Here is how I lay out the blame when it comes to causing the recession.

Bill Clinton/Democrats - 15%
Bush/Republicans - 20%
Various people from the 1970's-1990's - 5%
Dumb people who bought a house they can't afford - 10%
Greedy banks/bankers/investors being reckless - 50%

I look at it as politicians being the enablers whom changed the laws to let the bankers do it.

The banker then did it, but the home owners were stupid enough to sign up for it. I think each holds equal blame as they each played a role and with out one or the other it never could of happened.

Meanwhile the only one of the group to be bailed out was the bankers, but of course that's who the politicians work for anyway.

Both bankers and politicians should of went to jail. The home owners should of just been fucked..

@ Paul You are not relevant anymore.
Is this how you enjoy your retirement? Cheap drama?

Tell the world how we are fucking up?

The mortgage crash was symptomatic.

It's the damn war <stupid>. (* to borrow for Bill Clinton's election tag-line).

The mortgage market was allowed to go nuts. The GW Bush administration allowed (FNMA), commonly known as Fannie Mae, to over finance and exceed the responsible LTV ( loan-to-value) ratios. There was bank fraud in both borrower applications and appraisals. The housing market was manipulated to finance fake prosperity while war debt was piling up on the US national debt. Robust economic activity, or its illusion on the markets, lowers the borrowing interest costs to the government ...

The financially irresponsible borrowers, not being limited by responsible mortgage lenders defaulted, then the house of cards collapsed, The Great Recession <Viola>

The problem is that these mortgages were being sold around the world as pooled securities with false representations of their values stated by rating companies. It was a scam that collapsed and triggered the market crash. Then the top 1% bought up the market after it crashed and made fortunes.

This DJI of 20,000 may crash again soon and the process repeats ...

Bend over and spread your cheeks ...

http://ei.marketwatch.com//Multimedi...8-001cc448aede

Trump rally could mark biggest postelection stock market rise since Hoover - MarketWatch

Look at it this way. Republican voters finally have their way. Republicans now control everything. You won, republicans, contrats. Now please go Make America Great Again.

Like the dog that finally catches the tire

look at it this way. while liberals were ripping bongs & watching jon stewart, GOP was busy at the state level out competing & outworking liberal democrats. Libs only show up for the presidential election, & take the other 3 years off.

it has turned into a fatal problem given the liberal media creates such a bubble world for the left that they were talking about the GOP imploding after the election, oblivious to the internal rot of their own party, which the liberal media pretends doesnt exist.

even now, the liberal media looks outward for excuses for hilarys loss - russians, comey, fake news. Libs fooled themselves thinking black lives matter rallies, & dozens of liberal media channels parroting the same race whining bullshit, equals a strong party.

wrong. :1orglaugh

Bill Clinton, GWB, other politicians and bad financial regulations 100%

Blaming the Bankers for getting very rich. Is like blaming a mad dog running wild and biting people. And not blaming the owners.

Those who want more deregulation in business, be careful you might just get what you wish for.

So you admit to fucking up.

Ther problem with people is often down to perception.

Some here think they have no power and will get fucked whoever they vote for so vote for the guys who will carry on fucking them.

Others vote for people who offer quick fixes. For instance, bringing jobs back to America will force up the price of goods. Double to Quadruple what it costs to make the same product in the West. Are they willing to pay that much to give a countryman a job and slow down the decline of their country for their children's sake?

Some think there will always be opportunities for the brightest. Not thinking there will be another 10,000s bright people in their own country looking for an opportunity and a many more overseas.

Some think the Government should spend more and lower the debt. So here's an idea.

Trump promised to spend more to rebuild the infrastructure. The Government spends nothing and passes all the cost onto Americans who use the facilities that are rebuilt. For instance tolls on roads, bridges, higher charges for electricity, water, telecommunications, security infrastructure, etc. Road charges are easy as are all the other charges. None of this is done with taxes or by the Government. Trump signs it over to Corporations to rebuild and make the users pay for it and provide a profit.

This could be carried through to many other services the Government provides. And there is no getting out of it. Unless you live under a bridge. Your kids go to school, you pay for the tuition, you want police to protect you, you pay for it, you want your house extinguished should it catch on fire, you pay for it. And so on.

Countries in Europe have the same problem. Governments promise things the people can't afford.

They thought the public would vote for a toxic candidate because the other guy was toxic.

Both sides having been giving you the finger. And it's been going on for decades.

Not exactly. Dems didn't get off their asses to vote, correct, but dems admit this. But if you think Pussy Grabber-elect had no help from Russia, and idiots who believe fake news, then you're wrong.

Paul I have lots of experience with failures and usually know when people are full of shit.

No Mark. Hillary Clinton was a consensus candidate.

Her predicted election success turns out to have been a 50/50 shot as Trump played the hand he dealt himself better.

What is done is done.

ahahahaha, th silly bottom never changes.

