so what you're saying is that its ok to steal as long as its not too much ?
or not from your pocket.

way to go

This is what I would think is common logic.

BTW, I love your traffic. No harm no foul in this one. I respectfully agree to disagree.

:)

Do you know any AFF affiliates that are noticing decreased paychecks? I don't.

Not at all. If they are stealing from me then why are they still converting so well for me?

Answer that simple question.

and does that makes it ok ?

If you're promoting AFF, then your sales don't get stolen by AFF anymore since they apparently fixed the cookie thing. So as long as their poping AFF over your AFF stuff, you'll get the sale.

But if you try something else, then they could be effecting your conversions with that other program due to hijacking some of your traffic.

In other words.. If YOU ADVERTISE 100% AFF/Cams and absolutely nothing else, then carry on.

Anything else you may advertise (like competing cam/dating sites), well then you may be losing traffic/sales to aff/cams.

So if they're not stealing from you its ok ?

It is affecting you directly... From what I understand 0,5 to 2 % of your sales were stolen for you directly by AFF (using Zango as a tool to kinda shave).

I might be wrong but from the threads I read they replaced affiliate cookies by their own using that method.

But I can agree that using aFF or not is your own decision and the money that come in at the end of the day is what matters. Zango aren't gonna be there in a year or two from now but AFF will be.

P.S. With the payouts they are giving to affiliates, it's just normal that they have to use such tactics to turn in a profit.

For the record, I am not "in bed" with aff/cams. I also promote Pussy Cash and Dating Gold. I suggest others do the same. Try them all.

I have so many sites that "they" couldn't possibly know everything that I run.

I am not denying that this is going on, but I do think it's being blown out of proportion in terms of aff/cams.

Click the "free porn" link in my sig. What cams and dating sponsors have the fat banners? Not aff/cams at the moment.

I do still promote their properties, however, and I still get a check from them twice a month like clockwork. Sometimes big, sometimes small, but no complaints.

fiddy takes

Bump for Sleazy and his views

No. See the post prior to this. They have no way of knowing every site I run. I promote other dating and cam sponsors.

because it's a small shave across thousands of webmasters. Zango toolbar is still only a small percentage of browsers. You are losing sales, it's just too small for you to notice the impact.

Zango are the real villains here, but AFF supporting them certainly isn't a good look imo.

I'm sticking with AFF as one of my main sponsors. A person recommended promoting AFF to me a number of years ago and it was very good advice.

:winkwink:

That wasn't the point.
First of all they can steal from you without knowing your other sites
they just bid on keywords and if it happens to be on your site the surfer
will get a popup with their landing page.

However, the question was if its ok for aff (and other sponsors) to use zango
even if it doesn't affects your bottom line.

They don't have to know your sites. They buy "keywords".. the Zango toolbar installed in the surfers browser triggers the popup depending on things like the keyword being in the domain the surfer goes to. So, for example, if you have a domain with "cam" or "cams" in it, then the aff/cams popups may be coming up over your stuff.

The only way for you to truly know how it's effecting you is to install the toolbar yourself and then start visiting your sites and clicking your links. You may be surprised.

Buisness is buisness.
Well put.

My point was that if they don't know of my other sites they must be stealing. The shit would pop up. I'm sure it does. It sucks.

It is not okay for anyone to use Zango, IMO. Will I cut off my nose to spite my face? No.

As for why everyone is on the attack against AFF specifically is beyond me. Why not attack them all? Is it because they are a huge target?

Every site I promote is done in a legitimate way on my end. If you are implying that I am stealing by having links to AFF, you've lost it. This is the internet, remember?

Been there, done that. An old P3 850 laptop Dell running XP on dialup (to eliminate the possibility that it's a source IP thing as well).

Yes, I'm being jacked. Can I stop it? No. Unless I can convince tens of thousands of other webmaster to stop promoting AFF. That would be a tough sell considering I'm not going to stop.

They convert.

Where do you come with this shit ?
Just because this is internet doesn't mean things shouldn't be taken seriously.
Where the heck did you see me mentioning anything about you stealing by using aff ?

I asked you a simple question of wether you think its ok for some sponsors to use zango.

Answering that is up to you if you continue to promote them or not.

As to why aff is the target, its probably because they're the biggest
and probably, unlike some other wannabe sponsors, the affiliates expected
more from a company such as aff ?

Actually in business it's not how much you make, it's how long you can make it .... shitty businesses practices is very short sighted.

