I think we agree - reduce the interest and S&G and the stock will gain.

Good post Biggy2

actually, this was part of the problem of their original offerings. their costs to get new customers was more than $120 if i remember correctly, and the income on a clients lifetime with them was around $100. so just on operations they were negative before paying for their debt, at least based on what i remember in one of their filings.

if you only gain about $100 a member but you are running $200 per signup marketing programs, you are likely to have a deficit.

If only it were that simple. I am sure on some of their joins it may be like that, but I doubt every single join they get costs them $100 per member, after all they are an insane brand with an insane member base - surely some people just remember who they are and signup to buy with an acquisition cost of $0. Also, in their last quarterly they actively discussed dropping media buys that were non-performing...

You all underestimate Marc Bell. The truth is, there's a reason he has millions and you are on GFY applying the assumption of one rudimentary statement or application you read to his whole business model as if this is 100% truth in reality.

I was doing some research for fun last night. As recently as Sept 14, Marc has actually been a buyer in his own stock of FFN at $2.75. Granted it was only 10,000 shares. What I found really interesting is him and soem of the other FFN guys are involved heavily in a REIT called ARR (http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=arr). This thing pays off a monthly dividend that yields 19-20% !!! Considering the gov't has just stated interest rates will remain low for quite some time, I'd say that might be a pretty interesting and quality buy to a shareholder, although I do need to look at it some more.

Why would you put your money into a company that does this to it's customers?
http://www.ripoffreport.com/Search/a...nd-finder.aspx :disgust

why is Will76 so butthurt?

let's take a look wills ifriends http://www.ripoffreport.com/Search/ifriends.aspx ... it has 415 reports files vs 93 for aff.... those fuckers at ifriends still own me five figure check from back in a day when they terminated a ton of affiliates for no reason...

If you read their last two quarterly reports you would see that their pure operating costs (not lawsuits or one time costs) they are still going negative (revenue-expenses). You can't say "with out their debt" with out their debt, penthouse would have already gone bankrupt. The debt is what got them the revenue (AFF & Cams). And while they paid off a little of the debt, it would take them several years, if ever to pay it all down at this pace... Most of it comes due this year anyway. They also have more pending legal problems that they can not afford and future very large payments to make for a settlement they just made. Bankruptcy is the only thing in their future.

Marc Bell might not be an idiot, as much as I think he is and don't like the guy. But he did a terrible job with running ibill (at least for us customers). They ran ibill into the ground and you right the "insiders" do make off like bandits because I bet anything that Marc Bell and company still made out well from ibill where as the rest of us got fucked. I wouldn't be surprised to see more of the same from them from FFN. You right about one thing those sharks have a skill I do not have that allows them to run and pillage corporations, do back door deals, have money *magically* disappear. If it's an art at screwing people to line their own pockets then he is a Picasso... but I still think he is an idiot ;)

Why it's not allowed to dislike a company around here. How odd. I didn't realize it was all love and peace and harmony and I was just the odd ball hater against Penthouse and AFF and their standup history.

Please inform ifriends that they are mine. I am not receiving my profit sharing checks :(

disliking company is all fine, but you're a little obsessed with it... seems like everyday you wake up, before doing anything you go post about aff :helpme

I've only started a couple threads about them in the last month, hardly every day. So I do have room to improve and step up my game i guess :1orglaugh :winkwink:

thanks for your concern on my mental health though. I'll invite you to the FFN bankruptcy party at my place when they close down and buy you a drink. :thumbsup

biggy, i looked at the original ipos, and they all showed horrible negative cash flow, with the selling costs to get new customers out of line with their lifetime membership income. apparently the only way things balanced was by selling the traffic on to others or to upsell within the sites, but that was not clear from the ipo so i cannot speculate.

what marc bell is doing is likely trying to look for a pop in the stock. remember, he has lost 75% of the value of his stock holdings in ffn so far. but if he can buy more at a low enough price and get a pop, even $1 more, he can cut his losses significantly and perhaps even come out where he was when this started. its a good move, but it depends on the stock staying alive and not making it to zero before someone else comes along to buy them out.

when you consider how quickly the stock lost 75% of its value, investing in it now is either a stroke of genius or the fastest way to the poor house. we will see. chat with you again when it hits $1, okay?

$2.13 right now, opened under $2 this morning.... still dropping like a rock.

FFN hit a new closing low at a whopping 68 cents, down 25 cents for the week.

typical week for ffn.

Marc Bell is an artist alright - a bullshit artist! :321GFY

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Actually, it was a worse week than usual for FFN, as their stock is nosediving into the ground:

http://charting.nasdaq.com/ext/chart...WD=539-HT=395-

Fuck FFN for supporting and underwriting thieving piracy sites for so many years through their advertising. :thefinger

http://cdn.buzznet.com/assets/users1...5282353424.jpg

Personally, I would like to see Marc Bell, et al behind bars, but bankruptcy is a good start - although a weasel like Marc Bell will likely find a way to personally profit off of a Penthouse/AFF/FFN bankruptcy, since that is the kind of greedy sleazeball he is and has always been. :2 cents:

ADG

68 cents heh.

That would have been a really nice short at IPO.

ummm, isn't that rising?

Yo Sleazy, that was 2-1/2 months ago (Sep 22nd) dude - FFN stock closed down at $0.68 cents today (it's lowest since going public):

http://www.thestreet.idmanagedsoluti...&SYMBOL_US=FFN

Remind me to not get dating or stock tips from you (never mind, I'll remember). :upsidedow

ADG