We withdrew all of our military forces in '73. South Vietnam fell to the North in '75. It was they who lost.

I am not theorizing that the government wants to win and get out. I am assuming that they do not want a swift end to the conflict...for whatever their reasons...just as it is apparent they did not want a swift end to the Vietnam conflict...once again...for whatever their reasons.

LOL Good night theking, I'm going to go to sleep and enter your world.

I don't think there's any theorizing at all as to what's going on over there when you see which groups are profiting from it, and who in the government stands to benefit from those groups' profits.

It doesn't agitate you even a little bit that your government is spending trillions of your tax dollars and sending your young citizens over to risk the loss of their lives so that few rich and powerful people who appear to operate above the law can up their net worth a few million a year?

Is that the America that you love and fight for?

i think the reason the U.S. lost vietnam and afghanistan is you can't make people like you , especially by smashing them into submission, you may get them to submit , but the moment you turn your back they will be on you.

There is no way to win other than to kill everyone there.

The government uses our military for the sake of "perceived" national interests...be it self defense...geopolitcal...or economic interests. American businesses are a part of our economic power. It has been said that what is good for business is good for America and there is a lot of truth to that.

I am not in a position to know what the government knows thus I am not in a position to understand why the government does the things that it does.

I certainly do not approve of all that our government does or all of what private enterprise does...far from it...but ultimately I think that government attempts to do what it "perceives" to be in the best interest of our country.

I long ago chose not be become an activist. I limit my activism to the power of the vote and letters of complaint to my congressman...and I do not have any intention of changing this position at this point in time.

You seem to forget Japan and Germany. We smashed them into submission and both are now good allies...and economic powers.

BTW...we did not lose Vietnam...South Vietnam did...we with drew our forces in '73 and the South fell in '75...and we have not lost Afghanistan at this point in time.

I did not see this post earlier...but the answer is of course not...but PF apparently made such an impression on some of the members...they like to think that he is still alive...even more than eight years after his death.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

any americans change their view of war/america and/or plan to send along the thread starter's video & message to the so-called murderous coward soldiers and their families during this holiday season?

would like to get a head count of how effective these sorts of campaigns by our wonderful neighbor to the north are.

please post if you have.

.. except the iraqis .... :2 cents:

and here i thought the people that went into the armed forces had 'no options'

but i guess it's easy convincing 18 year olds that killins' fine

don't you love it when 20 year olds read for 5 minutes and act like they are the only ones enlightened to everything? They feel the need to lecture the world of how messed up it is and that everyone needs to wake up...

This is me waking up.. realizing that people posting at 4am (in my time zone) on a work night probably shouldn't be listened to at all...

exactly. :thumbsup they're like a 14 year old boy who just got laid for the 1st time and is now running around acting like a pussy expert.

Japan you guys took the easy way out, murdered hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians just like what Al Qaeda does right now, be proud! Germany was smashed into submission by the pure might of the Soviets - not the Americans.

Hey theking, do you know what losing means? It means what you were fighting for to happen doesn't happen and what you were fighting to stop from happening happens.

You guys lost Vietnam. Everyone knows that. Going to be losing Afghanistan soon and everyone can see that coming. Sucks that even with all the weapons and technology these guys are kicking the US's butt, maybe it's time US soldiers learned a thing or two from their Taliban superiors. :1orglaugh

Dynamo: For someone that believes so strongly in what the US is doing, why aren't you there fighting with your brethren? If I believed in a struggle that my country was going through I'd be the first one to sign up to help. Or is all you have left personal insults against me?

everyone knows about the My Lai massacre. If you go into the army or marines in 2010 you're definitely going to be sent to Iraq or Afghanistan. Back in the day the vietmanese were called gooks. today the arabs are called durkha's. Potential soldiers should think ahead and realise that they probably will be ordered to kill babies and civilians. Like Vietnam, there is no enemy in uniform in Iraq. Any civilian could be a soldier. This is why these guys get nervous and trigger happy. They just kill anyone and hope its a combatant.

If you walk into a normal bar and try and punch everyone in the face yr going to get yr ass kicked eventually. This is what the US does in these countries. These wars are not supposed to be won.

Hey man if it's a work night for you then go back to sleep. Some of us are on our own schedules and we sleep and stay up whenever we want. Sucks to be you, homie!

