uhmm.... there was no "Russian mafia" in 1984 in the Soviet Union apart from what is called "Thieves in Law" and they were hardly sophisticated,... ever. These are very low level criminals who's obligation to the group is to spend their lives in prison AND NOT HAVE, SAVE OR INVEST MONEY.

Not to mention the fact that there were no legal mechanisms for moving large volumes of money out of the county, investing outside the country, laundering outside the country etc as the only way to move money would be through the 1 and only government bank that existed at the time. I mean you are taking about a body of government that oversaw the production of everything or the cost of milk or price of a jacket nation-wide. it's not like money was just flying around unaccounted for or the system was easy to game.

I mean the stupidity of that quote is off the charts. There was no "Russian Mafia" at the time. People were getting executed in the 80s in Moscow for relatively petty crimes like selling grocery store inventory out the back door. You have a fanatically patriotic intelligence agency watching every citizen and their every move... even to the point of putting all older women on the first floor of apartment buildings next to entrances to have nosey people who know exactly who comes and goes out of every single apartment building in the nation. People being snatched off the street and disappearing simply because they promoted buddhism by putting a flyer on the wall in the entry to their apartment building and dumb shit. It's 100% retarded to make such claims and obviously can't be proven.

I mean KGB had (still has) a military branch to do things like stand right next to the guy on the nuclear sub with a pistol pointed at his head to make sure he turns the key. Yet somehow, billions of dollars were moving in and out of a nation with no financial system, one national bank, a currency not used or exchanged anywhere on the planet and in a nation that had a lot of cities ("closed cities") locked down so tight you needed permission to enter or leave even as a Soviet citizen... and where any city can't even be entered or left without going through a police checkpoint.

Sounds legit.

I guess if you just say "Russian Mafia" + "Trump" in the sales formula, idiots will "ooh and ahhh" and it's easier to sell books.

So you have a stupid book written for stupid people riddled with "may have", "some believe", "could possibly...", "seems to indicate" etc etc etc

So let me if I understand this correctly.... Someone who is an expert on the Russian mafia, who writes books about the Russian mafia, who has no political agenda what so ever because they don't write books about politics.... But they must be wrong because it doesn't fit into what you want to believe about Trump.

I have news for you... You don't think Russia had a Russian mafia in the 1980s? Are you serious? Twenty seconds of research tells me the Russian mafia has roots back to 1720, grew in the 1900s, and then exploded at the end of WWII. I am pretty confident the Russian mafia was pretty organized in the 1980s and looking to launder money.

That was out there back in July, it just did not get much attention.
I think this part of the investigation has been on delay till after the election.

If you understand how these investigations work, Mueller has to follow one lead and connect it to the next in a chain of paper evidence, not just suspicion. He can not 'JUMP' into a new one it has to be directly related and connected. So I am sure he asked for the folks at the FBI to delay as much as possible until he made the necessary connections in actual paper 'proof' to go down this road. She is the link.

But it really makes this all clear now to me. But what worries me is just how far this stuff goes. It may not end with just RU > NRA > GOP it may be other countries and other non-profits and either party.

Kinda scary if you think about it.

I see it as a chance to really clean house and set some new rules to prevent it in the future. Get'm all. Get'm out and put'm away.

I hope it is allowed to finish and not stop when it becomes inconvenient for some.
Always believed in 'drain the swamp' but never figured trump would be the guy to inadvertently do it.

I guess it just happens when you are drunk in money and influence and you get very sloppy. But they were pretty close to just legislating their actions as legal.

If you have noticed, many in the senate have been flipping on issues since the election. I think they know this is about to break wide open and will want to downplay money they may have received and look more like a statesman beyond reproach.

because you're a dipshit that doesn't know anything at all about Russia, has never lived in Russia, doesn't speak Russian, has never had a family in Russia, has never ran companies in Russia, knows nothing about Russian crime, hasn't known hundreds of legit mafia figures, hasn't worked with Russian criminal groups and the criminal underworld, doesn't know or understand the Russian banking system before and after the fall of the Soviet Union, has never had to operate businesses with hundreds of employees within that system and who knows nothing about Russian history or culture.

