I can tell somethingis wrong just by email volume, my inbox used to just move like a stock ticker and now it is like on weekends it can have same email at top of stack for half the day, weekdays not much better, sponsors arent mailing promos, people dont even bother to spam, less and less offers of course way less sales emails lol. The end has been her just i got hit be for some of you but the end has been here for a bit except for the few mega corps that control everything now, there is no need for affiliates at all now.

That tells you more than all of the "my proggie converts at 1:10, see sig" posts...

yea unfortunetly :(

Only the strong or ad supported survive.

-BIGTYMER 2011

There are very few pure active affiliates left. And many that are left only send $xx-$xxx to any one sponsor at a time. I think many programs have started with a strategy of focusing on fellow paysites and mega affiliates only. Many still try to keep up appearances by having an ICQ contact or two but they are seldom staffed and they don't work much with smaller or medium sized affiliates. I suspect some set their shaves to minimize the commissions which are paid to affiliates and then they help themselves to whatever they can take from that affiliate. It's free money. That's the only reason they still keep their programs. They only want to keep up appearances at this point. The small sponsors left who still need you are themselves for the most part beholden to the 3rd party processors such as Ccbill, Verotel and Zombaio.

Isn't that the truth. You can't be the type to send 10,000 high quality uniques to mega programs with a 0:10,000 ratio. You simply won't last long because those programs will gladly take that traffic from you for free if you're stupid enough to let them. I'll put up an address and ask people to snail mail donations before I'll send my traffic to some mega program on a 0:10,000 basis. I'm no fool.

Hey Dynastoned,

Hope all is well.
Found your account and saw the stats you posted ; I would like to note and suggest a few things to bring you to Latinasextapes.com average conversion rate which now stands at 1:1100 this period.

- Please get in touch with [email protected] icq : 572295000 or [email protected] icq :63720522 . They will be able to go over every picture, every slogan, every tour and find the optimal path to help you convert. You would be surprised what this can do.

- The 13 000 uniques are sent over 2011 ; roughly 100 hits per day. Oftentimes such little concentrated traffic from a specific source at a given moment cannot be judged as a total.

I am confident working hand in hand with us will bring you sales.


If you wish to talk to me directly about this or the industry as a whole I am available on icq or skype. To all suggesting that PaySites are dead ====> you cannot be further from the truth. I have spoken about this on a panel @ the Amsterdam show and will be speaking further at a panel at Internext in vegas on January 16th.


Thanks!

13,000 sent over a 1 year period is almost no traffic.

I'd kill the $1 or free trials if you have the option and go full priced or more like 4.99 works for me at pimproll but free doesnt sell shit, i think surfers are too smart these days and jump back when they see the $1 trial they prob have been burned before and know $1 means 300.

There's your answer. They can adjust your conversion rate this easily. Must be some magic join links they have on their join pages.

Don't complain first here, email the support and tell them the problem and that they have a week to fix the problem before you name and shame. Then if nothing changes, move your traffic to sites who are still making you money.

Could always try us. Some crazy niche shit to promote. :)

Anyone else small the unmistakeable whiff or something that can be changed?

I've mad it no secret that IMO this industry is on a downward spiral. The Tubes that generate tons of money don't generate shit. What they do is take 100 sales and turn them into 10 sales. The key is they were other peoples 100 sales and the 10 are now theirs. All legit business and they won't complain. Until the advertisers can't afford to advertise because free sites are taking their business.

You want to hurt Tubes? Hurt the platforms that support them. Tell surfers where to find free dating and cam sites. The effect will be proportionate to the number who do it. The less dating and cam buyers going via ads on Tubes, will hurt Tubes. Sending traffic to dating and cam sites who advertise on Tubes, is suicide IMO. Mofos own one of the biggest tube sites in the business, sending them traffic is like sending your enemy bullets to shoot you with.

...and when Mofos has banners up on one of the biggest torrent sites out there, what do you expect?

For every paysite customer that rebills forever there are 10,000 that don't.

SUBMITS in nats means page 1 submits. Not card submit. Thats on page 2 and you don't see that in nats for most programs I can remember.

Those are the people that are putting email password and picking a join option and then submitting.

