If that is the case- then why is AVN pushing so hard to appeal to the end users?

Also look at he award winners over the years and tell me 100% honestly that it's not slanted and non biased

I don't know much about the video side of the industry so, honestly, I really can't answer that one way or the other. What I can say is, please don't turn this thread into a thread about AVN. I posted the news here because .XXX is a big story that's very worthy of discussion. Let's please keep on that subject here.

I want to know what people in the adult industry supported this becuase I cant believe anyone would. They said in the article they have support of the adult industry I want to know who. Also this does nothing against child porn its a cash grab to make $75 a domain and trust me by this time next year their will be a new law saying we will have to give up our .coms for .xxx. Which sucks because 40% of adult is overseas. These guys figure they can control adult because if I remember correctly you also have to follow their rules and whats to stop them from charging $75 the first year and then bumping it up $1000 a year. Also Aly a true industry publication takes a side if something is very bad for the industry.

Fyi

http://uspto.gov "XXX" Issued Live Trademark Held by http://XPays.com

http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?r...entry=78127349


also- nobody brought this up yet, but it won't be the government ghettoizing the adult internet with .xxx - it will be the credit card companies if anybody who have the ability to say "all adult sites billed by visa are required to use .xxx blah blah blah". Visa and mc make their own rules unlike the gov't who has to deal with pesky issues like free speech.

Post courtesy of:

http://XPays.com

Are you going after these people for violation of your trademark

See my post, number 2 in thread.

the commonality of the word ghetto was not my point. re-read please.

IMHO, your trademark will never hold up on something like this. I'm surprised you even received it in the first place. But good luck anyway.

.xxx will not catch on. Even if by remote chance, they are approved as a TLD, just wait and see who chooses to use them over a .com, no one.

Adult content on .com domains will never be against the law, and so long as it is that way, .com's will be king.

Everyone will buy them because if things change do you want to lose your domain name? As far .com adult sites never being against the law what you basing this on? Havent you been keeping up on current events?

the $60 a year fee is ridiculous. It should be the same rate as all other domains.

Never say never when it comes to online porn... As far as we know it may vanish tomorrow morning.

I heard it would be $75 and you have to follow their rules

yes despite .XXX never having been a extention 500 people on overture searched for porn.xxx last month. Once surfers learn about .xxx that'll be the first place they'll go to find porn.

mainstream bitches, were the real money is made :Graucho

Agreed, the .xxx domain will have plenty of built-in traffic from clueless surfers looking for free porn. And since all the good domain names have already been purchased, for the most part, .xxx will allow webmasters and squatters a new chance to grab something less than 42 characters long. If it was released, I'd certainly go after some of the domains, but I still won't forsake .com

Actually, they said they had "the support of the industry." They did not specify which one.

I think that was intentional.

1.) People buy anything based on hype. No one will lose their .com because of legal adult content.

2.) US constitution, 1st amendment.

3.) For the most part, yes.

Guess who owns that domain? New.net.

Sure there are some decent .xxx domains getting traffic. Same with all extensions.

.xxx domains are a fad. Believe they are the future if you wish.

The first amendment doesnt cover porn, its not protected speech.

I'm no lawyer. We'll see.

either am I but I have one , its not protected speech its hasnt been for a long time.

Of course the first amendment protects porn. Maybe you are thinking of "obscenity"? Even that is not mentioned in the constituton. The first amendment does not make exceptions, only the Supreme Court does.

Even the current conservative Supreme Court has made several split rulings affirming that porn is protected speech.

The problem is that Bush is trying to remake the Supreme court and other courts to push an activist right wing religious agenda.

Justice Scalia, one of the most right wing judges, has said several times that he does not believe porn is protected by the constitution. If one of the more free speech supporting judges were replaced by Bush, you could see a country where adult material is considered illegal under all circumstances.

Look at Scalia's comments if you doubt it's possible.

