You have a very simple mind.

The election is over. We're talking about the national deficit and spending with no way to pay back.

Clearly your mind isn't capable of contributing anything useful other than the constant reminder you're stuck in the past.

#51 Trump Nation :thumbsup

Cool you're useless in contributing to the conversation as well.

We'll assume then, as a businessman, that you are in debt with no way to pay and probably close to bankruptcy ( or at least one under your belt ) since you support going into debt building a fence with no way to pay back :thumbsup #TeamAmerica :1orglaugh

How do you do it? You need a late night infomercial...



Don't resist the Democuck is strong in you. I've probably spent more on Amazon this week than you've made all week. :thumbsup

Isn't it awesome to see one side acting just like other one did 8 years ago :sadcrying

Or 16 years ago...

Or 20 years ago...

The pendulum swings a bit farther to the left or the right with each cycle.

As long as we keep blindly voting for the same two parties over and over we will continue to have the government we deserve. :upsidedow

I doubt it. I doubt you even voted. I doubt you because you can't give normal input on a deficit conversation.

Your mind is stuck on ideaology and an election that ended last year. You have no concept of governing and that insight shows us you have a shallow concept of business, if any at all.

You can be a dick and insult me over and over again I'll just block you if you have no depth and just brag & insult. The Joshua G runs deep in you :thumbsup

That's kind of how it works but part of the reason I didn't vote Republican this election is because Bush was a spender.

Trump showed signs of being a big spender as well and that was a big turn off. The wall a huge public works program, etc.

The conservative movement has transitioned to Democrats, if you don't believe that then where is the conservative movement?

Send EVERY Trump Voter a bill for $150.00 to start work

Yeah, the check is in the mail ...

I think that's a great idea, crowd fund it!

I put my money in for Stein to do the recounts . Crowd fund projects and if they don't make the goal they don't get funded.:thumbsup

The wall isn't the solution it's just a simple representation of the problem.

Here in California we've put in 4 bills over the last 8 years to fortify the border and increase border patrol officers (feet on the ground is the solution). The Republican congress rejected every bill!

The last bill approved was in 2006 and it had no teeth The Secure Fence Act of 2006 we asked for $5 billion then and Bush only gave $1.2.

It took 3 years to put up 613 miles of fence and we needed 300 miles more , the Republican congress refused to finish funding and building stopped. We pay about $5 Billion a year on border security here in California. The Secure Fence Act of 2006 wiki is a good read and primer on what we're really dealing with regarding the DT wall project.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:thumbsup

I bet this guy is proud.. :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

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Not sure if a Trump supporter would understand this but we have a free trade deal with Mexico. We can't just add taxes however the new president wants.

Do you realize it's US consumers who pay the increased tariff? The tariff costs get built into the US sales price of whatever the item is. So no, raising tariffs on Mexican imports does NOT make Mexico pay for the wall.

One Mans Tax Break is Many Other Men's Tax Burden
(including their children)

What if.. Trump doesn't really want to add a VAT but instead wants Canada and Mexico to end theirs? It's not really free trade when 2 of the 3 traders aren't playing by the same rules. If the threat of a US VAT is on the table all trading partners are tripping over each other for renegotiation..

The US has State Sales Tax
Canada has a GST
Mexico has a VAT

The only differences is in the rates.

There may be a US national VAT soon to replace Social Security Payroll Taxes I read in an opinion article at Forbes. This would be great for business as they would get payroll tax relief and probably won't raise wages unless they have to -- pocketing the difference as profit.
Repealing the ACA (Obamacare) will cost $350 billion over the next 10 years maybe this new VAT will pay that too. It could pay for the wall too :1orglaugh
VAT is a consumption tax -- lower and medium wage earners spend the most in consumer consumption. Higher prices, caused by new tariffs and a possible VAT tax means less value for the money available to spend. Most of the proposed income tax cuts go to the top 20% income group. So, all is good if you net over $200K/yr ...

PBBC owns this post.

They have GST in Australia and I loved it! Tax time was so easy too, no IRS.

Lets hope they gut the IRS and goto flat tax of 4.75% for everyone, impose GST and switch Obamacare over to single payer as an extension of medicare. So much easier and cost effective!

I think we are talking a 20% -25% VAT to pay for national single payer healthcare and social security.
Then a flat 10% to 15% income tax to pay for the rest of federal current spending.

Most of you won't save money. I am assuming rents, food, securities and real estate sales will be exempt from this VAT.

PBBC are a bunch of losers making little money anyway so this won't affect them :2 cents:

GST and VAT are national level taxes. State sales taxes are local level sales taxes. Not all states have a sales tax. They aren't the same thing.

Canadian goods can have GST, PST, and HST added -- Who the fuck cares-- it's consumption taxes.

Whatever -- consumption tax is consumption tax. That is part of, or added, to the price goods you buy. WTF do I care what division of government gets the money?

