200 million Russian acres of lebensraum!

it because of culturally enrichment Microsoft with Indian coders :1orglaugh
https://cs6.pikabu.ru/post_img/big/2..._373938186.jpg
welcome in merica 2040 :thumbsup

yes - that´s very good comparison.
and if someone does not even get this in his mind every try to enlighten him is senseless.

he can not see the benefits because he can not see ANYTHING.
just a waste of time to discuss with this kind of people that closed ears, and eyes but their mouth open like the grand canyon.

Anyone from Ukraine, Georgia or Belarus wants to chime in how much better it was not to become EU member after 1989?

I mean they must be surely doing so much better than CZ, SK or PL - right?

All this freedom they have, not being ruled by anti democrats from Brussles, the trade agreements... there must be flowing milk and honey on a daily basis.

At least according to Paul.

And Syria and Lybia! Will be good! So progressive so European. And UK will pay for it :1orglaugh

https://scontent.fprg1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...2f&oe=5D32BCD8

https://scontent.fprg1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...16&oe=5D32549F

:glugglug

Paul doesnt understand the EU is a work in progress...

Paul Will fix them Some magic tradedeals!!!

Without EU
https://avatars.mds.yandex.net/get-p...f0f88605/s1200

With EU
https://t-ec.bstatic.com/images/hote.../160867477.jpg

https://www.google.com/search?ei=fEC...10.f9acM4H7i7I

It's the government of the country you live in to teach you.

It also upgraded the level of debt in those countries. But I will give you it has taken money from the richer countries and donated it to the poorer. Not so good if you're one of the givers.

That was a Microsoft development.

Net contribution of the UK to the EU: 1.25% of the annual GDP

Having unrestricted access to a market of 500 million people: invaluable

Paul and the other brexiteers: Idiots

:2 cents:

it was a joke)
Muhammad has replaced William in the top ten most popular boys' names in England and Wales.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7958221.html

i know you will not understand it but here a few facts:

UKs GDP went from 1,5 trillion to 3 trillion TIL the brexit votes.
since brexit votes it went down from 3 to 2,5 trillion already and UK is STILL in the EU.
imagine what will happen after they are out.

britains annual growth rate after the crisis went up to 2,5 %
after the brexit vore it went to now 1,4 %

britains wages growth since the crisis went from - 3% to +3,6% actually falling since the brexit vote.

britains national debt to GDP doubled up since the crisis - but this is not caused by the EU as this happend in nearly every country of the world. with actually 84,7 % debt to GDP with a falling trend) britain is still doing MUCH better than the US with 105,4% (trending upward)

britain´s unemployement rate went from over 8% in the crisis to 3,9% - this is better than most other countries did.

the longterm unemployment rate in 1995 was at 1,6% and is now at 1,1%

now lets look on the wages:

anually wages growth after the crisis are in average at 3%
inflation rate went down in the same time from 2.4 to actually 1,9%

so more money even compared to the inflation.

there is NOT ONE of your arguments left when you compare it to the real numbers.

so keep your tears you cried now for the future - THAN you will need them.

but as you are safe in a EU country you are anyway just hypocrying around.

https://scontent.fprg1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...2f&oe=5D32BCD8

What difference does the colour make?
We can control the entry of criminals.
Elected by who?
£350 million does exist.
The UK was pressured to contribute towards Eurozone bailouts.
Sadly you're right and politicians fucked up the democratic vote.
Yes the EU will go against the wishes of the the Irish and British people.
Not if the UK is bound by a good deal like a Common Market.
Then kick Turkey off the list to join the EU.
Non-EU migration is controlled.
We can but don't. That's why a lot need welfare.
Most of the rich are 100% for the EU.

Ending roaming charges was good.
Banning hidden payments good.
Free travel for teenagers, not sure if that applies to all countries, as my daughter still pays.
It did not fund anything, the EU takes money from countries and spends if for them.
Devastated workers rights in richer nations.
https://www.tax.org.uk/media-centre/...-and-avoidance
Improved food standards is a good thing.
Independant nation can strike trade deals.

Now tells us which one of those pluses is unique to the EU and unable to be achieved by separate countries.

These are unique examples that apply to the EU.

The Euro has dumped most Southern Eurozone countries into massive debt.

Freedom of movement has destroyed the job prospects of millions of people all over Europe. By importing cheap labour to put natives on the welfare and save companies billions of Euros. It's also put terrible pressure on the receiving country to house, healthcare, educate migrants.

Mass illegal immigration shows how incompetent the EU is. Only people fleeing war zones are entitled to Asylum those moving to a better life aren't.

EU membership limits Britain’s international influence, ruling out an independent seat at the World Trade Organisation (WTO).