"caused"

A simple fact of macro-economics is that economies both expand and contact regularly and in cycles with each being proportionate to the other. NO ONE can prevent an economic recession AND have consistent economic growth. They both go hand in hand. There was a massive boom... and we paid for it with a proportionate crash. That is the norm. One can't be said to be responsible for significant economic growth and then at the same time be said to have played no role whatsoever in the inevitable recession/correction. The real estate bubble happened because as you know, over a long period of time, things slowly got increasingly wacky with lending and there a LOT of blame to go around for that as it happened over several decades. It's also easy to say "Bush" or "XYZ" should have stopped it... but anyone should understand that obviously no one, anywhere ever is going to get on board with making it harder to get a mortgage - which would also have immediate, far reaching consequences economically and politically.

My personally issue with the housing market collapse is that we didn't let all the associated banks and companies like Lehman Brothers etc collapse as well. Instead, companies made shitty and wreckless decisions and then paid no real economic price for it. The tax payers had to pay for it. Even passing a retarded fucking stimulous package to bail out banks under the presumption that they would just pump that money back into the economy and start lending, but they instead just sat on it to ride it all out and see what happens. An exercise in epic retardedness when it comes to legislation and tax payer money

Wikileaks says they didn't get their stuff from Russia. Its cute watching you believe everything Assange had to say when he was releasing stuff about Bush but now think he's lying.


Hysterical actually.

So you think it is perfectly okay for banks to do things that they know are irresponsible and damaging and will turn bad for people down the road all for the sake of making a profit?

Banks like Washington Mutual were giving away mortgages to people who had no jobs and no source of income. When asked, they said that a source of income was not one of the criteria for qualifying or a loan. And why would they care? They give the mortgage then within 48 hours have packaged it up and sold it to someone else. Those people sell it to someone else and it gets passed around. Eventually, someone has to deal with it when it goes bad.

Suggesting the banks weren't at fault for their own behaviour is rediculous.

You really don't understand what happened do you?


JPMorgan to pay Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac $5.1 billion over mortgage securities

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...=.bc930648fc6a

The Nature and the Origin of the Subprime Mortgage Crisis butt ugly old school HTML site but it is pretty much dead on.

The corruption of the loan origination process was the core problem.
The loan originators sold the loans to big banks who sold off crap loans to the government but continued to service the loans for a fee, then the loans were packaged into securities and sold off to investors as sub-prime loan pools when default guarantees. These former-government agencies, probably through incompetence (major fraud?), had a major role also. AIG almost failed because of credit default swaps insured with securitized mortgages

https://insight.kellogg.northwestern...t-wrong-at-aig
What Went Wrong at AIG?
Unpacking the insurance giant's collapse.
Based on the research of Robert McDonald and Anna Paulson

They all made money until the scam collapsed and the government, really the taxpayer, got stuck paying for most of the loss.

So much for successful privatization of government agencies ...:2 cents:

Privatizing Social Security will make this look like a cake-walk.

exactly. It really annoys the shit out of me hearing assholes say Obama's anything but a good person. He's not just been good for the US, but has done the world proud :thumbsup

if not, he'll be pushed out & Pence in. Which would be the end until the next election in 2020 :2 cents:

I think this is why Bush & Clinton have not RSVP'd the inauguration. They will not be there. They don't want brains splattered on them if DT is assasinated :2 cents:

Then it should be easy to post why I'm wrong. So why haven't you?

This had to be the way it was. Because wth Banking/Finacial Services dominating Western Economies. Bankers rule.

I agree with you that it's a shitty way to be, just imagine the Banking Industry moving out of the US. Which was in effect what would have happened if they weren't paid to stay.

I don't think it's okay. I believe under the legislation it was impossible for them to refuse a mortgage, I may be wrong there.

Blaming Bankers for doing what Bankers do is pointless. The real blame lies with politicians who all them to do what they did and about to repeat it.

As Squealer says we are now reliant on boom and bust economies. Banks inflate and we all earn a little, then the bubble burst and we all lose a lot. Go see what your GDP would be without the Banking sector.

What did Obama do that was so bad?



I think some are already planning a "Grassy Knoll" moment.

The banks can absolutely refuse to give mortgages.

While I agree that politicians have to shoulder a lot of the blame, there is something to be said for being a scumbag and that is exactly what the bankers behaved like here. Nobody forced them to give mortgages to anyone and everyone they could find only to immediately sell them off knowing that the people who bought the houses have no way of actually paying for it.

There were bankers that knew they were buying toxic mortgages, but they did it anyway then used them to create investment funds that they sold to a lot of people by flat out lying to those people about what was in the fund. When it crashed and burned and those investors lost everything, the fund managers gave themselves a big bonus, folded the fund, and asked to be bailed out by the government.

Sorry, but that isn't right and we shouldn't just shurg that kind of behavior off.

You do too good of a job doing that daily sticking your own foot in your mouth.

Banks resell most of the mortgages that they write.

The banks continue to be the servicers (collection agents) of the mortgages that they write and then sell.

You cannot get a mortgage from the bank because it does not meet the underwriting standards of the bank's buyers.

Nice Meltdown(s)