the Federal Government has a budget of 3.6 trillion
the Federal Government has a tax revenue of 2.3 trillion
the Federal Government has a budget deficit of 1.3 trillion

These are the people you want to run the internet?

Sorry, I think they need to fix what they are running currently before expanding their reach even more

I agree....but everyday they make new laws.

This is nothing but a law to stop stealing. It's not "running the internet". Though I suppose you can say that any law affecting anything could be used to "run" something.

The Chinese can still access the illegal parts of the Internet...

My prediction for the day SOPA passes...

http://www.emily18.in/gfy/sopa.jpg

It depicts the tube owners leaving the USA never to return and thumbing their noses at SOPA.

to enforce the law, they will start a tax or fee to pay for the enforcement. Calling it something besides a tax lets them do anything they want. Once the new fees start, then the codes, permits and overall bureaucratic cluster fuck will begin

i would support sopa if the penalty for making a bogus complaint was the complete revocation of the offending companies copyrights

would any of you guys be willing to support such an amendment

Sorry brah's, I can't agree with anything that provides the ability to shut down sites like reddit/youtube/facebook. It's likely they won't be shut down simply because they're the biggest, but thousands of other sites could; and it would also hinder new start-ups.

It's also a violation of the first amendment:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/75153093/T...SOPA-12-6-11-1

SOPA isn't about fighting piracy as much as it is about continuing the expansion of control big brother has over us.

This is an interesting video about SOPA if you can get past this guy's annoying face/voice:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=WJIuYgIvKsc
(In a nutshell, the companies lobbying millions for SOPA, are the same companies that helped largely facilitate the problem by distributing the file sharing apps).

It's that whole concept of creating problems in order to introduce solutions.

I'm not against SOPA as a whole, just a few of the key provisions. Your copyrighted material should be protected, but SOPA as it stands is excessive and contains too much power. I understand many who own copyrighted material here don't give a shit and just want to benefit from the bill itself because it directly affects business, and that's understandable, but I would personally like to see it revised.

guess libertarianism only extends to the right to do cocaine and fuck teenagers.

Not worried about. With all the other crap the US government does, and will do, with or without our consent, this doesn't worry me at all. Let the chips fall where they may, and if it means the end of the internet, I will go on with my life.


:2 cents::2 cents::2 cents:

It's scary how much I agree with you much of the time.



Due process? :1orglaugh

Now child porn site operators and pirates have something in common. How about this... don't allow or upload anything to your site that isn't yours. Problem solved. If they abuse the law, we'll adapt or die. Won't be the first time a law was abused, won't be the last. I'm not worried about it either way. 1) I'm not a pirate. 2) I don't fear the internet "breaking." 3) Piracy of every kind has to come to an end one way or another. 4) Shit happens. We'll deal with it or we won't.

I hate the government and want nothing from them. However, I hate piracy worse and am willing to roll the dice on this one. Maybe they will get it right. Maybe they won't. But if they do, it sucks to be a pirate or someone who makes a living from pirated goods, whatever those goods are.

Don't let the door hit them in the ass...Buncha fucking crooks, for the most part.

Scared it might infringe on your advertising on piracy sites?

What ever you think, they can't make a worse job than self regulation has. This law is coming. Adapt or die.

So long as the bogus complaint was filed knowingly and in bad faith, sure, I'd support that.

Funny how gideongallery repeats himself like a broken record that an artist who creates something should be forced to give up his work so gideon can steal it IF he fucks up and accuses the wrong person.

How about this...the next time gideongallery steals something off the internet, the owner of that content shows up at his house with a baseball bat and beats the dogshit out of him.

Now THAT sounds like a fair thing to me.

I think in principal its a good law but I also think you are going to see the big guys pushing out the smaller guys by filing complaints whether legit or not , Less competion means more $$ for them

It would be a new spin on "due process," that's for sure.

I.e., if your process involves stealing content via the Internet, you get beaten with a baseball bat in due time. ;-)

I would love to see gideongallery get what's due him

so would you extend the same protection to the "pirates" requiring you to prove that they knowingly infringed before you could apply any penalty

or would you want the penalties to stay the way they are currently.

and i find it funny that you don't want to live with the same penalties you want to apply to pirates

when you accuse the wrong person you wiping the wrong person from the internet

your destroying their business, your doing a hell of a lot more damage to them then all the pirates combined are doing to you.

oh and btw i never said the creator had to give up his work, just the copyright

open source proves you can still sell your stuff even if everyone in the world has the same right to sell it too.

IBM made a billion dollars selling linux

same principle applies.

It's a little too late for the Gideons, Damian Js and porno jews of the world.

All meaningless circle jerk questions are moot and only a statement remains.

Adapt Or Die.

.

Yeah, imagine that :)

If this goes down it's the thieves that will have to do the fucking adapting this time around.