All of the Bush voting pornographers are enemies of free speech.

lol, new.net


i wonder what they will do.

bump :disgust

:disgust

REDUX

http://www7.nationalacademies.org/i...itepaper_7.html

Read your history.

http://www7.nationalacademies.org/itas/whitepaper_7.html
 

:Oh crap

oops -

A little response for Mike South and others with concerns from Paul Fishbein's AVN Blog:

"For those who trash us on the boards and speak without any knowledge of what's really going on (yes Mike South, you), here's the story. In the early days, at the encouragement of a couple of our biggest clients, we had meetings with Jason Hendeles concerning AVN's potential involvement with the .XXX business. We viewed it as a business opportunity. We sought the advice of many in the adult business, some of whom felt that the .XXX domains would "ghettoize" the adult business, while others felt there was a real opportunity.

However, we never made a deal with Jason and to date have no involvement in .XXX. Not that it's anyone's business, but we consistently look at opportunities for our companies and choose to do some and pass on others. It's a regular occurance. We are launching a new trade show (AVN's Adult Novelty Expo), a new annual (AVN ID), a new gay monthly (GayVN) and we are expanding other businesses. I would welcome any busines opportunity, from Jason Hendeles or anyone else, if it make sense for AVN. That is called BEING IN BUSINESS."

Cheers. :thumbsup

Paul Fishbein Writes:

AVN President Paul Fishbein posts:

For those who trash us on the boards and speak without any knowledge of what's really going on (yes Mike South, you), here's the story. In the early days, at the encouragement of a couple of our biggest clients, we had meetings with Jason Hendeles concerning AVN's potential involvement with the .XXX business. We viewed it as a business opportunity. We sought the advice of many in the adult business, some of whom felt that the .XXX domains would "ghettoize" the adult business, while others felt there was a real opportunity.

However, we never made a deal with Jason and to date have no involvement in .XXX.

That last sentence speaks volumes, the truth is you SHOULD have had involvement and you should have seen it for the bad move that it is. Instead you chose to stick your head in the sand and sell us out by not doing anything. or did you do something?

From My Site: 07/27/2004 For all of you asking why .XXX is a bad idea...READ THIS:

.XXX Still Not Dead, And AVNOnline is Helping to Pimp It:

The key word here being pimp of course.

lets look at whose who in this battle:

First you Have ICMRegistry and their little used car salesman Jason Hendales, Jason's job is to garner support for the .XXX domain for ICMRegistry so that they can try to ramrod it through ICANN. The proposed price tag for .XXX domains 75.00/yr.

Second, You have knowledgeable adult webmasters, attorneys and lobbyists like myself, Jeffrey Douglas, J.D. Obenberger and Bill Lyon who are against this, for reasons I will spell out in a bit.

Third You have parties in the biz, who, out of ignorance or alterior motive or both would support this under the guise of....you guessed it....keeping the children safe. These include LFP, Vivid, AVN and some of the board of the Free Speech Cabal. Though AVN has been passive in it's support, it's editorials speak for themselves.

Take the recent issue of AVNOnline where they lay out the story noting that the Free Speech Coalition held a special meeting to discuss and vote on this. AVN reported that the members in attendance voted it in BUT the big bad wolf (Then Director of the FSC) Bill Lyon vetoed the vote and called on the board of directors to decide the issue. Now here is the FACT that changes the whole story that AVN conveniently left out.

The night of the vote ICMRegistry brought in a bunch of "Ringers", they paid the dues for them to join the FSC so that they could vote in favor of .XXX, thus guaranteeing that the measure would pass. Bill Lyon saw through this ruse and did the right thing.

They also conveniently left out the fact that the FSC had been BRIBED to pass the measure....reportedly to the tune of 8.00 per domain sold. That's a hefty chunk of change and was certainly enough to buy the votes of some of the FSC Board members with less integrity than Lyon. Lawrence Walters and Greg Picconelli were salivating at the idea too because passage is job security for them as you will soon see.

So when you come right down to it, it's all about the money. ICM Registry will make millions off of this and thus will go to great lengths to sell it, even if it means selling us out.

Now some of you might be thinking that this aint such a bad idea, you are wrong, here's why:

It doesn't "protect the children", kids dont get porn from responsible adult sites, they get it off of kazaa, bearshare, limewire, morpheus, IRC and others.

