It's really amazing when you think about it. So much information out there and people still doing the wrong stuff.

Well... at one point that was a standard banner ad in mainstream (i.e. flash "punch the monkey" banners as an example). The idea was always "send more clicks to the sponsor/advertiser" - of course, everyone eventually learned the hard way that "more" isn't better.

Again, my point was simple. It's not just "traffic" that makes money and "more traffic" certainly doesn't guarantee more money. Traffic is only part of the equation.

to bad that doesn't actually work as an explanation

Huh? Who are you replying to?

If they like to call it selling then let them. In the real world it's sending traffic and hoping for the best.

They can filter and hone it, yet ultimately it's a numbers game. Because they can't deal with them as individuals on a one to one basis and sell to their needs.

Also to sell you have to know about your product, what it does, what it's strong and weak points are. Few here know that about anything but a few niches. I've been in porn 3 decades and only know teens and big tits well. I love Penthouse Glamor, but couldn't sell it.

You only have to look into sites to see how little the owners know about the niche, few really nail their niche. Now is a pornsite owner selling porn or just getting so much traffic someone will buy?

Then how many people rely 100% on what the sponsor gives them? Good luck "selling" with only that. :Oh crap

If a person standing outside a disco giving free tickets for hot cute girls to come in and take a look at the disco is selling. Then so are webmasters.

No selling is a refined skill, that it's clear few here have.

If more traffic = more sales. This industry online would be full of billionaires. :1orglaugh

Before anyone comes in with some more BS let's see proof.

Forget my sites as proof I can sell a paysite membership. The content was shot for offline and know it's not what would sell best online. We couldn't afford to change our game. :thumbsup

I (everyone) knew it was coming but I still can't believe the words on the page. :1orglaugh

This is selling. F. A . B. style

F = Feature.This chocolate has taken years to develop

A = Advantage. To give an instant explosion of taste in the mouth.

B = Benefit. So you can feel the full sensation.

Which all counts for zero if you give them a stick of brown plastic. That's not selling, it's lying and conning.

In online porn adding mere words to a sample of the porn is just that, mere words.

Honing, filtering and refining the traffic. Isn't selling, it's targeting the best audience to sell to. Like trying to sell the greatest tasting filet steak to a bunch of vegans, OK that's extreme. You get what I'm saying.

So ultimately all affiliates can do is to hone, filter and refine. Because when the decision is made to go onto the site and get out a CC. It's not because of the convincing words. It rests on the shoulders of the product. And without closing a sale, you haven't got a sale.

Call it what you like, but it doesn't make a slab of brown plastic a bar of chocolate. :winkwink:

This for most is what they call selling.

http://www.downblouseloving.com/images/template_26.gif

to the original point of the thread?

try using this logic to explain what you do for work to some chick; it doesn't go far

so best buy doesnt sell TV's? they merely sell traffic to Sony, Samsung, etc? I dont think your logic is right :winkwink:

If you don't have the sign up page, you can't be selling. Promoting yes, selling no.

As very few affiliates have a sign up page or even a tour to close the sale, how can they "sell"?

Promote yes.

Main Entry: promote  [pruh-moht]
Part of Speech: verb
Definition: help, advance
Synonyms: advertise, advocate, aid, assist, avail, back, befriend, benefit, bolster, boost, build up*, call attention to, champion, contribute, cooperate, cry*, develop, encourage, endorse, espouse, forward, foster, further, get behind, hype*, improve, nourish, nurture, patronize, plug*, popularize, propagandize, publicize, puff, push, push for, recommend, sell, serve, speak for, speed, sponsor, stimulate, subsidize, succor, support, uphold, urge, work for

Anyone see the word sell in there?

However

Main Entry: sell  [sel]
Part of Speech: verb
Definition: exchange an object for money
Synonyms: advertise, auction, bargain, barter, be in business, boost, clinch the deal, close, close the deal, contract, deal in, dispose, drum, dump, exchange, handle, hawk, hustle, market, merchandise, move, peddle, persuade, pitch, plug, puff, push, put across, put up for sale, retail, retain, snow, soft sell, soft soap, spiel*, stock, sweet talk, trade, traffic, unload, vend, wholesale

Notes: a cell is a small compartment or the basic structural and functional unit of all organisms, while sell means to exchange or deliver for money or its equivalent

Sell as meaning. To sell the idea of taking the next step of the process. In that case affiliates do "sell". Is that what people here meant?