Sweet.
.

Same shit different day. For some reason you morons think bringing in the gov to save you will bring back the good ole days of porn sales.lol.

yes. adapt or die.

http://torrentfreak.com/firefox-add-...ocking-111220/

Ditto.
Add me to the list too

Who are you and what do you do in this business?

http://www.rogerebert.com/apps/pbcs....ARY/111229973/

it has way more to do with theaters not adapting to the new marketplace


btw you can blame the abuse of the access shifting fair use

if movies were released on every medium at the same time the theaters would have to make the experience better then watching it at home.


piracy would be an issue because the theaters would be showing movies in 6 spectrum autoscopic 3d and the CAM would only capture the 3 spectrum 2D version of that.

Could you explain how stopping people from stealing is "censorship"?

If they have something to communicate they can CREATE it themselves.

This isn't "censorship", it's a law to stop people from stealing other people's work.

A lot of people have some strange definitions of "freedom" and "censorship" around here.

You all need to take a look inside yourselves and ask yourself honestly...do you support stealing or do you believe it should be illegal to steal.

no one will be doing this....one example will be made for people who abuse the system...just like when you waste the courts time in other places...if you take them for a ride with this, expect to be bent over by the Law and they wont be worried about the domain you own. IT will probably be a federal offense to make a false claim.

this .......................

I'm not sure that the scenario you just presented would even be considered under this law. This is about stealing copywritten WORKS, not CREATING similar works.

I think you may be stretching it to come up with that scenario. But you don't have to even try to stretch it to see what piracy has already done and is doing right now to this business.

I'm pretty sure that what you just described would never be a serious SOPA infringement or even given a second thought. And you might even get in trouble for wasting their time with something like that.

Just look at DMCA. Have the govt. "abused" that? Hell no. Matter of fact they have under-enforced it pretty darn well. Not just on porn (because they could care less about us) but in mainstream as well.

Listen...right now a cop can pull you over in your car, beat the shit out of you, plant some drugs on you, and throw you in jail. But that's just theory. Doesn't mean we're gonna suddenly change all traffic laws just because it MIGHT happen.

Same here with this law.

I don't trust the government. But I do recognize that when people decide to start stealing freely and destroying the economy online...it's time to get rid of the antiquated DMCA law and get something with some sharp, sharp teeth.

As long as you create your own content...you have nothing to worry about from this law. It's really pretty simple. That's why I welcome it.

I create EVERYTHING for Claudia Marie's site. This law does nothing to hurt me and everything to help me.

It's the people who contribute nothing...like gideongallery, who are the very most afraid. And of course, people with cam companies, dating, etc. are sweating it. But they shouldn't. All that traffic isn't going anywhere. It's just going to move to legit sites which was where it was before Pornhub existed.
And the dating and cam and pill sites will get their traffic and sales from the legit sites just like they used to.

Bottom line is...there's nothing going to stop what's coming. And the uncreative thieving pirates with their upload scripts that automate everything are going to have to:

Adapt or Die. :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

You do understand that the fact that they are "pirates" makes them criminals by definition, right?

and making a false sworn statement is not

the penalty i am talking about would only apply if you took down an INNOCENT site

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Anyone who thinks this won't pass in some form is deluded.

It will be a very interesting time.

No, the freeloaders pirating porn will get it from Tubes. Our business model was shaped years ago and a race to see who could give away the most free content. tubes are only a progression of that. Pimproll took it to the next level, closing a site and turning it into a free Tube. More money in selling ad space than selling paysite memberships.

Because selling paysites memberships has nose dived. Soon all that's left will be selling ad space. Or owning the occasional niche site.

Piracy has done little but scratch this business. Giving away free porn amputated limbs. Even in the early day it was clear that only a small % were actually buying. the vast majority were getting off to free porn. It reduced the real money making side of porn to a shadow of it's former side, retail offline. Now it's hitting online porn. Within 2-3 years recorded porn will be little more than a freebie to sell ad space. Or to scrape a thin film off the top with membership sales. Free porn, legal or not, is the real cause of the decline of the porn industry.

For some delusional reason some people think their porn is a must have and nothing else will do. They are in for a shock.

Anyone who makes a false claim is leaving themselves open to a big court case. And the big boys don't want to destroy this law. They want it to work.

Robbie, you really need to try and understand that being AGAINST SOPA doesn't mean you are profiting from piracy, and you need to stop suggesting that or provide proof.

The other thing you need to realise that piracy has always been around, before the current financial incentives. Usenet was THE place for piracy. Did they get paid? No. Did the up loaders get paid? No. Were there advertisers? No. Was there a gajillion gigaflops if stolen content? Yes.

If this law passed in its current iteration it will not stop piracy. I promise you. You will not go back to getting a billion dollars a month to spend on coke.