You're "pretty confident" about a lot of things and none of them make you look like an intelligent person.

^^^those name calling hissy fits will get worse as the trumpire comes tumbling down.

I could care less if Trump dies of AIDs tomorrow. It won't affect my day one bit.

Don't waste your time. Russian mafia has been active since the 1700's, but conveniently skipped existence in 1984 to clear trump from future investigations & shit.

Your constant name calling hissy fits in defense of trump proves different.

Russian mafia not exist :1orglaugh

I would refer you to look up the Russian oligarch's corruption in disposing of toxic waste in gasoline as has been documented as it applied to BP, standard oil (who bp supplied and bought in the 80's) and others ? at under 2%, it was undetectable and money was made from disposing of it but look how it was done. But I think BP was fined for it. Nobody went to jail.
Yea, back in the 80's.

They are referred to as Mafia or just organized crime. Call them what you want but it says nothing about truth of deed.

I could list many, many others but that is not the point of this thread. All the data has been out there, it only takes the will to read it. Come back and say that after you catch up on your reading. At least 35 years of it is relevant to how we got to this place today.

Not fake news, you can just look up what has come before the courts, and that's probably only the tip of the iceberg. Back in the 80's they couldn't extradite those individuals in the soviet union.

The point of Butina's question was to force 'public statement' for his support for dropping sanctions in exchange for support from Russia on his election.

That's how this kinda stuff works. 'Say it publicly' and gain our support. Butina was just the actor to make it possible as that was unlikely to be asked by real journalist.

It also should be said that some of these oligarchs are actually home in Ukraine.
Does that make things a bit clearer in recent events. The protest events in Ukraine that originally divides the nation were of the corruption between the same oligarchs and the president at the time. He fled to Russia.
Manafort's contacts were mainly in Ukraine. Hmmmm....

Again... there were no "Oligarchs" in the 80's. You are very confused with language, labels and timelines. It was only in the last year of the 80s that any private business at all first came into existence. The first so-called 8 Oligarchs came post Soviet collapse (berezovsky, khodorkovsky, chubais et al) in the 90s. In the 80's there was the only Communist Party, it's loyal members, the KGB, the military. factory workers and farmers and that's all.

I believe this is to big to stop now and would be highly suspicious of anyone who tries.
I'll bet the NRA is burning documents as we speak. Hiding/destroying email.
Senators have some 'spain'nin to do.
Everyone has a cover story to make.

Somehow I think there is some similar method the Saudi's have used.
We shall see.

I don't really care. It's not relevant.

You should never assume things of people. What makes you think I don't have family in Russia? What makes you think I've never been to Russia? I'll give you a little hint... My mother's last name was Chreptovich.

From Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_mafia

"The Russian mafia can be traced back to Russia's imperial period, which began in the 1720s."

It details the Russian mafia starting in the 1920s, gaining ground after WWII, and then again growing after the fall of the USSR.

I am not an expert on this but... It's kind of common knowledge. Here in the US we had problems with a branch of the Russian mafia in Brighton Beach. I lived in Bayridge, Brooklyn at the time, early 1980s, and I remember hearing about them.

It's surely not a stretch that the Russian mafia starting using Trump to launder money in the late 1980s. In fact, it all fits perfectly into both timelines.

Again you silly dildo, we're not talking about 1700's - the conversation is about 1980s. Peak Soviet Power, peak Soviet Union, Peak Communism and the only "Russian Mafia" as in organized criminal groups were "Thieves in Law" who were just small time criminals who didn't launder billions of dollars. "Mafia" doesn't mean "anyone who breaks the law" fuckwits.

I see that factually incorrect statements are not "relevant" to you.

Cause... Orange Man Bad!

But you're fine with the Democrats giving $500 million / year in taxpayer money to Planned Parenthood, while Planned Parenthood donates a lot of that money back to Dem campaigns & lefty causes? Typical libtard hypocrisy.