It does "Zone" adult into a cyber ghetto, they say that we won't be required to use it but ask yourself this: Does your state have seatbelt laws? Remember how they sold that? They said Oh we won't just pull you over and give you a ticket for not wearing it, we just want to enact it to protect you and your children, now "Click It Or Ticket Campaigns are rampant right? Just how long do you think it would take Ashcroft or someone of similar narrow mindedness to pass legislation "protecting the children" by forcing adult sites to use .XXX. Picconelli and Walters say no way they can't do that but I guarantee you these two hot shots aren't going to represent you for free to prove it. For them .XXX is money in the bank, fuck what's good for the industry.

How long would it take your city or state to demand that ISPs "filter out" the .XXX domain or lose permission to provide service to you? Specially if you live in, say Utah?

Starting to see the problems now? Ya I thought you might.

You see its all about the money, ICM Registry, Picconelli, Walters...these people could give a fuck because they are going to make money, even if only because adult webmasters will buy the .XXX domains to protect them from cybersquatting, at least that's what they are counting on.

Next time you hear AVN wanting to speak for the adult webmaster community, remember this people. You gonna be at Internext? Tell them to stop trying to sell you to the highest bidder.

That's the way I see it.

mike south responded to this on his site :

That last sentence speaks volumes, the truth is you SHOULD have had involvement and you should have seen it for the bad move that it is. Instead you chose to stick your head in the sand and sell us out by not doing anything. or did you do something?

I have to agree with him on this one

Mike also posted this from his archieves:

From My Site: 07/27/2004 For all of you asking why .XXX is a bad idea...READ THIS:

.XXX Still Not Dead, And AVNOnline is Helping to Pimp It:

The key word here being pimp of course.

lets look at whose who in this battle:

First you Have ICMRegistry and their little used car salesman Jason Hendales, Jason's job is to garner support for the .XXX domain for ICMRegistry so that they can try to ramrod it through ICANN. The proposed price tag for .XXX domains 75.00/yr.

Second, You have knowledgeable adult webmasters, attorneys and lobbyists like myself, Jeffrey Douglas, J.D. Obenberger and Bill Lyon who are against this, for reasons I will spell out in a bit.

Third You have parties in the biz, who, out of ignorance or alterior motive or both would support this under the guise of....you guessed it....keeping the children safe. These include LFP, Vivid, AVN and some of the board of the Free Speech Cabal. Though AVN has been passive in it's support, it's editorials speak for themselves.

Take the recent issue of AVNOnline where they lay out the story noting that the Free Speech Coalition held a special meeting to discuss and vote on this. AVN reported that the members in attendance voted it in BUT the big bad wolf (Then Director of the FSC) Bill Lyon vetoed the vote and called on the board of directors to decide the issue. Now here is the FACT that changes the whole story that AVN conveniently left out.

The night of the vote ICMRegistry brought in a bunch of "Ringers", they paid the dues for them to join the FSC so that they could vote in favor of .XXX, thus guaranteeing that the measure would pass. Bill Lyon saw through this ruse and did the right thing.

They also conveniently left out the fact that the FSC had been BRIBED to pass the measure....reportedly to the tune of 8.00 per domain sold. That's a hefty chunk of change and was certainly enough to buy the votes of some of the FSC Board members with less integrity than Lyon. Lawrence Walters and Greg Picconelli were salivating at the idea too because passage is job security for them as you will soon see.

So when you come right down to it, it's all about the money. ICM Registry will make millions off of this and thus will go to great lengths to sell it, even if it means selling us out.

Now some of you might be thinking that this aint such a bad idea, you are wrong, here's why:

It doesn't "protect the children", kids dont get porn from responsible adult sites, they get it off of kazaa, bearshare, limewire, morpheus, IRC and others.

It does "Zone" adult into a cyber ghetto, they say that we won't be required to use it but ask yourself this: Does your state have seatbelt laws? Remember how they sold that? They said Oh we won't just pull you over and give you a ticket for not wearing it, we just want to enact it to protect you and your children, now "Click It Or Ticket Campaigns are rampant right? Just how long do you think it would take Ashcroft or someone of similar narrow mindedness to pass legislation "protecting the children" by forcing adult sites to use .XXX. Picconelli and Walters say no way they can't do that but I guarantee you these two hot shots aren't going to represent you for free to prove it. For them .XXX is money in the bank, fuck what's good for the industry.

