One more point

In the old days - there where maybe 2 or 3 shows max per year. Now shows are saturated - I don't know of any industry that averages 1 trade show / event per month - which this is what seems to be the current rate for this biz.

Reduce the number of shows per year to 2 or 3 and the interest may jump up again - and become more interesting for both the established and new-comers alike. :2 cents:

to walk the floor of nab costs nothing.

Best response in thread. Cheers to you and the well thought out response. You are definitely the kind of person we would like on our team.

It's good to see you on here!!! That first show was the best!!! I am really grateful that you and I met and that we still manage to stay in contact after all these years?. I hope to see you again soon!

All the best!

Because I realized that if I want to listen to a bunch of overweight guys try to convince me of how important they are I can just take my bike for a spin a little too fast. A speeding ticket is only $100 and the whole experience gets condensed in to 15 minutes rather than 3 days.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh :thumbsup

The first show I was at was the very first Adult Internet show! That was back in October (I believe( 1995 in Orlando. It was IA2000, which was mainly a "Phone Sex" convention but added an Adult Internet component. There were no booths for "us", and only about 40 Internet industry people showed up. We all hung-out together and had a great time. Most of those attendees became the original YNOT members way back at the beginning.

The early pre-2000 shows were still the best, IMHO. We were all learning, and the networking was excellent.

Carol xoxoxo

These come with seminars, food and much better parties.

This is what I always say and people are either impressed, or the conversation gets awkward :1orglaugh

The seminars are weak at best.I would rather pay $1000 for a real seminar then a weak add on. If Im there its for business not to go to parties.

It's good to hear that I'm not the only one that got a weird vibe when I told people that I'm just a webmaster. I fall into the comfortable range where I'm not a "bro" but I make a decent living.

I'll just confirm that the ROI is too low. The money isn't an issue its really about the time invested and what I get out of it. I can think of two panels that were helpful out of my show experience. The rest of the time was spent eating and drinking. Frankly it's more valuable as a tax write off than an actual investment in improving my business since people are accessible in so may ways online.

Yes it's very clickish but I have yet to have someone tell me to fuck off when I walk up and introduce myself. If I don't meet new people that's on me but I admit to getting swarmed with reps who don't know a damn thing about the biz. They are like networking land mines. You don't know they are one till you shake their hand and get a half-assed pitch and a request for a follow up.

You pretty much hit it spot on, as I see it being a smaller webmaster and a one man show. All these companies claim they want to talk to webmasters like me, yet they do nothing but cater to the the few whales or same old crowd they always cater too.

What reason do they give a guy like me to go to a show? A guy whom just runs TGPs and Blogs and isn't a big fish in any way. In reality even if I did go to a show I really wouldn't want to talk to a bunch of affiliate reps anyway.

I mean really what can they do for me other than ask me to send traffic? If I went to a show, I'd want to talk to other webmasters not Reps to programs (sorry). Seems to me the topic is about webmasters not attending shows, so that's a catch 22 all over again.

Personally I've toyed with the idea of trying to put something together for the local webmasters in Central Florida. I'd love to see a simple once a month get together to talk biz and share ideas, maybe in Orlando so it's centrally located.

That's the kinda stuff I'm interested in, not glamor shows in Vegas.. yea would be fun but well, I think I already covered that.

Would be nice to see something like this in the UK

you guys are all just anti-social

i have a blast at shows & meet tons of new people....close tons of deals

free dinners/hookers/shooting range/helicopters/jet fighters......all on the companies comp cards

why not fucking go?

I've always preferred meeting and networking with the smaller webmasters. They could always do more for me and my sites than the larger companies would or could.

Carol xoxoxo

Unless you're selling something, the only plus I can think of is being able to write off a vacation (or 50% of a vacation, whatever the tax rules are in your area). Otherwise, when I vacation I'm usually trying to get away from work related stuff.

something to look forward to, even at my advanced age :thumbsup

i just go to be the token darkie

cant wait =)

Very interesting Post. :thumbsup

DING DING DING! We have a winner!

I can sum it up in one pic

http://www.internextlasvegas2007.com/double.jpg

Every year, the shows are more and more of an excuse to party, mixed with the same seminars we've seen for years, the same old convention floor (until the floor vanished) and the "same" new reps bullshitting about their great new programs that will vanish in six months.

Back in the day, the NatNet Suite was an actual "semi-quiet" venue for real webmasters (not big program owners, but actual webmasters) to meet and talk real "mid-level" business, problem-solving, ideas and partnership suggestions (not big names at the blackjack tables, self-inflated reps pitching pre-paid deals for join numbers most webmasters couldn't possibly hit, or "content producers" who talked a great game about deals they wanted to do and then vanished a week later or never produced crap.)

The NatNet Suite was where I met most of my good friends in the business - and we're still friends, even though most of them ended up doing other things when the salad days were over. It was also a place that was a controlled environment and a hell of a lot of fun, especially when Dokk was at the mike.

Today, I'm almost 54. I have ownership of my own niche. I don't want to party until I drop anymore, and people pushing people into pools or through windows don't amuse me anymore. I don't want to spend time bullshitting with dozens of people who say they can do great business with me and then vanish. I don't want to waste time with reps who've been in the business for three months who want to tell me they can make me 100% more than I'm making now. I don't want to hear the same seminars that I heard in 1999 (albeit with updated information that I already know.)

