Where did I comment on the GDP? I didn't, thats where you lost it

That's one way to put it I suppose. LOL
You can always find someone online to prove your point, but I never heard of Altman and Rubin, what are their stakes in over seas markets?

Damn man, you're like into beating your head in the wall?

I should slow down ,Maybe I should slow down to a pace you can understand and do this one line at a time, now you're adding more Variables that weren't in the original post. But hey, when you don't have anything?

So answer this about what you have written above, if they cancel each other out, why is Obama not happy with the supreme courts decision on campaign finance?

Lost what? Of course you did not comment on PER CAPITA GDP (not GDP), I introduced that. It was to explain why your below contention is misguided and superficial Your statement is a non-sequitur.

Damn, dude. Robert Rubin or Roger Altman?

They are the economists that Hillary had as economic advisers who were quoted in the article YOU posted as stating that her idea of placing a "moratorium on trade agreements -- which would be used to beef up labor and environmental protections and provide more aid for domestic workers displaced by foreign competition" would:

Now, I know you already slipped in the canard about their stakes in overseas markets, so I'm sure you'll be quick to try and dismiss these gentlemen as evil jewish bankers.

Beat your strawmen all you want, but you'd be better served with an economics 101 book.

This isn't a shock. When you constantly have the fed playing around with low interest rates and runaway spending, as well as a moron for a fed chairman, this is bound to happen. I definitely enjoy the morons who blame it on the private sector.

I have to agree with Vend, omg the world is going to end now. lol Back in the day the avg ceo made 30 to 40x what the avg worker made, now they make 500x. To pay themselves that much money it has to come from somewhere.
I was watching a show on frontline about Walmart. Walmart used to make 20 percent on products made in the usa. With them pushing their vendors to produce in china they now make 60 to 80 percent profit. Mac used to be made in America and now made in china they havent become cheaper.A iphone costs $600 to buy without a contract, the workers that build them make 30 cents an hour. That's how their net income jumped 70 percent to 14 billion.
The corps make the big contributions.So its never never going to change.It started with Reagan and its gotten worse and worse. Wages have been flat for yrs and if it wasn't for cheap credit the middle class would realize how bad they have been truly getting fucked in the ass.
Both sides keep feeding the little people the bullshit so they think they are on their side and they are not. Probably the only guy on the peoples side is Bernie Sanders the rest are full of shit.

Of course government and monetary policy makers have culpability. Whether its Glass Steagall or pushing Fannie Mae to get involved in more and more questionable mortgage loans or keeping the monetary gas pedal down along the way or embarking on deficit spending. All very arguable points for mistakes.

Of course, this goes back decades and involved both political parties and prior monetary leaders.

But I don?t see how you can call Bernanke a moron. I realize you don?t agree with Fed policy or perhaps even its? existence, but without his [FED] action we would have had a total collapse. If you listen to him, he didn?t even like what he felt the FED had to do, but it was the lesser of two evils in his opinion.

I think you recognize that we were on the verge of a global economic deflation / depression and I can only assume you would have been okay with allowing that outcome.

But finally, the private sector has to shoulder its part of the responsibility. No one made people ?keep up with the Jones?? by leveraging themselves into oblivion. I didn?t do it. The private sector deserves its share of the blame (although I'm not sure who in this thread is solely blaming them).

This may be hard for you to understand, but an honest person can say something is unfair even if they may benefit from it. For example, if they passed a law that said white people can no longer be given speeding tickets, that would be nice for me, but I could still speak out on it and say it's not fair. Progressive organizations can exploit the new supreme court ruling as well, but that doesn't make it correct.

Believe it or not, some people can still put their own motivations aside for a moment and fight for what is right.

Obama (and many others) are angry about the Supreme Court decision because it says that corporations and individuals are equal, even though it's pretty common sense to see that a corporation can exert a much greater influence than an individual can in most cases. Also, being able to hide where money is coming from is harmful to an open and honest democracy. I'm not sure how hiding the source of political contributions is seen as a positive step towards transparency.

Tony, you are making a value judgment, not an economic one. You may be right or you may be wrong in the big picture as to what is best, but I think it is debatable.

Moreover, I'm not saying what is right or wrong per se, I'm just giving the economics of it. I was arguing to Vendzilla why I think his thinking doesn't make economic sense and why his conclusions don't follow.

As far as the little guy goes, well if they invest like an idiot they'll lose money. My advice is don't spend what you don't have, don't invest like an idiot, don't stand in front of a moving train. Free-trade is a moving train. The world economy does not have training wheels.

Not totally unexpected considering the rise of the ENTITLEMENT STATE.