OK, I didn't realize that but it's still shitty based on shitty numbers I've seen. With one program where my ratios TANKED, at least 15% of what's showing as submits turn into joins.

So programs that take you right to the join page but still show submits in NATS, what are they counting?

Why don't you guys quit focusing only on big easy programs and share your knowledge and experience with smaller operators. Yeah you can't pick it on trees anymore or expect it to fall in your lap but there are some rich fuckin farmers. It ALL starts with content - if you don't reach out and guide and help us you'll lose the chance to be a big fish. You'll stay a little tadpole sucking on the tit of the big sharks (I know none of that shit does any of that shit, it is an analogy). Forge a real relationship. If you have already done that then tell me why I'm wrong. I'm all ears.

actually i've only been sending traffic since the 15th of august not the entire 2011 year (roughly 4 months). regardless of how many uniques i send a day the fact is 13k+ uniques have hit your tours and have yet to see any results off of high quality targeted traffic. it is what it is you can paint the picture however you want. those are the facts. i respect your biz do what you do i have no desire to get into a pissing match. i was just explaining the dismal outlook this industry has when it's not only your affiliate program but numerous programs across the board that are in exactly the same boat as you are in this instance.

Yah, my ratios are the same with a lot of the saturated programs. People think you can just keep beating on the popular stuff that everyone and their mom is pounding and still make sales in 2011.

Not saying that is what Dyna is doing, because he's a smart dude. I'm sure there's something else to it. Just saying that you have to look harder for stuff to promote these days.

:2 cents: :thumbsup

no doubt about it seems as if the latin niche has been beat to death. i still see sales from various other high quality unique sites but they are few and far between.

the stuff i make my most sales on is super micro niche. those are still protected from saturation. only downside there is the volume is less, but the ratios are still good.

i'm actually surprised most of the people that responded in this thread haven't called me a hopeless loser that just doesn't know what hes doing and are making millions of dollars promoting the same shit.

definitely shows me that i'm not the only one having trouble converting most anything.

little man makin 5-10k/month without 100's of thousands of quality unique traffic to send to sponsors are no more it seems. it's cool i still make enough for beer money with the current situation so i'm not upset so much as i am disappointed that we as an industry let it get this way.

for those of you little guys out there that went all in on this shit i feel for you.

This would be the best thing to test a sponsor, get a friend to do it using your link and not your computer. Then come back with the results. This would prove shaving.

Why affiliates haven't formed a club to do this for each other is beyond me. Stops the rumors and myths. Proves once and for all if a sponsor is shaving and then the proof can be posted everywhere, on a name and shame list.

see thats the difference between me and you. i'm not here to save face i'm just shootin it straight.

this thread kind of reminds me of xxxjay's site ************************* definitely prophetic to say the least.

and ayo jay thanks for pullin my link off your blog. even after i threw up a few of yours on mine just to get one link on yours rofl.

it's been done before and nothing ever comes of it except 7 page drama then everyone forgets the following month. seriously you've been here since 2001 and still haven't figured that out yet?

Did you contact pr0 for advice yet like I recommended?

nah troll i haven't talked to the kid in a few months.

Bad reflection on affiliates then. Either all fish wives moaning or a herd of cats who can't act as one. Maybe after 10 years I expect too much of them. Still making a few test joins will soon show if you're being shaved or this is the state of online porn.

It could be both.

The only reason to shave, because it self defeating, is a program can't afford the high payouts of 2000-2007 in 2011. Why is obvious, less joining and all the savings that could of been made have been, leaving the high cost of traffic as the only place left to save money. Can't cut payouts on the sites, as affiliates wouldn't join. But shaving is an option to save money, while making it look like you're paying out big.

Or so much has been given away free for so long, the culture of paying for porn is dwindling.

Still 2,000 hits on a join page and no conversions? :upsidedow

My crappiest sites of all crappy sites return a pretty good ration off join page hits. They don't bother going their, they know what a join page is.

Not following you. But either way, I'm curious as to his almost 1,000 join hits. Are these join form hits?

What was his form submissions? Do you show those stats, if not, why?

^
good question above lol

join hits there seems just registration form hit... and 700 = actually leads who registered on that form.... but still.... 13000 over year or hour means shit assuming none of 700 members of the site didn't buy any shit. I would scream on OP place after 70 members didn't buy, not waiting for 700. I am not big fan of adult, just using it not for promoting paysites, but these sponsor or like you call it total scumbag it seems.