"A Democrat accused Trump of something so it must be true, even though there's not a shred of evidence!" :1orglaugh

Are all leftards this gullible, or just vast majority of them?

:1orglaugh

.. and the plot thickens. GOP political operative Paul Ericson to be charged for being a Russian agent.

"Paul Erickson, a longtime GOP activist and boyfriend of accused Russian spy Maria Butina, has been told that he may soon face charges for acting as a Russian agent.

The Daily Beast has obtained a “target letter” that was sent to Erickson’s lawyers by federal investigators informing them that “they are considering bringing charges against him under Section 951 of the U.S. code—the law barring people from secretly acting as agents of foreign governments."

GOP activist investigated as Russian agent due to relationship with NRA-linked alleged spy

"During Donald Trump's presidential campaign in 2016, Erickson attempted to develop a back-channel between the NRA and the Russian government.[1]

In May 2016, Erickson sent an e-mail with the subject line "Kremlin Connection" to Trump campaign adviser Rick Dearborn asking Dearborn and then-Senator Jeff Sessions for advice on setting up a meeting between Trump and Russian president Vladimir Putin at an annual NRA convention. After Trump won the presidential election in November 2016, Erickson said he was advising his transition team."

Wiki

I sent this guy ( Semion Yudkovich Mogilevich ) an e-mail to see if the Russian Mafia was in existence between 1900 - 2018. Let see if i get a reply ?

Sure they do, it's just in the end, if your right, it changes nothing.
Get over it.

Trump has been in bed with the Russians laundering their money for them since the 80's.
Whoever those russians are to be called. It matters not what you name them.
Let's just call them folks with to much money wanting more willing to side step any law to make more.

The court cases of record of the 90's show that. It wasn't faked news. I read some of those court transcripts back in the 90's.
And if you look, you can still still go read them.

Crockett is clearly one of those Antifa domestic terrorists. As such i'll have to report this thread to the secret service and dhs for further investigation.



So nevermind that the Clintons were taking millions from Russia for shady deals, and let's accuse Trump voters of being white supremacists.

^^ Ass-Nutter proves himself to be a hysterical liar over & over. :action-sm

Dems always rely on lies, smear tactics, and fake hate crimes. They're not all despicable people but most of them are.

:pimp

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...36&oe=5C9D153E

:1orglaugh

The Dutch Docs

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JbY...mRtNUROnD/view

explained:

I can only comment on the quote. I could care less about someone assigning me an irrelevant research project to prove themselves right.

no Russians or Ukrainians on this board are going to say "yes, there was "Russian Mafia" in Russia actively moving Billions of Dollars around the globe in 1984" and 'Laundering Money" which wasn't even a crime in the USA in 1984.


And it does matter what you call it when what you call it is a lie to sell books, not to disclose or present well supported and honest facts.

Again, i was commenting on the quote you used
1984+
Soviet Union+
Russian Mafia+
Laundering Billions

The only thing that happened in the Soviet Union in 1984 are bread lines and KGB, Police and Communist Party crackdowns to maintain control of a failing economy that was going over a cliff and restless population.

That money that went missing from Kazakhstan had nothing to do with any of those things and happened in the early 2000s if recall and has nothing to do with Russia unless you think Kazakhstan or Russia are the same place.

But I understand to need to twist things around... cause... you know... Orange Man Bad! For your purposes, it's OK to call Kazakhstan - Russia,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_...f_Donald_Trump

An analysis by USA Today published in June 2016 found that over the previous three decades, United States president Donald Trump and his businesses have been involved in 3,500 legal cases in U.S. federal courts and state court, an unprecedented number for a U.S. presidential candidate.[1] Of the 3,500 suits, Trump or one of his companies were plaintiffs in 1,900; defendants in 1,450; and bankruptcy, third party, or other in 150.[1] Trump was named in at least 169 suits in federal court.[2] Over 150 other cases were in the Seventeenth Judicial Circuit Court of Florida (covering Broward County, Florida) since 1983.[3] In about 500 cases, judges dismissed plaintiffs' claims against Trump. In hundreds more, cases ended with the available public record unclear about the resolution.[1] Where there was a clear resolution, Trump won 451 times, and lost 38.[4]

