K.. you have mine.. can my account be updated please.

This is seriously the dumbest thread i've seen in a long time.

Virtually every affiliate who makes money with us has *already* sent proof that the people receiving payment are who they say they are. It's a no brainer, keep the program filled only with honest webmasters and you are now part of a program that can truly maximize *real* joins and compensate you for them.

We aren't storing this info. We just verify and then post it on usenet ;-)

If you don't like our policy then don't sign up, or don't send traffic.

We don't want to do business with people who aren't willing to abide by our policies. These aren't extreme policies, you can sign up, send traffic, and verify your identity 1 day, 2 weeks, or 3 months later, we don't care.

If you want to send traffic but arent comfortable with our written policies then just hit us up and we'll figure out another way to verify who you are.

Just like all the whiners in this thread say "fuck it i'll send my traffic elsewhere...."... so do the scammers.. scammers would rather send to a program that blindly pays with no verification of any kind.

Hit me up so I can check your acount to fix this

If it is immediately write all the info down from the conversation - and then find yourself a small claims lawyer - its against the law to ask for an ID to use a CC :)

Not everyone has a scanner and a lot of webmasters won't want to deal with this. First rule of business don't try to control your customers and partners. The more complicated you make it for a webmaster to sign up the less money you are going to make. Sure you will still get good webmasters that like your program but the hundreds of smaller webmasters that send a few sales a week will pass you by and that's thousands in lost sales. I'm not going out of my way to send a copy of my ID to anybody, fuck that. Why do something that no one else in the industry is doing? Most people don't even like to give out their SSN number.

sounds like a deal. I'll send mine tomorrow. Would have done it sooner, but my scanner was buried.

Anyway, I don't know what all the drama is about. If you live in the US you have to give a sponsor your name, address and social security number when you sign up. Most programs make you fill out a W2 as well. If they want to steal your identity that is more than enough info right there to do a pretty damn good job. I had mine stolen by someone that ran up 60K in bills and all they had was my name and a blank check. They were able to use that info to learn everything they could want to know about me. Wiseman having a scan my ugly mug on my drivers license isn't that big of deal in light of the info on me they already have.

The thing is... you're just WRONG... most of our smaller webmasters have already sent us their info.

The people who arent sent their info are the ones who are either LAZY, PARANOID, OR SCAMMERS

Real business people know the value of just simply knowing who you are dealing with.

I happen to agree with you and perhaps looked in the wrong place on your site for your info. All I could find was an address in Texas on your 2257 page (do you really have no hardcore content more recent that June 2005?), so I looked on WHOIS:

Domain name: quickbucks.com

Registrant Contact:
Whois Privacy Protection Service, Inc.
...
PMB 368, 14150 NE 20th St - F1
C/O quickbucks.com
Bellevue, WA 98007
US

Presumably you are willing to provide "real business people" with names, addresses, phone numbers, etc for the principals in your operation?

Why do you have to attack people like that? Just state your policy and let it be already. This thread gets more disturbing everytime I read it. You keep talking about "real business people", well real business people dont post things like what you just said on a public message board. Let it go already. :2 cents:

gotta agree with you here, iwent out of my way to make it clear i thought this was a good idea just poorly insituted..


Hey wiseman.. instead of reapeating your promo's in huge font why not just ease our minds and explain it a bit better.. You catch more flies with honey than insulting people.:2 cents: I'm fully ready to support you guys with this as long as you guys are a bit more clear

you stated above the id's are not stored , just looked and destroyed. How does this prevent fraud ?

verify my shit i emailed my id a week ago.

get your lemmings to work!

filling out a w9 and have it verified by a cpa is good enough. I applaud quick for doing what they can to mitigate tax dodgers. What this shows is that they really are paying out alot and have been advised by someone who knows the tax game a little better than the gfy accountants. Many programs have to pass the liability of tax payments to those they pay off themselves and on to the affiliate just like any other job. Everyone has to pay taxes. Thats rule #1
Duke

Nastydollars, Topbucks, and Bangbros do about 5 trillion more signups per day than quickbucks and they dont ask for drivers licenses or passports. That's just ridiculous.

heh yeah .. just dont send your bank password with the passport :)

Reasonable sentiments, but...

