Fucking your woman in the ass is also illegal in some states. You support cops busting doors down in those cases too?

I suppose if they have a search warrant they can bust the door down if I don't open it. I'm not sure butt fucking is a felony charge though.

This is an excellent example of why all drugs should be legal.

Back to the point. If they thought there was a lot of drugs in the house why would they climb through a window like a burglar? It seems justified by texas law.

Well said!

Yes.. and they shoot dogs summarily as a matter of course upon entering. It's SOP.
Fucking Police States of America!!!

You seriously do not understand the fact that guns that are not loaded are fancy hammers!!! (There is no time to load, when seconds count)
Guns in the house for protection should be loaded unless there are reasons to keep them unloaded. (kids etc....) in which case they should be kept safely yet accessible for defense.
He is legally allowed to have a loaded gun, Your reasoning sucks.

Home invasions happen all the time, good reason to shoot somebody.
Home invaders are smart enough to yell "Police" when the come through the door.

Yes this!!!

They were serving a search warrant, not an arrest warrant.

They go in at 5am in the morning because they are expecting problems and want everyone to be sleeping so they are disoriented when they enter, do not put up active resistance, and do not flush their stash down the crapper. Obviously he was not disoriented when they entered.

I know, that's why i said they could wait for him to leave, then take their time searching the house. If they found drugs or whatever in their search they could arrest him at their leisure in a safe environment, like while he's at work or when he returns home.

Unless there is something saying the person has to be home for them to perform the search. I dont see why that would be the case.

You are missing multiple issues here....

First is they want to catch him with the drugs, not find the drugs at his house when the main suspect is at 7-11 getting a slurpee.

Second, even if he leaves the house they still have to serve the search warrant, and they still go in gun blazing expecting issues.

Third, you are also assuming they could "arrest him later in a safe environment". When you say "safe environment" do you mean when they attempt to serve an arrest warrant at his work place when he is armed? Or do you mean when he shows up to find his front door busted open and six people going through this stuff?

I'm sorry, but when police are expecting problems, resistance, or gun play they go in at 5am with flash bangs hoping to surprise everyone and catch them off guard. When you have two armed parties going into a confrontation sometimes the shit is going to hit the fan.

The police did nothing wrong, they were serving a legal warrant. At the same, the man shot a police officer who was doing his job.

Why? If the drugs are in his house he is responsible. Unless there is some strange law that says the suspect has to be home when the search is performed. I don't see why that would be the case.

Ya, but I think there will not be as many issues when there is no one home. lol. Do you think they can't do some surveillance on the place or investigate a little to determine who is in the house?

I mean just about any situation that doesn't involve busting through a window like a burglar. Hell, a regular traffic stop would do the trick. Wait for him to get in his vehicle at his parking lot at work then box him in and draw down on him with their guns. Just about any scenario I could think of is safer than crawling through a window at 5 am. That's why there's a dead cop and 3 others shot. Do you really think this guy was just some insane cop killer that would kill any cop who farted in his general direction? Or do you think maybe he thought he was being robbed?


That seems to be working out great for them.

Stunning (well kind of) that some people (well 1 or 2) seem to think that if cops break into your house, it means you ARE guilty of something. Also that if you disagree, you are a conspiracy theorist.

I guess we'll be getting the announcement soon that the US no longer needs a Judicial system at all.

They was after black folks again

How about arresting him while he's getting into his car on his driveway. Voila.

The truth is they just don't want to wait. It's inconvenient to wait for the right time.

They can think about that at the closed casket funeral I guess.

Ummm your live by the sword die by the sword can be applied to the SWAT team members as well... Don't want to get shot in the face? Well don't execute a no knock warrant in the middle of the night by climbing through someone's window...

Let's go wild here and say that he did have cocaine in his house. Maybe he did the day before, who knows.

Is using a SWAT team at 5:30 AM in the morning, running the risk of someone getting killed (police, animals, children, target, neighbor, ANY ONE) as Rochard pointed out with his defense argument, really worth the reward of busting a guy with cocaine? Really?

