Ahh gotcha.

Thanks, carry on.

You mean you wouldn't trust me inside the guts of your system with a kill switch? Come on! :mad:

That's not true.

I had a mishap with a DVD distributor who licensed some of my movies to them by mistake during one of Mansef's massive content buys. It was taken care of, but shit does happen.

Come back here in 2 years - on June 1st, 2013

The porn tubes you know of today, will be gone... or completely unrecognizable at a minimum.

As will be gone 40% - 50% of the current industry, either consolidated or out of business.

right it not like there has ever been a time when a content producer sent a bogus takedown request.

Hrm I have a little idea, likely will go nowhere but here goes. Will report back in a few minutes.

i still dont understand the thought process behind you guys. jack a bunch of content, fully KNOWING what you are doing is illegal and then playing the "tell us and we'll remove it" game with you think is ok?

on top of that, you guys don't even remove half the content that is asked for... or just keep adding more and claim its "user uploaded"

enjoy the ride now... it will be over shortly and you guys will struggling to find the next venture to make your car and mortgage payments

The thing you don't understand is what we are actually doing.

We are not jacking content.
We are not doing anything illegal.
We are not playing any games.
We do not ignore DMCA requests.
The content is user uploaded.

Nathan, you forgot one:

We profit from stolen content that does not belong to us.

I will be shooting porn in 2015 i will still be here

user uploaded :1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

.

I am going to upload some watermarked content today without a partner account and lets see if it gets posted or not...

every time i tried this in the past, none of the content was posted and i own it...

which means that you have people manually reviewing uploads...

that is a violation of safe harbor and you know it....

but, i will try again today and see what happens...




.

marketsmart, its actually not a violation of safe harbor, but go and try it either way...

I'll second that. In my 2 years here I have met some true characters and a laundry list of people who have no business conducting business.

So, just to be clear then, are you publicly admitting that you have people manually reviewing uploads?

And if so, what is the decision process these "people" are working off of, and then additionally, are these "people" paid employees?

Inquiring minds....

how is that not a violation? you can not manually review every user uploaded file and choose which ones are ok and which ones are not and at the same time allow the same infringing file to be repeatedly uploaded time and time again.

your argument would not hold up in court... :2 cents:

but dont worry, no one will step up and try to sue you guys anyway... :thumbsup






.

So what your saying is if I created a tube site and had, say a friend upload a bunch of your full length videos and content to my site while I fully know they are full length and was is going on is not legal, THAT WOULD BE OK??

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

keep thinking that to yourself, christ you guys are fucking retarded

Yes content owned by a UK company in which I have an interest was being repeatedly uploaded, removed, uploaded, removed. However I have been discussing Manwin with friends and peers for months before posting this thread. I may be the one posting but this is not an AdultKing show, I'm just playing spokesperson at this stage.

The original idea floated in the original post was simple, put a tube out of reach of Manwin that exploited only Manwin owned content. User uploaded of course, users being a room full of Indians with fast internet.

The threat of Manwin to sue me was an empty one, all that would be acheived by any attempt to do so would be a loss of money to lawyers for Manwin, there are problems of jurisdiction, applicable laws in specific countries that may be bases for such an operation, the fact that Nathan by his own words invited me to do it, the list goes on. Manwin's greatest weakness is that it has set a precedent for what is acceptable and a very good argument could be made that Manwin are trying to litigate against their own business model. If it got to court, if Manwin gained a default judgement, then they have a nice piece of paper in the form of a court order that is completely unenforceable.

An invitation was made to Nathan to come to the table to discuss options and he has done so in this thread. He has already indicated they use fingerprinting technology for content control and also admitted there is some kind of review process of uploads. This again presents Manwin a problem, it is a weakness that can be exploited by insisting that if uploads are screened for bad stuff then they can also be screened for infringement. The onus is on Manwin not to infringe on other parties rights, it is not the onus of the aggrieved party to tell Manwin they have infringed IP rights.

The next step was an offer to provide an industry based solution to remove content *instantly* that was infringing, Nathan has, on Manwin's behalf, committed in principle to such a scheme with conditions.

Now it's a case of building the scheme from the ground up, however there are several contingency plans if Manwin refuses to play ball.

I have made it clear through this thread I have no personal grievance toward Nathan, for better or worse he has been a contributor of note to this industry and is a very clever man. However most would agree Manwin needs to clean up it's act, as do many other tube operators - unfortunately for Manwin it is the test case for this issue. Manwin has set itself up as the new golden child of porn and is therefore an appropriate target for trialling methods to make infringements of the rights of others something which has real consequences.

It is up to this industry to stop what the tubes are doing, there are many creative ideas that will be floated soon. If you have an idea to stop tubes raping rights holders, then express it clearly, become involved in stopping this grubby trade of stolen content.

In the meantime, later today a website will be set up to take registrations of interest from content owners who wish to participate in an industry based solution, if enough people step up to the plate then it will be game on.

The scheme as I see it should be phased in. First with a register of content that rights holders explicitly forbid Manwin to host on their sites. It will then be up to Manwin to remove it, very fast. If they don't then they risk the consequences of not doing so, whatever they may be in practice. Then the second stage should be to automate the system with fingerprinting. Meaning that a system will be in place that will zap a video the minute it is uploaded if it's on the exclusion list via software API's provided to Manwin. As Manwin is the primary offender in this exercise, it will need to provide a significant contribution financially to keep the scheme afloat, again if it chooses not to then there are other options.