In Damian's link against SOPA we can read

We understand why the groups like the Motion Picture Association of America and the U.S. Chamber of Commerce are supporting the bill as piracy of content costs the original producers/distributors tens of billions of dollars. They?re desperate for a solution to recoup that lost revenue.

So it is good we all agree there is a problem. If the Internet companies are really concerned with the problem of copyright, and they are the Internet "savvy" ones, where can we read their solution ?

Good catch.


This is where porno jew and his fellow travelers like to step in with their usual taunts of eat shit and die.

The truth of course is that these so called internet "savvy" folks don't have any solutions to offer, or more specifically, none that they like.
.

And you need to stop your silly scaremongering about "breaking the internet".

And I dont really care if you have a link where someone says some problems might ensue. That is not "proof" that one day we will turn on our computers and the internet will be gone in a puff of smoke, "broken" by a law designed to reinforce the basic laws of property and ownership.

The easy porn money is probably gone for good, but that does not mean that adult industry peeps cannot support a law which aims to protect the creator of intellectual property from having it stolen.

So you have no rebuttals for any of the points raised by the DNS experts? OK.Didn't think you'd be able to offer much on that front.

Ah, so you just pretend there are no DNS experts saying there will be problems and*that* is your counterpoint?

I bet you didn't do well at debating at school.

Read the articles. No one is saying the internet will be gone in a puff of smoke. Point/counterpoint. That is how you have an interesting discussion.

Or a law designed to give the government control to censor the internet for Americans. Look, China already has this censorship. Has it stopped piracy there? Why do you think giving control of DNS to the government will fix the problem here? Do you really think that pirates are just going to stop? You don't think they will do something else? ftp servers begat IRC which begat usenet which begat napster which begat bit torrent which begat file lockers. Pirates have a good history of adapting.

I think everyone in the world would support a law that just did that. SOPA isn't that law.

The real problem is that THERE IS NO TECHNOLOGICAL SOLUTION TO PIRACY. None. Nothing will work.

What needs to happen is that people need to stop wishing it was 1990. It isn't. Things have changed. You need to find a new way to get people to pay for your product. Period. It seems that some people are managing to make millions from releasing their stand up comedy. What can you learn from that?

In real world you get 10 years for raping a girl and maybe 6 months for false accusation.

your idea doesn't make sense but also it is against basic law principles in most countries including USA. so it can't be done.

Damian, I dont need to rebutt your DNS experts saying some issues might occur. I am rebutting YOU saying that SOPA will break the internet.

Then you bring up China which as you say already operates a similar system - and look the internet still works !!!

Why is the internet not "broken" ?

This is the problem with wrapping dramatic language around your carefully chosen "facts". It just sounds silly.

Lets go back to China - you ask if it has stopped piracy there. I dont know what effect their particular laws have had on piracy and neither do you. I do know however that the Chinese govt are more concerned with the control of politically sensitive information than the distribution of stolen content. So the control of website content via DNS and China has a bearing here, but has nothing whatsoever to do with piracy.

However I think your biggest mistake is your claim that "nothing will work" is so very immature.

You are still claiming that society should not legislate to uphold what the right thinking majority require because the problem will not be completely iradicated by the legislation. Think about it Damian - how many laws achieve this utopia ?

No, of course. You don't NEED to. But just saying LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU isn't a very interesting counterpoint. Makes it look like you are unable to argue effectively against that point.

You're not. In a rebuttal you need to make a counterpoint. Not just say "I don't care".

Oh gosh you make this hard. I didn't say they operate a similar system. I said they censor the internet. It's a totally different method of doing it.

Please don't say what I don't know. China has the most piracy of any country ever. This is well documented. Sorry you are unaware of it. But your ignorance doesn't mean it doesn't exist. They pirate fucking whole apple stores ffs. :D



I said there is no technical solution to piracy. There isn't. History has proven this. As soon as something is 1s and 0s you can pirate it. At home. On a 200 buck device. Rather than name calling, make a counterpoint.

No I'm not. Of course they should legislate.

Quote what I say, make a counterpoint.

Sigh.

I did not say I dont care what your chosen experts say. Did I ?

I said YOU are making misleading claims that the internet will be "broken" by this legislation.

Can you understand my point ? This is the third time I have made it and I am getting tired of trying to explain it to you. So my rebuttal regarding YOUR broken internet point is that your claims are wild and fanciful using dramatic language to further your argument.

With regards to China, yes they have priated entire Apple stores, but that tells me absolutely nothing about what effect their laws have had on piracy ON THE INTERNET in China. It may have increased, it may have reduced since the introduction of their censorship regulations. No one knows because the Chinese will never allow that type of information to be released. Thats not me telling you what you do or dont know - I am just pointing out the the inadequacies of your argument.

