my parents told me from the get-go that Santa was a fictitious tradition that evolved to enhance collective generosity in order to assuage class guilt. Possibly inspired by imbibers of magic mushrooms (of which I am a huge fan btw). They also explained to me the coca coal/crass commercialism version of St. Nick/ Xmas to give me the full context of how much people will co-opt anything to grind the dollars. We had some deep convos about it each year, I think that was our version of cookies left out for an over-stuffed elf, talking the sociology and politics of what we know as 'Christmas'.

My parents never talked down to me or lied to me about stupid ish like flying reindeer and I don't feel like I missed out on anything.

The point is when you're a kid xmas rocks either way. you get cool stuff, you get to be surrounded by peeps you love, whether Santa 'exists' or not. I still felt the magic in the air, knowing my fav aunt was flying in to visit us, that I'd get some wicked gifts under the tree even if my family put them there.

Sure it was sh!tty of someone to out the ruse to your kids but I guess the question in my head is why lie to your kids in the first place? I don't see why it's necessary but for parent's own indulgence? my fav childhood memories of xmas are spending time with peeps I love, who love me. Why some of y'all parental sorts feel the need to build the event into something 'magical' for the little ones confuses me; there's nothing more meaningful than spending time with those that we love. Even kids grasp that, don't underestimate them.

"oh man, you are a piece of dick, now whole family without xmas presents, thanks alot!" :winkwink:

Maybe it is for me. I do not see the harm in believing in a bit of magic at such a young age. I am rather shocked that at 5 years old you were able to have such serious conversations and have them mean anything to you in later life.

I guess you are quite smart, so even though English is your second language you use it quite well. I realize of course that Christmas is a commercialized holiday, I just do not care. I want to see the magic in my kids eyes, I want to hear the excitement. I want them to believe in something for awhile.

We get a bit cynical when we get older, I want to keep some sort of magic in their life while I can.

:2 cents:

LOL !!! win.

I know there is no Santa (in Russia it's Ded Moroz) when I was 3 year old :pimp

English is my first language, I was born and raised in Canada. I just romp around in the Caribbean now because I can. I'm also old as fuck (adult industry-wise), so in terms of predisposition towards cynicism I can't feel you there. Idealism mends it's merry way...

In terms of my family we're all academics and nerds (an inherited trait) so we get along well, and my earliest convos with them on all topics pushed and prompted me but never beyond my limits. From my earliest memories of my family we have always talked politics, when we're not laughing that's what we do. Remembering those convos isn't an ordeal.

I get what you mean about wanting to see magic in your kids eyes, so squeeze your eyes tight yourself and see what you remember about your early xmas years...is it a fictitious elf or is it the moments you shared with your loved ones? I'm not a betting woman but I would guess it would be the latter?

For sure, my parents had a somewhat unorthodox technique in raising me, but I think some principles hold true regardless. 5, 10, 20 etc years from now all your kids will recall about the early years of your holidays shared together is your place in 'em. Not 'Santa', just your family coming together to create the the magic of the moment.

My point is, while I think trying to pretend that Santa exists is strange, your choice in disclosing (or withholding) the truth is blown. Due to an outsider that ship has sailed, cover blown. Completely unacceptable, I agree. You choose what's best for your children, not an outsider. That said, now that the proverbial ship has sailed maybe you can introduce them to a new version of Christmas that's rooted in the real world magic of having loving and caring people with whom to share the moment?

Your children can still have an xmas filled with magic, even without the elf. Sure you can lie to them, create cover stories for why your neighbor would speak such heresy but for real, why not take this as an opportunity to tell and show what the season should really be about?

Just my :2 cents:

as I stated above you have been the wronged party here so I wish you a wicked holiday however you proceed.

Kuwa na Krismasi njema :)

These two combined.

Then bitchslap the fuck out of him next time you meet him. As a bonus.

hahahahahahahaah

Thats really stuped and non of his buiesness.

I'm not taking sides here but when defending yourself against "bitch" accusations You should leave out the part about treating yourself to a million calorie coffee from Starbucks for crisis management.

50 phonies dressed as Santas

It's good your kids learn early about reality instead of believing in fairy tales.

Children should be allowed to enjoy their childhood. There's plenty of time for them to learn about reality. My childhood got cut short due to circumstances outside my control. To this day I still wish I would've had all of it.

exactly :1orglaugh

Well you got to think it this way... at least you don t have to lie and invent schemes for the next 3-4 years...

this. :2 cents::2 cents:

:2 cents:

haha...should i mention starbucks only hires fairly hot young girls who speak english over here?

Going to Starbucks and then sitting in it and enjoying a coffee watching all the students studying English or other subjects is something i like to do about once a week. :)

A bit pervish maybe, but i am well received.

sounds like you were never allowed to be a kid... "Santa was a fictitious tradition that evolved to enhance collective generosity in order to assuage class guilt" your parents said this to you at what age? i don't care how smart you are, no 5 year old would get that in those words.

the point is you called it a 'million calorie coffee' which is what women would say. If you just said 'coffee' it wouldn't sound as if you were Bridget Jones eating her sorrows away with an icecream bucket.

