Because THEY aren't HIM.
At the end of the day, that's the ONLY factor for the rabble.

I know what you're saying...BUT...I've been to some "poor" South American countries (as I'm sure you have too), and I partied with some RICH people that lived there.

I'm 100% positive that if you and I were born and raised in a poor third world country, and didn't get killed when we were crazy teenagers...
We WOULD rise up to the top there as well and end up being the guys with the most pigs and goats in the village and have the hottest native women in our shacks.

The U.S. is a land of great opportunity. But I really don't feel that the government bureaucracy had very much to do with it. I think it had more to do with people like the Founding Fathers and later on people who led the expansion west and SEIZED opportunity in spite of the govt. (think Kennedy, Vanderbilt, Flagler, Rockafeller, etc.)

Hell, I'm living here in Vegas. It's a perfect example of the govt. fucking up something.
The mob built this town up and made it great.
Now? The govt. here makes it impossible for a small brick and mortar biz to get started. Only mega-corps can even think about it. And the govt. dips their hand in and regulates everything so harshly that it's definitely not "Sin City" anymore.

It's a town living off the past rep that it once had back in the 1940s through the 1970's. And every day it gets a little bit lamer and lamer (can bureaucrats EVER stop making new laws?) . People can only come here so many times looking for wild fun times...and instead get ass raped at every turn by the big companies running these casinos with their overpriced everything (remember when Vegas was the place you could come to for almost nothing?).

Count me as one of the "crazy" people who believe that "yes" we do need some govt. oversight to make sure that things are "right"....but I think that they have WAAAAAYYYY overreached (like they always do) and are stifling people from getting ahead in life.

As I said...I pity the poor fool who tries to start a small brick and mortar business these days. And then...if a miracle happens and he hits the big time?
Well...they want to tax him MORE for doing a good job. :(

Here is something to think about:
The federal income tax was first enacted in 1862 to support the Union's Civil War effort. It was eliminated in 1872, revived in 1894, then declared unconstitutional by the Supreme Court the following year. In 1913, the 16th Amendment to the Constitution made the income tax a permanent fixture in the U.S. tax system.

So the govt. is so goddamn greedy and power hungry that when they were told that Income Tax was unconstitutional...they simply amended the constitution to MAKE it legal
:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Great post.... you really proved me wrong this reply. :1orglaugh what an idiot.

I love your post though, yeah 401k's aren't a dedication and dividends are taxed at twice the rate, not half... hahahahahahahahaha, and that's like the baby list.

Please give us some more of your brilliant banter for us to laugh at this evening...

We had taxes on land, slaves, tea and other good trades long before America was even America and before 1862 :)

The constitution is designed to be amended.

Without those income taxes,there would be no road system,most of the major medical advances happened after medicare. There would be no internet, gov dollars fueled the development of and huge subsidies for the investment in board band. Most people didn't go to college,fuck most didn't finish high school but the first gi bill caused a growth in college education. Then student loans and pell grants. These things just didnt fall from the sky. The middle class was created after FDR before that it was rich and poor.

Can't we all just agree that government is in bad shape, and needs to be "revised" ?

I agree with you. :thumbsup

Why are poor people forced to do less? It's equal in this case... for example: When they cut taxes, if you're poor, you make no extra money, you don't get a tax break on a refund... Those benefits are for us higher income people.

If you're broke at the end of the month after making $250k, then you have money management issues. If you had half the taxes you do now, you would simply spend the money and be in the same situation. Assuming it's true.

A tax refund does not pay all of your taxes back, it's a refund - most people only get part of it back.... It's 22.5k for getting more back than you put in, and YOU also get it back for that equal amount too, but you also pay more because of the over amount, so your "refund" gets sucked up into the mix of owed taxes.

I agree... $250k is not rich, it's nice money, but not rich... that's how you know he's blowing smoke up our asses. Even if me, you, and everyone making under 1 million a year, paid 50% gross tax, we still wouldn't cover the tax burden. It's not enough money, the super rich simply have that much of it, that's how much f'in money they have over "everyone" here.

