Hey Roger if you truely want to do this you need to take into account that $$ talks.

Rather than say banning and trying to clean the streets with your NwO, perhaps you should set up a pay structure that ENCOURAGES this TGP behavior.

Perhaps a higher rate. Money talks, and this may be the only thing that gets tgp people to convert to your ideas. Offer the "good" tgps more $$ per signup.

If tgps see more $$ they will be lining up to change.

However if you and your top 20 big boys wanna shut out the tgps for having hardcore, some other paysite is gunna make bank catering to them all.

Banning them is not the idea.
Encouraging them to change and investing in this change is the way to go

I totally agree
but it has to start somewhere
If it gets cleaned up we can all afford to raise payouts and the traffic or the surfers value goes up for may reasons.

Both sides need to work to gether and make it happen
you know what I mean. and what if the Processors steps in on the one sponsor who caters to them and turns them off.

they won't be able to get there own merchant acount to handle
all the cancels and chargebacks

bingo.

Cause realistically, if the top 20 pay programs decided to ban me and my tgps because of the "TGP PC" you are cooking up, Id go to a site that does pay tgp webamsters and isnt part of this Union of paysites banning tgps.


And im sure there would be TONS of them.
Yo can almost see the ad slogans now for these tgp friendly paysites saying that they are TGP friendly.

It would be a big mess.

Like i said, if you want this to work and want to clean this all up, encouragement is the way to go.

Offer "approved" tgps this higher rate, and leading by example these tgps will set the standard for others.

But realistically, there will always be hardcore tgp with too much free shit even with this dynamic.

The writing is on the wall bro.
Free shit is happing at exponential groth rates.
the number of Pay sites are growing like mad, everyone and thier mother owns a fucking paysite now. Once you and your UNION wack out the tgps, are you going to go after next? all the paysites also?

If it isnt tgps, it will be kazza or morpheus. It if ist them it will be the growth of competing paysites. The market jsut isnt what it used to be. You can sit around and point fingers all day man, but face it the indusrty isnt what it used to be. What it used to be was the begining of an era. Its growing. And its goin to get a lot worse before it gets better.

Ive said this before and Ill say it again over and over.
Quality is the key. QUALITY is the only thing that will KEEP YOU ahead of the game. Quality is the only thing that will keep you IN the GAME. Ideas, creativity, Quality and marketing. Thats it.
I mean come on, it amazing these cookie cutter shit sites made the millions they did 4 years ago. Those days are over. Evolve and adapt or sink. Be better than the competition or move aside. Casue im tellin ya, and you know you see it, ideas and people getting in this biz are coming in and spreading like wildfire.


Weeding out this person and that person, and trying to gather up silly little unions of "big players" is just silly and not realistic.

The tide is coming in, and unless you build that house up higher its cunna get washed away by the growth and tide around you.

Boneprone I will be honest you seem to know more about the TGP's and what it would take to clean it up.
I've always focused on Paysites but I think we all need to figure something out.

and it might not just be the sponsors involved it could aslo be the 3rd party processors.

the bottom line is we need to clean it up as much as we can.
because all my buddies don't even need me to jack off online:)
they all know where to get it for free.

I never said get rid of the TGP's all i'm saying is if i can jack off to your gallery your traffic sucks ass. Its that simple
why do you think we have all these charbacks and cancels they can get it all free
Period

We need an internet mafia. We set a few rules on the quality of sites, and if you try and defy the rules a group of hackers wipes out your sites, your social security number, and everything so basically you don't exist anymore. Then your ass gets kidnapped and used for slave labor building websites. And if you try and escape we feed you to rabid goats :thumbsup

there is room for everyone all I'm saying is it needs to clean up. so all of the paysites big and small will profit. and so will TGp's.

Cut the Surfers air supply off and see if he pays for oxygen.

Its very simple Supply and demand

Just like drugs on the street why do you think drug dealers do so well
they don't give you a Kilo for free and say have fun.
maybe you will pay me later.

Truthfully there is only ONE thing that can clean this shit all up.
And his name is

ASH CR OFT.

Government is the only factor or power that can correct this.
You see the market has grown like wildfire. The market, and factors in the market are out of control, and no matter what you or the good old boys want to do you cant prevent it.

You can stand in the way and yell and scream for it to stop, but its too late in the game man. Way too late.

We are in a state now where the market cannot control itself.
Early on it was possible. But not now. Early on these ideas should have been implied, but not now.

I mean look how hard it is for the market to even regualte and control Child Porn, and lolita shit.

If we cant even stop processors to stop billing for this shit, and paysites of this nature from arising, how are we gunna police tgps that simply show this pink that you happen not to like.

The market cant police or correct itself. Not the way you want it to.

The only factor and power that can is the Govenrments.

I suggest you become an anti-porn Lobbyist if you truely what want to do what you wanna do.

You are speaking in ideal and unrealistic terms man.
you cant stop it.
You can only evolve to whats happening.


