ok. good luck with wall of text theorizing instead of testing. let me know how that goes for you.

omg the ignore list. what will i do? please don't.

I'm looking forward to it. I think you'll see your ctr a little higher this time because of the more prominent banners and links than what was typical last time.

People can talk shit but I'll believe a guy like you because you have a record of not bullshitting. Same for Jel and Nautilus. Same for most of the honest smaller or medium sized long time pay site owners in the industry who are mainly staying silent in regards to this.

that sums up your whole way of approaching the world. instead of learning from people who are succeeding in this new environment, you only listen to those who can't, who validate what you have already decided.

I know but when you generalize it is like a sawed off shotgun blast where everyone in a wide path gets stung with some buckshot. So how about I stop being defensive when I feel you aren't being offensive?

You have had programs get in the thread and comment but why would any others do as much when all they get is a Markham rant, and you and others that just seem like malcontents taking shots at their integrity just because they work with legit tubes?

Wait, you could do a lot more sales but you aren't really interested in that. Yes, makes sense.

Looks like he is avoiding me now. Wonder why.

Yeah, imagine that!

The man would like to hear the opinions of honest webmasters rather than those of thieving tube monkeys.

What the hell could he be thinking????
.

there is a reason paul markham agrees with everything he says.

Like I said please don't be so defensive. I'm not shooting you with buckshot... Come on.

Here are the people who own paysites who commented as far as I know. Don't take this as a personal attack, I'm only saying what I think out loud.

You - Spent the last year defending Manwin in these threads. Not what I'm looking for as far as experiences although I'll listen. No offense or anything. I don't think you are lying but I already know how you feel about this.

Robbie - I know Robbie isn't a bullshitter. He'll openly admit what he used to make and what he makes now. I know he tells the truth usually. His experiences were mostly what he considered negative but his experiences are rather dated. He is going to run a new test and I'll tend to believe him.

Ruseful - At first his numbers blew me away and I started to believe him. Then it was revealed that he's basically an employee of one of these tubes. I can't call that objective or reliable. I'd like to see some others.

Nautilus - Nautilus's stance is no mystery. Same as Robbie. But I know him not to be a bullshitter so I put some stock in it anyway. He says the tubes did bad for him in the past. Even worse than what Robbie saw.

Mr. Peabody - I like Mr. Peabody. But like you he's praised the tubes in the past a lot too. He's not really what I'm looking for as far as new experiences from paysite owners.

Paul Markham- Well we all know Paul Markham!

Jel- I know Jel is also a no bullshit kind of guy and I would tend to believe him. He says he's going to run a test with his sites.

DWB - I think he is a paysite owner and from what I recall his experiences were mostly negative.

Pornhub - Come on.


If I missed a pay site owner who responded let me know. Like I said I'd like to see more experiences from actual pay site owners. Not just the usual suspects or employees. There are thousands of them on this forum.

I am prone to colorful metaphors and analogies to make points. You can deal with it because that is not something I am going to change just because you feel like you should be able to point accusing fingers at everyone without being taken to task for it.

I think Porno Jew called it. You just really want to hear from people that confirm your suspicions. You don't want to believe Homegrown and you don't want to believe Peabody just because we figured out how to make it work for us. Somehow that brands our opinions and advice as ineligible and bullshit and makes us Kiss Asses. Backroom Casting Couch confirmed what Porntubeguy said but I guess they are also not to be trusted just because they agreed with him. Pay no mind to the fact that Porntubeguy actually went and essentially copied that type of content for his own site based on seeing its success in his time at youporn.

But I guess by keeping the blinders on you just missed that altogether... I wouldn't mind but you keep trying to present yourself as being objective when clearly you are not. No offense either - just giving my perspective, so sorry if it comes off critical, which can't be helped.

Where did Backroom Casting Couch post? Considering how long the topic is it's possible I did miss a reply or two.

ThePornTubeGuy runs one of the tubes and is promoting his own programs to get people to upload content. Of course I'm not going to trust him in the same way I would trust an independent pay site owner. Let's be real.

Like I said I'm mainly looking for objective experiences from people who haven't been defending tubes in the last year or don't own the said tubes themselves. I don't see where that is unreasonable. The idea is that you would think a few pay site owners saw Ruseful's stats and decided to give it a shot and would have made quite a few sales from it. Where are these people? If these tubes are so helpful to the pay sites then this topic should soon be filled with pay site owners praising them. I'm waiting to see it. One way or another let's see what the truth of the matter is.