Of course all this is open for discussion between those members of the industry who wish to participate, many have already expressed a desire to have this issue dealt with, so it's time to take real action.

For those people who think that I am just pissing into the wind, that's your right to hold your opinion but there are a group of people in the background with significant resources to ensure that the issue of content theft assisted by Manwin ceases.

We screen for illegal content. As in, bestiality, child porn, rape and so on...

And no, I "admit" to nothing, there is nothing to "admit" to.

See my post above, if you can screen for bad stuff you can also screen for infringement. The onus is on you not to infringe on the rights of copyright holders, not the other way around.

You must realise that the big tube party for Manwin is over, we have suggested an industry based scheme and you should come on board. It's the right and responsible thing to do. You can't have it both ways, you cannot set yourselves up as the golden child of the adult industry and rape other parts of it at the same time. Just remember what happened to Rome.

delusions of grandeur ...

you can't be that stupid

your equating instigating the upload with just not stopping it

AK, no we can not, only once you grasp that fact, you will understand DMCA.

Go and setup your system, and we will use it...

you do realize that there is a liability for taking down content that has a right to be there

when it clearly illegal (CP/beastiality) the fact that contents illegal means the injured party is never going to complain

but in the case were you can't tell by looking (licienced/unlicienced) the injured party can sue, if you only take down properly notifed content the liability shifts to the notifier.

I appreciate that Nathan, but what does a US law mean to a UK entity ? Why should a UK entity bow to US law to have something removed that would clearly place you in liability in the source country of the content ? It's a serious question. My legal advice is that DMCA's mean shit when it comes to countries like Australia and the UK, all we need to do to remove content is tell you to according to my advice.

They have great poutine in Montreal. :)

That's why stage one of our scheme will be to provide a regularly updated list of content explicitly disallowed to be added to the tubes to Manwin. It will be up to them how they administer it, if they need more staff to check everything against the list so be it. When we have an API it can be automated, however that wont happen overnight.

Also, a UK company having it's content infringed in the USA is able to sue, it doesn't have to issue a DMCA, that's a US law, doesn't apply in the UK.

A whole can of legal worms is opening up here.

Because US law is a usual basis for new laws, especially in places like the UK.

Most of europe is following the same principle as DMCA. If a notice is sent and content is removed on it, there is no liability by the service provider, forum, board or whatever.

"International Law is mostly unexplored legal territory."

- The West Wing, 2004

This means most "international lawsuits" go jack nowhere.

Interesting read. I noticed how Nathan kept mentioning the word "illegal". Not that they didn't do anything wrong, but they didn't do anything wrong "illegally". So you know it's wrong morally, but legally it doesn't matter so who gives a shit?

Options I thought of:
1. Hire hackers to infiltrate the network and destroy everything
2. Work with Nathan to get Manwin to start making changes.
3. As previously suggested, catch them being shady and take them to court
4. Hire hitmen from the Deep Web (Google it). Keyword being hitmen not man.
5. Leave the industry
6. GIANT botnet to take down everything Manwin.

That being said, I don't own any adult sites, networks, businesses, etc. I just come here for the boobies :)

Fucking retard.

Bad part is there is a world full of crazy people out there. It's just a matter of time before something bad happens.

Hell, for all I know gideongallery might snap from all the times I've shown him to be an idiot who isn't even in this business and never made a dollar.

Man that would suck. I'd rather die most any other way than by the hands of gideon "dumbass" gallery :1orglaugh

I guess I should have been specific. I'm not building illegal tubes or even accepting user uploads :)

Thats the beauty of the CyberSEO plugin... this shit updates all day on its own with hosted FLVs. Traffic on this one domain has doubled every day for 5 days in a row now.

2 sites done now, 112 more to go. All on domains that range from 5 to 14 years old.

Oh for fucks sake Nathan give us a break, UK Common Law property rights are ancient principals of law, how can you be so pompous. The FACT is that DMCA is a USA Law and does not apply to the rest of the world.

With our scheme, you wont be getting DMCA's you will have a single list, updated regularly, from that you will remove content immediately as it is upoloaded or found on your servers. You will follow the laws that protect the content rights holders no matter where they are. Why ? Because it's the right thing to do, not because it's in the Digital Millenium Copyright Act which covers a few hundred million people out of many billion it does not affect or apply to.

i think a more likely scenario would be for gideon to get you incarcerated and then get himself incarcerated at the same facility and then bribe the guards with a few packs of smokes to get bunked in the same cell with you and then try to rape you....

when you finally got released, every morning when you inserted a tampon into your rectum to stop the bleeding, you would know that gideon got the best of you..

sounds plausible... :1orglaugh






.

Comments like that are why I love this forum :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

I did read it all.

We don't want to build tubes, we want to stop tubes raping content rights holders. If that means using "legal" means in other jurisdictions so be it. For the time being Nathan seems to back a solution, let's see how that goes.

If you own content and you don't want it on tubes then we will try to put together a coalition to ensure it doesn't happen. If you don't care about the tubes, don't get involved.

But I repeat, this has nothing to do with tubes or tube envy. It is all about content theft.

I don't like some of the violent suggestions in this thread, Manwin is the issue not Nathan, not Gideongallery, nobody else.

This thread is to tackle content theft and the resulting distribution by tubes.

Yeah supposedly this board has the best of the best in our industry. Would expect more but then again maybe not.
Again I give some people on this board to much credit when it comes to being professional and intelligent.