1. There is no onus on those asking for a W9 to verify the information on it. It is a criminal offense punishable by fines and/or jail to provide false information on a W9, which - wrongly or rightly - is felt to be adequate protection for the IRS.

2. Any operator wishing to follow the tax code properly should also be asking non-US payees to complete a W8.

3. Failure to provide the required forms should only trigger backup withholding tax: there is no provision in law for paying nothing.

So this is not about making sure everyone is paying their taxes. Fair enough, people can understand QB wanting to protect itself against fraud. But is the faxing or emailing of documents the least intrusive way, or even a reasonable way to acheive such protection for them.

Someone being paid by wire or check is already leaving a trail, as to a less direct extent is someone being paid by EPassporte. If someone like QB wants to verify a more direct trail, such as one to an address, the obvious way to achieve that is some form of mailed confirmation. Marginally more effort plus the cost of a stamp, but more effective and less intrusive. Telephone confirmation - calling the affiliate - would be another option.

Such methods are not cast-iron guarantees of anything, but the valid point several have made is that anyone intent on fraud is also more than capable of and likely willing to fake the copy documents which QB are asking for instead. Thus honest affiliates - surely the majority - are being exposed further to the possibility of identity theft, while any benefit to QB is largely illusory.

None of which would have been enough drama even for GFY, except that the transparency QB require is not reciprocal and instead of attempting to explain themselves, they lashed out at those who question their policies. That is why this thread is still running...

You show your id to cash a check

You show your id to buy a pack of cigarettes

You show your id to get into a bar.

You show your id to rent an apartment.

You show your id to get a blockbuster video card.

You show your id to get a job.

You show your id to get on a plane.

You show your id to suck cock on film.

The list goes on and on.


Equality & transparency?

We're not signing up to your program. You are signing up to ours, and you are asking for us to give you $30 or $40 for every $0.00 or $1.85 in sales you generate regardless of whether we make a profit from that trial.

This opens up lots of opportunities for scam artists. Especially when we run promos like $60 or $70 for an entire month.

Again, as far as transparency? When you cash a check at the bank, you don't ask for a copy of the bank owner's id even though they ask for yours. When you buy a pack of cigarettes, you don't get to see the counter girl's id because she saw yours. If you don’t trust us to pay you, then again… don’t sign up. You are making an active choice to enroll in quickbuck, you are enrolling because you like our sites/payouts/content and nobody is twisting your arm.

Hell, when you shoot a porn video you have to get model's ids ,but my guess is that the owner of the studio isn't sharing his id with the models. Life is not always a two way street, again, you want my money, you want me to send you a check/wire/epass/paypal, you want to promote my sites and use my content. You're asking me to give you something, so in exchange I ask you to verify who you are before we send payment. If I personally invite you to join, then it’s like a VIP line and yes, we would not ask for ID from somebody who we solicited.

Seriously, if you don't like it, send your traffic elsewhere. Requesting ID’s has had absolutely ZERO impact on our business and I would encourage other programs to institute similar policies.

Finally, let me re-iterate, anybody can join and send traffic immediately. This is not an ARS style "no link codes until you send a w9", this is simply a request for verification before payment and it is reallly really clearly disclosed at the top of every page in quickbuck if you're account has not yet been verified.

The drama level must be at an all time low for this thread to be getting any attention.

My last post on this matter:

Perhaps requesting payees to identify themselves will stop the fraud we have experienced, perhaps it will not, how about you let us figure that out since it's our business.

Will it stop gangs of professional carders with fake passport machines? No.

But it is a *deterrent* because much like having an alarm system, a burglar usually prefers to break into a house with no security and no dogs, even if the dog is little... and it also changes a small and likely unpersuable act of petty fraud into an act of presenting false identity which is a felony in some states.. and if you use a passport it is a felony everywhere.