Lets be clear here Damian you brought up China as an example of how they have instigated similar legislation "Look, China already has THIS censorship" you cheerfully claimed. You used China as an example of why SOPA wont "work". So have your changed your mind ? Or are you now agreeing that comparisons with SOPA and the Chinese legistlation is really rather silly ?

With regards to history proving there is no solution to piracy. Jesus. Technological innovation is not about history. It is about the present and the future. Invention and human advancement is relentless. It will not stop because you want it to.

Should governments give up on changing their banknotes just because eventually the forgers will one day learn how to recreate a reasonable copy ?, and should the laws which put the forgers in prison be rescinded because they do not "work" ?

Give it up Damian, your arguments are preposterus. The free ride for thieves might not be eradicated by this legislation. But you have not offered a reasoned argument as to why you think that is. Jumping up and down shouting "it will not work" is not a detailed and reasoned critique of actual text of the act. (sigh)

if you used the law to ONLY stop people from stealing your not censoring anyone

However if that what you truely believed the law was doing you would have no problem losing your copyright if you "mistakenly" blacklisted an innocent company.

The fact you don't want to face that penalty PROVES you know this law will censor people.

the principle of law is equality of punishment

if you totally wiped out a site from the internet WRONGFULLY and you refused to fairly compensate them for that loss

justice says that you should suffer the exact same penalty


and piracy will get you 1 year and a shit load of money damages

btw if you knowingly make a false accusation your also guilty of conspiracy to commit every crime against that victim too.

if someone gets killed because of your bogus accusation (death penalty case) your guilty of murder.

there is no similar balance in this act

the penalty for making a bogus claim is exactly the same penalty as it always been.

it the equivalent to a loop hole that allows you to get away with killing someone by simply framing them for a murder they didn't commit. That loophole doesn't exist in the current laws

it should exist here either.

Gosh this is tiresome. I based my *opinion* on reading the articles from the DNS experts.
I linked you to the site where the experts explained the problems with the DNS part of SOPA.

Would you like to explain why they are wrong?

Yes. Your point is that you think *I* am a DNS expert and wrote articles explaining why the DNS issues with SOPA are very dangerous?

Good point! This is awesome fun.

How do you imagine they would *get* this information? How does a government measure the impact of sites with pirated content on exactly? Do you think the file locker sites just tell them?

No, that isn't, but the part where you said I didn't know something was.

Well, you are desperately trying to, but you're not really doing it very well.

No I didn't. I said they have a firewall and it doesn't work. Really, try quoting what I say, then attempting your counterpoint. It makes it much more cohesive.

No I didn't. Really, quote what I say.

You made that comparison. I said China had internet censorship. Do keep up.

It is totally about history. Since the dawn of mankind piracy has been unstoppable. Then the digital age came along and it is now REALLY VERY unstoppable.

Do you seriously, honestly, in your heart of hearts think that someone will come up with something and all the pirates will just go "ok, that's us done". You don't think they will change? You don't think they will just create another internet? Seriously?

I never said to rescind laws because they don't work. There is a law against copyright infringement. There should be. Please, quote what I say rather than waste time making facetious points about stuff no one said.

And yet you cannot actually make a SINGLE counterpoint to ONE of them. So go figure.

All you need is the pure IP.

Please provide your counterpoint as to why that is wrong. (This should be good for a laugh...)

Then (for bonus points) go on to explain why it is a good idea for

1) your competition to be able to get your site shut down in 5 days with no judicial process or proof
2) to allow the US government to censor the internet

And then tell me if you honestly think this bill will have any impact whatsoever on adult website revenue and why.

100 scared pirates arrggghhhhhhhh

.

Honestly, I'm really not sure.

At this point, while I've read the text of SOPA and quite a bit of analysis of it as well, I haven't really given it as much thought as I will if it passes, and I don't think I have as full an understanding of the penalties and consequences under it as I'd need to answer that question. (Among other things, the Act references a number of other statutes and is limited in some ways by those other statutes, and I haven't gone through the effort of 'connecting all the dots,' so to speak.)

I haven't concerned myself with SOPA too much thus far, simply because it is just a bill at this point and as happens with many bills, its language could change significantly before passing, or it could never even go up for a vote in the first place.

Plus, if SOPA does pass, I think there's very little question that it will be immediately challenged in court, and my hunch is the Court would issue a TRO against its enforcement (or the enforcement of portions of it that are subject to the legal challenge, at least) pending adjudication of that case.

So, in other words... ask me that again if/when this bill actually becomes a law and its verbiage is final, and by then I should have a more satisfying answer. ;-)

Your proposed penalty for false notifications was an easier hypothetical for me; I don't appreciate fraudulent use of federal statutes, so I'm good with fairly severe punishment being applied when people engage in such.