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Waveu6410 09-10-2006 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarah_webinc
Regardless of the poltics, it just strikes me as odd that there is any need for a fictional 'docudrama' about 911. I would think the real stories are dramatic enough with out having to make more things up.

I agree, with the scope of 9/11 all that is needed is a ONE documentry. Included would be true accounts from survivors and plenty of stories of the people who died that day.

smashface 09-10-2006 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempest
5 years after the fact, what good does it do to "blame" Clinton... Peoples actions often look stupid in the light of hindsite. So seriously.. why now?

Whenever something goes wrong, the right wing looks to the past and begins to blame Clinton. This is another example.

And as others have said, many people - like the 40+% of the American public which still believes that Saddam Hussein was tied to Al Quaida, will believe that what they see tonight is real. Even though many of the people involved have already denounced the "facts" posed in this movie.

mardigras 09-10-2006 07:11 PM

I find it interesting how they are showing it... tonight is 3 hours commercial free... Tomorrow they will play 1 hour of the movie, cut to George Bush live for 20 minutes, then conclude with the remaining 37 minutes of the movie.

xclusive 09-10-2006 07:16 PM

If this bullshit had to do with Bush fucking things up and the facts not being right the republicans would be asking it to be pulled as well. This is an example of why this country will never come together like we should. Way to many people see it as a democrat or republican thing. We should work together as Americans and ask for the truth no matter who is in office. They are there to serve us. I love my country and both republicans and democrats are fucking it up. We need people in power that want to do what is right for the people not thier oil buddies or their other million special interest groups. But we all know that will never happen and I think that's sad.

kane 09-10-2006 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edgeprod
And it came out -- lies and all.

Let the ABC thing have the same courtesy -- at least it's BASED on truth, and not some conspiracy bullshit.

I never argued whether or not Moore's movie was factually accurate or not. You said Moore got a pass and I simply pointed out that that was not the case.

As for ABC airing it, I support free speech and if they feel that airing this movie is exercising their freedoms of speech than I think they should go ahead and do it. There is a difference though. If you wanted to see Moore's movie you had to buy a ticket and go to the theatre or buy/rent it on DVD. with this movie anyone with a TV and an antenna can watch it so the audience may be much larger and the damage done much greater.

I would hope if ABC doesn't edit the movie and fix the problems that they will air a disclaimer before/during it to say that some things were fictionalized.

tony286 09-10-2006 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mardigras
I find it interesting how they are showing it... tonight is 3 hours commercial free... Tomorrow they will play 1 hour of the movie, cut to George Bush live for 20 minutes, then conclude with the remaining 37 minutes of the movie.

wait the media is all liberal lol Clinton is old history what he did or didnt do, its been 5 yrs since 911 and bin laden is still running around.How does that not piss off the right wing sheep?????????? This man was responsible for the death of 3000 americans and not the number 1 priority of this administration.

smashface 09-10-2006 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kane
I would hope if ABC doesn't edit the movie and fix the problems that they will air a disclaimer before/during it to say that some things were fictionalized.

I agree with you about free speech but they have been given a tremondous resource - radio spectrum - and were once required to air opposing views and educational/worthy programming. Granted that with cable the spectrum isnt as valuable but damn if they give it up willingly.

The networks don't do enough to sponsor and promote responsible political discourse.

And as to the disclaimer, it will be in 6px type and be onscreen for about 12 frames. :1orglaugh

MetaMan 09-10-2006 08:08 PM

uhh it is not supposed to be factual you will have stupid people like you calling it real after it has aired.

it does no one any good by airing something that will only create mass confusion and false info.

ronbotx 09-10-2006 08:13 PM

"Are there any men left in Washington, or are they all cowards?"......

That quote from the movie sums up the anti-terrorism policy of the Clinton administration. Multiple chances to take out Bin-Laden, too weak and indecisve to follow thru...

HAPPYPEEKERS 09-10-2006 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyHalbucks
Clinton is the worst piece of shit to ever occupy the White House.

His legacy reaks.


:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

yes.. bush is much much better lololol

tony286 09-10-2006 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronbotx
"Are there any men left in Washington, or are they all cowards?"......

That quote from the movie sums up the anti-terrorism policy of the Clinton administration. Multiple chances to take out Bin-Laden, too weak and indecisve to follow thru...

thats not so at all , its fiction remember thats why its called a docudrama

notabook 09-10-2006 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronbotx
"Are there any men left in Washington, or are they all cowards?"......

That quote from the movie sums up the anti-terrorism policy of the Clinton administration. Multiple chances to take out Bin-Laden, too weak and indecisve to follow thru...