And again, please don't be so defensive. I wasn't "pointing fingers at everyone". Take it easy. It's just that I know already how you feel because you've been posting in Manwin threads defending them for the last year. Your opinion is nothing new to me. I'd like to hear from others.

people have posted. you refuse to see it.

Well my first video clip is now live on Porntube.

So the testing begins :)

http://www.porntube.com/videos/claud...eampie_1116788

My experience so far is I can't even open a fucking account lol, timeouts, no confirmation emails, no replies to emails sent about problems. If I ever get to the stage of subbing any vids I'll be chiming back in.

Your watermark on that video is very difficult to see. Personally I wouldn't bother with the fancy watermark you use in your members area and just go with something plain and very easy to read at first glance. The volume of traffic from typeins will probably be larger than the banner. :2 cents:

Keep waiting because getting good ratios is not going to happen overnight and, frankly, most people won't figure it out because it actually does require an investment of time and energy and most people want a quick fix and a thousand sign ups in a week for no effort at all. Keep waiting because most of those that are successful at it don't want to help you. In fact, they can't wait to see your body floating by in the river of web failure like so many other webmasters. (Sun Tzu once said "victory is seeing the bodies of your enemies floating past in the river").

Peabody gave it a shot because he saw companies like Homegrown and others doing it. I have never seen him kiss Manwin's ass over it either. He seems to have approached it very much like us - cautiously and professionally and forming his own opinion based on his own unique experience. Still, in spite of acknowledging him as a straightshooter you can't take what he says according to your so-called standards of objectivity.

What makes people like Robbie have so much value to what he is saying then? No disrespect to him but he pretty much admitted he only took a very small crack at it, didn't like it, but now is saying not only that he would have to try again, but also started his own tubes, and even turned Claudia's site tour into a tube. So he is in fact a "tube site owner" and I suppose when he starts doing well with it then he will be a kiss ass too?

The sad thing is I am truly trying to help you but you can't hear my advice or anyone else's that has tried offering meaningful and practical business wisdom just because you have this false notion that I am along with others trying to defend Manwin.

Manwin scares me. They should scare everyone. They don't need me to defend them and they don't care if I do or don't. They are running a business. I am running a business. If we can make money together then all is good but that doesn't make us anything beyond what our partner agreement or affiliate terms describe. So quit painting me as some sort of Manwin booster-boy. More often than not they have to put up with us being a squeaky wheel about stuff so they probably consider us like a fly on a horse's ass that has to be flicked away constantly with a whip of the tail.

Because I'm cool like that. :)

We should be working together btw. If you want to trade some promo we will put Claudia Marie in our "Neighbors" section... juicy member's area traffic from HGV and I think our surfers will love her as we have a great base of big boob milf slut fans in our site.

You probably have a few options for how you could promote us and we are open to hearing what you think works. Hit up spike at homegrownvideo d com or skype him at hgspike.

I have a section in the members area as well that I do upsells with. Yours is called "Neighbors" , mine is called "Other Whores" lol :1orglaugh

So yeah, we can do that.

I <3 Far-L.

Actually Far-L I owe you an apology because I looked back and I can see where you thought that reply was about you now after reading back. I think I wrote the same three things in another reply but instead scratched that and just stuck it in with the reply to you. I had thought it was an independent reply not to you and couldn't understand how you seemed to think it was directed at you but now I see it looks like it did quote you. I definitely did not mean to imply that you were a Manwin employee. I know you're not. I see now you aren't a "Manwin booster boy" either.

I do think there are many pay site owners who have been reading and have decided to give it a shot to see. So I think we are going to hear the truth either way soon. I see Robbie and Jel are already starting tests. I read another thread where someone else stated they are getting into tube submissions. It should be interesting to see what people see. Like I said many pages back if it really helps paysite owners over the short and long term then that's great. I am skeptical. I think a lot will depend on how much content they are giving out. We will see.

I agree that the url on the watermark is hard to see.

Apology most graciously accepted. And just for the record, your healthy skepticism is a positive attribute and not anything I can fault. I think Peabody possesses that same quality and that has helped him in his own efforts undoubtably.

This thread has been at its best with a healthy and robust measure of scientific skepticism and where each hypothesis has been tested to garnish empirical factual data that can be presented and peer reviewed.

Where it gets in trouble is with those that still want to believe the Earth is actually flat and won't accept any evidence to the contrary.

I am in agreement and will make an easily read bigger text watermark for the clips to follow.