In the USA gasoline it taxed at federal and state level ... WTF is the difference -- you pay the tax on the 'goods' -- fuel in this case -- and that is all that matters.

Lame ass argument as usual :2 cents:

I'm all for a consumption tax myself. Hopefully that's what happens and that's the way it should be.

But, the argument isn't at all lame. All goods entering Mexico and Canada are immediately taxed via GST and VAT. That doesn't happen in the US. My business is selling business equipment. I get contacted by business owners in Canada and Mexico often but we can never do business because once it's all said and done it becomes too costly to get it across the boarder. I don't even bother trying anymore because I already know the end result. I've only successfully conducted one transaction with someone in Mexico. The only way that deal happened was him having to enter into the US and wire me the funds because Mexico makes it nearly impossible to send funds into the US. And then he had to pick up the machine in the US and transport it in himself.

Consumption tax is a sovereign issue. Trade Tariffs are a separate subject.

Business equipment is an ITC in Canada like it is in the EU -- any VAT paid is refunded by the tax authority.

Mexican businesses pay VAT on business equipment made and sold in Mexico.

You are just parroting a lame Trump argument.

No I'm parroting from experience. As far as Canada and being refunded on business equipment I don't know but it doesn't really matter. The upfront cost is enough that it makes it not make sense. Generally buyers who come to me are small business owners who for the most part are purchasing out of pocket. They generally don't have the leisure to pay more for something just so they can be refunded later. Also you ignored the part about Mexico's extreme restrictions on funds going into the US. The claim is it's drug money laundering laws. But the problem there is the drug money flows back into Mexico not the other way around... I can send money into Mexico all day long.

The point is both Mexico and Canada businesses have an advantage over US businesses in this so called "free trade" agreement. Nearly all current trade agreements are essentially anti-US agreements.

So, basically, you admit that all the latest US president, after WW2 , were incomptetent ?

Trump wants to renegotiate NAFTA. He could do it.

Imported goods, if they are ever imported, will cost 30% more.

We can have all the jobs back.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Just a couple of things here that need further explanation.
All of the jobs created in Mexico by NAFTA help keep Mexican immigration down. They include more investment from Japan and China than the US.
Those industry's that have moved there will pull out and go to other 3rd world country's where labor is cheap and other trade agreements reduce costs of shipping goods to the US.

Wall-Mart was the largest promoter of NAFTA and no secrete that they had a cozy relationship with the Clinton's (being from their home state) as well as the Republican's.

They continued to push for even faster and cheaper ways to take advantage of this trade deal by promoting legislation to create a super highway to distribute goods entering the country from Mexico on your tax dollar.
That legislation will re-surface under Trump no matter his talk about NAFTA. These trade issues are much bigger than a President and a handful of Congressmen as BILLIONS of dollars are at stake for someone.

If anyone of either party really thinks that any of it is going to benefit them, they are fooling themselves.
By the time they put words to their deeds in some sub-committee in Congress, the legislation will have language that does completely the opposite of what was intended, bought and paid for by Corporate Interest.

Those that think a VAT tax will be fair to them have not seen the language that will be used to know that. The heart of that is who is exempted for what.

At the state level, I watched as tax break after tax break was issued and my sales tax go up. So it's a matter of who exactly is paying the tax. Business does not pay sales tax and if they do, it is directly written off. Just a example.

Don't wish for anything unless you are willing to see it through with the right wording to mean what you intend. Because that is bought and paid for by others who seem to have more FREE SPEECH (money) than you, while you are not looking.

We the tax payers pay for a lot of things that make doing business in the US so profitable for so many that do not even want to pay for those benefits we provide. All this and more to have a JOB !

...I owe my sole to the company store...
Find out why the song "16 Tons" is coming true once again.
It just has different names and faces that manage to keep everyone pointing fingers at each other. It's all just a magic trick and most fall for it every-time.
Some need a real history lesson before history is re-written to hide the facts.

We'll actually be paying for the wall twice.

The first time when we pay upfront from the treasury.

The second time when we pay more for Mexican goods, via raised tarrifs, to pay the treasury back

#ThanksDonald :thumbsup

Yes, Mexico will tell him their payment terms are Net2000.

It would save the US and Americans a lot of money to build the Wall. Making Mexico pay for it is easy, stop giving them money and start charging Mexico for imports.

Not giving them money would be easy. Charging them for imports is a lot more complex. Look at it like this. Say a company makes a product. That product is assembled here in the US and the company employs 500 people. The company uses parts that come from Mexico. If we slap a fat tax on Mexican goods the cost of making that product will go up and the company's profits and sales will likely go down. The owner of that company may find themselves needing to come up with a way to save money so they decide to get rid of as many of those 500 people as they can and replace them with robots.