Now THIS is a sandwich!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_03cCfAQdwe...00/dagwood.jpg

I'm 100% for the govt. doing those things.

But does it need to spend TRILLIONS of dollars? No.

Should we have military bases in over 200 FOREIGN countries? No.

Should there be hundreds of billions of dollars in pork spending from career politicians to their cronies? No.

We don't NEED an income tax to do the things you stated. We could easily do those things with a small national sales tax. And remember...Pres. Clinton put the extra tax on gasoline back in the 1990's to keep our highways in good repair! :) (gee, I wonder where that money went? The Pentagon perhaps?)

Tony...our govt. are a bunch of damn crooks. They spend, and spend, and spend. It's not their money so they don't give a damn. They have all their health care needs taken care of on our dime. They have a pension for the rest of their lives on our dime. And they kick money to their business associates constantly on our dime.

My grandmother used to say: "The road to hell is paved with good intentions"

And once FDR started the beginning of a welfare state, with GOOD intentions...the crooks and con men moved quickly and are now embedded in Washington D.C. stealing and spending like drunken sailors.

There is nowhere else to get your hands on TRILLIONS of dollars of FREE money! And as I pointed out...if something is unconstitutional...they simply MAKE it constitutional!
Of course that money was made off of the backs of people who EARNED it. It's NOT THEIR MONEY. Or at least it isn't supposed to be. :(

My argument is...because they didn't PAY any taxes to begin with!

And yet, a few years ago they all received checks from the govt. as a big national "tax refund"!
Remember that?

Everyone I know who actually pays taxes was furious over that! How the fuck can you get a "refund" if you never paid? :1orglaugh

Everyone pays taxes to begin with... they get a refund at the end of the year returning back "income tax" but not any of the other taxes.

Only a very small fraction of the population pay zero taxes through refunds, the "truly" poor. That's something like single $9k a year, or 22.5k for a family of 4. At that, you pay 0% tax on that first $20k as well, and even get a refund... however because you earn more (not because you are taxed more) your refund side is absorbed up.

Those checks went to tax payers.... 100% of them. It wasn't your money that they got, it was their money.

Hahahaha, just shows how far down the food chain you are mr. Mom, thinking that 401ks are "rich people deductions"
:1orglaugh

It's an investment which is a deduction... idiot. Ie: the actual point you tried to argue.

Nobody said it was for rich people.... idiot. However no poor person making $15k a year pays $15k a year into the 401k... idiot.

Man... out of stupid fucks on this board, you take the cake, bar none.

Demand is what spurs all of that, without demand none of that happens.

good morning, mr. mom.

add reading comprehension to the list of reasons you're a failure.

now prattle on son, I take a perverse pleasure in watching nobodies pretend their not out of work mr. moms.

Sly, to get back to your point (after wading thru the usual unintelligent trolls with their "I know all about rich people because I work from my bedroom" logic)
Buffett is a liar.
From today's Washington Post:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...d0iK_blog.html

When you add up all of the various taxes, and look at the effective tax rates, it is clear the tax system is already pretty progressive. Everyone pays some tax, even those who pay no federal income taxes, and the wealthiest pay a larger percentage share of taxes. Here’s the effective tax rate for all of the groups, according to the CBO:
Lowest quintile (23.4 million taxpayers), zero to $18,900: 4.3 percent
Second lowest quintile (22.4 million), $18,900-$32,100: 10.2 percent
Middle quintile (22.9 million), $32,100-$47,400: 14.2 percent
Fourth quintile (23 million), $47,400-$71,200: 17.6 percent
Highest quintile (23.6 million), above $71,200: 25.8 percent
Top 10 percent (12 million), minimum income of $98,100: 27.5 percent
Top 5 percent (5.9 million), minimum income of $134,400: 29 percent
Top 1 percent (1.1 million), minimum income of $332,300: 31.2 percent
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

now monkeys like theCock and tony404 will ignore these facts and continue to throw shit but those of us with real businesses with real incomes know the truth.

