The fastest growing part of the US economy is debt LOL

Tommy you don't even understand real estate investing in its simplest form. Buying investment properties with cash? Really? It's obvious, like with most topics you speak of on here, you're totally clueless.

i just sit here and laugh at you moron.

there is no hope for you but you are funny at least.

^^^ Truth :1orglaugh

Tommy, let's use a real world example.


We each have $100k a piece.

Tommy buys 1 house with cash. Tommy's earning 10k a year in rental income

OneHungLo buys 10 houses and puts down $10k on each house. OneHungLo takes out a $900k mortgage for 30 years. OneHungLo is breaking even early on, but as the mortgage gets paid down, OneHungLo is earning rental income.


At the end of 30 years -

Tommy's 1 house is now worth $200k making him $20k a year in rental income.

Onehunglo's 10 houses are now paid off (thanks to his tenants) and are now worth $200k a piece ($2 million in total) with $200k a year in rental income.

Who would you rather be?


^^ This is just rudimentary real estate investing. You don't have to be an "economic guru" like you claim to be able to grasp this.

in terms of points. It's not even in the top 25 in terms of % drops.

You're going way over his head with that. He'll never be able to understand :2 cents:

It really is just a liberal echo chamber when it comes to them. I saw the drop looked up the data and clearly it wasn't a big issue. But the sky is falling according to CNN. Obviously the higher the dow goes it will have this issue going forward. But its the end of the world

Of course CNN doesn't focus on the 200k jobs added or the largest wage growth since 2008 :2 cents: Let's focus on the irrational drop of the stock market which was well overdue for a correction.

ok i will answer you with the most common world example.

1. i buy my house and pay it cash
2. the rest of my money i give to my bank what is lending it to you and pay me interest
3. i wait a bit til the next crisis comes or your renters can´t pay their rent anymore and you can not pay your mortage.
4. i take a little part of the money from my bank back and buy all your shit for an apple and an egg.

Only problem with your scenario is rental property doesn't price with residential property. Rental properties' value are primarily based off of the rent roll/ cash flow. When the housing market crashes more people rent and rents either stay the same or typically go up.

See the way I outlined it, time & debt are on my side. Renters have always and will always rent, whether the market is up or down. When you have time on your side it doesn't matter.

Thanks again for showing your ignorance you insufferable bastard.

Great examples you posted of basic real estate principles! Now all I need is that 100K (and decent credit for the mortgages) and I'm off and running. :thumbsup

Gotta love our resident expert thommy's logic. Pay in cash (dumb), put money in bank to gain interest (idiot), wait for unseen market forces to appear (which they may not) forcing you to sell and THEN he will have the last laugh.

OMG too funny. In terms of percentages I wonder which scenario is more likely to happen, yours or his? :1orglaugh

Lol I was thinking the same thing when I read his post. Basically he is gambling more in his scenario than HungLo is.

Tommy's scenario never happens because like I explained - rental properties are based off income and not necessarily property value. Barring nuclear devastation, renters aren't going anywhere and when was the last time your landlord lowered your rent?

But yeah, real estate is the way to go. The best part about that scenario is on that 2 million in equity, a big fat zero has been paid in taxes. You literally can perpetually forgo the taxes, even if you sell it you can move all the income into a bigger piece of property through a 1031 exchange and literally never pay taxes. Why do you think Trump doesn't want to show his tax returns? He hasn't paid a dime on BILLIONS of real estate he owns. Fucking BILLIONS evaded..and the beautiful part is...it's all legal! lol

the problem with negative gearing is that 30 years, in your example, is a lot of time and the prices of real estate and rent in the USA are already a joke...you are heavily betting that your current 20 trillion $ debt, your 4.6 trillion deficit towards pensions, 10 further trillion debt that just trump will make and your #1 growing industry: debt, will not come due....

what happens if your economy tanks and renters cant pay the say 2000$ rent?...you can not dismiss the very real possibility that the debt will come due...guess what the banks will do with your shit?

the real estate racket/balloon, the medical insurance racket/scam and the taxes on the middle class and poor are only going UP....I hope your renters pay off them properties soon...