Raising the cost of goods coming in from other countries will only work if those goods have competitors that are completely US made because if they aren't the cost and price of those goods will go up, but wage will likely not rise to keep up with that increase. It could end up being very bad for our economy.

It could work, but we would have to go back to being a country where we produced every little part used in making products here and if it comes to that they will use robots and not people.

Keep this in mind. Mexico will not be paying for anything and it's ridiculous that there's any discussion about it.

Trump is talking out of his ass, which is where most of his speech comes from. Almost everything he says is a fleeting thought.

It's the same thing as if Trump said "You know, all of the bears at all of the the zoos will be trained to mine for gold hidden by bigfoot under the Empire State Building". The idiots who worship him will believe it.

So you would rather pay less, increase companies profits than save the US.

This is the biggest problem ATM. The West is exporting jobs, importing cheap labour and automating what's left at an unprecedented rate. The end result will be 100s of millions unemployed or on low wages and relying on the State for support, and debts that will cripple us. But the 1% will be very very rich, not that they will be contributing to the running of the country as they will reside in countries that don't tax them.

In the future, it will be of real importance where those factories using robots are based and where they pay taxes. At the moment there's nothing to stop them being based outside the West and contributing nothing to the costs of running the West.

To stop us from questioning this policy they give cheap toys.

We either go back to being the World's production centre we were or we decline. That's already in motion. How much of our debts are to support the present policy?

A countries economy means nothing if the people are poorer. Especially if Government revenue relies on what all the people have in their pockets. And an industry that might need bailing out in the future.

http://s.wsj.net/public/resources/im...0425142848.jpg

http://fm.cnbc.com/applications/cnbc...20sector_0.png

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...ment-1-1-1.jpg

This is happening at the moment.

Americans are already paying a lot because of the useless migration controls. They pay via taxes/spending, low wages, jobs, crime and social services.

The idea that illegal migrants can get an SSC, driving license, medical care, schooling, etc. Is only to benefit those with large labour forces or property giants.

Getting Mexico to pay for it is possible. But probably won't happen because Americans don't want to pay more to protect America.

I am sitting in a leather high-back office desk chair made in Mexico by (for) an American company that I bought for only $230 six years ago. I don't want to pay $400+ for my next one. I need a new one ...

Paying $900 for an iPhone and putting an American to work at a menial task is not my priority.

The future jobs are not on the assembly line making goods that can be made for less outside of the country. 1960 ain't never coming back.

There are jobs in the development of new technology to be had. Jobs in construction, infrastructure upgrades, jobs that have to be done on the site (in situ). Jobs for dullards in old industries just are not needed.

We cannot export low skilled workers because the third world is full of them.

When goods cross borders in trade -- armies do not cross borders for war :2 cents:

Paul you went to school in England?
Emigrate means to leave one's country to live in another. Immigrate is to come into another country to live permanently. Migrate is to move, like bird in the winter. The choice between emigrate,immigrate, and migrate depends on the sentence's point of view.

Quit fucking up the language --English is your first language ...

Unless you meant short-term immigrants or immigration :)

It's a tightrope that they will have to walk. Keep the tariff too low and it won't have any real effect. Make it too high and it will cause problems for American companies that use imported parts to make their products.

In the end, it really doesn't matter. Robots and automation will be replacing all low wage/simple jobs. Like you say, what will matter then is where those companies are located and who they pay taxes to. Too high of a tariff and those companies will take their robots elsewhere.

Didn't you say Trump would win 49 states or some non-sense like that?

When Hillary is in jail and mexico has reimbursed a wall that covers the entire boarder (his two main campaign talking points) I will come in here and give you guys credit. Until then you are just a Trump apologist and support him no matter what he says/does

That problem is easily solved. They make the parts in the US or a country that has a balanced trade deal in manufactured goods.

Will the present location and high tariffs to countries they sell to effect which plants they automate?

Too high tariffs and they daren't take their companies elsewhere.

At the moment the EU and US are the two biggest markets and instead of protecting those markets and jobs both Governments have put them into a continual decline. China dare not go into a trade war, it can't afford to. When the US adopted an isolationist policy, it relied on the world for exports. Now China does. If not stopped it won't in 10-20 years time.

Imagine a lower GDP with more goods produced in the US by US workers with decent paying jobs. At the moment see how GDP is calculated and see how it relates to manufacturing in the US. The EU is putting itself into a similar boat. It's threatening to cut off it's biggest market, while actively seeking other markets outside the EU that are worse and taking 9 years to get a deal.

The next step would be tax havens. A simple rule that tax havens have to be home for a real head office which employs more people than the country they based in. This stops people like Google from dodging taxes that go toward running the countries they rely on for sales. What Trump offers won't do the trick. My idea would.

The problem is it will never happen while big corporations buy our governments.

You live in a world of denial and fantasy.