Please tell us how you really feel.. Where does this anger come from? Is it daddy anger or perhaps some undisclosed homosexual feeling that you can't grasp?

So really, all you have in the end is to call me "angry" because otherwise, i'll just crush every point you make while i watch TV

the point for me is: those things almost never happen when no guns are involved - or, like in the recent case in China, 22 children get INJURED by a knife - but none of them was killed.

so yes, i do think guns being easily available is a factor and as far as we know this kid went to the shooting range with his mother in the past, so he knew how to use them.

in a similar case in Germany it was also the fathers gun and a kid that received gun training as a teenager

of course there would be dozens of other possibilities how to commit a similar crime - but why dont they ever happen? why is it always a shooting?

i think the key point is that psychologically all those kids on a killing spree have a lot in common and it always ends up with the same effect: going out with a bang and be famous at least once in their life - and even if it is for being a mass murderer.

and guns are a perfect tool for that

Na, I'm just practicing my free speech.. why are you so mad? Seems rather ironic that you are in this topic defend their hate mongering as free speech, while condoning my free speech by trying belittle it as liberal left wing extremism or what ever you called it. Not to mention bringing politics into this by bitching about Democrats in one of your first posts..

So again.. why are you so angry?

I am not sure how to dumb this down enough for you so that you might understand. I'll try.

1) I am not defending what they are saying by pointing out the obvious fact that its protected speech under the Constitution (a fact you seem to continue to ignore and/or deny)

2) We are in an industry that relies 100% on the same argument - that its legal because of "free speech"

3) You are in fact far out on the left fringe

4) Liberals are always the first to talk about "freedom" and "rights" and the first to try to take them away when they don't agree with those who are exercising the same.


Simple enough?

I'm guessing not.

I think the core issue is always going to be that "guns" and that right are part of the very identity of this country in the mind of most. Reason and logic will never play a role in the abolition of anything. It will have to be fear overriding personal beliefs. So maybe when its 5000 people getting gunned down, it will change things.

My point is that it's always shooting because guns are there. Remove guns and then it will be something else. I don't believe guns or no guns is the determining factor... if anything, its the lazy way out and psychos have yet to be forced to think of more brilliant ways to commit mass murder.

It's not overly difficult to create nerve agents and bombs or to just steal a tanker full of gasoline, open the valve and do a few laps around a school before lighting it on fire. So the irony in banning guns in my opinion, is that it would simply force people to look at alternative methods to kill large numbers of people.

Also, my firm belief is that the first and biggest problem is cultural, not whether or not one has access to weapons and which types of weapons.

I find it funny that you have gone off on a rant rampage because I said free speech & hate mongering are not the same thing.

But carry on.. you still seem mad enough to go another 2 or 3 pages.

if you're a die hard christian who belives in god's will, then you have to believe that he in fact killed those kids. so in a sick way, they have a point. it's just a shame god has not shown these idiots his wrath.

we can absolutely agree on that - CZ has similar gun laws as the US and in Switzerland almost every grown male has a rifle at home - yet the deaths by gun crime in those countries is like 10 or 20 a year - not 30,000

But then they would have to agree that it's god's will that there are homosexuals and everything else that they protest, after all it's god's will or it wouldn't exist.. See how that works. :winkwink:

Can't argue it's god's will for one thing while saying another is an abomination.

Because in CZ they don't see the guns as weapons to use against each other - They are not seen immediately as something to kill other people.

And that is the obvious error to their idea about God's will. But that will never make sense to them.

There is no such thing as christian logic.

This is also what bothers me about these discussions in the US, incidentally. No one asks "what the fuck is up with the parents" which should be the very first question. Instead, its "what music did he listen to", "what video games did he play", "why didn't the school spot this sooner", "it must be vaccines", "it must be additives in food" etc etc. all directing attention away from the real issue and turning it into idiotic gun debate or the need to censor video games... even though its quite obvious that stuff all applies to any developed country and they do not have the same issues.

It's a cultural thing. Everything in the USA is politically correct. There is this growing collective narcissism, where no ones to blame, no one can be called out and a firm belief that its no ones business. You can't demand more of anyone cause nothing is there fault and you're just the asshole.

The true tragedy is that people won't stop and take a look and who they were, who they are and where they are going as a society. It's just so much easier to lay blame and move on.

People make fun of religion but at least in the absence of nationalism, it gives some sort of framework for conduct and whats expected and a social contract. It's not without problems, but then again, neither is the absence of religion.

It's not just Christians.. :winkwink:

Whether you consider the vile hatred spewed by the WBC to be freedom of speech or unlawful hate-mongering...it comes down to the fact they are merely disgusting pissants devoid of human compassion or understanding.

Imagine a world where the energy spent arguing in this thread was re-directed at finding a solution to prevent similiar massacres of innocent children in the future.

Actually, the typical christian response would be along the lines of, "God created man and they act of their OWN free will". Essentially giving god a pass.

Of course, when a christian sees something they themselves deem miraculous, it's THEN "the will of god" and he should be thanked.

So basically, god has nothing to do with anything bad that happens and should NEVER be blamed, but should be thanked for everything good that exists or happens in the world, because THAT'S his plan. Ya know, like someone winning a Grammy or a Super Bowl MVP.

We try to teach our children to take responsibility for their actions, but god only wants to accept credit for the good things and pass on the blame for bad things? I wouldn't be friends with someone like this let alone spend my life WORSHIPING them.

Wanna know about his parents? Humm so far the media has said his mother had a very survivalist mentality and she pulled him out of school and "home schooled" him & his father wasn't very prevalent in his life. Not to mention the mother was very much into guns and took her sons to the gun range a lot.

Sooo.. what type of people are usually the types of people that home school their children, worry about the doomsday & have a bunch of guns lying around?

Humm my first guess isn't those dirty liberals that want free health care, but maybe I can get a second guess..

Does it not seem just a little bit odd to you that pretty much every one of the teenage shooters in these mass shootings always comes from a home where guns are common place and have usually had a very Conservative upbringing?

Now I'm not against guns as guns are just a tool, but I am for responsibility when it comes to them. However it sure seems to me that it isn't always society that has a problem with responsible gun usage, but usually certain groups with-in that society..

Interesting that you have to keep saying i'm angry in the absence of anything of substance to say.

And still you have no clue that "freedom of speech" means as what they do falls within the bounds of protected speech, no matter how you try to characterize it. Something can't be "the same thing" as free speech. Either its protected speech, or its not. But keep calling me angry, since you have nothing of value - or even anything coherent and intelligible to say.

Hahaha wow dude. Thats what you got from what I wrote?

I gave you too much credit. Way too much credit.

I suppose its my fault, as I shouldn't be surprised.

Fucking awesome! :thumbsup

Guns are not allowed to be an issue in mass shootings? That's a fascinating argument, please lie down on the couch and tell me more.

By the way, this organization has taught me one thing: God Loves Idiots

Classic
http://cdn.ientry.com/sites/webprone...cs/blah123.jpg

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:thumbsup

The impression is that they're just a bunch of dumb hicks, but many of them have law degrees, and the old codger that runs the show is an experienced lawyer. The fuckers make money when they're attacked for intentionally provoking the grieving. These pig twats aren't simply voicing their beliefs. They're working the system.

http://www.npr.org/2011/03/02/134198...baptist-church

http://www.demotivationalposters.org...1314043466.jpg