The topics of the legal cases include contract disputes, defamation claims, and allegations of sexual harassment. Trump's companies have been involved in more than 100 tax disputes, and on "at least three dozen" occasions the New York State Department of Taxation and Finance has obtained tax liens against Trump properties for nonpayment of taxes.[1] On a number of occasions, Trump has threatened legal action but did not ultimately follow through.[5]

Of Trump's involvement in the lawsuits, his lawyer Alan Garten said in 2015 that this was "a natural part of doing business in [the United States]",[5][6] and in the real estate industry, litigation to enforce contracts and resolve business disputes is indeed common.[5] Trump has, however, been involved in far more litigation than fellow real-estate magnates; the USA Today analysis in 2016 found that Trump had been involved in legal disputes more than Edward J. DeBartolo Jr., Donald Bren, Stephen M. Ross, Sam Zell, and Larry Silverstein combined.[1]

Again, that has nothing to do with the book, your arguments, 10 Billion Dollars in Kazakhstan or anything at all. Definitely has nothing to do with:
Soviet Union
1984
"Russian Mafia"
Laundering billions of USD in the 80s

Transcript of James Comey's Dec. 7 Interview With House Committees

https://www.lawfareblog.com/document...use-committees

And the Russia investigation came up a little to much... I wonder why ?
Seemed to be the target hidden around Hillary's email.

Kazakh Who Allegedly Laundered Money Through Trump Tower Ordered to Pay Bank Back
https://www.newsweek.com/british-hig...ndered-1088665

It seems to run in the family...
https://www.gq.com/story/ivanka-trump-jewelry-business

The Panama papers

I completely disagree. The Rusisan Mafia was so huge they had were also firmly entrenched in the US in the 1980s.

If the NRA gets wrapped up in this and taken down, I'll make cream in my pants.

You don't have to live in Russia to know that the Russian mafia existed in the 80's. Is your logic that nothing ever really happens unless you were actually there to see it? Is that how your narcissistic mind works?

You say that bullshit like you know something about organized crime in Russia or as you infer, its lack of existence during specific time periods. So you're so invested in Donald Trump being innocent, you're willing to tell people they're wrong when they make the highly likely assertion that Russia had organized crime in the 80's. If I told you dolphins are wet, would you say "you're not a fish so how would you know?"

By the way, Russians have been doing crime organizationally for centuries. It's a nation run by crooks. Crime is in their DNA.

So you hate groups that defend civil liberties. Very strange. If you hate freedom you could always relocate to North Korea. Or Cuba- nice weather at least :1orglaugh

:rasta

again, i know its tough for you trying to reason with that big turd between your ears.. so you're making shit up. a few petty criminal ex pats in brighton beach who escaped the soviet union is not "an organized criminal enterprise so huge that...". you guys just keep inventing fake facts.... cause Orange Man Bad

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_mafia

Russian organized crime or Russian mafia (Russian: рoссийская мафия, translit. rossiyskaya mafiya,[2] Russian: русская мафия, translit. russkaya mafiya), sometimes referred to as Bratva (Russian: братва: "brotherhood"), is a collective of various organized crime elements originating in the former Soviet Union. The acronym OPG is Organized Criminal (Prestupnaya in Russian) Group, used to refer to any of the Russian mafia groups, sometimes modified with a specific name, e.g. Orekhovskaya OPG. Sometimes the acronym is translated and OCG is used.

Organized crime in Russia began in the imperial period of the Tsars, but it was not until the Soviet era that vory v zakone ("thieves-in-law") emerged as leaders of prison groups in forced labor camps, and their honor code became more defined. With the end of World War II, the death of Joseph Stalin, and the fall of the Soviet Union, more gangs emerged in a flourishing black market, exploiting the unstable governments of the former Republics, and at its highest point, even controlling as much as two-thirds of the Russian economy.[citation needed] Louis Freeh, former director of the FBI, said that the Russian mafia posed the greatest threat to U.S. national security in the mid-1990s.[3]

Organized crime by any name is still organized crime. But you can split hairs if you want.

again, you are continually attempting to conflate irrelevant timelines and irrelevant facts.