I run my risk vs reward analysis different than the Killeen Police Department. Wasted resources, wasted life, and wasted goodwill.

nice email [email protected]

The swat guys want to keep their jobs. They'll be downsized if they run out of doors to bust down. Also, we can't have our kids replacing their adderall with cocaine.

Y'all should get rid of guns off the streets completely like the UK, fucking loonies.

Knock on my door and you live. Come in through my window, and you die. Zero hesitation.

Damn the consequences, police or no police.

Or stupid motherfuckers could just stop climbing through the window.

:2 cents:

this is a good excuse for the cops to continue their militarization. prolly get some drones to handle this sort of no knock warrant execution. It will go through the window no probs, take out the dogs with some drone weapon and zap the big bad doper.

Someone entering my home without identifying themselves as a LEO with a warrant first or being invited in is going to be met with deadly force as I will be in fear for my life and I am hard of hearing also. Prove I wasn't in fear or I could hear them announce themselves.

Home Invasions happen all the time in this area and it is not the Police usually. Sometimes the victims are injured, there have been a couple fatalities in the last few years. Sometimes the perpetrators are caught, shot, or even killed.

Because his attorney will argue he was no at home and had no knowledge of any illegal wrong doing found in his house when he wasn't there. It might be a long shot, but it forms the bases of doubt.

They most likely did so some surveillance.

I'm not sure about you, but I don't want my local PD blowing through $40k of overtime in a single week just to they can have five officers at at time watching the house 24/7 for a week.

No matter what, no matter how long they watch the house, if they have reason to suspect firearms in the house they are going to go in hot and heavy. It's standard practice for law enforcement.

The search warrant was for the house, not the car.

You are saying a "regular traffic stop" would have done the trick, but that is not the case at all. Police most likely knew he was armed, and forcing a full felony stop in public with guns drawn on a suspect they already know is armed should be a last resort in the interests of public safety. I don't want gun battles on my street. Hit 'em fast and catch them off guard.

In fact, it is working out great. How many warrants are served a year nationwide, and how many incidents do we have? I have no clue - how many warrants are served a year? Ten thousand? One hundred thousand? Then compare how many issues we've had - I can only think of two in the past year, this one and the baby.

If the mother fucker has a long and violent criminal record and is believed to be armed with an AR15, then yes.

Then you fucking move.

Common sense tells you that you need to live in a place with a low crime rate. (And when you get older, you look into local schools too.) When I first moved to California to live with my girlfriend in 1989, she wanted to live in the Castro Valley / Hayward area. Some quick research told me that twenty miles away over the hill had a much lower crime rate. Same thing when I moved back to California - I had to move to a certain area for Playboy and picked the safest one.

If you have a choice between arming yourself because you live in a high crime area or living in nice a neighborhood where that shit isn't common... And you pick to live in the crappy area.... Well, you toss the dice, you arm yourself, and pray that you aren't shooting a police officer, your neighbor, or even worse - your kid who sneaked out - when someone crawls through the window.

Better yet, get an alarm system.

There is no evidence of that anywhere.

Next.

For those of you not familiar with Texas, a very high percentage of the population has guns in their home. Even the women. Women love guns just as much as men. This guy having a 9 mm close to his bed is no different than having a glass of water next to your bed.

Jesus man, get your head out of your ass. Crime happens everywhere, and usually when you least expect it. Sure, it happens more in bad areas, but no one is exempt from having bad shit happen to them no matter how safe their neighborhood currently is.

The fact you are so sure you are safe makes you are perfect target. Just because it hasn't happened to you yet, or someone you know, doesn't mean the worst isn't going to happen tomorrow. There are countless murders, rapes, home invasions, and kidnappings that happen in totally safe areas, all over the world. You're also a possible target any time you leave your house.

Neighborhoods also change. Sometimes they start out nice and they go downhill fast. Goes the other way too.

I could spend 2 minutes on Google and pull up countless reports of horrible shit that happened to people "in the perfect family neighborhood."