Sure I can shit and piss aout Kazza all day, about how it hurts us (which it does) but its not going to do me any good.

What do those who evolve and adapt do?
They plant movies and content in kazza and morpheus.

Why, becuse they see the writing on the wall.

Can they stop morpheus or kazza?
No. How will they survive and use this to their advantage?

They plant shit on there. They figure how to make cash with it.

What you are trying to do is outlaw something that is not outlawed. Change the rules of the game yourself.
The market is not this small community as it was years ago.
It has changed. You cant do this.

Like I said you are now better off becoming a politiacl lobbyist, or a politician.

I totally disagree
I think we can correct it and its not about the good old boys.
even though we did pave the way for you guys but thats another story all together.

Its about all the paysite owners not just big sponsors we all need to be active on it.And even the Processors would back it if everyone was active on cleaning up the net.

Anti-Porn Lobbyest Give me a break i've been doing this shit for a very long time. check out my history.

I don't understand why you are so negative about it.
But I guess we can see what happens right. Its not me almost all the paysite owners I talk to are for it big and small.

and a few tgp guys who I'm not going to mention now.

The tgps can except the galleries but if they don't get paid will that webmaster continue to post hardcore or full galleries etc? that is the question?

Roger, im not dogin ya..
I have the SAME concerns about this as you do.

Ive been watching the market saturate with free porn like crazy.
Ive seen the paysite growth BOOM. Everyone has a paysite company now. Ive seen The growth of kazza and morpheus and cringed at that, and hate it when I hear conversations among people saying why pay for porn when ya got kazza.

All we can do is raise the bar on ourselves. Improve ourselves to stay competitive. Improve Quality.
Improve our netorwoking woth one another.

Look at adult.com
Look at all this new shit they have opened jsut in the last 3 months. Lensman sees whats going on. What does he do?
He raises the bar. He gets in the content biz. A perfect way to adapt to what is going on. He makes new quality sites and programs. Exclusive content. No cookie cutter shit.

Raise the bar on yourself.
Its not You VS the Competition anymore.

Its You VS You. You trying to figure out the puzzle we have in terms of how to make a product better. Not how am i gunna shut down this growth in the industry that is spreading like a wildfire.

Where were you when the TGP2 ship sank?

you guys could have supported them a bit more.
There were talks as to increasing thier payouts and everything.

But it just couldnt survive. Good idea, but the market couldnt keep it fueld.

This sounds like a huge tgp2 idea.

But man, i agree with you. Im not in any disagree as to what is going on.

All we differ on is the solution.

Ummm... well if all the big tgp's were basically forced by the big sponsors to accept no hardcore galleries their surfers would very quickly go elsewhere and they would lose their precious sextracker rankings..

All the big tgp's (and small) can build their own paysite easily if they have to..

Surfers have always had access to masses of free porn..

before the net there was free porn on bbs systems, then along came easy net access and usenet blossomed.. millions of pics & vids for free, available to anyone with outlook express..

then came file sharing systems.. try searching for 'bangbus' on directconnect or gnutella.. loads of free vids..

tgp's, picposts, links lists etc.. all free porn and have been around for many years

image search on google and other media search engines - masses of freeporn


for a small tgp to change the rules is no problem, they lose nothing much.. for a big, well established tgp with years of bookmarks and loyal surfers its suicide..


as boneprone said - offer incentives, better payouts to compliant tgp's and the 'revolution' will start from the ground, from the small tgp's and spread.. if 1000 small/medium tgp's comply then you may have control over a very large percentage of the porn surfers..

I hear ya

But when does that bar end we also have new reality sites and exclusive content coming out with great programs.
exclusive content is great ut most guys just want to jerk it real quik and move on.

there are so many surfers who would pay if they can't get it for free we at least need to try or we will just kill ourselves and only a few will be left. and you can kiss everything goodbye because it will all be free and the surfers already know this.
If thats the direction its headed then it really will be to late and we will have a couple years left if we are lucky.

Or the way things are going we can all lower our payouts since the traffic is not worth as much the surfer is valued lower because you know he will cancel during the trial.
why should he continue to pay?

I'm just venting right now. I will at least get the ball rolling I hope others will jump on board

Kewl
I think we can figure it out if everyone helps
it will be the big topic this next few months

Once all the paysite owners and Dialer guys get on board we need to work with everyone to hammer it out.
it can be done . this indusrty is not that big

As boneprone said-that might be the solution I don't know but we need to fuigure this shit out now.
We just need to work together i don't think the big tgp's will lose there traffic they are well to established.

and if some smaller smaller tgp starts there own sites with hardcore galleries all the sponsors will pressure the processors to shut them of. not a problem.

Hell man, if you need me to support ya, and if you get this rollin i will.
We both want the same thing.
We all do. To clean shit up, and reward those that help our market. Getting rid of pink may be a bit extreme.