Most of my good friends are out of the business now, so I don't have a crew to hang with. And I don't want to spend hours at the Circle Bar talking to dozens of people, looking for semi-serious mid-level business people to be friends with. I used to very much enjoy Fay and Dave's shows, because they were small, intimate, and primarily attended by people like me. But those shows grew out of control and morphed into smaller versions of Internext.
Even so, when January came close every year, I always gave in and went anyway. And every year, it got less and less productive.

This year, I have a cat near death, a wife who's eight months pregnant, a friend who's dealing with illness and serious depression - and wasn't able to make the last-minute decision that "fuck it, I'll go anyway." And you know what? I don't miss it at all. Not anymore. What I miss is what it *used* to be.

I know I'll come off as an embittered old-timer who can't change with the times. So be it. The question was asked - and that's my answer. And I know there are others who agree.

I stopped going to shows because I realized - after going to a bunch of shows - that most programs don't buy exclusive content. They think making a content deal is about buying sets of licensed content.

Seems to me that most programs are really cheap mother fuckers where it counts the most. If these guys aren't investing the heaviest in what they're selling, how do they expect to really be a player in the biz?

That was a wake-up call to me, honestly. I was a little naive to think I'd be welcomed with open arms, offering them precious content that will monetize their traffic. I guess I was naive to think program owners understood the value of such a service.

its a catch22 but the reason I don't attend many shows is that there are no other webmasters to talk to and I'm really not interested in spending time with affiliate reps.

I'm wrapping up my show time tonight, finished the going away party, got to say good bye to those who were still there.

I got to spend some time with Chris from AVN, and I told him straight up. I've been going to AVN shows from IA2000. This show was hands down the best one I've been too for networking, making deals, and rekindling old business relationships. I'm not a Bro, I didn't get invited to 12Clicks dinner (I'm sure my invite got lost in the mail :)), so take that for what it's worth.

I used to be alot like some of the people in this thread. I remember in 2002 J$tyles ranting at me for not going to shows that year and the next. My answer was I had anyone I needed to do business with were either on my cellphone or ICQ. I was wrong. New Players are shooting up every day. If you don't go to at least one major show a year, you are only doing yourself a dis service.

I am sorry, I am not sure how it is we have never met since you are obviously attending more shows than I thought. Be sure to come up and say hello.

As far as the parties are concerned, let me assure you that they are great networking opportunities. I feel your impressions are based on what you have read rather than what you have experienced.

Why does the owner of redtube or porntube need to go to an adult convention?

They already own the porn industry.

Was good to see you again Bro :thumbsup

Because they ripped off the content and now they need to figure out how to sell it.

You could break into Best buy and steal TV's and then give them away and all you would do is make a gas bill for the truck.

Who are you kidding, Anthony - you've ALWAYS been a bro --- that's just not what they called it back then :1orglaugh

Glad you had a good show :thumbsup

It’s a shame that you don’t want to talk to reps, because reps like me have the knowledge and the know how…. I am interested in creating relationships with my webmasters, that way I can better assist you with the things that you need to help you grow

You only need a rep when you got a problem. :winkwink:

Well, I have never been to one of these shows, but reading how little biz is made, and how the average webmaster is treated ( lol or not! ) really doesn´t make me wanna go either :P

Good seminars, reps that can make decisions and actually make deals, and lots of attendants ( real working webmasters ) would make them a lot more appealing.

It would be nice if sponsors cared for other things, like loyalty, years promoting them, consistent traffic, etc, referrals, etc, and invited the average webmaster, just so it would be a mix of small, medium and biggies ;)

Shit.. did I just get owned by Baddog? :Oh crap

We do a tremendous amount of business at so many of the shows. We setup meetings and dinners ahead of time which is key. Having a booth or cabana is mainly for branding and to give current clients a place to easily find us. We also put events together like the golf outings and the Porn Poker Tour whcih has become a staple event at so many shows.

Sure, every show is not spectacular but so many of them are . The Internext show that ended yesterday is no exception. Great job done by AVN.

so everyone here is bitching and moaning about loud parties and no invites but how come when a sponsor creates a lax event with good atmosphere, everyone complains that there are no girls to look at???

I have organized and set 2 major parties for Python besides the GFY XMAS, open invite, food, open bar great venues, and by midnight everyone is gone to the stripclub and has complained about no girls but they never bothered to look around the room to network....sponsors can't win.

Having been a sales rep for 5 years, I found that I made most of my best contacts thru ICQ, then meeting at a show in the lobby or an after party in someone's suite(where I could hear myself speak).

OR, looking for people on the boards and setting up specific meetings or dinners also is another great tactic.

Creating small gatherings is by far the best way to maximize potential. I do dinners w/ diff ppl all the time to create some intimacy and solidify relationships that were started online. :)

Too many big egos. I am happy being a lowly affiliate and don't really see the point in spending the money to go and get drunk when I can do that at home.

great thread.. and i understand why people won't go anymore.. i'm stuck in between webmaster/program owner so i can offer something for both.. the beginning was hard because it's a closed group but after a few shows i met the right people who care about you in person.

i have to agree the hotels are very expensive.. for me a simple hotel is enough as long as i can hang out with people and get the chance to meet new people then it's worth going for me business will be done when everybody gets back home.. before i want to promote something or someone i have to know who they are and what they are like..

take an example of the costa rica bash .. great organized.. i only have to pay for the flight. the hotel food and drinks are paid by the sponsors..
i think that will be the new way of sponsoring and organizing webmaster shows..