They don't care about that. You have the shit in your house and you will be charged. My neighbor down the road got raided for pot and his 70+ year old mother (who lives with him) was also charged. In fact everyone in the house was charged.

Way to exaggerate. Have one guy sitting outside. When he leaves the house radio it in and have them come bust in and do the search. Have one other officer follow him so they know where he is while the house is being searched. Or... they could just bust through the window and get shot all to fuck. I'm not trying to teach cops how to run investigations, I'm just saying there is a better way to do it than busting through windows like the Expendables. You certainly don't need a team of 5 and a week of surveillance to know whether the guy has left his house or not.

No one is arguing any different and saying they shouldn't. The issue here is them busting through a window which clearly made it look like a home invasion.


What are you talking about? They execute the search warrant on the house and look for evidence there. Once they determine he needs to be arrested then they'll arrest him wherever they choose. You don't need a search warrant to arrest a wanted man in a car!???



He probably had the gun by his bedside for protection, like many people do. You are acting like this guy was a crazed gunman looking to off cops if they looked at him sideways. If they blocked the guy in somewhere with multiple guns pointed at his head do you think he is going to get into a gun battle when he knows he'll be killed? Again, the issue here is he obviously thought he was the victim of a home invasion.

Tell that to the cop who got shot in the face and the innocent guy who might be executed by the state for simply defending his home. And I have no idea why you think I have an issue with cops serving search warrants. It's with cops busting through windows and creating what appears to be a home invasion scenario.

I gotta hand it to Rochard - willing to let everyone think he is completely out of touch with reality... willing to let everyone think he misses the point entirely, over and over and over again... willing to come over as a brainwashed subservient sheep - all to get sig views.

You sir, have balls of steel and an evil genius IQ count no doubt - bravo :thumbsup

^ lol....

Good observations and insight my friend, this whole procedure smells fishy.

I didn't read if he got a normal job but even if he didnt he must leave his house sooner or later.

thread's been trolldhard.

First of all, I've probably fired more rounds in this life than you'd fire in 10. So you don't need to school me on guns. I grew up in rural Alaska, my father was a professional hunter and brown bear guide and I had more guns than a small militia by the time I was 13.

My 'reasoning' (not that you'd recognize reason) is the simple point that police coordinate off site, get organized and then move in pretty fast to serve a warrant. He was in an apartment. He was apparently sitting there, ready with a loaded weapon and opened fire as he saw them approaching the window and shot the first SWAT guy in the face as he came through the window and then kept shooting at others.

How fucking psychotic are you people that you rush to defend a guy who is sitting with a loaded weapon in his apartment and then just opens fire on anyone? Of course your "reasoning' also requires you to insist they didn't announce who they were and were not wearing identifying clothes which happens exactly never when SWAT teams serve high risk warrants.

You guys are so fucking eager to argue an insane point that you completely ignore the fact that he was in an apartment, not a house. If he saw them coming, he knew who they were. If he shot them as they broke his window and before they announced who they were, he had no legal right to do so. If he shot them after they announced who they were, he's still wrong. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks, you don't get to legally open fire through the window/wall of an apartment to kill people outside.

Again, the entire point is to catch the person with the drugs.

Great, your neighbors were all charged - but how many of them were found guilty and went to prison?

The entire point of police doing their job is do it correctly, not to give an attorney a chance to plant the seed of doubt.

[QUOTE=MrBottomTooth;20231148

Way to exaggerate. Have one guy sitting outside. When he leaves the house radio it in and have them come bust in and do the search. Have one other officer follow him so they know where he is while the house is being searched. Or... they could just bust through the window and get shot all to fuck. I'm not trying to teach cops how to run investigations, I'm just saying there is a better way to do it than busting through windows like the Expendables. You certainly don't need a team of 5 and a week of surveillance to know whether the guy has left his house or not.
[/QUOTE]

They don't have "one guy" outside watching the house. You have to watch the house for days to figure out who is in it, and what their routine is going to be,.

And it still doesn't matter because they want to catch him in the house with the drugs, not find the drugs without him there.