Realistically i dont think it will work, but in my heart i hope it does.
Brain storm some more ideas bro. This is all just raw thoghts and bar talk we are doin here but its a start.

Thsi was a good healthy discussion.
Raw, but I think its a start.

Dont get your hopes up too high though

damn i must be tired.
I cant type or spell right. (worse than usual)
Its not even 4:00 am yet.

What would happen if all the sponsors would stop giving out free content for Promotion ??

Your asking the sponsors to stop excepting TGP Traffic good.
Then you'r also asking them that they STOP giving away FREE Hardcore Content ???

There are always 2 sides of the medal. Don't just go after the TGP's do go also after the ones who give away the Free Porn.

I'm sure the ones who buy theyr content for the Gallerys are much mor concerned about how much they show then the ones who use FREE content.

No answer me that. Will the sponsors who do agree with your proposal also stop giving away free content or will they give out censored content ??

Ouch! Do you also break legs? ;)

Seriously.. I would not agreee with that.. I don't want any sponsor to dictate to me what I do with my paysite or my tgp.. if a processor would cave in to pressure from another company (my competition) I would run very fast from that processor.. in fact I would say that perhaps there are even legal issues there..

you think things are bad now? there is still shitloads of money being made by *many* sites and companies - solid profit margins, and low cb rates.

i believe things will need to get much 'worse', before they will get any better.

even if you could completely rid the net of tgps (not just kill hardcore galleries), the traffic would simply reshuffle itself to kazza et al. free porn (lots of it) is here to stay. with more becoming available each day... along with new ways to aquire it en masse.

evolve or die.

I hear ya My eyes are red LOL

I think there will be a board set up for this very soon for all the sponsors and tgp and paysite owners to chat on and hammer it out.
But just about all the big sponsors and little paysites i've talk to are ready to back it and thats about 15 that I talke dto so far.
once I get there aproval to post who is backing it I hope everyone esle jumps on board

I think the sponsors will censor or just give out mellow content no pink. make them pay for it don't give them the whole cow.

Someone once told me (My ex) LOL
why buy the milk when I can get the cow for free.

Maybe I'm not explaining myself I said we need the TGp's they just need to clean it up.
people will still go there and see the hot new chicks. they just have to pay for it if they want to see more..

Mark the way it will be set up the industry tgp's,paysitescompanies ,webmasters etc. will police it not the sponsors so your right step into the danger zone and you will go down.

the industry needs to police itself just like any other industry we need rules to continue to do business
we just can't be the yahoo cowboys anymore.
Hell yea it was fun but those days are over

Disturbing.

Quiet and I are on the same wavelength.
Not that i didnt think we would, its just cool to see.

so what your saying is evolve or die.

So lets take the regulations of all car exhausts and let the ozone layer keep depleting and we will survive and evolve.

Or do we try to clean it up and continue to live comfortably

I under stand i've seen it get worse over the years I've seen many companies come and go every year. but if we don't do this or at least try we will all be screwed.


I can't fuckin type anymore
Late:glugglug

The auto industry could care less or give a fuck about polution.

The only reason US autos care is becasue of GOVERNMENT regualtions.

Laws, incentives, and $$.

You just proved my point

you're completely missing the point.

*if* you managed to kill all hardcore on all tgps (and that's a HUGE if) - said hardcore (and the associated traffic looking for it) would simply reshuffle to new places and formats of delivery.

the only way to kill hardcore porn outside of pay sites at this point, is via government regulation. but good luck with your union.

i was going to post more or less the same thing, but you already covered it ;)

ok so ive been out drinking but....

Sponsors should have a plethora of hosted galleries, not just 10 of so per site but hundreds updated regularly

get rid of the gallery submitter

make life easier for the tgp owner, give them revenue from their gallery views without hosting costs... have them not worry about cheating gallery submitters etc plus some traffic back in ratio to gallery views

... ok so its a combination of sponsor hosted galleries, diabolic galleries, and choker traffic

somethin like that

that wasn't the point.
Come on all I'm saying is we need to regulate it on our own.
so we have many more years of profit.

If it doesn't happen.
then we might as well all have tgp's and give it all away for free.
Fuck it.

im glad we agree!
I knew I could get you to understand!

Go to sleep Roger.
Its late.
Recharge the battery, and we can all do this again tomorrow.

We'll come up with somethin.

This is all a start.

LOL
watch what happens I don't think we should let that happen.

But all that could mean is there will be no money to support all the free shit and we start all over again.

:thumbsup

Peace out cause I'm passing out

same here.
lets let the Russians talk it over as we sleep.
They should be waking up around now.

There is only one way to slow free porn from TGP's and thats make them more money buy offering less the allmighty dollar is all that matters. Nobody will change when your offering less money. Paysites dont care about free stuff and shit newbie galleries sending them traffic they make good money on the exit traffic.
I think I may have the answer but Im not ready to go public just yet. Boneprone Id like to have a chat please hit me on ICQ
77762980.