Love how no one here can come up with a logical argument so they resort to personal attacks. Well done guys! On here it goes, in any real debate you guys would have been laughed out of the room by now. PR_Glen if you had one hundredth the knowledge I do on the subject then you'd be with me for sure. But ignorance is a dangerous thing, and instead of reading and educating yourself all you have left is insulting people.

wow, you are dense, full of yourself and entirely full of shit. you come here and push your agenda of enlightening others to your way of thinking about soldiers being cowardly murderers whose families should shun then and have the audacity to tell me i should go fight when you completely make that position up?

when did i EVER claim i believe in those wars? in fact, i said in this thread war = murder and i am on the record here stating we need to end those wars- period.

moreover, your complete lack of knowledge of historical events is one of the worst i've ever seen an adult have. look up the bombing of japan prior to dropping those bombs and see what the casualty rates were and were projected to be. fact is, those bombs saved lives, some say millions. a fact you will fail at comprehending.

once a soldier, he's bound to obey. the sad part to me is how can anyone these days be naive enough to think they will get to fight for an ideal? freedom, democracy, etc... US hasnt fought for any of these since the civil war... even WW2 was about money

In Japan, the US soldiers were too cowardly to go in and do the actual fighting, they were scared they would die, the Japanese were down to fight, but the Americans pussied out and used their pussy atom bomb to end it quick. Things don't really change that much I guess.

So if someone today 'estimated' that killing 50% of the United States would save more lives in the long run, you would be all for it?

I'm talking your mom/dad/kids all had to be killed so others can live, is that ok with you?

If Al Qaeda says that their attack on the World Trade Center saved lives in the long run, then it makes those attacks okay? Come on, they saved lives, maybe even millions.

Nuclear bombs were used that murdered hundreds of thousands of civilians that had nothing to do with the war. The bottom line is that again the US showed itself to be the biggest bully and murderer this world has ever seen. Hope you are proud to be part of that!

And yes, the soldiers fighting there are little coward pussies as can be clearly shown when they get afraid of fighting guys that have 1/100th the firepower as they do.

Damn YOU Rabbit!!!

You'll screw everyone up in this thread by making sense and being a Canadian :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

keep proving your ignorance by posting. you have no comprehension about ww2 facts whatsoever. hindsight is 20/20 for elitist people like you who think your view is the right one and only one. fact is, you are interpreting an event that took place 70+ years ago during an absolutely horrific time in 2010 light from the comfort of your office chair and behind a keyboard.

that's failed logic.

you aren't familiar with bosnia? oh, who was the aggressor in ww2 again?

crickets.

So you think it's okay that hundreds of thousands of innocent people were killed?

And MY logic is failed? Right.

What happened is the United States committed the biggest terror attack known to man kind, an attack on civilians in order to terrorize them so that they would hopefully surrender. Sounds like what Al Qaeda tried with the World Trade Centers - I guess you support their reasoning for that as well?

Getting your panties in a bunch is enough for me. Mission accomplished!

Sorry that you don't believe in anything enough and aren't confident enough in yourself to try to make sure people know what they're doing is wrong.

Keep being a follower dynamo - luckily you have leaders like me to do the dirty work.

If anyone watched that video and it didn't effect them at all they need to get checked out. Watch the murder being committed by your brave men and women over there, cold blooded murder. And better yet, watch them do the killing from where the guys being killed have no chance of fighting back - proving yet again that US forces in Afghanistan are a bunch of coward pussies.

thanks for proving each and every one of my points in a single post.

what a leader. your parents must be proud.

I just led you into helping me keep this thread at the top for almost a full day now. You are unknowingly helping me do exactly what I intended.

Keep it up buddy, more views is what I want and little posts like that one are perfect for bumping me right up to the top. Thanks for the help dynamo!

wow, your life goals are so lofty.

and you do realize that's the typical gfy troll reply right? thanks for bumping my shitty thread, i've signed up 400 more affiliates thanks to you!

you aren't fooling anyone.

Not trying to fool anyone - just wanted to show them a video.

no, you wanted to push your anti-america agenda on the rest of us.

grow some balls. maybe ask santa for a pair for xmas. who knows, you could get a xmas miracle.

Yes that I did want to do by showing a video.

Up to you if you want to change your mind or not.

Grow some balls? What are you talking about? Do you mean the balls to say things against the strongest government in the world or the balls to agree with everything they do and submit to their ways? Right.

Don't be mad that I did what I wanted to do and all your pathetic arguments were easily and thoroughly crushed by my logic and facts...I'm sorry that I'm smarter than you...its not my fault!

yeah familiar with both. are you familiar with roosevelt's reasons for arming the US pre-ww2 and how all intelligence about perl harbour was ignored so that public sentiment could be turned around by the disaster that followed? after that, WW2 became politically viable. of course, financially it was viable long before that.

point being is that there are and always will be many places in the world where ideals are being threatened and many more where such threats can be fabricated. but if you think the government will fight for an ideal, you're as big of a sheep as they come. in the end, its all about money and i for one would never put 1 second of my life at risk so that some gun manufacturer can get his fat bonus.

but hey, many volunteer not caring what they fight for, they want access to an education, they want a job, they want to see action, they want to travel. and thats a choice i can respect.