Fuck no. I'm converting popups of a main paysite tour at 1:7000, not even anything slick about it, and still looking for something better.

Try other sponsors.

Homegrown, conversions to converts that retain
 

Sorry to jump in here like a itchy scratchy spamacite but honestly, Homegrown is doing just fine and converting on even the worst tubes better than this -- on qualified search traffic, branded and unbranded terms we do wayyyyyyyyyyy better. We haven't done a latina site yet unfortunately but we do have some other niches that are doing better than I expect anyone to believe.

Maybe it is because we are unsaturated. Maybe we just have a good product. Maybe we just have way more than anyone can see anywhere for free. I don't know.

We would certainly be grateful for the biz if you want to see what we can do.

Seriously why would you even ask, you can get all that shit free, who the hell is going to do a $1 signup when the second link has more niche specific videos then you could ever watch in one year...

I think it's kind of funny you'd even think you get anything off that, here's my top results for your first keyword:

www.pornhub.com
www.slutload.com
www.spankwire.com
www.thelatinateen.com
xhamster.com

and anyone is going to join a trial, lol... state of the industry folks, you have to find others way to make money, you can't just "promote" a program anymore using old techniques

I think someone else mentioned those 700 submits were where they just entered their email, not CC information. But my question in response to that is how do you know they aren't emailing all 700 of those people 3 days after the attempt and telling them to come to Porn Hub for free porn? You don't unless you are checking them.

Regardless of what they are doing you gave them 700 email addresses for free. This is one of the problems with the model. You should be getting something for this whether a quarter, fifty cents, or a dollar.. Some sponsors are even using these emails to automatically sign people up for dating programs. It's no wonder affiliates are hurting while many of these programs get richer and richer with each passing month.

it just says select a username and password so they aren't collecting emails through that page.

who knows when i get some time i'll look around and throw up a few more sponsors. i already have i think 5-6 different latina sponsors on that site.

Looks like you're right about that. But it is something to look out for. The join form sure loaded slow for me when I tried it but I don't know if that is a fluke.

Yeah I've only had experience with Manwin programs unwittingly (when they buy the program and keep it quiet that they own it so I don't know any better than to keep sending traffic) but I've never seen good conversions and I've seen many complaining on webmaster forums. If you are going to keep them up at least keep them honest by comparing with others in that niche.

Exactly - better would be to put some focus on building rather than chasing ratios every other day.

The "submits" or "join hits" are most often what I'd call sucker clicks to the join page from tours. They aren't people clicking on a "join now" button, showing intent to purchase. They are clicking on a thumbnail image expecting to see it and being dumped on the join page. These are two very different things.

if retention was ever that bad there would be no affiliate programs..

its 2011 and you are trying to tell everyone about test sales? seriously?


THEY PUT A MAN ON THE MOON???

I don't care if the 13k was sent over 10 years.. It's still 13k and 0 signups. And it was SE traffic!

What's the average rebill length these days? It's bound to be lower than it was 5 years ago and even that number was pretty low in the big scheme of things.

As far as I know Submits and Join Hits are 2 different things.

Submits is where people fill in the Pre-Join page. Email addy, name, pw.

Join hits is what you are talking about.

Right?


I would guess 2 months

You are correct. I'm tripping. I thought he was speaking of just join hits which is a garbage stat in my opinion unless you weed out the sucker clicks. I am still leery of what exactly constitutes a submit in NATS also though. In some cases I believe just activating one field of a join process will track as a submit.

Even so, I would agree that 0:700 ratio seems pretty damn bad if what he's saying about his traffic sources is true.

are your results surrounded by tube links? seems most search results now are all links to tube videos and a few others inbetween.

LOL it's like when you promote a cam site for years with a weekly regular payout of round $150.00 to $200.00 and more........then they change the name and it all suddenly stops overnight, and when you say something they tell you the affiliate link has been moved over and is working but you have clients who are from your main membership site saying they still do privates from the same link and we get nothing anymore......makes you wonder..........bottom line don't trust anyone anymore.....and if you have a pay site....rely on your own traffic.......no one else is going to make you rich except yourself......