You can try to justify it all you want, but if you were in front of a judge, is that what your defense would be? "I thought they wanted me to hang around until I was thirsty?"

I thought you were talking about the cop being bored.

LOL wow they dont have anything better to do than book people using interenet connections. My gawd.

I'm not interpreting law here. I'm saying it's a dumb ass law. The technology makes it pretty easy to protect your network. I prefer not having dumb laws on the books that try to protect people from their own stupidity.

Do you go walking into banks that you do not do business at to score free candy?

Want me to talk to Lars and see if I can help you get a raise? :winkwink:

I was and you said both the cop and the guy had a feeling the something was wrong.

This quote from the cop makes me hate cops even more:

"I had a feeling a law was being broken, but I didn't know exactly what,"

And then instead of a warning for this huge gray area he arrests him and it gets on the news?

:1orglaugh no i'm good :winkwink:

But according to the law it's not.

What now?

i can't believe that people are arguing that business owners are providing free internet as a some sort of philanthropic public service... and that no one sincerely, genuinely has any idea that it might be not only morally and ethically questionable, but illegal to drive around looking for free wi-fi connections to surf from.

what I noticed is the only way to prove the person is actually using the internet connection is to admit it, you could easily just say I'm using my own connection or switch screens if he comes to your car, I doubt a police officer would even know the difference.

My point all along has been this is a dumb ass law.

standing on the street... you see a motorcyle running and no one around... how do you know not to steal it? how do you know its not just free to use? how do you know its not just a community motorcycle?

THE POINT IS THAT, JUST LIKE WITH THE WI-FI CONNECTION... YOU KNOW WITH 100% CERTAINTY THAT ITS NOT YOURS.

eh... it's almost like a don't ask don't tell type of thing. Sure, we all know stealing wireless is not really on the level, but in the event of an emergency/urgent situation I use anything I have available

People with completely unsecure networks are opening themselves up to potential problems, including illegal activity being conducted on th network. Without a TOS/popup page (which is probably relatively easy to do), businesses are really just asking for it

That doesn't justify leeching off of the wireless, but if I'm just trying to access my bank account or email for legit purposes - I won't feel bad for even one second doing it

With the resources available to local cops, it's pretty damn near impossible for them to catch someone unless they volunteer the information. Unsecured wirless = sitting duck

if you're not secure you must assume that people will at some point use your wireless connection - that's a solid assumption. And hey, if you realize that and still want an unsecured network, then great.

Then get it changed. Until then at least some of us are going to obey it, and would appreciate the direct fiesta's of the world with their insufferable flawed logic not cock off at us for it.

Cheers. :D

So you assume that a guy not even able to protect his wi-fi , will be able to rename his router to his business name .... :1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Its a FREE accessible public area just like a public bathroom, If you don't want people to use it lock it up... or specify that its for paying customers only... as most business do....

Once again FREE ACCESSIBLE PUBLIC AREA

If U build a park in the middle of the city, and dont fence it in, aswell as post signs saying its "Private Property" people are gonna walk thru it

you sound like a child defending MP3's. just because its there.. just because no one takes significant steps to stop you from stealing... doesn't put you in the right.

you can build a park in the middle of the city without a sign saying "private property" they are still trespassing on private property when they walk through it. no one has any obligation to take extra steps to prevent others from breaking the law.

pretty soon this shouldn't be a problem - New routers let users type in the desired name and password when setting the router up with the software.

Plus, if you don't know the basics of wireless internet (or can't follow directions), you either shouldn't be using it or someone else should set it up for you :2 cents:

Your absolutely right but if they dont take those extra steps how will anyone know if its private property or not...

and lets say you decided to walk thru said park on your way to somewhere else should you get arrested for it even though no one told you or specified it was private property to begin with???

Wouldn't you think you were just taking a stroll thru the park and doing nothing wrong???

Hi, is it possible to see how many people are connected on to your unsecure connection? Is there a program for that?

Thanks!

"Whether or not you agree with the legality of using an open WiFi network without the owner's authorization, one thing is painfully clear: if you're going to leech, try not to do it from a parked car right in front of the building."

Lol. Thats great.

heh.. I could still do it in front of the building in my car and they couldn't do shit - not cause they don't have the power, just because I'm not a retard

sure, just go to your router IP where you access your router panel

you really don't seem to get it. i dont need to put a sign above my front door saying "NO PUBLIC RESTROOM" to prevent people from coming into my house at any time, day or night to take a piss. and "how was i supposed to know his home wasn't a public toilet" isn't going to get you a pass in court.

you don't need to take steps to prevent others from breaking the law. they are expected to not break the law. whether or not people can take additional steps to prevent these situations, has nothing to do with the other person breaking the law.