God damn, reading ?Multiple chances to take out Bin-Laden, too weak and indecisve to follow thru...? from your post, I thought you got Clinton confused with Bush for a second lol. Seems both the Clinton and Bush administration were soft when it came to Bin Laden eh? =)

kane 09-10-2006 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smashface
I agree with you about free speech but they have been given a tremondous resource - radio spectrum - and were once required to air opposing views and educational/worthy programming. Granted that with cable the spectrum isnt as valuable but damn if they give it up willingly.

The networks don't do enough to sponsor and promote responsible political discourse.

And as to the disclaimer, it will be in 6px type and be onscreen for about 12 frames. :1orglaugh

I was watching football and switched over just to see if they would have a disclaimer of sorts. Much to my surprise they had a full screen statement and actually read it aloud explaining that this was not a documentry and it was a dramatization and that some events had been fictionalized. At least they did that. It will be interesting to see what goes on tomorrow with the responses to it.

RF_Erick 09-10-2006 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarah_webinc
Regardless of the poltics, it just strikes me as odd that there is any need for a fictional 'docudrama' about 911. I would think the real stories are dramatic enough with out having to make more things up.

It's almost election time!:thumbsup

stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dvae
The legacy is set in history he can't change what is.
source:http://prorev.com/legacy.htm
See what I mean:

RECORDS SET
- The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
- Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates*
- Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
- Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
- Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
- First president sued for sexual harassment.
- First president accused of rape.
- First first lady to come under criminal investigation
- Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
- First president to establish a legal defense fund.
- First president to be held in contempt of court
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad
- First president disbarred from the US Supreme Court and a state court

OTHER MATTERS INVESTIGATED BY SPECIAL PROSECUTORS
AND CONGRESS
OR REPORTED IN THE MEDIA

Bank and mail fraud
violations of campaign finance laws
illegal foreign campaign funding
improper exports of sensitive technology
physical violence and threats of violence
solicitation of perjury
intimidation of witnesses
bribery of witnesses
attempted intimidation of prosecutors
perjury before congressional committees
lying in statements to federal investigators and regulatory officials
flight of witnesses
obstruction of justice
bribery of cabinet members
real estate fraud
tax fraud
drug trafficking
failure to investigate drug trafficking
bribery of state officials
use of state police for personal purposes
exchange of promotions or benefits for sexual favors
using state police to provide false court testimony
laundering of drug money through a state agency
false reports by medical examiners and others investigating suspicious deaths
the firing of the RTC and FBI director when these agencies were investigating Clinton and his associates
failure to conduct autopsies in suspicious deaths
providing jobs in return for silence by witnesses
drug abuse
improper acquisition and use of 900 FBI files
improper futures trading
murder
sexual abuse of employees
false testimony before a federal judge
shredding of documents
withholding and concealment of subpoenaed documents
fabricated charges against (and improper firing of) White House employees
inviting drug traffickers
foreign agents and participants in organized crime to the White House.

.

Lies all lies haha... Or so Im sure Ill read further down on this thread. :winkwink:

ronbotx 09-10-2006 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony404
thats not so at all , its fiction remember thats why its called a docudrama

I don't know if you can read, since your posts indicate you're uniformed, but try these two and perhaps you'll get a clue.

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/...CLZZZZZZZ_.jpg


http://images.amazon.com/images/P/03...CLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

MaddCaz 09-10-2006 08:47 PM

since when was clinton the bad dyde?

tony286 09-10-2006 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronbotx
I don't know if you can read, since your posts indicate you're uniformed, but try these two and perhaps you'll get a clue.

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/...CLZZZZZZZ_.jpg


http://images.amazon.com/images/P/03...CLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

READ THE 9-11 COMMISSION REPORT! In it it clearly states A) Never at any time did the CIA have Bin Laden surrounded in a house or anywhere else for that matter, B) The CIA had ?Standing orders? from President Clinton to ?Kill Bin Laden?, and ?Not to bother to call us about it, JUST DO IT?.

tony286 09-10-2006 09:02 PM

the 9-11 Commission found that Clinton’s actions were not diverted by the sex scandal. In fact, he drew much criticism from the right about “Wagging the Dog” in the only attempt to kill Osama.

stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony404
the 9-11 Commission found that Clinton?s actions were not diverted by the sex scandal. In fact, he drew much criticism from the right about ?Wagging the Dog? in the only attempt to kill Osama.