As i've said many times now, I was only responding to the language of your quote. ....
1984
Soviet Union
Russian Mafia
Laundering BILLIONS of USD in foreign countries

and as the article quote said and as i have said already several times... the only "organized crime" in 1984 in the Soviet Union were small time nobodies smuggling jeans and counterfeiting bibles and low level shit, corrupt Communist Party members who were executed when discovered and loose bands of "thieves in law", who by their own rules are required to not have assets, not save money and to spend the bulk of their lives in prison... they were not well structured, global criminal empires laundering BILLIONS of Dollars in foreign countries. They were simply convicts who could not operate within the Soviet System, get good jobs etc and therefore vowed to embrace prison and operating outside the system.

But again, don't let actual relevant facts get in the way of a good Orange Man Bad rant.

Well, the orange man definitely ain't good. Can't name a single good thing he's done yet.

This just comical.... A young good looking woman from Russia who loves firearms and loves dating older men..... Hook, line, and sinker. They fell for it.

You can keep saying it...

I don't think you are reading me. I don't care. You are splitting hairs that are to short to cut.
Get over it !

As a Public Service to Trump Supporters, I would like to remind them:

-Be sure to take off your MAGA hat BEFORE setting it on fire.
-Several cases of severe head burns have already been reported in Red States.

↑↑↑ Retard TRIGGERED!

:thumbsup

My entire news feed this morning is full of "Trump will be indicted" and "Trump will be impeached".... But hey, it's a nothing burger. Right?

))

The era of the tsunami combover is going to provide many lulz forever.

I am just amazed.
When Hillary was accused, I knew 2 things.
That it was likely politically motivated as most things are when they know your going to run.
And there would be a investigation.

Not trusting the 1st that it was just political motivation, I'm glad there is/was a investigation. And you always hope these are not disruptive to any biz as usual as far as the government running. But leaks always have that effect when it is someone in a sitting office.

Now, I would dare anyone to show me a investigation by any special council that has been shown after the fact to be in error or corupt. Because the folks that control government change hands frequently, there is plenty of opportunity for wrongs to be made right again.

But I have not seen it in my lifetime anyway.
Now I have seen investigations fall short of finding other crimes and I would site D.Cheney on that, but still ? Where is the after fact smoking gun on 'ANY' investigation that is corrupt. Knowing there is plenty of time for it to be looked into after any change of power.

So now here we are again, a investigation into Russian meddling into our elections made out to be a investigation of trump. And all I can say is that trump made himself to be a target only by his actions and words.

And the only way this has been disruptive to the Office of the President is because Trump is heading a offensive against the special prosecutor. Otherwise, it is a investigation that has yielded results of wrongdoing that should not bother the POTUS unless he knows he is implicated in what they will find.

So, regardless of how bad POTUS is implicated, we now know even more about the flow of foreign money other indirect influence to politicians and I can only hope this does not stop because I want them all. No matter the party.

So until someone can "show me" where these investigations have been corrupted in the past, you can keep reading the spin handed you to stop it, but I would think you might want to know yourself just how far this crap goes.
Unless you have a vested interest in it going away !

So either way, your not going to make a successful argument to make it go away without some kind of proof.

I will remind you that anyone's conflict of interest does not 'change' the fact a crime may have been committed. As long as nobody is fabricating evidence.
You can't stop a investigation on allegations !

Within a month, we might have a clue to how far this has really gone as to outside money going to politicians of all flavors. Those of you who voted for 'drain the swamp' should be overjoyed, but not so.

This type of corruption diminishes democracy as a whole. I hope there are enough out there that actually care about that.

We have enough corruption from inside sources to have the need to worry about it from outside sources as well.

funny stuff. you're such a dipshit that you quote a CNN producer pumping out "Trump / Russia Collusion" bs stories everyday for ratings who admitted it with that very phrase that it was all bullshit.