I second that. fuck you

anyone?
wow, a canadian standing up against the big ole u.s. of a. government by posting a youtube video on an adult message board.

Why World War II ended with Mushroom Clouds
65 years ago, August 6 and 9, 1945: Hiroshima and Nagasaki

"Sixty-five years ago, Truman did not have to use the atomic bomb in order to force Japan to its knees, but he had reasons to want to use the bomb. The atom bomb enabled the Americans to force Tokyo to surrender unconditionally, to keep the Soviets out of the Far East and - last but not least - to force Washington?s will on the Kremlin in Europe also."

---

"Truman himself, however, hypocritically declared at the time that the purpose of the two nuclear bombardments had been ?to bring the boys home,? that is, to quickly finish the war without any further major loss of life on the American side. This explanation was uncritically broadcast in the American media and it developed into a myth eagerly propagated by the majority of historians and media in the USA and throughout the ?Western? world. That myth, which, incidentally, also serves to justify potential future nuclear strikes on targets such as Iran and North Korea, is still very much alive - just check your mainstream newspaper on August 6 and 9!"

Why World War II ended with Mushroom Clouds

doing what i can!!

its amazing how *much* canadians know about america.
:1orglaugh

look who it is, another canadian america basher with the same ole same ole.

btw, that link and your cut & paste from it negates nothing re: what i stated.

it's amazing how *much* americans know about canada.


Now back to dyna mo's post about the soldiers. I don't believe most soldiers are evil. However, there are a few that are. From every country, including Canada. You cannot pin point it to one country.

It's the same with Police, you will have your good ones and bad ones.

Anyhow to all the soldiers from all around the world who are doing the politicians dirty work, have a Merry Christmas.

trust me, Americans don't give a shit about canada. if it weren't for chat board clowns shooting their mouths off about that which they do not know.......and hockey, we'd have a hard time remembering you existed.

Cool story bro

but you forgot Oil, I'm sure you care about that as well.

its amazing how *little* americans know about america

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

your military requested 58 nuclear strikes during the Korean war with this argument, so..

some kid typing away in his parent's basement, does not represent all Canadians lol. just like some moron typing away in a similar way, but across the boarder, does not represent all Americans. jesus. like it or not, we are you're largest single supplier of oil, your largest trading partner, and arguably your most important allie. but continue with the blanket Canada bashing, it's fun :glugglug

It's amazing how little American's know about the rest of the World.

Yeah you'd forget about Canada until you needed more oil, power or water.

Before you go off all half-cocked, my mother is American. I can live in Canada or the USA it's my choice. I'm also not a raving patriot that thinks Canada is the greatest country on Earth.

I don't know why you guys get so upset. The USA is not some giant that goes at it alone, you know. Nobody is trying to say Canada is better than the US. Canada and the United States enjoy the largest open border in the World. We're each other's largest trading partners and we supply you with more crude oil than any Middle Eastern country.

While *YOU* might not think or care about such complex topics as international relationships, I can guaran-damn-tee you that the people that run your country sure do. Don't get me wrong, as a Canadian living some 10 feet or so (literally out my drive way, across the street and over a ditch in to the park and I'm in Washington State, where my American mother lives.) I actually understand how important the relationship is between our two countries. I also recognize that the people are not so very different either. Especially in a given geographic region. The people in Washington State, for example, are very similar to the people in British Columbia.

Believe me, we want the United States to be the all powerful, all knowing source of righteousness and goodness that you mistakenly believe it is; And perhaps at one time it was. We want to participate in achieving that because we know full well that what's good for one country is good for the other. FOr you to dismiss opportunity like that with stupid comments like "we don't care about Canada" just shows how little touch you have with reality.

For a guy that claims to be as bright as you do, I'd have expected you not to advertise your ignorance so regularily. My mistake I guess.

of course wars are fought over money. duh. money is a resource and the conquest of someone else's resources has been a motivator for war since the sumerians.

but you're drinking your own kool-aid if you don't think ideological factors do not have an impetus in war. groups of people throughout time have found the need to conquer or try to conquer others who do not look at things the same as they do. just like the op of this thread, he stated himself that americans are unable to agree with him when he attempts to communicate his views intelligently (i've yet to see that however), so his solution- hit us on the head with his views "to get his point across".