't think so.

When I first entered the online industry it was owning a content company.

AL4A made me an offer to start a content company with him. He funded the start up...I did all the work. Nobody made a salary off of it for the first 6 months while I was busy shooting content week in and week out.

I worked for free.

And while I worked for "free", I was a 50% owner of a company, learned the online business from the top people in the world, began making 6 figures a year on the side as an affiliate, and ended up running one of the biggest traffic TGP sites in the world for the next 10 years and made over 14 million dollars between 1998 and 2006.

That is what can happen for a motivated person who knows what to do when opportunity comes calling.

Yes, having the skills to impress the right person and then doing whatever it takes (including working for free) can definitely change your life.

One of unknowing mentors speaks!! :)

Words of Gold here folks.

Robbie,

I'm not saying that any part of that aspect of what you said above is not valid.

I'm saying that the OP's line of " ... there are FAR more joins being made now that there have ever been ..." ... is bullshit.

That depends, overall I agree with it when taking dating and cam leads etc into consideration.

With dating and cams perhaps, I'm not sure. But for paysites there's no way.

Oh I agree on that. Paysite sales are on life support. You know...the actual porn industry part of it.

Dating and cam...which are a part of the adult industry, but not really porn...are still hanging in there.

Not sure if it's still making as many NEW sales as it once did. It's hard for me to believe that there could be anyone left on the face of the Earth who hasn't already been cookied in for AFF.

And the industry numbers on AFF looks like they are losing money every year.

Cams has been huge business. But it's been declining a little bit over the last couple of years. The girls aren't making quite as much money overall and I'm seeing my own sales to them starting to decline slightly as well.
Just like dating sites...it's oversaturated and I think there might be a dozen people in the world who aren't already signed up at a cam site. lol

I have thought since the beginning that unless we can somehow (magically) get back to selling PORN again we are going to continue to see decline instead of real growth (not just minimal growth brought about by people becoming old enough to have a credit card).

I never saw how giving away the product to sell traffic could be anything but a relatively short term way to make a ton of money.

If a business isn't growing, but just going sideways...it's never a good thing.
And now, every indication that I can see in every way shows that the industry is contracting.
That is a bad thing.

And yes, I do blame it on a business model based on giving away everything for free in order to sell traffic.

Don't know that there is anything that can be done about that. :(

See, I don't worry about the 'decline of the Industry'. I don't give a FUCK about any of that. I care about ONE thing only: MY money. So as long as MY sales continue to go up, and I make MORE, who gives a fuck how other paysites, cams or dating is doing? I cannot control 'the Industry' nor can I control other websites' success or failure. I worry about MY shit ONLY.

So if "the Industry" is making less, and former ballers are struggling/leaving, who cares? It's about ME (and YOU), not 'the Industry' (comprised of a zillion independent webmasters and a handful of major players). So what if, in 2003, you could make $1,000,000 and today in 2015 you can "only" make $300,000? Stop looking back and start looking at what works for YOU and your life NOW. That's my philosophy.

It's why I'm such a happy little fuck. :)

If your sales are growing then good for you!

The reason you might want to worry a bit is because you would be doing a LOT better in a healthy adult industry.

And any industry in any kind of a decline is going to eventually affect the sales of everyone involved. Even you.

But congrats on beating the odds so far. I'm in the same boat...working all the time to keep things from falling apart. But in my case it's a game of keeping it sideways. Any real growth is so small that it's inconsequential. :(

Dating right now is about where paysites were circa-2009. Go look at any Ashley Madison hack article and you will see people in the comments saying "LOL why would anyone pay when tinder is free? dumbasses!" The same thing started being said about paysites around 2008/2009 so there is probably only 2-3 years left until the bottom drops on most dating other than with a free model.

Cams is about all the industry has left but you're saying it is slumping as well for you and that isn't good. I think that is partially again the free model taking over.

Yeah you can still make money in a declining market but as you say in another reply it sucks because you would have been doing far better before.