I know you have me on ignore and I also know you're going to click on this comment to see what it says anyhow.

I not only SELL porn I link to the fucking join page 99% of the time. Now tell me I didn't sell that surfer, just try to. :1orglaugh

You think you know what everyone is doing based on what you see a handful of people doing on GFY. You know NOTHING.

Proof please, show us your process so we can see you're not bullshitting us.

hey moron if you had even the slightest whiff how internet marketing works today you would know NO ONE is going to out their sales and landing pages so people can copy, steal and sabotage. in fact posting someones page on some mainstream boards will get you banned.

you don't care because you sites only exist as an example of how not to market, but do you really thing he's going to out his techniques?

get a clue retard.

Apples and hammers, no comparison, Bestbuy does sell TV's.

Please show us how well your impossibly shitty sites convert Paul. Show us some hard data so its not just bullshit talk.

Prove you know how to sell porn. Not sell content. Not sell content to magazines, but to sell a porn membership to a surfer.

Where's the stats Paul? Where's the proof?

I never link to my pages in public but I'm going to make an exception. I've dug up the first "real" website I put up from 2004. It doesn't give away too much of my technique but still proves that I was linking to join 7 years ago. From 2001 to 2003 I pretty much used free hosts and all of that stuff has since died. I've changed some things quite a bit over the years, other techniques I still use but this will at least show him what he wants to know.

Let's take a trip down memory lane. One of my pages from 2004 can be seen on archive.org here.

http://web.archive.org/web/200406031...n/profile.html

Not my best converting stuff, this was more of a test when I first got off of free sites (angelfire, geocities, etc) where I converted 1:4 or 5 because they seemed more real to the surfers. This is also very short on content because I moved from using a few different pages to dozens / hundreds of them based off of real girls profiles on Ifriends. Before this I actually worked with the models, all of these were just pulled from the content section.

Anyhow, the archive join link won't work but if you'll look you'll see that it says:

http://web.archive.org/web/20040603193522/http://clickcash.webpower.com/SetPermanentSignupCookie.cgi?svc=IF&lang=ENGLISH&t ype=BOUNTY&mode=1&art=FREEMEMBERSHIP&acct=STOCKTRA DER23&url=https://orders.webpower.com/iFriends/viewprefmain.htm&ref=http://mysite.ifriends.net/cgi-win/$ifupload.exe

Pull out the url I linked to and you get this. Feel free to click it.

http://clickcash.webpower.com/SetPermanentSignupCookie.cgi?svc=IF&lang=ENGLISH&t ype=BOUNTY&mode=1&art=FREEMEMBERSHIP&acct=STOCKTRA DER23&url=https://orders.webpower.com/iFriends/viewprefmain.htm&ref=http://mysite.ifriends.net/cgi-win/$ifupload.exe

They changed their join page to rotate so it's ugly as shit. On my later promotions I hacked up a way to pick my favorite join page and went with the standard white one because it looked more legitimate / professional.

This is 2004, I was linking to join in 2001. I made almost $5,000 my first full week of pushing webcams and linking to the join seemed like the only reasonable way to sell it. I sold the surfer on my page and asked them to sign up. 2011 and not much has changed. I have and do link to other pages if the source of traffic or sponsor doesn't give me the options I need to effectively promote them but this is the very basic version of my selling style that I have been using successfully for 10 years minus the time I was out of the business.

Cheers

Jeff, are you old?

Almost 48

Found one from 2001 as well. Damn I let some nice domain names go. :(

Oh well, maybe Paul is taking a break and hasn't seen this yet.

This is not correct.. trust me
Content is what sells, if its placed on a tour or in a banner.. CTR means very little

I make porn sales based on my business name and site and I'm an affiliate.

You are basing your opinion on how many sales, I am basing mine on 17 million

OK won't quote the whole thing as people have read it.

What you seem to be doing it using good selling text and the sites samples.

Is the girl giving away sample biscuits, in a store, and quoting the sales phrases selling?

Because that seems to me what you do. Obviously promoting a 1 to 1 experience like a webcam doing this is a good way. Were they signing up to a free membership or a paid membership?