How long would it take your city or state to demand that ISPs "filter out" the .XXX domain or lose permission to provide service to you? Specially if you live in, say Utah?

Starting to see the problems now? Ya I thought you might.

You see its all about the money, ICM Registry, Picconelli, Walters...these people could give a fuck because they are going to make money, even if only because adult webmasters will buy the .XXX domains to protect them from cybersquatting, at least that's what they are counting on.

Next time you hear AVN wanting to speak for the adult webmaster community, remember this people. You gonna be at Internext? Tell them to stop trying to sell you to the highest bidder.

That's the way I see it.

:Oh crap :(

Bravo Mike
You hit the nail on the head with this-
I know for a fact that ICM paid webmasters FSC dues at that meetig-
How do I know?

I was recruited to bring people to the meeting -I belive it was $50 a pop they paid..

I must have been at a different meeting. I definately saw more Nay's than Yea's.

Yes it was 50 a pop, it was paid for me.

As far as Mr Fishbein stating
" I would welcome any busines opportunity, from Jason Hendeles or anyone else, if it make sense for AVN. That is called BEING IN BUSINESS.""

I guess that's why they chose to review and sell a booth for sexyoutdoorsports where women were being shot having sex in the blood of dead animals...what did AVN get out of that? OH i know, BAD PRESS.

Funny when I offered to sell YNOT to AVN 6 yrs ago before I ended up brokering it for a lot more money than we ever dreamt....They weren't interested.

They could have run away with the adult web back then-
They could have rallied all of us and made so much more money off of us..they were ignorant of the web back then-
And IMHO they still are.

It would have made plenty of business sense to acquire the web presence of YNOT - they simply do not understand the online biz- that's why all the waffling exists.

What on earth makes you think that AVN has the power (or inclination) to "sell" webmasters to the highest bidder?! AVN produces adult industry publications and events. It is not some higher power, and it is not a political lobbying organization like the FSC. The fact that AVN didn't take a stand on one side of the issue or the other is, in my opinion, more testament to the organization's integrity than NOT (They COULD have made money but chose not to). Mike and Tony, I'm not saying I disagree with your stand on this but at that time, and still today, our industry was and is divided on .xxx . In my opinion, AVN has a responsibility to write the news, not create it. Any power it has can and is used to actively support organizations like the FSC. However you ascribe far more direct political power and responsibility on AVN than is warranted.

To believe the FSC is to believe AVN

If you look at FSC's website in great detail you'll see where every survey or statistic is dervied from AVN's numbers

I think we have already proven AVN to be liars- so in my humble opinion, the FSC is being given incorrect information, and that is the most dangerous part of this entire problem- the dissemination of bad information-

You see it on this chatboard, you see it in the magazines for our industry, and you see it with the attorneys and head of these companies.

Bad information is what will kill this industry- not .XXX and 2257
Uneducated webmasters making uneducated decisions

The way I see AVN can come off as not sounding like a greedy sell out to the industry, is while at the same time pushing this new .xxx to 'keep the kids safe' angle which I don't think anyone would argue is a bad thing, then ALSO push a 'standard' filter system, say like ICRA or something that can have the same effect if parents/people wanted to filter out those participating .com's that have some adult content on them...

pushing a 60 or 75 dollar a wack .xxx to line their pockets is crap no matter how you slice it, the same shit can be done with a standardized filter that ALREADY EXISTS....


push that why don't ya if you REALLY care so much about cleaning up the InterWeb...


oh why wouldn't you do that as your PRIMARY PUSH? ooo yeh that's right, it's more about caring for your pocket than the good or bad you're doing to free speach, keeping the internet clean or anything of that sort....quit blowing smoke already


.

This is our "V" Chip" for the entire online adult biz..

