Can you explain to me what good it does society to have someone who is old lose everything they have worked for just because they got sick or injured and needed medical care?

My nursing home bill is $300/day. I've been here eight years and six months. After seven figures went for six months' hospitalization, I was put on Mass Health aka Medicaid. I've seen our former district attorney here, a state senator, business owners, and other wealthy people. I see lots of Medicare recipients, too.

I'm the youngest one here by twenty-five years or more. Several families have talked about the future in funding

I'm moving July 19th to a home being built by the commonwealth. The agency running the house promises an entirely different setup, from my own room to decent food we choose.
But, it's all state money. I move from Medicaid to a state-sponsored home. I had a meeting today about the transition. They have to look up the fees as I asked about it. I'll get $200/month or more for personal expenses. Here I get $54.80/month from SSDI; the rest the Home gets. $54.80 but $25 for hosting my sites. Let's just say my credit cards are maxed out.

If nursing home payments are reduced, a lot of people will end up in the horrible facilities. I'm in one of the best but could write a book on the inadequacies. I have amnesia but have my mind. Many people here are senile or have dementia and can't speak up.

Our country needs to take care of the elderly and incapacitated. Veterans served. We paid taxes. We contributed to society.

Yeah they do "regulate" it...they fucking hold hands with them and allow them to price gouge us and there's nothing we can do about it. And when we try to buy our pharmaceuticals from other country's...the Federal Govt. tries to stop that as well. The govt. "regulates" the high prices by the legislation they have passed that gives Big Pharma, Big Hospital Corp., and Big Insurance everything they need to milk the system. And ObamaCare was the BIGGEST gift of them all.

It's like dealing with the mafia in the old days. :(

I'm on nine medications daily plus five others as needed. My Morphine daily, three times a day of twenty milligrams, is over $600 a month. They use a pharmacy up North rather than locally. They deliver but their prices are crazy. Oyxcodone is $950 for sixty pills. I could buy it on the street at a cheaper price

Old person can't take it with them to the grave, so there is nothing really wrong if an old person "loses everything." Also, it's clearly better to invest in a young person rather than old. So if given a choice, it makes more sense to setup a tax system where young get more, while old get less. ObamaCare goes against that logic, they squeeze the young, to subsidize healthcare for the old.

How does it feel that there are people on here that say disabled people are welfare leeches and pieces of shit? Disgusted I'm sure.

So what if someone retires at 65 then they get sick at 70 and by age 72 they have recovered and are back to living their lives? They could live another 10-20 years. If they had to chew up all their resources paying for healthcare now they are going to live out the rest of their life broke and on the system costing even more.

They can't take it with them, but they can leave any money/assets they have to family members. Do you think this money and/or assets would be better used if it ended up in the hands of this person's family or if it ended up in the pockets of shareholders and CEO bonuses?

In Holland it is the same. People that save must pay extra in a nursing house, people that didn't save get it for free/cheap. You don't have to sell your house, but if it is already sold, you must 'eat' it up first. So even in a social country that is the case now cause Healthcare cost too much.

Is it fair that i have to pay extra tax so a rich elderly can give his/her children money when they die? And who will be paying for me than in 20 years when everything is even more expensive?

Very disgusted. Wait until they become disabled. You can't work depending on the disability. Your friends are there at first, then most go away. Welfare? I paid into the Social Security system for decades. I won't live long enough to collect. I'll never get back what I paid in.

People here who bash the disabled are ignorant fools. Most probably earn enough for a Big Mac weekly while living with mommy and daddy.

Would I change my situation to working eighteen hours a day, seven days a week, $20k a month? Gee, let me think about that ....

Leeches? I'd gladly trade places and get away from SSDI. It's easy to judge others from a moral throne.

You are one of the biggest morons in the history of this forum.

Cars are manufactured in close proximity to the market buying them. Japanese brands sold in the US like Toyota, Nissan and Honda are not made in Japan. They are made in North America. The same strategy is used by US automakers for cars sold in Asia and Europe.

There is no right answer to this, but someone has to pay the bills, either "old" or "young."

What you said doesn't sound "right", but I think sending a bill for "old" person's healthcare to "young" person like ObamaCare does is more fucked up. Why should "young" person have to pay for something that has nothing to do with him? Shouldn't each person be responsible for his own life, his own expenses, etc?

Isn't it pretty obvious that previous generation failed to properly plan for retirement and old age related health care costs? Why should the "young" be paying for mistakes of the previous generation? Isn't it obvious that ones that made the mistake should now pay the price? It's unfortunate that it might mean that "old" will spend their retirement in poverty, but that's the only fair solution. Offloading mistakes to the next generation certainly is not fair.