A home invasion doesn't go through a window, it goes through the front door. You want to gain access for multiple people as quickly as you can, not have them climb through a window one at a time.

How do you not understand this?

Which is going to be better and safer - Police catching him off guard while he is sleeping or doing a full felony stop with an armed man in public?

Police want the suspect quickly on the ground in matter they choose, not to give the chance for a car chase that leads through a school zone. (This happened to my kid's high school last week.)

[QUOTE=MrBottomTooth;20231148]
He probably had the gun by his bedside for protection, like many people do. You are acting like this guy was a crazed gunman looking to off cops if they looked at him sideways. If they blocked the guy in somewhere with multiple guns pointed at his head do you think he is going to get into a gun battle when he knows he'll be killed? Again, the issue here is he obviously thought he was the victim of a home invasion.
/QUOTE]

Typically police do a no knock raid when the suspect has a violent history or is expected to be armed. My guess is that this guy was always armed and police knew it.

And like I said.... Police serve countless warrants on a regular basis and there are so few issues....

To me I see police trying to do their job. They had a suspect, they thought they had a valid reason, and they served a warrant. It sounds odd they went though a window from a tactical view point the would want to enter the house from multiple access points and we don't know the details. I am pretty confident they all yelled police and yelled out that they had a warrant when they entered.

What point am I missing?

I've noticed there are two kinds of people out there.... Those that think cops are pigs, and those who support the police. The difference is usually age and if people have kids or not.

When you are young and single you hate the cops, you fear them; You slam on the brakes every time you see them and hope they don't find your little pot stash.

When you get older you figure out the police are doing their job and trying to protect society. You want police to do their job - You want police catch the robbers so they don't hit your house next, and you want the police to catch the drug dealers because you don't want your fourteen year old kid doing meth.

I live in the 8th safest city in the state of California, and the 58th safest city in the United States. This isn't by accident - I choose where I live for exactly this reason. I don't live in fear of home invasions or being robbed.

If you fear the police, you either haven't grown up, you are doing something wrong, or you have seriously fucked up in life.

Oddly enough years ago at 3am the local cops came banging on my door. I took my time getting downstairs to them, turning on all outside lights before I opened the door. There was four cops there, three of them armed with shotguns. They got a complaint about a "domestic dispute" and our neighbor thought it was at my house.

My wife and I NEVER fight and we were sleeping.

But my wife comes down the stairs and they ask "Miss, is there a problem" and my start ass wife was like "You bet there is a huge problem" and I'm like "oh shit". Then my wife says something like "you need to freaking explain to me why you just woke us up".

Then the police are like "why are your eyes all blurry?". Duh. It's 3am and I was sleeping.

if you've done nothing wrong, you'll never have problems with the police. But if they are doing a no knock raid on your house you know there is a reason for it.

I am in a hotel room in England right now while everyone else figures out what the plan for the day is going to be. I hate waiting.

The point was he had no point :2 cents: :thumbsup

There are these things called Standard Operating Procedures and creeping in through a window unannounced is the farthest thing from that; so no, they weren't doing their job correctly.

And then there are those of us who call bullshit for what it is and don't refuse to realize and call attention to a fuck up when it occurs.

Supporting the police doesn't mean ignoring when they break their own rules, put themselves above the law, carry on worse than the criminals they are supposed to be apprehending, etc.

I am. Good riddance pig, and let that be a lesson to the rest of your "brothers".

Tell that to the dead people killed as a result of no knock raids being executed on wrong addresses. Oh wait. You can't. Because they're dead.

http://www.businessinsider.com/9-hor...12-2?IR=T&op=1

What are they all so frightened of ?

learn some history. There you will find that this country was built on guns, liquor and tobacco.

Insecurity.. Seems to be a common thing with certain types of people that own guns. There are normal and sane gun owners whom are responsible and then there are guys that have to have a gun for the living room, a gun for the night stand, a gun for the computer desk ..ect..ect. These are usually the quack-pots that fantasize about shooting someone and becoming the hero of the day..

way to go stereotyping every Texan with a gun.