How about when the little guy is busting his ass and he gets laid off in his 50's because if the job is done overseas and the ceo gets a huge bonus?That guy is fucked, burns thru his savings ,his 401k no one wants to hire someone in his 50's.So he loses his house it kills his credit. Yep its all his fault, they got you buying the bullshit line.People that worked harder than you can imagine are getting fucked and losing it all. My father worked for a large healthcare company they were shipping jobs overseas by the boat loads. This was during the bush boom years and then the chairman took a 500 million dollar bonus.
Its economic not a value judgement.

twice ... wouldn't it be sense .... ???

What entitlement state? You try and live on $250 a week of unemployment. Read history before social security becoming old was sentence of starvation for 60 percent of the elderly.
Like this internet? It was government tax dollars that paid for creation of the internet. IT was the GI bill that helped create the middle class. Before that there was poor and rich and not much in the middle. The way its going back to. lol
Germany now has low unemployment because of government intervention
http://blogs.ft.com/gavyndavies/2010...-jobs-miracle/

We use to have tariffs in this country that helped keep jobs in the US, we have been sold out by those that think a world market is better, guess it's working really good for those that can ship others jobs overseas

As usual, the only thing you can add to a conversation is grammar, I bet that really works good with the ladies

I agree you with, Im going to now get hit by lightning or something. :Oh crap lol

I have no problems with entitlements, but if we can't afford more with the budget we have, then we can't expand them.
The internet was developed by the Government, but it grew because of porn and social networks.
GI bill had a lot to do with the middle class, I bought my first house with a Vet loan, but I also think the union had a lot to do with it as well, the unions just kinda over did it.
I don't read much about other countries, but isn't it Germany thats bailing out the other euro countries? At this rate, the germans will own europe, didn't they try that before? LOL

Tony, I think if we got together, we would have a blast, get drunk and wake up 3 states over with a room full of hookers!

But GDP is NOT what I commented on in your statement
It makes perfect sense, level the playing field and business that left to save money will no longer be saving that money
OK, forgive me for not knowing the names of the the Secretary of States Economic advisers, considering they still don;t know where they got all there money when Bill was making 35k a year as a governor

I flew in a canard once, over the desert just east of LA, is that what you're talking about? It was built in my buddies garage and scared the hell out of me, I went back the next weekend and did it again!

Don't get me wrong. I'm in support of a much stronger safety net -- in terms of better triggers on unemployment assistance, wage insurance, health care, foreclosure insurance, etc.

I'm in favor of putting money into research and development and science, and in programs that will increase education and skills.

We just don't have a way of stopping globalization and free-trade. It going to happen whether we have trade agreements or not. I'm just saying it's an economic reality.

I'm also not blaming the people who did it right. I acknowledge the problems you are describing. That's why I am in favor of the things I listed above, as well as a progressive tax system. I don't even mind paying a few % more and I don't even live in the USA anymore.

I just strongly disagree with V's contention that we could reverse free-trade and thus solve these problems.

And at the same time, I'm not prepared to refrain from chastising those who are "fucked" who did not do it all right, who made stupid decisions, but still want to blame the boogieman of free-trade.

:1orglaugh

Probably, but it is not grammar , but spelling .... :Oh crap

Passed spell checker, so you're a spelling nazi?

You are under the misconception that there is truly free trade, when a country manipulates it's currency to give itself a trade advantage like china, that can't happen, so you add tariffs, and why can't we go back to that, would it hurt your feelings?
All that we do is dissolve NAFTA and start over.......

I think we should enforce our trade agreements. I think that currency manipulation is a problem -- especially with the asian countries / china. I think that working towards correcting this is good for the USA and should be pursued further.

So no, it would not hurt my feelings to address these issues and I don't believe I am under any misconception here.

However, I believe you are under the misconception that free trade and globalization is a bad thing in general, and that by eliminating NAFTA (or other trade agreements) it will solve the problems you are concerned about.

I'm off for the night. Perhaps there is more to discuss, but it will have to be tomorrow. :-)

Of course it will be a hard time for the USA if they cut the budget really hard but if they just continue on the same path as they do now and keep borrowing money from the rest of the world and print more money out of thin air the budget cuts would be nothing compared to what's coming.

But lots of people say that it wont matter if they cut the budget or not, they wont make it anyway.
China, Russia and other countries have already talked about replacing the USD with Euro as the reserve currency. The dollar is losing value all the time, they just keep printing it and Americans got this stuff in their saving-accounts. It will be worthless in a couple of years!

Why do you think gold and silver prices keeps rising like crazy?
Because companies, banks and people are getting rid of the dollar buying something "stable", something that cant just lose it's value like the dollar might do.

I dont think they care too much about selling porn memberships when they might not even be able to buy food, what do you think?

Gold price
http://onepeggenius.com/wp-content/u...4954035789.png

Silver price
http://blog.artbeads.com/wp-content/...1011_chart.jpg

US Debt
http://www.sott.net/image/image/s2/5...Chart_2010.gif


But just stay calm, nothing will happen. The rest of the world will continue to accept worthless paper in exchange for products. :1orglaugh