Britain would have more control of its laws and regulations, without risk of having counterintuitive policies forcefully imposed.

Britain’s domestic security would benefit more from greater border control than political union.

Membership in the EU keeps Britain from fully capitalising on trade with other major economies like Japan, India and the UAE.

The EU subjects Britain to slow and inflexible bureaucracy, making it more prohibitive for smaller companies to do business.

Improved global trade agreements and more selective immigration could have a positive effect on the British job market.

The average person in Britain loses hundreds of pounds each year due to EU VAT contributions and agricultural subsidies policies.

The main reason for leaving is the loss of Sovereignty. Laws being passed in the EU that will eventually mean Brussels and Strasbourg. A two city deal just to keep the French happy. And getting compromise to please 27 nations as different as Europe is an impossible dream. Countries want to make their own laws and not be governed by a Centralist clique.

They did that to keep you happy Paul... 2 different cities for a more decentralized rule!

Just because EU institutions are corrupt, does not change fact how EU reduced corruption in EU countries.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Dieter and Hans work hard for Zlatan's rakija bottle.

Actually, it still confirms his point of view somehow. The thing that rich countries invest and make money in poorer countries and with their citizens, doesnt make automatically citizens of rich/er countries also more prosperous.

Rusische Rusland WITH Putin/ tzar:
http://www.thedrinksbusiness.com/wor...2/84804124.jpg

Rusische Rusland/ eastern asiatic Slavic Hordes WITHOUT Putin/ Tzar:

https://cdn-stream.httpid.com/c202/w...t_121/2566.jpg

it does - but it is an invention in the future and you will not see the result from a year to the next. if you look into the tradebalances of the healthy countries you will see the result of centuries of invention already.

you country (you are from poland are you?) is a very good example. in 2001 poland imported for less than 5 billion.
now poland spends 20 billion on imports.

politicians have the obligation to plan into this future because we voted them to protect our next generations also.

just people who give a fuck on that and think "i am dead til then" will not understand it. same as trump gives a fuck on the planet as he will be dead when our kids are facing the armageddon and he does not care anybody except himself.

if the buddhists are right and he will be born again - he'll probably go to the grave of former president trump and piss on it.

unfortunately - not only Trump. more like 95 % of humans on Earth. Human specie is a cancer for this planet.

you are right but that does not mean that we have to accept that.

humans awake every day everywhere on this planet and this is because they hear and see and feel it meanwhile.

and the EU is one of the hardest fighter for it and we reached more than the rest of the world and the trend is ongoing faster and faster every day. it is not to stop anymore - and this makes hope.

every day are good ideas born and realized. even when we fight for the morons and their children too we will not sit around and do nothing.

at the end they will say the same as with the ozone hole: "look we told you there is nothing" and they will never get it in their small brains that this is because we reduced the emmision that caused it from 110 million tonns per day near to zero.

yeah, true to a certain agree, but when you have a country like Italy that is built on mafia and corruption, then it's an Italian problem. Not a EU problem.

there are reasons why in Italy 20+% of young people are unemployed and in other countries it's 5% or less.

As I also tried to explain Paul repeatedly - it's not the EU that destroyed industrial production in the UK - it were the unions and Thatcher.

The EU didn't force the British to build the shittiest quality cars ever and the EU didn't force unions to go on strike until the British car industry was dead or taken over by Germans, Japanese or Indians.

If there is one thing Brits mastered, then it's blaming someone else for their own shortcomings.

poland runaway :1orglaugh believe me run, today still not late :1orglaugh

obviously. But I wasnt even talking about Italy (which is completely different "country" than Germany or UK)...I was talking about UK...Globalization proccesses usually make just some people richer and most of the people - not exactly... But thats not the case and "fault" of EU, its worldwide. But EU speeded up this proccess in some cases definitely.
Say you had some chap in UK who could rent apartment before hordes of Poles came, for lets say 500 pounds/ month. After hordes of Poles and other Eastern Europeans "invaded" UK - same apartment goes for 900 pounds.
Now, probably not so many of those UK chaps/ blokes were going before to work for 6 pounds/ hour...But now, new EU took all those jobs and UK blokes dont even have that option....
Who makes money on that ? Already rich people - apartment owners that rent them, factory/ company bosses that employ cheaper labour.
Who potentially lost ? Blokes that were low low middle class/ low class.
Which of them is more ? One of the main reasons for Brexit.

ok, I can agree to that.

only problem: in no scenario the EU hordes will have to leave the UK so Brexit won't make it better.

and first thing other countries will demand in future trade deals with the UK will be visa free travel - so hello more Chinese and Russians! :winkwink:

Winning!