If they signed up to a free membership which encouraged them down the line to buy. Then you're not IMO selling. Except selling them to take the next step for free.

What makes a person "Sold" on buying the porn?

The words or the content? I know words are also content, buy is it the written words or the visual samples?

IMO after all the years of promising satisfaction in the text and it not coming good in the porn. I feel words are no longer enough. Stocktrader's text is good FAB text.

Alara is a natural beauty, [FONT="Arial"]and just looking at her gets me all wet! Luckily she's bi like me so she knows how to really get me off. :)~[/FONT] Don't worry, she likes guys too and I'm sure she'll give you a show you won't soon forget.

Still, is it exceptional in today's market?

To close the sale the porn content has to prove it's true. The text prepares the ground.

If he wants to prove it to me and not share it with others, we can do this privately. I'm on ICQ.

Is that people who were looking or people who went to the site?

Boom!!! LOL :)

And quoted so that little post did not slip through the cracks.


;-))

I think very few people , have seen as many joins as you , Jeff.

if you cant sell porn, having the most traffic in the world wont make you a sale.

This is not a 1:4 sales text page. It sucked in comparison, probably 1:50. My 1:4 pages are long gone from being on free hosts and me deciding to deal with more traffic and money over higher conversions.

Anyhow, at the time people were doing 1:400 on the same website. Getting a credit card out of 1:4 people, call it whatever you want, but I was closing them on the product before I sent them off. Linking to a gallery is saying "look at this naked girl!" and hoping the gallery and tour do the job I should be responsible for is what most did / do.

Affiliates/webmasters don't sell traffic, they market a product and share the revenues (either by Revshare or PPS or some form) with the site owner. If programs were paying per click and nothing more, affiliates/webmasters would be "selling traffic".

:2 cents:

if your business is not focused on marketing its not a business its a hobby.

Not everybody is capable of analyzing stats, though a lot think that they are. However, I'm getting the feeling that there was another agenda to this thread, you were fishing for someone, so I'll leave you to have fun with him :thumbsup

Not necessarily. You can send more and more to a place that makes the most from it and end up worse than when you were sending a smaller amount.

And there's a hell of a lot more to it than just sending traffic somewhere that converts it best.

Good post. :thumbsup

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

What's better, 10k uniques doing 1:50 or 1m uniques doing 1:1000?

Ratios come into it when deciding where to send your specific traffic, not when comparing whether more traffic, or less, but more targeted, traffic is 'best'.

1:4 is still a hell of a ratio, even though it's irrelevant to what the OP is saying. Nice work :thumbsup

You know now that I think about it, of all the people who have their hand in porn online, Paul should like the [good] affiliates the most. They are an expert at showing the surfer what they want to see and create the best buying scenario possible. They are keeping porn buying alive for crying out loud!

While most program owners and TGP's etc etc just work on getting more and more traffic to throw at something and take whatever money they can get. And in the meantime annoying the surfers so much that they end up going to tubes.

in the end if you have mass traffic someone is always going to buy it and figure out a way to convert it. just like google does.

Most Affiliates run matched category websites.

No different to running a franchise business or any shop and selling the upstream product.

Eric fucks playboy chicks for a living, he probably thinks you guys holding the camera and selling videos aren't *IN THE PORN BUSINESS*

he is 100% right and if you disagree you are a fool

I could not grow my business as fast as I wanted to and maintain 1:4 ratios. I did the math and it turned out that getting much more traffic and shittier ratios would make me more money at the time so I did that. I worked with a pretty unique setup back then, all I really care to say since it's still a viable technique today. End of the day, I wanted to make as much as possible and went that direction.

To everyone that posted in the thread, thank you, agree or disagree is no matter. It was just pretty cool to see some REAL exchange of thoughts on a topic. Reminds me a bit of the original Ynot board circa 1997.

Yes, I do see the word "sell". Don't you?

Utes, actually the word sell IS in your definition. Oops.

If you want to define sell narrowly as the actual exchange of money, I suppose CCBill is the only seller. They then pay the affiliate and the program owner. Of course, by that definition a car salesman doesn't sell cars, only the finance manager does, and a real estate agent doesn't sell houses.

Actually the real estate agent is a perfect analogy - they get a percentage from the sale of someone else's house. The agent is an affiliate of the seller. Who great thinks real estate agents shouldn't try to sell houses?