So yes, present me with a fake passport and then use a stolen credit card to buy a trial at quickbuck, or (as everybody keeps mentionining other programs who dont ask for id) sign up with them, use a stolen credit card, disappear like a fart in the wind knowing that there is very little they can do to you.

I apologize if we came off as "attacking", but quickbuck is well... *ME* so perhaps I get a bit defensive when people question whether what we do to keep our program alive and healthy (for like 7 years now) is a smart choice.

hmm, maybe im wrong but i always thought thats why programs only paid every couple weeks or so, by the time payment goes out all signups would of been verified, no? this won't stop the big fraudsters, only the small timers.

Quick buck is shity sponsor one way or another so no need to bother with them.

sorry but there is a huge difference in everything you mentioned there, the main one being that the transaction takes place *face to face*.

also other than the bank, which only asks for id for large foreign checks (at least for me) none of the people looking at my id have it stored anywhere. unless the people im showing my id to are robots scanning my id with their eyes.

there are certain people who just won't send such information. i know a lot of hosting companies are doing this now, i refuse to do business with any of them. its just a matter of principal for me. its all fine and well to cover their ass but nothing covers mine. nothing ensures me something won't happen to my id, nothing ensures me that i will actually get paid. nothing proves who you are besides your site. sure quickbuck has been around for a long time and people know they pay but if this becomes standard for affiliate programs i can easily see it being abused.

Many different ways to defraud programs, but many times we find that the chargebacks or refunds associated with the fraudulent signups do not come through til the funds have been paid.

This coming from a fucking sig whore...jesus

you're ugly and your momma dresses you funny.

ping oc3networks.com
PING oc3networks.com (66.63.160.51): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 66.63.160.51: icmp_seq=0 ttl=51 time=89.556 ms
64 bytes from 66.63.160.51: icmp_seq=1 ttl=51 time=91.290 ms

ping webair.com
PING webair.com (209.200.29.36): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 209.200.29.36: icmp_seq=0 ttl=245 time=9.766 ms
64 bytes from 209.200.29.36: icmp_seq=1 ttl=245 time=13.096 ms

Not sure if this will stop the fraud but if you dont want to send the ID then dont...why bitch about it? Move on and as some have pointed out there are plently of sponsors out there that dont require it. But I think the guys who make real money from QB (and I dont mean $50 a week) would have already verified their ID.

If you dont like the policy that a company chooses to administer then leave.

The fact is quickbuck is in the shitlist,and this only confirm it.

what shitlist are you talking about? Do you sigwhores have a secret site somewhere that you list all the bad companies to sigwhore for?

in engrish?

On second largest adult webmaster thread.There are a lot of shit threads about quickbuck and that is why i avoid that sponsor as devil.

:1orglaugh

Yes I am sure they are about to close shop soon cause you arn't sending your 40 hits a year to them.

And I know what forum you are talking about and that issue has to do with a personal nature with that boards owner...but I'm sure if your english writing skills are anything to go by then you probably missed that point when reading those threads.

He's talking about the pond for those who are interested. The owner of the pond is throwing a little tantrum because of some domains we owned at one point.

They smoked too much pot and forgot that they were very happy that we bought them before they owned the pond again. When we owned them and pointed them to meat's board for free for years they seemed happy about it.

It's not worth our time and money to have lawyers make him take it down right now, we figure we'll wait a few years til we can prove it's damaged our business (with lots of threads like this where people refer to it as the reason they wont do business with us) and then we'll sue them for damages.

*late edit* we offered to sell them the names for the regfee... they declined to take them, then they expired and now they are parking pages, a big win for everybody involved :)

*even later edit* we actually signed transfer agreements (for free) for a few of the other names, but the owners didn't care enough to complete the transfer, so we still own them by shear laziness. the shitlist knows not what they speak of.

none of that has anything to do with i.d.

I guess google's accountants must suck. all i did was cash my checks , no forms no id no nothin. then again quickbuck is obviously alot larger and more experienced than the billions of $ google moves around right :winkwink:

8 great reasons why you should NEVER let your id leave your side or reside on someone else's computer you have no control over.

Now ill list some thing you DONT need to show your id for.