Yes Poland run! Run to the Hills to Puty so you can continue to Drink and Drive and assault gays all culturally embraced!

Join USSR and become culturally enriched!!!!

paul i'm not going join in with the others, these countries are in dedt, how can they have donations also? they all now pay back into the eu, their properties and land double the worth,

"visa free" - it is EU fetish.

expanding your market costs $$$...not expanding your market also costs $$$...

you falsely assume that not investing means status quo and instant riches...you expand or others take you over by expanding and having lesser production costs...

Moving money from A to B, makes B richer and A poorer. It never creates new money.

Moving money from outside the EU into the EU does create new money for the EU. We've seen this with decades of globalisation. China gets richer while the West gets poorer. Except the already rich who get even richer.

So Poland is getting richer, while the UK gets poorer. Who wins? The rich elite.

Relying on politicians to fix anything is foolish. They're part of the problem.

Nah....

Last time I checked they were still safely in the EU as well in NATO...

So Russia... let me tell you this about Poland:

https://66.media.tumblr.com/1c1aa952...vzrko1_500.gif

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh


dont move the money...keep it at home...somebody else will invest in poland and get the cheap labor...you are stuck with high production costs and no new market...winning...

all you brexit/anti EU dumbasses do not understand the very basics of economy...you pretend like "option B" has no negative side effects...

Industrial production was killed by globalisation and the Unions. All Thatcher did was close factories that were bankrupt without taxpayers money. Governments can only close government owned companies and no one will close a company making him money.

Unions forced car companies to limit R&D by forcing through pay rises for every change of design. The Labour Government under Wilson and Callaghan allowed the Unions to do this. Remember I lived through those years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent

Anyone who believes the EU is a Socialist Solution is delusional. It's on the side of big business all the way.

It's the lies that the pro-EU side make. For instance if all workers came to work in jobs the country needs, why do so many need to be getting welfare? Why do so many get jobs by under cutting native workers?

It's up to the the country concerned if they allow Visa Free travel in return for a trade deal. And not a club with lots small countries whose votes are needed to swing decisions. But I will give you that Tony Blair did fuck the UK by not setting rules on Welfare before he allowed everyone to come in. Again proving the ineptness of politicians.

EU it is the German market, not are Pooland's toilet cleaners :1orglaugh

where are you from? NATO lol for Poland :1orglaugh
https://politikus.ru/uploads/posts/2...300_polsha.jpg

Big chunk of Poles that left for UK are there for so long (since 2004-2006) already that they got naturalized/ got residencies,bought houses, some of them even have their UK citizenship since years.
So honestly many of them that are there, dont care about Brexit. It could be a problem only for those that want to go to UK after Brexit, mostly those with low qualifications.

The main reason for me not to like the EU is the loss of sovereignty of 27 nations to a Centralist government in Brussels. Which so far isn't covered in glory.

A lot of the examples Stefan gave have been done by non-EU countries and could be done by independent EU nations. All the EU is, is a Trade Agreement which we had with the Common Market. And even that was more binding than other countries trade agreements by not allowing other trade deals by independent nations. Imagine other countries agreeing to terms like that.

The point of this thread is to pull back from the march towards centralist power and if a coalition of anti-EU parties is needed to do that then lot it happen. After all if the people of Europe don't want to be ruled by incompetent centralist politicians trying to make laws that fix countries as far apart as Germany and Greece, Sweden and Malta, Poland and UK. Then that's democracy.

https://openeurope.org.uk/intelligen...u-regulations/

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4053/eu-regulations

you expand your market or somebody expands his market to your market...noticing the benefits of one solution, while pointing out just the drawbacks of the other, does not solve anything...

the teachings of paul markham: you are stronger alone :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

you do not expand your market - you go cleaning toilet, because your market(your ass) not belong to you now :1orglaugh you not take profit from your market - just get dirty work with shit :1orglaugh

not stronger sheeps when unite, just scared :1orglaugh

https://www.dcclothesline.com/wp-con...on-clinton.jpg

https://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Im...18295734_8.jpg

United Russia :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

in every team/union theres this one guy who is better than the others...just for example ronaldo in football...ronaldo gets the big $$$ and all the pussy...the other players do not...

now if you decide to play football for yourself, without ronaldo, you STILL have to play against the other team, but now you do not have ronaldo on your side...but you get to keep all the money that is nothing now...

this is just how it is in economy...

yes comrade, Ronaldo it is the UK, he leaves and you will stay with command toilet cleaner(strong unite) :1orglaugh and start play against most hard gamers :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:thumbsup
what could possibly go wrong?))

well ronaldo can not play alone as he does with others and cleaning UK toilets is better than cleaning bulgarian ones...a toilet cleaner is a toilet cleaner in any system...