Oh I see. I am on a fairly strict diet lately as i have been focused on getting fit. I workout very hard and try to eat only healthy foods. That coffee was my cheat for the week.
My last cheat was a large pile of chocolate.

My next cheat is a large cheeseburger with an egg on it and guacamole and poutine instead of fries.

I stand by my million calorie coffee..lol

I wasn't pulling a direct quote from 30 years ago there. If I had I would have used a pair of these: "" as you did. Simply I was explaining a concept that was taught to me at an early age, in what I'm sure at the time was age-appropriate language. I was a smart kid but I doubt I knew what 'assuage' meant back then. I just assumed gfy wasn't a bunch of 5 yr olds so didn't feel the need to simplify things down to that level.

nah, I had a wicked, happy childhood. wouldn't change a thing

I can't decide if this thread has put me in the Chirstmas spirit or crushed the life out of it for me this year. What a rollercoaster ride reading it was though.

For the record I'm 52 and still believe in Santa. Or at least the spirit of the season including the all-too-rare feeling of goodwill that Santa represents. There's not a damn thing wrong with letting kids be kids and believing in Santa. Fictitious or not why the driving need to be so literal and reality-driven with 5 yr olds? Where would books, movies, the sci-fi and fantasy genres, etc be without abstract thinking?

People say the world no longer has a place for corporal punishment but a father who takes it upon himself to tell another guy's kid something he has no business opening his mouth about needs a bitchslap of teeth-rattling proportions.

Priceless. You could do so much worse when his kid is at your house...

Religion harms kids? How so?

Pretty dick move of him to do to a little kid.

Now is the perfect time to take your wife's phone and change your name on it to Santa Claus from the North Pole. Call the phone from yours and in a santa voice say you heard "Mr. Asshole" said he didn't exist. Tell your boy " Mr Asshole" that he's on Santa's naughty list and has been since he was 5 years old etc... By the time you know it your son will be telling Santa everything he wants for xmas and hopefully forget about what "Mr Asshole" said.

Then call "Mr Asshole" in a Santa voice and tell him to fuck off. Better yet post his number here and we will all call him in Santa voices :)

lollll____

except by using imagination it inspires creativity and allows children to raise the bar on expectations, a very healthy practice. Telling them the whole world is a horrible shitty place most of the time inspires nothing... When you take children to an art museum do you tell them its just a bunch of oil paint thrown on a canvas, that were only commissioned by the richest overlords and kings and that artists only get popular after they die? Of course not, because nobody wants their kids to turn into serial killers.

They need to be inspired, they have the rest of their lives to find out the rest.

Wrong.


:1orglaugh

Hint: read the 10+ pager about Donny

Hint: Even if Donny is found guilty that is Donny, not religion.

Hmmm, keep kids out of religion. Let them decide about it when they are old enough.

It assaults their critical thinking, makes them choose "faith" over logic, and creates patterns of thought that lead to all of us suffering: the bullshit about sin leads to ridiculous censorship, the crazy "Jesus will forgive you" thing leads to Donny situations instead of just being MORAL for the SAKE of it, and the indoctrination (brainwashing) of kids with fairly tales is just disgusting as-is. Telling them the Jesus story as a STORY is fine, but telling them it's REAL is just ... crazy.

He was brainwashed by his priest dad since birth - which is a horrible foundation for life, proven time and time again.

You can ask if it's a chicken and egg story: Does religion drive religious fanatics nuts, or is religious fanaticism a magnet for nuts?

I think it's more of a viscous cycle: Religious fanaticism goes from generation upon generation, contaminating the mind of youth since birth about what filthy is, breeding sexual frustrated freaks because they were brainwashed to repress those feelings.

It's not a coincidence so many people who do 'gods work' fiddle with kids.


Disclaimer: im not talking about donny in that last sentence, he is indeed innocent until proven guilty.

Your son's friend's father lied. There is in fact a Santa Clause. Every Christmas morning your child wakes up and like fucking magic there is Christmas presents under the tree.

YOU ARE SANTA CLAUS.

Some of my sons friends have said the same to him but he does not listen to them.

We have explained that Santa is the Spirit of giving more than anything but he seems to be happy with the idea of a fat guy in a red suit.

i suppose you weren't allowed to have imaginary friends, play space or any other things your extreme reality based parents think is illogical and a waste of time. i used to think telling kids santa was real was wrong but now i see its just letting kids be kids. no need to suck the fun out of life and be all serious when you're five. you can believe in santa, you can believe in fairies, you can believe that you an turn into a werewolf during a full moon, you can believe in ghosts. you can get scared by a story around a campfire. its all just good fun.

I guess this might be true if your kid has Downs Syndrome or something like that.

:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup

Just rework it to the guy is full of it and their really is a Santa, most 5 Y/O trust their Dad and Mom more than some clown down the street.

You're being intentionally obtuse. :winkwink:

If you told a kid NOTHING about religion, then told them the story of Jesus at 18, they'd laugh in your face. It's only because kids are force-fed that bullshit from birth that they accept it. It's child abuse, in my opinion.

My cousin sent me this link.
I am doing it today.
https://www.portablenorthpole.com