I've only been reading half the thread so somebody catch me up.

For fantasy sake, let's say I'm making $500k a year. What deductions are available to me that put me in the $50k bracket?

To my knowledge, the only way I can put that personal money into the stock market and get a deduction would be a 401(k), which is capped $15k yearly and is not even available to those that make $500k a year.

I suppose I could invest that money into a personal business, that would allow for a variety of deductions, although my fantasy Fortune 500 company employer would probably not be too crazy about that.

Charitable donations I suppose. I wouldn't really get much monetary benefit out of that.

I must be leaving something out.

I don't particularly feel sorry for this person, I'm simply trying to figure out where $400k worth of deductions come from.

Alright,when you break ground on your demand factory I will look forward to the invitation to tour it.

they come from the fantasy land of the GFY troll.
Here in the real world, the numbers I posted above are facts.

Idiot... I didn't respond to everything you posted, I respond to one part. Damn.....

Btw, is Mr. Mom an insult? What a loser you must be.... even if I 100% took care of my kids, you kinda have to be a complete and total loser to try pretend like that's a bad thing... come on, no wonder you're so fucked up in the head... just wow.

The deductions don't exist. If you had that much to write off at the end of the fiscal,you have simply lost a lot of money and won't need to worry about next year.
The real world of business is no where close to as simple as most of the people in this thread would like to believe.

what, mr. mom?
I can't quite here you. you're unemployment apron is muffling your horse shit story.:1orglaugh

the 'rich' people in third world countries, 9 times out of 10 got there through illegal activities and corruption. not being successful at something legit.

and don't forget, the middle class is what made you all the money that you couldn't spend fast enough. tax them more...would they of had the money to spend?

income taxes in general suck, i'd rather see 20% sales tax and no income taxes but i don't see it happening.

oh, and the 'normal' people who get tax refunds most likely had too much taken from their paychecks by their employeers. something us self employed people never get. so while we all have to pay out big chunks, worker bee #134343 has money taken from him on every paycheck but ends up getting a small refund at the end, doesn't mean he/she paid nothing in taxes.

Yep soooo true..

I was stunned the day I saw some Texas Million air in an interview say that he could not make payroll if he could not get a loan form the bank. WTF...

Thats not being in business, thats being stupid.

Yes idiot... if you make more money, you pay more taxes... wow, holy fucking shit, no way man? :1orglaugh Just based on the standard tax bracket, any idiot would know that.

The top 1% guy paid the exact same % on his $18.9k as well, 4.3 average... it's the money over that brings his rate up, AS HE SCALES, god damn you're stupid.

If you've ever ACTUALLY really earned any money in your life.. you would know this... if you actually ran a real full on business, you would know this. Yeah... you're that big of an idiot.

I understand why you reply this now... anytime you actually speak and try to inject knowledge, you get blasted for being a complete idiot and shown how stupid you truly are... thus you revert back to the same argument style for your defense.

Oh wait, let me play along... wow, you totally burned me with that one, ouch. :1orglaugh

Every business will experience cashflow problems from time to time. If you grow your business at too fast of a pace, you are financing more receivables to your customers. In most cases you won't see your money for 30-45 days. Yet,on friday you must make payroll. While you are waiting to see your cash come in you will cover up to 6 payrolls. Where does that money come from?

Answer - You have a line of credit with your bank.

Now post the figures for the top .01% and for the top 400 specifically.

Also, as I stated earlier, the brackets are what is broken.
An heir earning 2% tax free on 100 Million invested in municipal bonds pays 0 tax on their 2M payout per year.
A person who earns 2M as payroll pays 30%+ on the same amount, and had to actually earn their money.