So I guess you're like tommy sitting in the desert with a plastic boat waiting for the rain? lol

If the economy crashes you can rest your beating heart my properties will still be rented. Like I said, barring a nuclear holocaust is the only way I lose.

no I am just being realistic about your dying business model...the middle class in the USA is going nowhere but down...automation will take more and more jobs...your debt is going nowhere but up and the bill must come due one day...taxes on the middle and poor will go up because somebody has to foot the bill...oh and then theres the healthcare insurance joke :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

negative gearing is basically banks printing money out of thin air, lending it to people who already have money so that they can rent properties to people who do not have money and will have less and less money in the future who are getting fucked on all sides...modern slavery LOL

what happens when your renter can not pay the 2000$/month? but you owe the bank 2000$/month to break even?

Better hope you don't have a fuck head playing with the economy then.

because in another scenario one gets mortgaged maxed and then finds interest rates got up 10x what they are now. Property prices cash because less can afford a new loan and those that are going broke dump theirs for what they can get. And all of a sudden your left with a dead asset, that's worth less than you paid for it, and costing your more than your making. Right now, well the past 5 years.. is good times, if your not paying down your debt, be prepared for some serious life adjustments.

-
Nice recap here on the events of the past week.

Stoking a fire with gasoline: why the US share market shuddered

Stoking a fire with gasoline: why the US share market shuddered

You're right. Mortgage rates could rise (although I'm locked in 20-30 yrs) and could lower prices, but once again that will not affect me because;

1) I got all the time in the world. I'm not a flipper or speculator. I'm a longterm investor. Mortgage rates are cyclical and rise and fall throughout history. I can withstand a 20-30% haircut on my rents and still make my debt service.

2) Mortgage rates go up = less people buying houses and more demand for rentals = $

I've been buying all throughout the 2000s and I can specifically recall my father laughing at me in 2008 when the bottom fell out because I had bought right before the crash. I survived that crash because I put enough down and my rents were never lowered during that crash. Now the mortgage is half paid off and the property is worth 25% MORE than it was in 2007.

Will mortgage rates rise? Yes 100%. Will we go into a recession at some point? Yes 100%. Will I ride out out? Yes 100%.


So are you in Tommy's camp where you pay for your house with cash and give the rest of the money to your bank to collect a pittance of interest and wait for some catastrophic unforeseen event? As an investor with any semblance of investing knowledge you have to recognize that as probably the worst choice you could possibly make. Or are you just going to agree with him because you guys share a love of hating Trump?

The problem is each of us is in a different market, your 25% increase over 10 years can't be compared to my 250% + increase here in Sydney over the same time frame ;)

I'd say 1/2 the investment apartments sold here.. don't even bother to get tenants. If you have CASH.. plonk it in Sydney property, or as in Tommy's case German. (only guessing that no idea of German market )

I'm just using that 25% as an example of buying in the bubble. My other properties from 2002 and on are up 200%+

And what do you mean by " 1/2 the investment apartments sold here.. don't even bother to get tenants"..I'm confused. Why would you buy an investment property and not fill it with tenants?

speculative buying rather than long-term investing, tenants are to much hassle, average here for a say a 2 room apartment is 900k most suburbs get 10-20% growth a year, so your making 100k+ a year just from that. Put a tenant in there and you make anther 30-40k a year but it limits when you can sell, and the condition the place is in, figure in 20k for a quick freshen up of the place.

For a lot of investors it's just not worth it, better to run it empty and flip for another one.

Here's my suburb for ya

https://www.realestate.com.au/invest...eray,+nsw+2062

Oh ok, I'm talking about buying apartment buildings not single family or one unit residences.


And wow 10-20% growth a year on real estate? I don't follow the re market in Australia but that sounds like you're in little bubble yourself.

No Sydney doesn't have a bubble.. its under priced

And you want to know why that is?

Immigrants.