UNCoolMikey. You proved you are a dumbass with that statement. Old people worked hard to save and buy a house, car, put kids through college, etc. You can't take it to the grave but you can leave it to kids, relatives or charity. My mom is leaving her houses to my best friend. He flies up yearly to visit me. He's been there for me as I was for him.

Young people can earn a living. Old people need assistance. Old people helped finance this country, helped create jobs, helped raise the young.

If an old person loses everything, YOUR taxes will subsidize them. YOUR money will help support them. They paid for decades for you; now it's your turn.

Not fair? Move to 🇰🇵 North Korea. Or, how about Russia? Or try Moldavia.

Perhaps it would be fair to have some kind of asset evaluation. If a person has a little money in a retirement fund and maybe a house that has some equity in it etc, they don't have to surrender those assets because they aren't amounting to much. However, if someone has hundreds of thousands or even millions in their bank account then they have to pay.

Of course, to me, the best situation would be universal healthcare so everyone was covered from cradle to grave.

Why should young people pay into Social Security which is then given to old people even though they can't start drawing it themselves until they are 65? If they die before that, too bad. Why should single people pay for people with kids' education? Why should any of us pay for police, fire, rescue etc. even if we never actively use them?

The general idea, like social security, is that younger people who are working pay for older people who are not and then when those younger people are old they will collect and the current generation of young people pay. To me, you judge a society by how they take care of the sick and old. To just tell old people, "Fuck off, live in poverty!" so you might be able to save a few tax dollars is pretty fucked up.

I don't get it, if you have assets that are enough to cover the costs, then obviously you can afford to pay it.

So, you can afford to pay for something, but you don't want to, and instead you want to have someone else pay for it? How does that make any sense?

You sound like you're about 19 years old at the most.

Maybe this will clear up my position:

If you have a bunch of cash in the bank or liquid investments like stocks etc. I have no problem with having to use those to pay for medical bills. What I don't like is when people have retirement accounts like 401K accounts or they have life insurance policies that they have to cash in to pay for medical bills.

To me, it seems crazy that a person who has a modest retirement fund that they worked their whole life accumulating should have to cash it all in and live in poverty the rest of their lives simply because they got sick or injured.

Medical Tourism
 

Big drawback to medical tourism is you have to be rich or have private insurance.
Medicaid won't pay. Medicaid won't even pay across state lines, even if it would save the Medicaid money.

Medicaid being run by each state means 50 different set of rules. My girlfriend's brother moved from Maryland to Kansas. In Maryland he had Maryland Medicaid. Year after he moved to Kansas, he got a letter from Maryland, stating he was still on their program. Can't use it, as Maryland won't pay for doctors and hospitals in Kansas and he moved here as he was going to become homeless there.

Kansas won't put him on Medicaid until he become 65 or disabled.

Not really.
If you ever go to Tijuana you will find dozens of clinics with U.S. doctors working in them. These doctors also have offices in San Diego and spend half their time in each place. Thousands of U.S. residents go there every year for affordable surgery.
I know plenty of people who have had surgery done there and were able to pay for it out of pocket.

Medical tourism isn't for emergency life-saving type surgeries. It's for the kind of surgeries you can plan for. Like hip replacement, etc.

Here's an article on it:
Medical Tourism: What is it, and What are the Costs, Benefits - Men's Journal

The only way to logically beat the system. :thumbsup

True. We hear are discussing our own systems as well.

So who will pay, the young who never met the person?

So change the system.

So change the system you have to live under.

What is the alternative, the young pay more in taxes to subsidise the old?

Care to explain how I should go about doing that?

There is such a thing as hard luck in this world.

https://s18.postimg.org/lf4vtjrt5/yingyang-35px.pngthe ying and yang of life should be:

No one is left to die without dignity but everyone must pay their way if they can.


There should be some cost controls in health trauma, health rehabilitative circumstances or end of life situations. Cost controls in what ways needs to be looked into. In 1920 they might have just put you in the charity ward where there were 20 beds with people placed there -- that was acceptable back then ...

In a perfect world, it would be like schools, roads, fire, police, military, rescue, social security etc where everyone pays into it and everyone who needs it gets to use it. Just like universal health care in pretty much every other industrialized nation in the world.

All persons pay Medicare Taxes on "ordinary income earned". Capital gains are exempted.