He blew up some tents and an asprin factory. One of which was the day before the star investigation report was coming out. Hmmmmm geee ya. Doesnt do shit about it for years and the day before he fires off a couple million dollar missles at nothing. RIGHT!! No wagging there. BAHHHH ! lol

tony286 09-10-2006 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stickyfingerz
He blew up some tents and an asprin factory. One of which was the day before the star investigation report was coming out. Hmmmmm geee ya. Doesnt do shit about it for years and the day before he fires off a couple million dollar missles at nothing. RIGHT!! No wagging there. BAHHHH ! lol

THats so not true.Lets see your beloved W sent thousands to their death for a lie. How about the august report bin laden to attack us with airplanes? How about bin laden is still loose? Come tell me the bullshit spin.lol

notabook 09-10-2006 09:14 PM

This is something interesting, seems there is a religious connection to the ABC movie. Very interesting indeed:

The Path to 9/11 is a movie rife with historical inaccuracies that blames President Clinton while heaping praise on President Bush. The docudrama was written by avowed conservative Cyrus Nowrasteh, who once spoke on a panel entitled: ?Rebels With A Cause: How Conservatives Can Lead Hollywood?s Next Paradigm Shift.? But the ideological slant behind this movie goes far deeper than Nowrasteh. Research conducted by a reader at Democratic Underground has revealed that the Path to 9/11 was the result of a project hatched out by a small group of evangelical activists who sought to ?transform Hollywood from the inside out.? Here is what we know:

Cunningham Linked To YWAM. David Cunningham was contracted by ABC to direct Path to 9/11. Cunningham is the son of Loren and Darlene Cunningham, the founders of Youth With a Mission (YWAM), a Christian evangelical group that actively tries to get ?youth into short-term mission work and to give them opportunities to reach out in Jesus? name.?
YWAM Sponsored the Film Institute To Change Hollywood. YWAM created an ?auxillary? group called the Film Institute, which was explicitly aimed at achieving a Godly transformation and revolution TO and THROUGH the Film and Television industry.?

Film Institute Began the ?Untitled History Project.? The Film Institute?s first project was simply referred to as the ?Untitled History Project? (UHP). In July 2005, Fox News reported that filming had begun on an ABC miniseries about 9/11 that ABC officials and producers were referring to it as the ?Untitled History Project.? A production company entitled ?UHP Productions,? which was co-founded with Disney began filming Path to 9/11 in late 2005.

UHP Became Path to 9/11. UHP Productions has only produced one movie. Harvey Keitel, who stars as FBI special agent John O?Neill in the movie, said that when he received the original script, ?it said ABC History Project.?


As Chewbacca would say? WrrrRRaaaaAAAAAaaaaarr

Compdoctor 09-10-2006 09:16 PM

What your really not thinking about, is the fact that this was aired without comericals, on ABC. Did I say there were no comericals?

stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony404
THats so not true.Lets see your beloved W sent thousands to their death for a lie. How about the august report bin laden to attack us with airplanes? How about bin laden is still loose? Come tell me the bullshit spin.lol

You're right it wasnt the next day it was 20 days later


Quote:

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/09/12/binladen.profile/

on August 20, 1998, President Clinton ordered cruise missile attacks against suspected terrorist training camps in Afghanistan and a pharmaceutical plant in Khartoum, Sudan.

http://www.npr.org/news/national/starrspecial.html

On Wednesday, September 9, 1998 Independent Counsel Kenneth Starr delivered a 445-page report to Congress alleging 11 impeachable offenses by President Clinton. Here you can find NPR News coverage and the actual documents. The reports are graphic and we urge you to exercise caution when reading, listening or watching them.
HOWEVER what I was thinking of is it was the DAY AFTER THIS!

Quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/August_1998

August 19 - Monica Lewinsky scandal: U.S. President Bill Clinton admits in taped testimony that he had an "improper physical relationship" with White House intern Monica Lewinsky. He also admits before the nation that he "misled people" about his relationship.
Nope no wagging the dog there to shake the stank off himself nahh.


And this below is just a bit of irony I had to post.



Quote:

Clinton Apology
President Clinton apologized to Monica Lewinsky, her family and the American people during a National Prayer Breakfast on Friday, Sept. 11.

Lev 09-10-2006 09:53 PM

Bush is an idiot

https://youtube.com/results?searc...&search=Search

tony286 09-10-2006 09:54 PM

what about bin laden still being loose thats all history W is president now and bin laden is loose.

stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony404
what about bin laden still being loose thats all history W is president now and bin laden is loose.

Ya and his organization is getting trampled. But does this mean you admit to Clinton wagging the dog now? Given the dates do you not even question the motives?

tony286 09-10-2006 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stickyfingerz
Ya and his organization is getting trampled. But does this mean you admit to Clinton wagging the dog now? Given the dates do you not even question the motives?

no I dont but that is history bin laden did this to our country and he is still free. Maybe Clinton could of got him if the right wasnt crying missles for monica but thats history lets talk about today. He is loose, we were promised dead or alive, he hasnt been caught.

stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony404
no I dont but that is history bin laden did this to our country and he is still free. Maybe Clinton could of got him if the right wasnt crying missles for monica but thats history lets talk about today. He is loose, we were promised dead or alive, he hasnt been caught.