I'm not getting the impression that you seem to be getting it eigther.... this is not about a private home / place its a public place / area so there is a considerably understood diferrence...

Aswell as a diferrent perception of applicably acceptible laws...

it may not be acceptible and may be considered to be against laws to walk into someones house (i.e. trespass) but that doesn't apply to public areas

But than again we could just B misunderstanding each other in which case we're both right

you said the "park" in your example was private property. thats where it ends. its private property. the owner doesn't need to take any steps at all to warn people that its private property... you trespass, you're in the wrong. end of story.

whether or not he could take extra steps to prevent trespassing is irrelevant. the fact that he doesn't, does not make it ok to trespass on his land.

Oh, I forgot to mention... the Staples Wireless Network has BANNED GFY!

what a travesty

hmm ok I think this computer I reformated it after I set up the router and it doesn't have any router program on it that I see( I just searched) :Oh crap

If I go to the router website (SMC) and download the software...thats the router panel?


hha I know so little about hardware :1orglaugh :Oh crap

Thanks!

yes there is a way to tell

http://192.168.2.1/lan_dhcp.html for Belkin . . . leave pass blank

Your absolutely correct in your point....

But will you please try to understand mine its diferrent than yours...

my point is that even though your trespassing your not aware of it...

I dont think anybody would be since the owner didn't take the extra optional steps to make others aware of it...

It doesn't make it right but should you go to jail / get arrested for it???, I don't think so...

There's no expectation of privacy and or no expectation that people will stay off it... if no notice of any kind is given in such an area...

Although I consider assumptions to be ignorrant, in this day & age people simply just assume and expect that public areas are free for all...

so if the owner doesn't take those extra optional steps (which he doesn't have to) than how could he expect others to know what his expectations are...

After all everyones terms are diferrent...

and some people / communities do put up parks and public AREAS for others to use free...

Example: 2 diferrent parks one public one private both identical in every way with no notices of any kind on eighter...

U walk thru both can you tell which one U trespassed on???

The minute you'd make a judge aware of that situation and the fact that no notice of any kind was given a judge most likely will throw it out of court...

and would consider it nonsense for the owner of said property to even have U arrested, since theres no way for U to have known what the owners expectations where...

Same applies for public WiFi connections since its considered a public area (Not Physical area but still public area non the less)

I should know, since I just asked a relative of mine who's a judge in the state of NJ

If I was arrested, I would sue Microsoft and whoever made my network card. I turn on my laptop, its connected, I dont have a choice to connect or not, no pop up, if you leave your network open, my computer connects. I'd be rich.

ok let me check it out, thanks! :thumbsup

no U'd access your panel on the net
i.e. http://yourisprouterip

Contact your ISP they'll give U the ip address

Redshoe . . . it might be totally a free, legal service in Maui. I'm not usre of this, but that law is Michigan . . . I do know some communities provide free open access.

Diferrent states diferrent laws, what may be acceptible in one may not be in another (it Varies)

DO THE POLICE EVEN HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXAMINE YOUR COMPUTER TO SEE IF IT IS CONNECTED TO THE STORE'S WIFI??

This just seems crazy to me that charges were every possibly even layed in these cases, without them calling in network experts to access the routers to get mac address info for connections and then acquiring some type of search warrants to get access to the surfers laptop computer.

The guy obviously messed up by incriminating himself to the cop instead of keeping his mouth shut or denying. In none of these cases I can't see how they didn't get off.

Maybe the cafe should say "Internet for paying customers only" just like "restrooms for paying customers only"

NO they don't... in the artical the guy kept coming back and after a while he was asked and he told 'em what he was doing.

YEP... :thumbsup

sheee it
 

I had an apartment building next door going to town on my wireless until I decided to simply secure the connection ... then I felt bad that I ended everyones internet :1orglaugh

Not a very good comparison.

Take that same oxygen bar, but now you have people coming in and adding extra holes to the oxygen hose to put in their own nosepieces without paying.

that's an even worse comparison :)

It would be like an outdoor concert charging people for setting up lawnchairs just outside the fence or on a close by buildings rooftop to enjoy the music for free.

Like spyware/adware/scumware!

in this case the holes where already there owner (added the holes himself ) didn't bother to blug 'em up...

lol that's shitty.

Eh, I was working with what i had.

That doesn't help since you can obviously access the network from outside the cafe and may never see the sign.

I guess all I'm trying to say is that I think people should be expected to be smart enough to protect themselves and therefore their networks. Some people here would rather have the law protect them. That's fine. Just remember that the laws are made by people who say things like this:

Damn that is crazy !!!