You dont need your id to get paid with google

You dont need your id to get paid from yahoo

You dont need your id to get paid from adsense

and the list goes on to include every sponsor i have ever heard of..

Any sponsor can make any rule they want your right and nobody has to use them , but i see no reason to ostricise your affiliates by instituting plans that havent been thought out.

It does take some guts to admit when your wrong, maybe in your mind your not, thats cool too. but i think by some of the responses show many do not think its a wise idea.

Why not just start a new thread "QUICKBUCK OFFICIAL STATEMENT"
Due to recent worries about our "ID or else" policy we have decided to hold up on enforcing this policy until we can better ascertain its usefullness. We at quickbuck listen to our affiliates and we of course do not want to make it harder for you to get paid. We feel by preventing fraud we can INCREASE payouts to honest webmasters. We apologize for any confusion and look forward to a rewarding relationship with our affil's in 2007

if($newaffiliate = some-one-u-dont-know)
{
send a letter with a code to the $newaffiliate.
require $newaffiliate to fill in the code in some webbased form before you issue the first payment.
}

Maybe Wiseman should change his sig to "fuck the affiliates. we do!" :(

And if you were running quickbuck it would be your prerogative to do so, but I'm running it and I have years of experience running it. I know the one thing that all affiliate fraud has in common, it comes from people we don't know.

You think it's wrong. I don't. You say it hasn't worked, I say that it is and has worked. You say it is costing me business, I say I don't want your business if you wont abide by our policy and that it in fact has improved profitability and our ability to do high priced promos.

The good thing about it is that this is a free country and you are welcome to believe what you like and make up theories about anything you choose. If you think I'm wrong then you should start your own program and come up with all sorts of wiz bang neato ways to keep fraud in check.

You say *many* think it's wrong, perhaps you underestimate how many affiliates we have. GFY posters are not reflective of most of the industry imho.

Yahoo does not require an id to advertise with them, because you are the one sending *them* money. If you want to get a yahoo xml feed, you do indeed have to sign a contract, send articles of incorporation and often provide references because you want to use their service and you want them to send you money. Google also requires you to sign a contract and send articles of incorporation if you want an XML feed.

Adsense? Come on man, they control the content, they control the path to the advertiser, and they control where their ads appear or don't appear. If you want to give me the ability to control your quickbuck ads then by all means I'm happy to make an exception to the "we require an id" rule.

And please... Send me money, I promise I won't ask for any information about who you are when I'm cashing the check.

CCbill requires contracts and proof of id, Paycom requires contracts and proof of id... For every example of somebody who doesn't require proof of id (for the company or the individual if you're not a company) I will show you a company that does.

Why do you think CCBill doesn't just open up their procesisng up to everybody who can submit a form? Because if they made the process automated they would have every scammer in the world signing up and submitting card data, an affiliate program running on their own merchants really only differs from a biller in that we don't give you the ability to control the pricing.

Ask ANY processor and ANY bank what the NUMBER ONE way to prevent fraud is in affiliate marketing? The #1 answer is to KNOW YOUR AFFILIATES. KNOW how they are promoting you, KNOW what they are promoting and KNOW who they are.

Is this a fool proof method? No. It's the best we've come up with so far. Give me a better idea and i'll happily consider it. Constructive criticism doesn't mean saying "your idea is stupid", it means saying "your idea is stupid, here is a better way of doing it". I welcome constructive criticism but this armchair quarterbacking is really pointless unless you just enjoy posting.

Bottom line is that if you want me to write you a check for 1k, 5k, 10k or 100k, you need to show me an id so that if you decide you want to play games with stolen cards, promote us from kp sites or violate can spam that I can come after you.

Any affiliate who has an issue with our policy is welcome to contact us and we can arrange a suitable method of verifying your identity or corporate identity if you're uncomfortable with our current process.

The day I take a GFY thread as a blueprint of how to run my business is the day that I will shut our doors.

That's crazy but this isn't a first... ARS wanted all that crap and then some to pay me via epass instead of checks. Needless to say they are still waiting.