Well actually what Bin Laden did is history too. So we should just let it go by your thinking.

And btw Clinton had many an opportunity to get Bin Laden prior to Monicagate. He was offered up cuffed and ready to go and he refused. This was after the cole bombings. The FEDERAL GOVERMENTS proceedings for going after Clinton for LYING UNDER OATH IN A FEDERAL COURTROOM had nothing to do with stopping him from getting Bin Laden. Amazing how much the liberal media has twisted history into what you folks belive to be truth now. And if you cannot see how obvious the intentions for the missle strike were then I cant help you.

tony286 09-10-2006 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stickyfingerz
Well actually what Bin Laden did is history too. So we should just let it go by your thinking.

And btw Clinton had many an opportunity to get Bin Laden prior to Monicagate. He was offered up cuffed and ready to go and he refused. This was after the cole bombings. The FEDERAL GOVERMENTS proceedings for going after Clinton for LYING UNDER OATH IN A FEDERAL COURTROOM had nothing to do with stopping him from getting Bin Laden. Amazing how much the liberal media has twisted history into what you folks belive to be truth now. And if you cannot see how obvious the intentions for the missle strike were then I cant help you.

liberal media ABc gave this docudrama to Rush and not Clinton pleaser wake the fuck up. Also the 911 commission found he was never given bin laden on a silver platter that was right wing bullshit. Whats truly amazing to you none of this is bush's fault and he is doing just fine by you. Very scary

smashface 09-10-2006 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stickyfingerz
He blew up some tents and an asprin factory. One of which was the day before the star investigation report was coming out. Hmmmmm geee ya. Doesnt do shit about it for years and the day before he fires off a couple million dollar missles at nothing. RIGHT!! No wagging there. BAHHHH ! lol

At what time did stop being the President? Was he just supposed to sit back and not try to seek retribution for the attack on the embassies?

His duty is to the American people, just like President Bush, not the Republican Party and its right wing.

TheSenator 09-10-2006 11:09 PM

9/11 HAPPENED ON BUSH'S WATCH PERIOD.

Takes some responsiblity you fucking idiots!


Even life long Republicans can see the mistakes of the BUSH administration on the "War on Terror".

Saddam did not plan 9/11 you dumb shits, it was OSAMA.

stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony404
liberal media ABc gave this docudrama to Rush and not Clinton pleaser wake the fuck up. Also the 911 commission found he was never given bin laden on a silver platter that was right wing bullshit. Whats truly amazing to you none of this is bush's fault and he is doing just fine by you. Very scary

Yes yet Clinton admits he could of got him himself. ......

Its on audio tape.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Clinton
They released him. At the time, 1996, he had committed no crime against America so I did not bring him here because we had no basis on which to hold him, though we knew he wanted to commit crimes against America.


stickyfingerz 09-10-2006 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smashface
At what time did stop being the President? Was he just supposed to sit back and not try to seek retribution for the attack on the embassies?

His duty is to the American people, just like President Bush, not the Republican Party and its right wing.

Try to keep up mmmkay?

Webby 09-11-2006 12:02 AM

Sure are some real sicko assholes in the US - awesome demonstration of hate at it's best.

They collect like flies to a fucking flypaper - wish they'd get stuck there :1orglaugh

pocketkangaroo 09-11-2006 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stickyfingerz
Ya and his organization is getting trampled. But does this mean you admit to Clinton wagging the dog now? Given the dates do you not even question the motives?

Well global terrorism is on the rise. Not sure how "trampling" his organization equates to more terrorism.

american pervert 09-11-2006 12:27 AM

watch this video- press for truth

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...ress+for+truth

Damian_Maxcash 09-11-2006 12:36 AM

There was nothing that damning of Clinton - at least in the 1st episode.

In hindsight of course lots of things could have been done to stop 9/11 - but in the real world thats not how it works.

FetishTom 09-11-2006 12:56 AM

As a non American I am kind of curious if Americans ever debate serious issues outside of the Republican/Democrat divide. Judging by this thread apparently not.

The Clinton/bin Laden issue is like the Ho Chi Min issue in the 1940's where he was assisted by and worked for the CIA or the Taliban movement in the 1980's which was also partly funded and assisted by the Americans.

In short it was judged to be the correct decision at the time.

Clinton had no grounds for 'getting' bin Laden as no crime had been committed against America or American interests and the seeds of Al Qaeda were cultivated in part with American aid back in the 1980's prior to Clinton's presidency.

Trying to get Clinton on this is absurd and pointless save for trying to score points in a Republican/Democrat slanging match. Frankly if the gist of the Republican argument is that this is all Clinton's fault then quite clearly the current administration must be in bigger trouble on this issue then we realise.


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