100 tube hATERS

There was nothing that I did back then that was so easy that anyone else could tap into it. It damn sure wasnt free to do. Same with the things that I do today. Different source for a different market.

The only difference is that today, I dont have near as much traffic. But when I can now convert at 1:30 I dont need near as much. My sales are anything but gone and I'm still doing a comfortable 5-figures per month and have always been a one-man operation.

And to be honest, I have never built a tube site and if I ever had ratios as horrible as what most tube owners call 'good' I'd have a fucking heart attack over it. Its funny that tube sites lure the surfers in with porn and then push dating and cams. Kill one market to push another. Maybe McDonalds should give away free hamburgers so they can sell fries & sodas. I'm sure that Burger King and Wendy's would be forced to do the same shit when their hamburger sales drop to near zero.

Good thing I'm in the fried chicken market I guess.

If you're doing a difference source for a different market today... how can you compare that to years ago?

Like I don't think free porn or anything made newsgroups die, which used to really pump some sales. The traffic simply moved, many times over. I can't really compare today to then, because it was sooooo different.

I have a feeling the traffic you bring in is probably rather filtered. A Google search alone starts the filter for you, and I bet you did a few more things to help. If you did the same thing with a tube today, it converts great, numbers you would expect. But at mass volume, a banner or just normal ads, no... that isn't going to rock any conversions unless the ad/content totally kills it. - But it's always been that way!

Dating and cams is not the income earners for major tubes... yes they make money, but it's prepays that pad the pockets. More than enough major companies willing to fork down the 5-6 figure, monthly, ad costs, that they've been renewing for years now. One would have to think.... the traffic isn't complete shit if they keep having the same buyers, over and over - for sure at those prices.

KCF has given away a ton of food making lines around the block.... it works if you're also selling something.

I'm done, you win. Good night/good morning/whatever.

I win? This was an argument?

WTF is wrong with you people.... no wonder you've failed, you can't even have a conversion without getting your panties in a twist.

"Hate" it's such a strong word ...

Which board was "bigger" or had more posts per day.
Im very curious

200 x $5 = $1000

30 x $50 =$1500


This about sums you up :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Pick one... yep, that one was bigger.

:1orglaugh

Is it some secret board that only you know about?

Why cant you mention the name?

WTF is wrong with YOU? I've failed? No. My panties are twisted? I dont think so.

We see this from 2 completely different points and that is that. I see no point in discussing it any longer. My 'panties' arent twisted with you, and damn sure not twisted over this.

I dont see what is so hard to understand about that. Good day.

Well, you could have just said that... or tossed up more ideas. But you tossed up a hand in the face and walked away like something butt hurt you instead.

Now it's not hard to understand, you actually explained yourself...

The problem with debating with you is you take a statement and twist it.

Yes I only made $2 million online in 10 years and you assume from that I made $60k a year. Not even you're stupid enough to realise online was just part of my income. In fact online was pure profit, after processing and hosting.

You know we shot for magazines and online was in addition to that. Magazine sales produced a profit without online. You must realise that.

If you don't you're not clever enough to debate something with. If you do know that, you're just arguing like a fool. Therefore not worth debating with.

No secret, unless maybe you just weren't around then. This isn't anything bad, the Industry was different then. We had way more Affiliates and far less sites/services splitting them apart. It was just a more focused Industry that matched the times and today it changed, that's it.....

Just as an example, might be a bad one but the point is about traffic.... A button on Ynot used to cost $10k-$20k, for 1 month, and I made millions back. GFY's top ad was $1.5k and now I think is $2k. Point being, the services back then were so much larger than GFY has ever been, that it's not even in question if you were around then.

Anyway, the topic at hand was with Paul and related to things always change, that everything going on today has always been going on and that this Industry WILL change again, the traffic & sales WILL move again.

That's the point I was trying to make to Paul. As technology changed, it has gotten harder, less free traffic to tap into every day, more of it bottled up, thus less people can just walk in and make a dime and of course more people will leave because it's harder.

That doesn't mean free porn or piracy did that... we can see with own eyes that it changed.

Everything you said was right, except this part.

In the scenario with tubes, and McDonalds being tubes, they would lure people in with free hamburgers and then sell them something that is parasitic to the rest of the fast food business, like health food programs to get healthy.

Health programs are completely detrimental to the fast food industry. But McDonalds has no regard for hamburgers, shit, they're free. Selling people the parasite product is where its' at.

Dating and cams are completely parasitic in nature to the rest of the adult business. They bring nothing to the table content wise. Mostly dating. Absolutely nothing. Shit they even steal the pictures of the content to make the fake profiles to take the money and spending power away from the adult consumers. You don't see the tsunami of traffic that goes to dating and cams coming back to paysites, etc.

What you see is almost a one way flow of traffic and spending power going their way from tubes, torrents, and fileshares, which is where a very large percentage of the adult traffic has gone.

If you remove scam markets like dating and penis pills, where do you send all that leecher traffic from these tubes, torrents, and fileshares?