However, https://www.thestreet.com/story/1170...e-earners.html

Unearned Income over $250K (modified adjusted gross income (MAGI) above $250,000(mainly from capital gains)) is subject to a 3.8% tax under the ACA (Obamacare)

So, if your MAGI is $750K Obamacare (ACA) costs you $19,000 in tax surcharges in that tax year. 500000*.038


That's what the repeal *Obamacare* is about to the top 1%. The rest is mainly bullshit diversions.

you guys should consider letting serbia or cuba run your healthcare...3rd world shit holes rank with your healthcare but are waaaay more efficient...americans cant healthcare...they just cant :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Actually if you listen to the right people it's about not forcing someone to buy something from a private corporation. As well as about those people like me who are small business owners that fall within that small gap that don't qualify for subsidies as well as not able afford the ridiculous cost of covering 3 people at inflated prices due to it. This being the first year of ACA in full effect I'm officially uninsured. In addition to that I received a notice from the IRS saying they were not processing my return because I didn't send in a form for ACA which I never actually was involved with. It's a big fucking mess for me that shouldn't even be. I basically have 2 options. Pay myself less money so I can qualify for subsidies which in turn screws me if I decide to do something like take out a mortgage loan or pay the fines and be uninsured.

ahhhh :O

@onwebcam you are being played as a peon by that guy that doesn't want to pay that 3.9% tax. This is the guy who the Congress cares about -- not you. Their *large political donors (and patrons)*

If you cannot afford insurance -- how will you pay for any *catastrophic* medical emergency you or your family may have? Unless you have $50K (really $250K) set aside to differ this expense, you need some form of insurance.

Don't get me wrong -- I understand you are between a rock and a hard place.

You should not have to pay more than 10% of your net business income or aggregate gross wage income for healthcare insurance. It's harder to calculate how employer paid healthcare insurance affects wages --but it does indeed lower wages-- as it is part of the cost of labor (benefits).

You should be able to buy a healthcare insurance policy with the deductible you want, including $10K, $20K, $50K.

It's not really fair for me to pay your medical expense, without healthcare insurance, if you cannot not pay, nor should you pay substantially more than you receive, to subsidize my higher medical costs pain in part with healthcare insurance.

However, what is happening with the Trump/Republican healthcare bill is: that all of us will end up paying for these Medicaid people that get cut off the ''program''.

Unless we refuse them service, when they show up at the hospital ER (in a desperate situation usually), every taxpayer will be getting the bill in one form or another -- including higher hospital prices to make up the losses. These people do not qualify for GA or AFDC (general assistance or aid for dependent families; AKA: Welfare) they get no Medicaid on that basis.

Collectively, we are all going to pay for their healthcare or watch them die in the streets. The heaviest cost burden will fall on the middle income earners -- that's what this dog fight is all about.

Firstly you don't pay enough in taxes.

In some countries, they do pay a lot more and get better public sector services.

Vote for people who will represent you and not people who represent the billionaires.

Then why are you voting for him?

The US has got the politicians it deserves because they vote for them.

Chumpanzees are short sighted simpletons like their cult leader chump.

Dentists are also popular. I went in Mexico and Colombia. Just look online at the reviews. I read some reviews where people in the USA had to pay 2500 USD for dental work that can be done for 300 euro like crowns.

Yep....I saw a lot of dentist offices down there as well. Doing dental implants for 1/4 the price of the U.S.
And they were U.S. dentists who live in San Diego for the most part.

I didn't personally vote for Trump or the Congressmen and Congresswomen that are supporting the current American Healthcare Act. I did vote for the ones that created the ACA (Obamacare) mess -- I have both benefited medically and suffered financially from that mess.

If you mean why the American people elected "them" the American people are not that smart I guess as a group.

-----
Under these circumstances you could eliminate Obamacare and have a chance of success.
Rich guy buys a Porsche or a Bentley he pays the VAT on it
If you trade $5 million a day and close your positions you pay the transfer tax
If the common man buys a new chair for his house he pays the VAT on it or buys a new toaster, iPhone ... etc

Benefit to the economy;
$700 - $800 Billion in canceled private payer insurance policies
Savings of $200 billion with a 10% decrease in one payer administrative costs with a forced gain of 15% in heathcare delivery efficiency.

If the government wants to give me a $300K grant, I can further research the numbers I used and make a nice white paper for them to read -- if not, those shitheads can figure this out themselves if they really want to.

The point is; they want to redistribute costs to those least able to afford them -- common and lesser citizens.

The best thing they could do at this point is make basic healthcare private payer insurance illegal -- but they don't have that power. One reason is because this healthcare private payer insurance system is regulated by the individual states. Notwithstanding Medicare payment allowances to providers.

Oddly enough, by allowing intrastate insurance competition -- the federal government can regulate insurance carriers in interstate commerce.