:Oh crap :Oh crap

i own a few Very Premium .xxx domains, and have been awaiting for this day

Aly Wrote:
What on earth makes you think that AVN has the power (or inclination) to "sell" webmasters to the highest bidder?! AVN produces adult industry publications and events. It is not some higher power, and it is not a political lobbying organization like the FSC. The fact that AVN didn't take a stand on one side of the issue or the other is, in my opinion, more testament to the organization's integrity than NOT (They COULD have made money but chose not to). Mike and Tony, I'm not saying I disagree with your stand on this but at that time, and still today, our industry was and is divided on .xxx . In my opinion, AVN has a responsibility to write the news, not create it. Any power it has can and is used to actively support organizations like the FSC. However you ascribe far more direct political power and responsibility on AVN than is warranted.

Look Aly don't try to bullshit me or anyone else with this nonsense. Everyone knows that AVN takes a stand when it is profitable in some way for them to do so. That is well documented.

What AVN did in this case was to let this proceed to begin with, saying that the industry is split on this is a cop out...its about split as much as it was split n sexyoutdoorsports.

My biggest problem isnt that you guys passively supported it..my problem is you dont have the fucking balls to stand up and admit it.

No you don't. No one can register them yet.

Goddamn, I wish our business talks went through back in the day, it would have been a pleasure working with you! By far, you are one of the most eloquent advocate for our cause.

Couple with the sledgehamer style Kevin has, and some very hard questions are being asked that no one is answering.

Thanks Anthony

Im available for my opinions and whatever anytime.

I love this biz and the people in it and I cant sit back and let someone fuck us over for a buck...it makes me crazy

They are not answering them because they are lying scumbags
PERIOD.

Until they openly admit that they are just that, I think I am going to have a field day exposing all of their lies and the hypocrisy behind this organization-

Funny I speak out against the FSC the other day and what happens?
I get a ton of emails to "silence" me Funny being that the organization I was talking about was called FREE SPEECH COALITION.

I offered my help- I sent XXXJAY my list of contacts I felt would be worthy, he agress. I got emails from Tom Hymes saying he'd call me two days ago- still haven't made contact.

I am not ripping Tom , I know he is busy...so when you get the time Tom call me I really would like to help.

I just think this business has had enough with all the bullshit already.

People- this board does more good for this business than AVN or the FSC will ever do-
How you ask?

When the inofrmation that gets posted here makes people think or question things- it's serving a purpose-

What purpose does AVN have?

TO TAKE WEBMASTERS MONEY-
We have it, they want it.

When they finally realize that they can no longer sell ads or tradeshow booths because their stance forced people to get out of the business then they'll notice-

How come the publishers of AVN don't come here and address the situation?

Oh I know like Paul said, if Mike wants to continue his discussion he has to do it on the Blog Site that AVN has

Is that to show their advertisers they get traffic?
It's fucking laughable and despicable at the same time..

from:


http://www.icann.org/tlds/stld-apps-19mar04/xxx.htm

"...
3. ICM and IFFOR intend to fully comply with the Schedule of Reserved Names set
forth in Attachment 11 of the base sponsored registry agreement as well as
reserve from registration all country names in accordance with ICANN Resolution
01-92., ICM and IFFOR also intend to reserve from registration a limited number
of domain names in accordance with existing registry agreements for business
development. This list has not been formulated at this time.

..."


reserve for business development?


:321GFY

Oh and I love this industry too, I have made a great living and met wonderful people in the 8 yrs I have been in it-

I am not ready to watch a bunch of stupid people ruin it - because of hidden agendas

I don't want to go back to working in a fucking cubicle at AT&T and listen to my alcoholic sales mgr brag to me about the homerun his 8 th grader hit at last night softball game..I don't wanna be another Joe Blow.

I want to help thi sbusiness thrive , even if many can't handle the truth I'll be here to post it.

If anyone thinks for a minute they can fart around me and I won't smell it- they are wrong.

My olfactory lobes work overtime

The battles you are picking are more likely to hurt this industry when you are attempting to damage the reputation of organizations you have a personal issue with. Attacking the FSC when it is ramping up a battle to fight for your ability to stay in business is irresponsible at best. Again, AVN is not set to profit from .xxx domains but is a proud and active supporter of the FSC because they have an agenda of defending the First Amendment and keeping us all in business... and know when to pick their battles, which you clearly do not.