You know the game Seth. That is cool.
:thumbsup

You mean like when you put down numbers with incorrect math and then try to use that to make your points? That's why nobody debates you, we're too busy pointing out your flaws in the logic.

2m a year over 10 years is 200k a year, and it's 50% profit for just about everyone... after affiliates, staff, hosting, domains, etc.. Unless you're one of the few with your own traffic network, which then still has it's costs.

Yep, magazines USED to be good, long ago. Just like many in our Industry could make $10k-$50k a month with just VoD, before download sites, before cable tv rights, before plugins... and so on.

Again though, NONE of that means you know shit about traffic online, sales online, getting traffic, converting sales and doing it at anything other than a trickle of a level.... point being, free site webmasters make more than you ONLINE and you're here telling us what's up? Hahahahahahahahaahahahahaahaa

So please name one forum that has more daily posts than GFY
thanks for the history lesson

Good lord... your question makes no difference to the conversion at hand, other than they're gone now or most of them. But if really want an answer that bad, the (edit: can't say that word) NP threaded forum easily had far more users, topics and posts daily, PornCity at point was off the chart, the one dig420 owned was far larger aff/traffic wise... Some other random big ones as well, niched up, a newbie one, an that avs board had a shit ton at one point, but when you have 60k affiliates that tends to happen.

No idea what it makes a difference though... point was, they come and go, traffic shifts, which is exactly what we see happened.

no board ever bigger than gfy. sorry champ. you got caught in that one.

You're wrong... and I didn't say bigger, I said more posts daily and yes, several had more daily.

blah blah blah

How many no name trolls does this damn forum have?

So the question on the table now, after all this back-and-forth (and I side with TheDoc, btw, over Paul Markham, who somehow thinks people will read all his endless, endless posts and not have a seizure - write a fucking book already Paul and shut the fuck up on here) is:

Now what?

Programs used to make GAZILLIONS "back in the day". Okay okay, I get it. TODAY THINGS ARE TOUGH - okay okay, I get it. "Things change", "the traffic moved", "adapt or die"....okay okay, I get it.

SO NOW WHAT?

Do programs continue to lose market share, affiliates, profits, and do paysites continue to sell less and less memberships? Great - THEN WHAT?

Is this entire Industry a fucking race to Zero or what? Will ANYONE (besides Manwin) be around even 3 years from now?

Not seeing much hope here in this thread.

Some programs have lost what they had, others have picked it up though.... the companies that will be around in 3, 5, 10 years will be the ones that follow porn on its technology ride. And as it does that, it's going to get harder and harder for people like us to compete - but that doesn't mean the market share is smaller, it simply moved.

Not sure I agree with any of those but thanks for filling in the blanks

Yes, I feel the same way. But are you talking things like Mobile, social media, some not-invented-yet new technology? LOL Because riding that technology wave often requires capital, commitment, longevity, market share, etc to really pull all that off and remain competitive. In other words, I can have some of the greatest content on the web (and I do, heh) but being a small company how can I invest, say, 100k in new technologies? TB can do so, of course, but us "little guys" will have it the hardest, I think.

What worries me is what I saw in the music and television industries (I worked in both, back in 80's-90's): a few giant companies will gobble up all the little guys and, in the end, you'll have four places to go get your porn. Sure, it may appear to the surfer like there is endless porn out there but, in reality, everything will be owned by 4 people. This is what worries me the most.

Aye, some of the technologies yes... we have so many now from tablets, internet tv boxes, crap I can't remember and yes, all the future stuff we can't dream of.

And exactly... that's exactly what is happening and will happen. The only half positive I see in this is technology makes it easier to tap into technology. While we may never find the market we once had... I do think many of us will continue to find little pockets that can pad our pockets nicely for decades to come.

That's also the way I feel, and I'm making business decisions based on that not-so-rosy future you are accurately describing. I could expand my business ten fold, hire people, get office space, post cool videos of my two inter-connected offices (LOL), but given your scenario I feel my pockets will best be padded if I stay "small" and flexible. Basically, what it takes for a single person or two to earn high six figures is easier than if that same person had even 10 employees. I would imagine.

Besides, I hate firing people and can't fire myself, so...:)

his wife wears the pants in the biz :winkwink:

Jealousy is a funny thing to watch. She can put the pants on anytime she wants, a woman that powerful, that smart, and that damn good looking is more than welcome to take the reign and run with it while I sit back and play golf all day. :winkwink:

Now get back to work... while I step out of the golf car and hit this drive right fast.

****Doc you keep typing "conversion" instead of "conversation"- i think you've beaten your head against the proverbial brick wall so many times it is starting to show.

Usually when Paul Markham steps into the thread i just stop reading and bail out.

Kind of like when you are driving down the highway and you see a bunch of red tailights up ahead so you know to exit and try another route.

But i guess sometimes you decide to stay on and see what the traffic is backing up.

In Paul's case sometimes i stay and read thru his post and I always end up pissed at myself.

Now i'll let you get back to the conversion at hand...

Thanks :) My conversion ratio at converting Paul's conversation to something coherent has been crushed!

That's a lot of C's.

Thread closed