;)

Do you think I'm against immigrants? I'm all for anyone who can come here and support themselves, especially ones that can afford to buy high-end real estate. I'm against the ones that offer nothing and will jump onto our welfare system, or the ones that come here illegally. As long as you come here and believe in our constitution and what it stands for (which eliminates all muslims) come one, come all :winkwink:

I guess there are quite a few people that disagree with you online about the Sydney housing market and whether it's in a bubble or not :2 cents:

Except for the Chinese, immigrants in general come with no money. But they get jobs, they want housing, they want schools and then they want better houses and better schools for their kids... its the same scenario world wide, well except in communist countries of course ;)

As far as the Sydney market goes, those saying its in a bubble.. don't live here, and they have been saying it for the past 20 years. Everyone who comes to Sydney wants a nice place, by the beach in a good suburb, its the Aussie dream! Currently you will need more than 5mill in your pocket to live that. So people " Immigrants ", newlyweds etc get in to the housing market in the outer suburbs.. 50 miles from the beach. And then they spend their whole lives trying to get to the beach. So the local property market is self generating with a natural progression towards the city and the beach.

There's nothing on the forecast to say less people are moving here, in fact its speeding up! Population projections - Department of Planning and Environment

No way do you invest in real estate or you would know right off the bat no one is going to give a loan on investment property with less than 20% down because investment property will not qualify for PMI. You're full of shit.

rental objects are paid from people who rent them and can pay them.

where would you be if you bought, let´s say 2000 objects in detroit ?

did you not learn from your real estate crisis ?

i mean it is up to you when you can sleep with debts - i can not.
and I own quite a lot of real estate. when i was young i did in ONCE and got a loan on
a house what i lost later in exactly such unforeseen circumstances.
since than i never asked a bank anymore for anything and i will never do it.

there are so much better ways to let money work without a gun from a banker on my head.

but as i say - it is your choice and you should do with your money and your life what you want. it is just not my way what can be because i am a few years older than you and i have already all what i ever wanted in my life.

yeah, I noticed that too. that makes a huge difference but Bladewire hasn't really grasped math yet.

Relax dumbass, I'm just trying to use simple numbers so Tommy can wrap his brain around the power of leverage. I would never myself or advice anyone to put down 10% on a property. Every single property I've bought i put down was 25-35%. But you could have up until last year through Fannie Mae's homepath mortgage..I believe you could have mortgaged up to 10 properties with 10% down. Personally I wouldn't but I know of people who did.

1 Fitty Thanks for nuthin :helpme

get your own debt slaves in the USA for just 25% downpayment! with their college debt and their healthcare racket and trumps new trickle up tax laws you can rest assured that they will give you ALL their disposable income just to keep a roof over their heads and to stay alive :thumbsup

freedoms! :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

capitalism is really really good if you a not poor! :1orglaugh

awww poor lil beta peasant crying about rich people making money :mad:

I was laughing at "freedom" in the USA LOL...how people who print money leech off of those who actually work for it :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Trump supporters and extreme right 'share widest range of junk news' | University of Oxford

Professor Phil Howard, director of the Computational Propaganda Project, said: 'There is an upside to all of this. It appears that only one part of the political spectrum – the far right – is really the target for extremist, sensational and conspiratorial content. Over social media, moderates and centrists tend not to be as susceptible.

i do not really agree with that if i understood it correct.

i am sure that the far right is heating the extremists up but in case of a terror attack ALL have to pay for that because the real terrorists already hate us all - for them there is no difference. and THIS is a CORRECT fact in this i even agree with grandfather paul.

and here is the real problematic point: the strategy of this REAL terrorists is exactly to throw oil in the fire. they WANT that we hate them ALL and the easiest targets for that are those right wing supremacists with a 5-inch world view.
they are taking care that at the end ALL muslims will become terrorists because most of them are not that educated to make a difference between real and fake. they have to believe what they can see. and they just have to open a few facebook sites to realize that they are hated.

this is what this clueless monkeys do not understand that they are the helpers of terror and not the defenders.

Nice find! Though, I always thought that was obvious. :)

Over social media, the real moderates, centrists and anyone else to the right of extreme left are branded as alt-right and/or nazi by the leftists.

Leftists consider themselves as the moderates and centrists but they are not. They are the extremists that they've been "warning" everyone about. They are the ones that want to completely deconstruct western civilization and turn it into some mutant society that will inevitably destroy itself and many of it's people.

not mine but hits the nail on the head:


the US tax code in a gif:

https://i.imgur.com/I6V4Gem.gif