That's exactly what my cock told me... :1orglaugh

It's a knock off of Met-Art and nothing special. :1orglaugh

To be accused of being a knock off of Met Art, makes it special as few site get anywhere near that level.


My point?
Pity so few do then.

Can many producers here do just as good material? <-------This is my point and the answer is YES

Because they are. This level of content would of sold better with TGP sites.

Well the only way to find that out is to get a "knock off" of Met-Art and test it. I admit we are just taking his word for it and I've been skeptical of that in this thread. IMO there are far better ways to get this level of content onto his tubes than asking people with "filler porn" sites, to fill his Tubes. He wins on this as it will give him at the minimum more traffic to sell. I have stated 90% will not duplicate his results.
Agree. Even giving out galleries with free porn killed some sales. A line of text and a soft core tour, would of been the best way not to lose sales. We all knew a better way. The problem was, we all knew the better way and we all did it. :Oh crap

The porn is special when compared with the rest of online porn. To accuse the porn of ripping off Met-Art and saying it's not special, is a contradiction. To rip off Met-Art is has to be special. Which is why there are so few doing that. To rip off a Tube site, isn't special, which is why so many do it.

I agree with you on the rest.

Yes, we kept the content ownership rather than shooting for others. so nearly 4 years after we stopped producing the money still rolls in.

hard to see? thats putting it mildly.
Replace the video asap with a straight forward watermark. check a few other videos and see what others are doing.
the banners are tiny, surrounded by massive ads and premium upsells. the type-ins seem very important to me.

We have tried a couple of tubes and on one we got some good sales 3000 clicks and 6 sales, but we have two problems, we don't go for quantity but try and make quality short films which are edited. That means we are selling fifty 20-30 minutes films.

trailer

Our trailers are edited and are about 90 seconds long. the click through rates seem to be Ok but our material is just swamped in the tidal wave of material.

If we made 15 minute trailers that would be 70% of the movies

how can one bitch about tubes if the tube marketing is done correctly?

https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1065257

See the dumb ass replies. Pornhub as a Platinum sponsor and the rest are mostly billing companies.

I can testify Robbie's stuff is good big tit MILF. so his stats will be very interesting. Still the watermark isn't good, but it's got Claudia's name around it.

I will get around to submitting some stuff as soon as I get the new tour done and get some clips made.

If Jel submits we will have his stats also.

I'm confused. Paul says giving away porn killed the industry and now he is giving away porn?

Weird.

The point of the tube sites is the media vehicle for the consumers to watch porn. Do you want to download as a surfer when you can just click and stream and it actually works? think of yourself as a surfer. I don't like tube sites either and I hate the way everyone pretends to hate them and then lets them use their content.

with tubes paul has just found a new way to justify his wall of text tirades against affiliates.

he is still blaming them for his site's failure, not the simple truth that consumers did not want to join his site (speaking as a former affiliates of his).

How many people do you think say "I was going to pay for Paul's porn but since these tubes are here, I don't have to"?.. :Oh crap

I have to admit. If i cared about buying porn and didn't know that if I started promoting they would give it to me for free. I would much rather click a movie and see what I want to see than have to jump through hoops to get what I want.

All the tubes have to do is shorten clips, but I'm sure they know that but had to have a reason to exist

Said this before and will say it again...

High ctr is usually the main goal but high ctr is not necessarily the be-all end-all of tube marketing. Highly branded but low ctr with high conversions can earn more than high ctr with unbranded ads that get crap conversions and this seems counter-intuitive to many folks used to just focusing on high ctr as a measure of a campaign's success.

Of course, getting to a point where high ctr is generating great click to sales/joins is the holy grail of tube marketing.

Niche makes a difference. Brand helps. Content quality is important, but I see plenty of programs doing well even though the content does nothing for my cock-O-meter and I am sure it fails to register much on Robbie's as well.

I know.

Pretty much a sign of the Apocalypse.

Wouldn't leave home today without a raincoat and a good towel.

Didn't read this whole thread, however, have you tried xhamster? Fill out a profile as well.

I'm afraid I've been trying Xhamster since they first opened. That is if you call having your content stolen and uploaded to Xhamster and having to dmca it down every other day "trying". lol

Sometimes if you can't beat them, you have to beat them another way. Have them signup as an affiliate and they put a banner and text link on your vid. If over 5 minutes I believe they just give you a free (no affiliate) link.

Try it out... it converts. Then when others steal your content just ask them to put your link up on that page instead of taking it down.