I'm also curious how useful your chart is, and if they are including all forms of income or only including taxable income.
If it's only including 'taxable income' the numbers are badly skewed.

Warren Buffet paid 16.2% in federal income tax on around 50 Million in earnings.
That is not a guess or a fancy hypothesis from a convoluted economic model. It's on his actual tax return.
That is not right. He agrees it's not right. Yet you are here pissng up at your betters and telling him he is wrong.

When, not if, we move to a national sales tax and/or flat tax with zero loopholes the problem will be solved, along with a slew of other inefficient assanine and absurd tax policy pitfalls. Until then, a very simple and fair fix is to include 'an absolute' tax rate that no deduction or loophole will allow a person to ignore within their own bracket. A smilar 'absolute tax rate' on the corporate side would do a lot prevent asset shifting overseas and to prevent companies like Golman Sachs from paying 2% or less per year.

dear unemployed half wit, the topic of this thread is about warren buffett stretching the truth. My facts from the CBO prove that he is. Please let the adults discuss the topic.

Now I know that you resent me because I'm successful and you're a hanger on in this business. I understand that being mentally challenged, you couldn't shift with the business. its ok son, this biz isn't for everyone. just wink out like the rest of your kind. pissing up at me won't get you a job.:1orglaugh

In the sales game this strategy is.... If you can't wow them with the facts. Blind them with bullshit.
Mr. Clicks has clearly run successful businesses. And anyone that posts here knows that. What is it you have done that we aren't aware of.

oh look, another unemployed know it all coming in to explain the CBO's numbers are wrong.

son, no matter how much the government takes from your betters, than money will never make it into your hands.

Oh look more lame twists, waahhhhhhh I didn't follow 12cunts rules, what a little bitch..

No Those Numbers Do Not Prove That, you're too damn stupid to understand how any of this works. wow, wow, and wow.. you REALLY are that stupid. HAHAHAHAHAHA.

What a poser, I'm a big daddy, telling mr buffet he's wrong... I'm his upper, what a loser.

and the unemployed monkey continues to throw shit. :1orglaugh

no surprise.

I've made a shit ton more than 12cunts and I'm a good bit younger.

I owned Largecash, several other programs, content plugins, we've created technology still in use today, and have been doing this successfully, for 15 years now.

Plenty of others that spank my ass... but not that idiot.

Huh? Yeah I guess I'm unemployed... as in, I haven't worked for someone else in like 15 years?

I know your brain is in backwards, but most of us here are business owners.... :upsidedow

We require proof when accusations are made around here. Saying go look it up on the interwebs is not proof. Show clear and concise proof, not hearsay, proof unless you would like a vacation!

ahahaha!

all that brilliance and the only thing you dare name is a parked domain.

yes, son, you're doing great!:1orglaugh

Actually Ronald it's 'unemployed know it all' Warren Buffet who has explained your numbers are wrong.
And you prattling on arguing with him about an amount and a tax policy problem that you personally will never reach.

TheDoc keeps pointing out that we have a graduated tax bracket system where we all pay an identical rate on the money we earn at each level of taxation. The guy earning 18K doesn't pay any more or any less than you, me, or Warren buffet on our first 18K and so on up through each bracket. He is correct, though he does a poor job of explaining it.

The simple fact is that the bracket 'tax rates' have become meaningless.
What matters are the actual tax rates people are paying on their income.
When deductions and loopholes allow people to reduce their actual tax rate to the lowest bracket from the highest bracket... Who cares what the brackets are listed at?
An absolute tax rate that capped all deductions and loopholes is a simple and effective fix for the problem.
If the defined bracket was stated instead as 'starting at 35% but never less than 30% regardless of deductions' the gamesmanship would be curtailed and we would begin to have much more meaningful discussions about tax policy because the rates would matter. As it is now, a large percentage of people aren't paying their rate and could care less what it became. If the highest bracket suddenly went to 99% you would still see Warren Buffet paying close to 17% because the bracket has little bearing on his taxation.