That's hillarious.. "I'll continue to put money in the pocket of those stealing from me as long as they keep sending me some pennies."

Don't worry about it.. Some of us will continue to fight your battle for you since you don't have a spine.

My apologies for for missing your point.

I do not think it's okay for sponsors to use Zango, but what is my choice? Drop AFF on principle?

You aren't seeing the bigger picture. If they are stealing from me and still convert better than anyone else, what do you suggest? This is starting to look like a smoke and mirrors attack.

Again, if they are stealing from me on some incredible level then why do I still get the credit for signups?

Very true. I've only been promoting them since the late 90s. Very short-sighted indeed.

You don't seem to understand the issue.. Perhaps the reason they convert better than the competitors you're trying is because they're poping up their AFF ads against the competitors your promoting and taking those sales from you and not giving you credit for that AFF sale.

I told you why you're still getting your AFF signups. They fixed the issue where they had been stealing sales and now they're not. i.e. what they're doing is not going to affect your AFF sales anymore. But it WILL affect your sales to other programs.

bottom line, is they're shaving you. Obviously not enough to make a big different so you're happy to live with it, and of course it's not just AFF.

I think it's a mistake to focus on the sponsors because Zango is the source of the problem. We need to treat the cause of the disease not the symptoms of it.

wonderful narrow minded crap

This is a WM and sponsor board so that's all one would see.. Who's to say it's the only thing going on? It's not. But the sponsors can stop doing what they're doing a lot faster then it will take to deal with Zango.

How would you feel if you owned a hardware store, you worked years building up your clientele and reputation, you spend money advertising it - when your customers are in your store and checking out a product out of nowhere an interloper representing your competition jumps into his face and tells him there's another product, it's better and it's cheaper and he'll drive him over to
the competition? I guarantee you that anybody would kick the shit out of the interloper. On the Internet you have no way of doing anything about it - you are powerless - you have to stand there and watch your customers be taken away right out of your store.

As time goes by and this dirty business tactic gets more popular then you really will have people forced into doing the same thing or they will lose their business completely.

Right now Zango hasn't penetrated far enough to hurt anybody's bottom line substantially - when there are 10 Zango's out there it will. People right now are just outraged about the principal of the thing and scared of what happens when the problem grows larger and I don't see any reason why it won't get larger when you have companies like AFF making it a very profitable business for Zango.

Zango have many customers we can't possibly hope to shut them all down one by one.

that wouldn't be so bad.

But its your choice.
I've made mine based on my beliefs and you do yours based on yours.
Its not like anyone is pointing a gun at you to drop them.

Okay. I really need to get to bed, so digest this.

Visit my main site (in my sig). I promote some AFF properties and have some fat banners for Pussy Cash. Serious real estate on my site...go look. Flash banner on the left and a huge one on the bottom. Those went up long before this thread.

So, are they converting or not converting? Is my site exempt from the Zango effect because I have AFF links up? If so, then they will convert, right?

After all, there will be no pop-ups for AFF when you hit Spasmodium if your theory is correct.

I hate Zango as much as the next guy, but let's target Zango.

NO fucking doubt

this shit would only ever happen in adult.


lol gotta love it

I think you need to install Zango on your computer and surf your sites to understand the problem.

And the best way to target Zango is to stop the feeders.
:2 cents:

Install Zango... Put a banner for a cam program on your site with a domain that contains "cam" in it like webcams.com etc. Click on that banner from your site like a surfer would and watch AFF/Cams popup over the site you were trying to get a sale for. Someone posted a screenshot of that exact situation earlier in the week.

You have to think in terms of how Zango can trigger the popups based on the keywords being bought. If YOU have a domain with the keywords in it, Zango will pop an ad over your site thus siphonnig some traffic away from your site. If the surfer clicks on one of your ads to go to a domain that has the keywords in it, Zango will pop an ad and thus hijack some potential sales.

You're not understanding how it works.

Let's be honest. You're not going to do anything. You're not going to punish AFF/Cams for stealing your traffic/sales and you're not going to go after Zango. And you'd rather we not keep bringing it up as it would be a constant reminder that you won't stand up for yourself.

Self fullfilling prophecy when you do nothing...

um.. see http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=673921

You made your statement about applying pressure to companies like AFF/Cams and not Zango. Going after Zango will take time. AFF/Cams and the other like them can turn off their campaign in minutes. Both can be done, but not doing one will ensure it fails. Thus my reply is still correct.